Wilderness...ruined?

[killjoyfuly]

 

prayer only has 100% protection agisnt npc not players also i rarly see people pray in the wilderness any more (unless nonmembers)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It does, however, have a 50% protection against players does it not? That still is technicly cutting the opponents attack/strength skill in HALF from a level 43 [that you can get in a day] skill.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And does it matter if you see a lot of people using it or not? It's still there and it still is an overpowered skill. Perhaps if they lowered it down to 15% (within line of all of the +str/+def/+attack prayers) it would be *much* more ballanced.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

mabe not 15% ud be better just using a def prayer bbut i do agree its silightly to much mabe 30%

[Nadril]

 

 

prayer only has 100% protection agisnt npc not players also i rarly see people pray in the wilderness any more (unless nonmembers)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It does, however, have a 50% protection against players does it not? That still is technicly cutting the opponents attack/strength skill in HALF from a level 43 [that you can get in a day] skill.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And does it matter if you see a lot of people using it or not? It's still there and it still is an overpowered skill. Perhaps if they lowered it down to 15% (within line of all of the +str/+def/+attack prayers) it would be *much* more ballanced.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

mabe not 15% ud be better just using a def prayer bbut i do agree its silightly to much mabe 30%

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That prayer gives 15% deffense not 15% absorption, two different things my friend, two very different things.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

30% is still much too much.

[Lowgravity]

 

 

 

prayer only has 100% protection agisnt npc not players also i rarly see people pray in the wilderness any more (unless nonmembers)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It does, however, have a 50% protection against players does it not? That still is technicly cutting the opponents attack/strength skill in HALF from a level 43 [that you can get in a day] skill.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And does it matter if you see a lot of people using it or not? It's still there and it still is an overpowered skill. Perhaps if they lowered it down to 15% (within line of all of the +str/+def/+attack prayers) it would be *much* more ballanced.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

mabe not 15% ud be better just using a def prayer bbut i do agree its silightly to much mabe 30%

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That prayer gives 15% deffense not 15% absorption, two different things my friend, two very different things.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

30% is still much too much.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't understand why they even changed it from RS1 melee protect pray (immune against melee attack from monsters, and no effect against other players).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In fairness to Jagex I think they are looking at is wrong with the wilderness and fixing it, or atleast trying. There was a big teleporting issue, they adding teleblock, it's not ideal but they DID do something to counteract it, there's protection prays, they added smite, still not great but still trying to counteract the bad things in the wilderness, 1 iteming people get smited.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Things are slowly getting fixed, it's just not quite there yet.

[123Yourgone]

 

 

 

 

prayer only has 100% protection agisnt npc not players also i rarly see people pray in the wilderness any more (unless nonmembers)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It does, however, have a 50% protection against players does it not? That still is technicly cutting the opponents attack/strength skill in HALF from a level 43 [that you can get in a day] skill.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And does it matter if you see a lot of people using it or not? It's still there and it still is an overpowered skill. Perhaps if they lowered it down to 15% (within line of all of the +str/+def/+attack prayers) it would be *much* more ballanced.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

mabe not 15% ud be better just using a def prayer bbut i do agree its silightly to much mabe 30%

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That prayer gives 15% deffense not 15% absorption, two different things my friend, two very different things.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

30% is still much too much.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't understand why they even changed it from RS1 melee protect pray (immune against melee attack from monsters, and no effect against other players).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In fairness to Jagex I think they are looking at is wrong with the wilderness and fixing it, or atleast trying. There was a big teleporting issue, they adding teleblock, it's not ideal but they DID do something to counteract it, there's protection prays, they added smite, still not great but still trying to counteract the bad things in the wilderness, 1 iteming people get smited.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Things are slowly getting fixed, it's just not quite there yet.

 

 

 

Yeah they add teleblock (which a meleer cant use unless he sacrifices half his food to a mage armour set (an extra 180k loss if he dies).

 

 

 

It also splashes, takes 60 higher mage then the lowest lvl teleport and can be hard to hit on anyone with a decent mage lvl.

