Tip.It Times Presents: The Good, The Bad and the...

[Necromancer_Magic]

This article is so truthfull.

 

 

 

It is so filled with truth im renaiming it Verity (truth XD)

 

 

 

This is the kinds of article i like, it tells members the Real news - not sugercoated stuff (like jagex does -.-)

[zander459]

You know youÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢ve been playing too much Runescape if:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In real life you and your friend are walking through a door, and your friend makes it though just fine, but for some reason you canÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t manage to get through, so you just stand beside the doorway, nose to wall, trying in vain to break through the wall, while an inviting doorway is just steps awayÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâæ..ifÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâæ..onlyÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâæÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâæyou ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâæÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâæ.knewÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâæÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâæ howÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâæ.toÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâæbackÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâæ.upÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâæ.and walk around the door jamb! Lord! WouldnÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t that be a stroke of genius! Problem solving at its highest level! But, unfortunately, this level of insight is simply beyond youÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâæ.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

OR

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In real life, your friend goes up a staircase, but you are unsure as to how to climb the stairs. (You knew how to climb stairs on other occasions, but the concept eludes you now. How very strange!) So you stay at the bottom of the stairs until (missing your friend) you just run off, willy-nilly, in the vague direction the staircase was pointing, looking for your friend (whom you saw climb the staircaseÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâæyou know this deep in your subconscious, but somehow this fact has divested itself from your short term memory ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Ãâ early onset AlzheimerÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s perhaps?). You just keep mindlessly running until your energy runs out and you collapse from exhaustion.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

My character in RS is as dumb as a rock. Yours is too.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This is because the Runescape AI is embarrassingly bad. Surely, by now, either Andrew or some other programmer at Jagex should have been embarrassed enough about these obvious flaws to fix them.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

These types of issues really irritate many older players and those younger players who are more sophisticated or experienced game players than their peers. They should have been fixed long ago. They have lead to attrition in the game, and this attrition will accelerate as the RS population ages. It is not "whining" to point out the truth.

[D. V. Devnull]

zander, nice examples. I'm laughing my rear off here just reading them. They're soooo freaking true. :lol: ...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Mr. Devnull

[zander459]

 

 

 

There is huge confrontation of interests in terms of what low-levels want (more, easy updates) and what older players want (less, high-quality and difficult updates). Jagex is siding with the low-levels, yet it still has a 13+ age limit. People are under the impression this game is for older people, yet Jagex make updates aimed at 10 year olds, and not enough of them to keep the low-levels happy.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ginger -

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You are dead on, of course. In addition to losing players, over the past year and a half I have seen the RS population at schools with which I am familar getting significantly YOUNGER, with only a few remaining players over 13, and the rest under 13. No wonder, with the way Jagex is running the game, but one wonders how this meshes with their "no player under 13" policy.

[D. V. Devnull]

In addition to losing players, over the past year and a half I have seen the RS population at schools with which I am familar getting significantly YOUNGER, with only a few remaining players over 13, and the rest under 13. No wonder, with the way Jagex is running the game, but one wonders how this meshes with their "no player under 13" policy.

 

 

 

Sounds like some schools aren't blocking stuff they should be. :( ...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Mr. Devnull

[zander459]

I wasn't as clear as I should have been. The schools don't allow RS to be played AT SCHOOL, but all the schoolkids know which kids play which games.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Currently, most RS players at these schools are under 13. This wasn't true a few years ago, when most players I knew of were over 13. Of course, this isn't a scientific survey, but it has been an interesting trend to watch.

[D. V. Devnull]

Can you imagine what will happen, though, if Kindergarteners start playing RuneScape? It'd be end of the world! :cry: ... (Not like this WOULD happen, but it could with how things are going.)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Mr. Devnull

[King_Peter18]

Now JaGeX has to go and nerf the barrelchest anchor and make it cost 700k to buy. Then they make it so that when you die with it, it becomes 220k. Now, why didn't they do that to the fremmy helm and the Granite Plate? (Off topic)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It was never against the rules to play under the age of 13. You just need parental consent to do so. Which I am sure very few of these kids do. I am 13, and alot of people have respect for me. Stop stereotyping kids my age and below. Not all of us are stupid. You have no idea what it feels like to be constantly stereotyped like this. Alot of kids I know watch alot of TV shows that, well, I was never allowed to watch and never watch to this very day. Those TV shows teach those kids how to act like fools. Now, then they're friends start acting out, and guess what. So do they.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Then they all start acting out in Runescape and what do we have? Immature players.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Please, stop stereotyping kids my age and below, we aren't all fools.

