Obtaurian

So essentially forgo cls and get maul? Yeah, you easily have the stats to slay wyverns with a maul. HOWEVER, I always bring a CLS + shield just in case I get frozen and can't move.

No, not worth using a RoW. CLS > rapier on wyverns. Maul > CLS/rapier on waterfiends and wyverns.

NO U

Been a long time since I last read a Times article. Now I remember why I stopped.

I don't like Nirvana. But I don't like "grunge" in general.

New keyer and new wingman! USA Hell Yes and Mr Greens, respectively. :thumbup:

I highly recommend that you look into collecting mort myre fungi. There's no competition and it's an easy ~700k/h as long as you've done the required quests (which are low-level quests). Collect fungi and start farming the most profitable herb you can at your farming level. There are a few fungi guides in the AOW. I believe there's two big ones, but one is better than the other. I'll go find it for you. EDIT: Here's the guide: http://forum.tip.it/topic/262591-guide-to-harvesting-mort-myre-fungus/page__p__4339635__hl__mort__fromsearch__1#entry4339635 According to this guide, fungi should be about ~600k gp/h right now, assuming faster methods of banking that are mentioned in the replies.

teehee

I still don't see what your argument is.

I don't see your point. If they don't know, they need to learn. If they don't want to learn, don't dg with them. Very simple.

GDs aren't the whole combat situations in dungeoneering. People with offensive third binds need to learn safe-spotting/kiting/side-stepping to avoid 1) having to eat and 2) dying. I think your disdain for offensive third binds might stem from a lack of combat "finesse" in dungeoneering, so to speak, which is confusing to me because I know you're good at combat in general, Games.

A better question is: How much are floors sped up by all five players having offensive third binds and making good use of them? While offensive third binds are hardly the only reason for faster floors, they're a non-trivial improvement.

Dungeoneer'd. With me.

Difference being that you can avoid death with or without a platebody, but you can't increase your DPS beyond a certain point without the items you listed. :thumbup:

That's like saying rape is okay as long as it's fast.

Spirit dags with scrolls are pretty much better than any other combat familiar till 89.

We use the friends clan chat, and we're always open to Tipiters. EDIT: Fail.

Geomancer is somewhat like Blink and Gravecreeper in that you need ragers/armor/potions to hit well. I would say that ragers are necessary for geomancer, so this shouldn't be an issue.

Yeah, always be on mage/zerker. Just slow switch to blitzer later.

Skeletal horde skeletons have zero defense. I can hex the melee skeletons with near 100% accuracy. And Green I'll amend in the guide that prayer flashing is for battleaxes and 2hs. :P

I didn't cover armor binds because there's not a lot to them other than reducing damage. In my opinion, you go 1-99 without an armor bind, so why do you suddenly need armor at 100+? :P But in all seriousness, I think armor is perfectly fine for people who key the vast majority of the time, so long as they're not using it as a crutch; keyers should learn to avoid death without armor before they bind armor. If I had to recommend an offensive third bind to a keyer, I'd say celestial staff. Just make sure you have a reliable teammate to make you fire runes. EDIT: Sagittarian body isn't really worth it without a hex. Sagittarian protects you from shades while plates protect you from everything else.

Finally finished it. All of you 100+ dgers need to read this. If you see anything you'd like me to add, just post in the thread or whatever. My brain is fried. MY THIRD BIND GUIDE: http://forum.tip.it/topic/293372-third-bind-guide-andor-discussion/#entry4843027