[killjoyfuly]

 

 

 

 

 

prayer only has 100% protection agisnt npc not players also i rarly see people pray in the wilderness any more (unless nonmembers)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It does, however, have a 50% protection against players does it not? That still is technicly cutting the opponents attack/strength skill in HALF from a level 43 [that you can get in a day] skill.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And does it matter if you see a lot of people using it or not? It's still there and it still is an overpowered skill. Perhaps if they lowered it down to 15% (within line of all of the +str/+def/+attack prayers) it would be *much* more ballanced.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

mabe not 15% ud be better just using a def prayer bbut i do agree its silightly to much mabe 30%

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That prayer gives 15% deffense not 15% absorption, two different things my friend, two very different things.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

30% is still much too much.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't understand why they even changed it from RS1 melee protect pray (immune against melee attack from monsters, and no effect against other players).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In fairness to Jagex I think they are looking at is wrong with the wilderness and fixing it, or atleast trying. There was a big teleporting issue, they adding teleblock, it's not ideal but they DID do something to counteract it, there's protection prays, they added smite, still not great but still trying to counteract the bad things in the wilderness, 1 iteming people get smited.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Things are slowly getting fixed, it's just not quite there yet.

 

 

 

Yeah they add teleblock (which a meleer cant use unless he sacrifices half his food to a mage armour set (an extra 180k loss if he dies).

 

 

 

It also splashes, takes 60 higher mage then the lowest lvl teleport and can be hard to hit on anyone with a decent mage lvl.

 

 

 

i think he means the 20+wildy telle block (i could be wrong :anxious: )

[Burzuk]

So, tell me, is having a level 43 skill (prayer) that can nearly nulify a 99 skill (attack/strength) really ballanced?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Things "can" be unballanced in a game you know? Just because it is there does not mean it is automaticly ballanced with everything else.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

As far as the 20+ wilderness comment, think about it. If you really want to get a decent kill you probaly need to go as far as 35+ wilderness, because running an odd 10 or so wilderness levels down is easy. Hell, even running from lvl 50 down to 20 is quite easy with some prayer slapped on.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The largest thing is to ensure that my opponent doesn't have a "get out of jail free" card (in the sense) I have to fight opponents over 20-30+ levels higher than me. Not to mention the wilderness is barren up there in the middle, and if you end up going to 50+ wilderness it's just full of 100+'s.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

at any rate, however, prayer is my big one I dislike. Its incredibly overpowered and needs to be taken out of the game.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh and, don't worry, you can still run out of the wilderness without prayer on. We all did it in RSC, and its possible in RS2 as well.

 

 

 

To everything you said there's an answer. Running from the wild it's possible? Does Entangle, Snare or even Bind tell you anything? Sure this might ruin your pure but heck if you don't want them to run go for it...

 

 

 

About prayer, prayer is a very hard skill to level. I think we all agree on this...(don't make up lame excuses now). So it's extremely hard but in the end because it's so hard it pays off greatly. I can't stress this enough...prayer is a combat skill.

 

 

 

Oh and Teleing? Teleblock does exist now.

 

 

 

The only thing i agree on with all you "wilderness-haters" is the increase of untradeable armor allowed in the wild. Other than that if you don't like it don't go in it. :roll:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh and on the whole "43 prayer you could get that in a day..." you could get 50 in any skill in a whole day. No-lifing, 24 hours on with a lot of coffee but you could.

[123Yourgone]

 

 

 

About prayer, prayer is a very hard skill to level. I think we all agree on this...(don't make up lame excuses now).

Prayer is 3rd fastest skill in the game to lvl behind cooking and fletching.

[swampjedi]

Would you two mind cutting down on the quote blocks? It makes this kinda hard to read. Thanks!

[123Yourgone]

Would you two mind cutting down on the quote blocks? It makes this kinda hard to read. Thanks!

 

 

 

Editted it down to the relative post.

[Burzuk]

@ 123yourgone it's easy? you must be talking in terms of clicking. Because it's hard to get the bones. Unless you buy them. Oh and if it is so easy to level how come there aren't that many people with 99 prayer? (that i know of at least)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

@ swampjedi sorry man. Will try to avoid it.

[swampjedi]

This is why debates >>> rants. Thanks guys.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Guess I should contribute!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Loko, I've never had any luck using bind spells on people, and especially teleblock. I'm ok with that, since I have them used on me all the time when I'm runecrafting.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nadril, prayer and teleporting is great for skillers like me. If you restrict them, I'll suffer. Honestly, I think Jagex always has erred on the side of stronger defense than offense, probably for this reason.