[Ginger_Warrior]

With respect, the point we are making is that there's been a slow trend in the age limit of 13 not only being reached, but dropping below. When I say "younger, low-levels", I don't mean 13 year-olds. People of your age are perfectly good and able to play this game, and sure you may have grievences, but people of your age group have the ability to look at a problem empathically, logically and analogically; and then make a solution based on those three criteria.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

One of the problem arises because the kind of players we're talking about (ie. 10 year olds, I've seen as low as an 8 year old playing this game!) don't have that ability. And that's no disrespect to the individual person, but it's just at that age group you haven't developed enough to understand that other people's viewpoints matter. Hence why you get the:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

"zomg da wip is so pwrd up n it nt far coz i cnt us coz im a pur an jagex ur nubs coz i kep gtin ownd n if ne1 wnts to flm me den i own dem in da wildy n pwn u."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jagex of course isn't in the least bit threatened by these threads, but because it seems so hell-bent on making this game attractive to the younger kids, they'll jump for it. This applies for the rocks at CW, this applies for the barrelchest anchor, this applies for protection prayers. The list that shows how the power of younger pressure infulences Jagex goes on and on. And this is at the real dismay of many of us older players, that do see things in a much more bigger picture, and will look at things like the economy, and how it affects each group of players. Only then do we make up our mind about what should happen - we don't just look at our own personal problems and how we can be benefited from X update by Jagex, and thus only push for our own advantage.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Like I said, Jagex needs to make its mind up. You're right, there is no technical age limit. But there is a mental age limit to this game, and if you're just not up to the challenge of facing 16 year olds and above, then this isn't the game for you. Come back when you're older, becasue there's a real problem when the opinions of a tiny minority of people half my age is being put before the majority of older, mid-high levels.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I hope that clear things up. We're not stereotyping anyone, we're just saying that in general, the people who Jagex seem to always to listen to are kids. And we're sick to the teeth of it after a year and a half of the game being dumbed down.

[zander459]

King Peter ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Ãâ

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I donÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t know what offended you. I went out of my way not to say anything that could remotely be construed as insulting to younger players, and it seems to me that others took similar care.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This thread isnÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t an ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¦Ã¢â¬Åolder player vs. younger playerÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâÃ

[King_Peter18]

Ok, thank you for clearing that up. There are some posts a few pages back that set me off. Sorry about that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I have found that I only get on Runescape to chat with friends now. As it is now probably comparable with Habbo Hotel as far as chatting goes. I am tired of the game being dumbed down as well. Alot of other games I play have followed that course. Really making me mad. "You are entering the Warzone" "Are you sure you want to?" "Still sure?" "Are you STILL SURE??"

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Is that your final answer? Is that your FINAL answer?? Is that your FINAL ANSWER??? Are you SURE??? Reminds me of Windows Vista. "Are you sure you want to allow this? ARE YOU STILL SURE????

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Lol. Lets see, does anyone see JaGeX changing in the next six months? I don't have any hopes.

[zander459]

Glad you are happy again.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Truth is that no intelligent person, regardless of age, likes being talked down to. That's why most well-designed games avoid this repetitive questioning like the plague.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Is anyone on this thread NOT aware that the desert is beyond Shanty Pass? Can't we all SEE the sand? Don't the camels give it away?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I am very much in favor of a "Kill Shanty and All His Stupid Guards" option. If we can get this put into place, I promise that once I have taken control of the pass, I will let you all through without asking you any more foolish questions.

[Azzazeal]

 

 

 

I couldnÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t agree more.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jagex seems to believe that people leave Runescape more out of BOREDOM than out of FRUSTRATION. Said another way, Jagex believes that it will keep people interested in the game by rapidly introducing new quests, new sets of clothing, new treasure trail items, etc., and it conversely believes that it should place a lower priority on updating the actual gameplay engine and features, because failure to update the gameplay engine leads to relatively less attrition than failure to ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¦Ã¢â¬Åkeep people interestedÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâÃ

[odeon40]

It may seem that aiming at younger children is a bad idea, but younger children are better at persuading parents to pay for membership, I'm sure it'll balance out eventually... or something and if jagex is aiming for money, prehaps it means they are planning to expand? And in expanding means more cool stuff? :-k

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also if it seems they are aiming at younger, it might just be becuase your getting older :-s

[King_Peter18]

JaGeX won't rise with the players, they will continue to advertise to the younger crowd. Why would they move up with them as they get older?

[D. V. Devnull]

JaGeX won't rise with the players, they will continue to advertise to the younger crowd. Why would they move up with them as they get older?