Third Bind Guide and/or Discussion. * Certain sections of this guide are somewhat out-of-date. Please hold while I redirect your call. [spoiler=Introduction.]The purpose of this guide/topic is twofold: To provide insight into the proper use of third binds to maximize room-clearing efficiency. To provide a point of discussion and research for furthering knowledge of combat strategy in dungeoneering. [spoiler=Celestial catalytic staff / empowered fire staff.] / Used with: Primal battleaxe. Monsters: Forgotten warriors, high-level skeletons, fire giants, level 169+ ghosts, demons, brutes, earth warriors, Bosses: Skeletal horde (with fire surge), skeletal trio warrior (and archer when it prays melee), Necrolord, Dreadnaught, Hope Devourer, World-gorger (the mage eye). Strategy: A celestial staff can be thought of as the hexhunter's counterpart. With a t10 ring and fire surge, it has higher DPS than a primal 2h with turmoil on many monsters (note that this does not apply to an empowered fire staff). - A celestial staff has two major "drawbacks" that users must always be aware of and try to work around: It consumes fire runes very quickly. The user must be on the lookout for essence and fire rune drops at all times, and only stop to make fire runes when appropriate. It's also helpful to have other players craft fire runes for the celestial staff user when they can. The start table usually has a decent stack of fire runes; 1,250 fire runes is 125 casts of fire surge; do not make more than necessary. Overuse can lead to an empty CSB. Logging in and out replenishes the CSB, but deletes the player's personal gate. Players should be extremely conscious of rune consumption and try to avoid having to logout. Staff users should be chosen to do portal rooms in warped floors if possible. - Lazy celestial staff users who can't be bothered to keep their fire rune supply nice and healthy would be better off binding an empowered fire staff. The empowered staff hits higher with fire surge than a celestial staff does with air surge. Obviously this is less than ideal. - Room-clearing strategy is similar to what hex users do. The player should always enter a room with their magic ring activated, focusing on forgotten warriors and all other magic-weak monsters listed (after shades are taken care of; do not use fire surge on shades!). Once the necessary monsters are down, the staff user can continue fire surging zombies, skeletons, and anything else that isn't resistant to magic depending on fire rune supply and charges remaining in the CSB (should not be done by empowered fire staff users or with wind surge). - Celestial staff users should start their floors on blazer, switching to t10 blitzer when fire runes are plentiful (note that this does not mean having both magic rings on quickswitch). Players who plan on binding celestial staffs should focus on leveling blazer to t10 before blitzer; blitzer only becomes worthwhile at t10 whereas blazer is always useful. - A battleaxe is the preferred weapon to pair with a staff because it's better than a 2h against zombies and skeletons, which is likely what'll be left to kill after all the mage-weak monsters are gone. Ease of switching is not a valid reason, as a player's APM (actions per minute) should be good enough to switch with a 2h anyway. - Kiting, safe-spotting, and side-stepping are extremely important for staff users as a means to reduce prayer and food consumption. - Having more than one staff on a team may present difficulties; essence and rune drops are likely to be fought over, greatly diminishing the usefulness of all staff users on the team. [spoiler=Primal gauntlets.] Used with: Primal battleaxe, primal 2h. Strategy: A very simple item that augments the user's strength while providing a tiny bit of melee defense. These fashionable orange mittens make the primal battleaxe unequivocally better than a prom 2h when used properly. Interestingly enough, a primal battleaxe with gauntlets provides higher raw DPS than a 2h with a rapier, but lacks the stab option of the rapier combo. Primal gauntlets are the first of two offensive third binds that a team can have multiples of without ever diminishing its usefulness. [spoiler=Blood necklace.] Used with: Primal battleaxe, primal 2h. Strategy: A blood necklace offers the second highest strength bonus of any non-weapon in dungeoneering (primal gauntlets are the first), as well as a wide range of significant accuracy and defense bonuses. It has no level requirement, thus making it the best 3rd bind for any non-maxed player, hands down. It's the second of the two offensive third binds that a team can have multiples of without ever diminishing its usefulness. - With a blood necklace, it's important to always be conscious of the fact that each monster near you improves your overall DPS by way of the passive damaging/healing effect (40 damage per monster within a 3x3 square per 15 seconds). If you're going to be praying melee anyway, it's always best to drag any melee monsters toward you either by attacking them or removing your hood (if there aren't a lot of rangers as well). In rooms where micromanaging monsters isn't possible because of high damage, always look for clusters of monsters and stand in them to maximize