[123Yourgone]

@ 123yourgone it's easy? you must be talking in terms of clicking. Because it's hard to get the bones. Unless you buy them. Oh and if it is so easy to level how come there aren't that many people with 99 prayer? (that i know of at least)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

@ swampjedi sorry man. Will try to avoid it.

 

 

 

There is 900 people with 99 prayer.

 

 

 

And yes you buy the bones, but you can still easily collect the bones in 1 day at green dragons.

 

 

 

Fact is prayer hasnt been a hard skill to train since ecto was added and its a lot easier now with house alters.

 

 

 

And my str is 92 on my main ..

 

 

 

I worked for 6 months to get it that high.

 

 

 

Lets say you did it the hard way and buried bones at the alter in wild (rofl.) It would still only take you a week to get 43 prayer.

 

 

 

My 92 str took 7 million xp and 6 months to achieve and any lvl 60 newb can spend a week burying bones and then click a button and half my damage at will.

 

 

 

I propose prayer pots have a lvl requirement added to them, 70 prayer would be good.

[swampjedi]

I say if you're skulled from aggression that you don't get to use protections.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thing is, I think the wild would be empty if that happened.

[123Yourgone]

I say if you're skulled from aggression that you don't get to use protections.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thing is, I think the wild would be empty if that happened.

 

 

 

Nah, people would still pk and thats the best idea.

 

 

 

Prayer comes from saradomin right?.

 

 

 

If saradomin is the god of good he shouldnt support you killing helpless rcers :-s

[Burzuk]

I guess we all know that experience is somewhat doubled whenever you level that's why lvl 1 is 83 exp and lvl 2 is 176 exp. So to get to level 60 in anything is fairly easy compared to get from 95 say to 99.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I am not and never been a member. Yet i do know a lot of Membership benefits (thanks to tip.it for that). I can't say for real how the Wilderness in members works but i am assuming it's more "interesting" and harder in many ways.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh and swampjedi you idea is awesome. that is...if you're attacking another player why would you want to protect yourself? You started it! \

[Nadril]

 

 

 

Nadril, prayer and teleporting is great for skillers like me. If you restrict them, I'll suffer. Honestly, I think Jagex always has erred on the side of stronger defense than offense, probably for this reason.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You don't need to "skill" in the wilderness. It provides better training and better money at a risk. Prayer takes away that risk. It becomes imballanced.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

To everything you said there's an answer. Running from the wild it's possible? Does Entangle, Snare or even Bind tell you anything? Sure this might ruin your pure but heck if you don't want them to run go for it...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not only do I not play anymore but I also PvP'ed with someone who was very heavy on the mage side. And yes it is still incredibly easy to get away even with entangles.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

About prayer, prayer is a very hard skill to level. I think we all agree on this...(don't make up lame excuses now). So it's extremely hard but in the end because it's so hard it pays off greatly. I can't stress this enough...prayer is a combat skill.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And so is attack and strength. A level 43 skill should not be able to "trump" a level 99 skill. It's rediculous to put it simply.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also it is not a hard skill to level.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh and Teleing? Teleblock does exist now.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yeah, it only takes level 85 magic and for you to wear a mage set to use it! It completly leaves melee and rangers out of the picture.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also, you should not have to use a level 85 skill to counter a level 25 skill.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The only thing i agree on with all you "wilderness-haters" is the increase of untradeable armor allowed in the wild. Other than that if you don't like it don't go in it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thats as stupid as saying "LOL if you don't like the game don't play it". So what if people actualy *care* about the games welfare, and want to see a game where the PvP is actualy *gasp* chalanging, and not who can hit their win button faster to get away.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Please, next time, actualy come up with reasons why prayer and teleportation are perfectly ballanced?

[swampjedi]

 

 

 

 

Nadril, prayer and teleporting is great for skillers like me. If you restrict them, I'll suffer. Honestly, I think Jagex always has erred on the side of stronger defense than offense, probably for this reason.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You don't need to "skill" in the wilderness. It provides better training and better money at a risk. Prayer takes away that risk. It becomes imballanced.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This is a pointless statement. You could do PvP in the duel arena, or not at all for that matter if you don't like it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Imbalanced is also a judgment call. It's still PLENTY dangerous for skillers.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now, care to make an actual rebuttal?