 

 

 

If Jagex can continue to hang on to the older players for longer, those older players can bring in other older players, and those other older players would possibly become members in part just because they have the money to do so.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Of note, money is something which younger players do not have directly at their control. Younger players are at the restrictive mercy of their parents.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Therefore, if Jagex REALLY wants more money, they need to take measures to hang onto the older, more experienced players.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

'Nuff said.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Mr. Devnull

[Ginger_Warrior]

 

JaGeX won't rise with the players, they will continue to advertise to the younger crowd. Why would they move up with them as they get older?

 

 

 

If Jagex can continue to hang on to the older players for longer, those older players can bring in other older players, and those other older players would possibly become members in part just because they have the money to do so.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Of note, money is something which younger players do not have directly at their control. Younger players are at the restrictive mercy of their parents.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Therefore, if Jagex REALLY wants more money, they need to take measures to hang onto the older, more experienced players.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

'Nuff said.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Mr. Devnull

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also, on less of a financial note, it would benefit the overall morale of the RS community if they listened to the older plasyers much more than they are right now. As things stand, the community is full of kids that have been attracted here, because of that advert and their own word-of-mouth. If you made the updates more driven towards what high levels want (and therefore, start to let fansites such as Tip.It have more of a say or invovlement in Jagex's research process), then the rate at which older people join up to the game will increase, and this wil counteract against the percentage of younger, immature players.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So therefore, allowing us to go along with Jagex, and not against them, would also have a positive impact on the community. I just hope Jagex doesn't think that the new Capital Latters update as a panacea for this lol.

[bluefusionx]

I used to always look forward to updates. What wonderful quest or new area are we going to experience? New skill, more bank space, extended features?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Well since Hunter came out, everything has went downhill. Hunter was and is the most useless skill. I hunt things in quests and with my weapons, I don't need some fancy gadgets to hunt birds.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From then on we had pointless updates and very infuriating updates ranging from cats not being allowed in castle wars (what is the point of that) and Rule 7's meddling (angers me the most). The quests were all too easy and it's just boring. Make some free quests for easiness. I think most members are quite experienced.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Rule 7 is just pointless. Control how we communicate with the players and how we interact. That is the point of their power. When you go into taking the BROWSERS we play the game with and choosing what can and cannot work is just too much. They even try to control what we do on the Internet! IRC chatrooms are something entirely different than RuneScape and they regulate what is allowed in the clients bundled with toolkits. I am quite sorry, but I do many other things on the Internet besides RuneScape. To be that obsessed with every little ad click is too much.. No company should take money over its guests. It's paying customers! (An experienced publisher should know that banner ads aren't clicked anymore. Sorry it's not 1998 anymore. Get contextual advertising.)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jagex seems more focused on money than their players. All successful companies meet the customer demands before anything. Where I work "customers are the key." I'm on the edge of a limb and if things don't get better I might not keep playing. When all my fun is taken out of a game, what's the point in playing?

[zander459]

I've seen this before in other companies.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think we are seeing the "dark side" of Jagex's growth.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

When companies are growing as quickly as Jagex, they lose focus, get very non-linear and don't think through things well. There is often infighting among factions at these companies. These factions have different ideas about how things should be done, so decisions are often made only to be "unmade" shortly thereafter.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So.....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jagex can't make a decision on Rule 7 and stick with it. They keep whipsawing people.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jagex can't figure out what do do with the new Anchor weapon, so they introduce it one way, then almost immediately change its stats, its cost to get repaired, and what happens when it gets PK'd.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jagex makes random, odd changes, like changing the way all of the worlds are referenced - deleting city names, and thus taking away a convenient way to tell people where you play (e.g., I play on one of the St Louis member worlds) - and then they give an explanation that, to me, seemed to be complete nerd speak gobbledy[grime]. (I wonder what faction at Jagex dictated this change....)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

To keep a virtual world feeling stable, it is necessary for the players to believe that the coding authority is thoughtful and consistent. I think that Jagex's growth issues are making the game feel less stable and much more random than it should feel. When companies lose internal focus, it becomes more important than ever for them to listen to their more thoughtful customers (of whatever age), who will help "re-focus" the company on what should be important.

[king_muumuu]