[Nadril]

This is a pointless statement. You could do PvP in the duel arena, or not at all for that matter if you don't like it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Imbalanced is also a judgment call. It's still PLENTY dangerous for skillers.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now, care to make an actual rebuttal?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not sure how that wasn't, but anyways:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

As I've said many areas in the wilderness are grand places for money/leveling. From the green dragons to the rune rocks it provides areas that can make you some *great* wealth if used.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The off set to this is the challange. You have to watch your back all of the time from other players looking to kill you. Prayer, to be honest, is too easy of a get away. Simply pray -- run to level 20 wilderness -- teleport.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The largest thing is that most "skillers" in the wilderness wear no armor. Esentialy the only "protection" they want to wear is their prayer, which costs them absolutly nothing to use. Armor no longer takes up inventory space which means that a skiller should deffend themself in the wilderness, through armor and running.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now, I still stand by that a 15% absorption prayer would be aeons better than 50% because it would still provide that edge to those trying to get away, but wouldn't be the end all be all skill.

[killjoyfuly]

i usaly take full prosy when i doing a wildy clue for 2 resons addy def values (or somthing liek that) plus if i get jumped by a team i can pray for longer as i run out o wildy/ telle at lvl 20

[123Yourgone]

i usaly take full prosy when i doing a wildy clue for 2 resons addy def values (or somthing liek that) plus if i get jumped by a team i can pray for longer as i run out o wildy/ telle at lvl 20

 

 

 

Thanks for making the point for us.

[swampjedi]

In his defense, he's a clue hunter.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nadril, I'll reply to that when I get home from work.

[Striker6]

There is a useful way to cure the wilderness of cowards. That is to remove the "protect from melee, ranged, magic etc" and the ability to teleport from the wilderness. Because of these factors it becomes harder to get a kill and easier to escape from a pker. All well and good for the skillers, however there is only a small area of the Runescape map where people can kill eachother I think the wild should be changed to a place where you can actually die.

[Mayjest]

I have no idea what you're talking about... wilderness is ruined, ha!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The wilderness is a place where players prey on other players. 'Normal' players are tempted in there by the promise of riches or better xp and promptly killed by Pkers, that is the way it is supposed to work. PKers kill skillers.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now, as a skiller in general (or at least, anything but a PKer) this annoys me greatly when I go to green dragons. Everytime I go, I wish I hadn't made that promise to myself that I wouldn't pay for raw materials if I could help it. But that is the way the wildy works.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

To those complaining that they can't kill other PKers - well you're technically not supposed to! According to the Knowledge base (or at least the impression given off by it) you're supposed to be evil mercenary types preying on the innocents weaker than you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And this is why, despite being a skiller, despite getting PK'd on average once every 8 trips to whatever I need to level at the time (roughly 3 failed attempts for every sucessful kill), despite the fact that dieing absolutely infuriates me, I will always support the wilderness and refuse to believe that it is broken. Why? Because I get killed by PKers, and that is the way it is supposed to me.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Mayjest

[Nadril]

There is a useful way to cure the wilderness of cowards. That is to remove the "protect from melee, ranged, magic etc" and the ability to teleport from the wilderness. Because of these factors it becomes harder to get a kill and easier to escape from a pker. All well and good for the skillers, however there is only a small area of the Runescape map where people can kill eachother I think the wild should be changed to a place where you can actually die.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Completly agreed. In my multitude of trips I would always make to the wilderness back when I played (in rs2) I would hardly see people die!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Combat can be slower paced if it isn't two pures fighting too. With food it pretty much can turn to be quite long. IMO make it so you can't eat food in a fight again, like in RSC. That would speed stuff up a bit.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

edit: or even better, make it so you can only use it every X ammount of seconds.

[Doughnut]

I actually like the idea of reducing the size of the wildernes. Some modifications that could actually go a long way to helping the wilderness:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Untradeable items drop as an alchable note that has a value ranging from 50-100k depending on the item.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Reducing the wilderness to 30 levels for the main part(still leaving mage bank the way it is)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No protection prayers will work in the wilderness.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

When fighting another player outside of mini-games/duel arena you have 30 seconds to logg, attack another player, be attacked.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Multi combat would only be high level wilderness for those clan wars.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No teleporting or change teleblock to a level 50-70 spell.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Those all seem like they would go a long way to stopping some of the things people complain about.