Well, as I've read through these 4 pages, I've seen basically two main people with strong valid points: Ginger Warrior and Baron8000. And Baron, I agree with Ginger more.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Baron, you do come up with a ton of good points. I think that the main reason people are annoyed is because Jagex is trying to have too much control. While Jagex does have complete right and control over the game, most players feel they are taking advantage of this. Like I said before, Jagex is making the game they want it to be, not the way we (the players) want it to be. While Jagex is not obligated for any reason to do whatever we want, I think it would be in their best interest to.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I remember reading through the archives of the Tip.It news and reading how the person who wrote it met up with Andrew in game, who was wearing the first set of full addy and rune 2h I think. This is of course no longer the case. The only interacting that I know about between Tip.It and Jagex recently was when Jagex threatened Tip.It with legal action because of the one controversial Times. I think that Jagex should be more supportive of rule-abiding fansites, rather than trying to shun us away from them. With the addition of the RuneScape knowledge base, banning clients, banning certain signatures for other forums, and the like, they sure aren't respectful of the work that fansites like this are trying to do. They just up and put SwiftSwitch illegal for example, without telling Strider first. Now that poor guy who doesn't even play anymore is trying to make us and Jagex happy. It isn't fair.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The reason that most people haven't quit is because they don't want to. Sure I don't really like what Jagex is doing (big understatement) but that doesn't mean I'm just going to up and quit. I don't know what I'd do in my spare time. Personally I'd rather play a game with a bunch of narrow-minded founders than watch cable TV. So while Jagex is trying to keep control, more people will become unhappy. Can you imagine if the relationship between Jagex and it's paying customers was actually good for the most part, rather than bad? I sure can't.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jagex is just digging their own grave. I remember when there used to be tons more worlds coming out each month. This increase of players is no longer happening. Sure according to Wikipedia the increase of players is still raising, but on a graph it would be leveling out. I wouldn't be surprised if more mature players started quitting after finally being fed up. This would make the game more full of kiddies who would annoy the rest of the mature players who didn't quit already. Jagex would be stuck with more people sending in stupid querys and ban appeals, wasting resources back in the UK. This would lead to Jagex trying to get more control. I see a big bad cycle starting, and by the way things are going, nothing is changing for the better.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Your end is coming sooner and sooner Jagex. I know that you're trying to make things better, but how can you keep turning a blind eye to all this? I along with many people are fed up, and I haven't even been playing that long and I can still figure it out.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Supply and demand. Us RuneScape players 'demand' a good, fun, creative and mature game. You 'supply' us with a dumbed-down, toddler-aimed game that shuns good things like SwiftSwitch, other fansites and probably even these forums, where people can post ideas that your forum mods would lock instantly.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Please let your baby go, she's all grown up.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That is precisely the reason why, after 3 years of playing, I quit RuneScape. I'm NOT bored with the game, but I don't want to play a game that's doomed to be a kiddie playground. YES, I'm unlike most other people, I AM doing something other than complaining in the forums about the situation. I'm removing 5 dollars from their monthly revenue.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm now trying to find some other MMORPG to spend my spare time with. I'm sure there are plenty of good ones out there with Devs that actually listen to their players. I'll eventually find it :D

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Well since Hunter came out, everything has went downhill. Hunter was and is the most useless skill. I hunt things in quests and with my weapons, I don't need some fancy gadgets to hunt birds.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jagex seems more focused on money than their players. All successful companies meet the customer demands before anything. Where I work "customers are the key." I'm on the edge of a limb and if things don't get better I might not keep playing. When all my fun is taken out of a game, what's the point in playing?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1- No, firemaking is. Hunter is second.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2- That's why I quit!

[nashy14]

^To the post above^

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Alot of players asked for a skill like hunter as it's a skill where you can show of how focused and how hard you train. Not everyone is like this (not many people at all) but some people jsut want a skill that will take a long time to train and will have no real rewards (so you can be one of the few with a high level in it).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Firemaking is totaly different and effect the opposit type of players, firemaking was useful before when there was no mas coooking in rouges den or on ranges, you would start a fire when you were low of food from fighting. Times have changed but firemaking used to be a skill that just went up depending on how long you had been exploring, not a skill that you had to "train".

[nashy14]

Back on-topic my 8 year old brother plays runescape (picked it up off me :oops: ) and now all him 8 yearold friends play to tho most games involve them standing in a feild saying "moo" over and over.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Most kids are used to being able to cheat a game (I never did it but alot of people find that fun :| ) That is why people are being dragged into account trading, money buying and scamming. The parents seem to know less than the 8- players themselves tho.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If anyone would like to see what I meen search "Runescape" in Google groups - I'm not sure if thats allowed so edit it for me if it's not.

[jimjimson]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From then on we had pointless updates and very infuriating updates ranging from cats not being allowed in castle wars (what is the point of that) and Rule 7's meddling (angers me the most). The quests were all too easy and it's just boring. Make some free quests for easiness. I think most members are quite experienced.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take. This is not yours to take.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

See why they got rid of it?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you can find the hidden message you are good. Cause if you only get to see 5 things you won't get the "special prize".

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Actually, it's not that hard to see, but runescape chat isn't like this.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I do agree with the rule 7 thing though.

[D. V. Devnull]

LOL @ jimjimson's post... :lol: ... That IS funny.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Mr. Devnull

[jimjimson]

And true. They really ought to change the options on cats so "walk here" is on top.