passive healing and damage. Be aware of other blood necklace users and work with them to herd monsters more quickly. - The healing provided by a blood necklace is non-trivial. In addition to guardian rooms, the healing ability is useful in mercenary rooms, the second form of Flesh-spoiler (stand on top of the player the spawns are attacking), and Necrolord when tanking the skeletons. - It’s useful to let the blood necklace kill level 3 monsters so as to not waste attack turns. In some situations it may be useful to let the necklace finish other monsters off so as to avoid overkill loss. - It’s important to note that the blood necklace saves both an inventory space (as opposed to secondary weapons like hexes, rapiers, etc) and an equipment slot (there's no other useful amulet in dungeoneering that can be gotten as a drop). [spoiler=Hexhunter bow.] Used with: Promethium or primal 2h. Monsters: Forgotten mages, necros, dragons, demons, hobgoblins (optional), brutes, books, skeletal mages (with ranged armor/potion), reborn mages, ghost room ghosts (except level 199 ghosts), ramokee stormbringer, ramokee skinweaver, mercenary leader. Bosses: Shadow-forger, Pummeler, Geomancer, Bulwark (after breaking armor), Skeletal Horde, Cursebearer, Skeletal trio sorcerer, Necrolord, Runebound Behemoth, Gravecreeper (with boosts, armor, or ragers), Flesh-spoiler, Blink (with boosts, armor, or ragers), World-gorger (needs at least three hexes to be effective), Kal’Ger (mage form). Strategy: If you find yourself on a team with a hex, follow this rule above all else: DO NOT ATTACK SINGLE MAGES/NECROS/REBORNS. EVER. DON'T DO IT. It's only ever viable to attack mages when there's more than one and they pose an immediate threat (necros and reborns in particular). Note that this does not necessarily apply to skeleton mages. - Similar to a celestial staff, hex users should always enter guardian rooms with their bows equipped and desperado activated. A single hex is more effective against a t11 mage than five primal 2hs with turmoil, so as mentioned, it's extremely important for non-hexes to leave mages alone in most situations. - Hexes should make use of safe-spotting, side-stepping, and kiting to avoid melee monsters while hexing. - Ranged armor from drops and the start table should always be given to hexes. The bow itself has low accuracy against some monsters and every additional accuracy boost is non-trivial. With just a stegoleather body, players can effectively hex skeleton mages that otherwise have too much defense. - Speaking of ranged armor, hex users should learn to hunt dinos and craft armor lossless. Skinning a dino produces 2-4 hides, so chaps (3 hides) and vambs (1 hide) should be the first pieces of armor made. It's also worthwhile for non-hex teammates to make ranged armor for the hex. Ranged armor is especially effective at bosses (Blink and Gravecreeper in particular). - A nifty trick known to just about any f2p PKer is the ranged->2h switch. A player can run towards a monster while shooting arrows, then switch to a 2h to deliver the KO or just to do a little extra damage without losing time. This is especially useful for shades, skeleton mages, lower level monsters, and dogs. The switch must be very quick to be effective. - Shades, though they have a magic attack, are not particularly vulnerable to hexes, so the hex->2h switch should be used when possible in the off-chance that the hex hit is high. Otherwise, just stick to melee for shades. It's sometimes useful to use the speed of the hex to aggro shades in monoliths. - Ghost room ghosts have lower defense than normal ghosts. Aside from the level 199 ghosts (unless the hex user is sporting some leather pants or is potted), any of the ghosts can be hexed effectively. If the hex user has plenty of prayer, it's useful for him/her to aggro every ghost in the room so as to save prayer and food for everyone else. - Hexes can easily solo Necrolord without taking any damage. It is highly recommended to use a strong ranged potion and a deathslinger, and either the hex user or a teammate should see to making them as soon as possible; the time and ammo saved is very much worth the effort. Necrolord has two types of attacks aside from summoning skeletons: His standard "earth" magic attack that can be negated with protection prayers. His "special attacks," which are his binds and curses. The special attacks can be evaded by moving exactly two tiles away (read: putting two tiles between the player's current and previous locations). When the skeletons are summoned, the player must teleport out using a personal gatestone and either get prayer or GGS to help with whatever the team is doing for about twenty to thirty seconds. If Necrolord is very low on LP and the player has enough food, it's sometimes useful to simply switch to protect melee for the skeletons and tank the magic attacks so as to kill Necrolord without having to teleport out again. - Assuming plenty of food and a bloodrager, Cursebearer and Flesh-spoiler can be soloed, too. However, it's often not worth the food/deaths/effort (this applies to Cursebearer more than Flesh-spoiler). - It's useful for hexes to snipe mages in upcoming GDs or skill/puzzle rooms to save the team food/prayer/stress. - Having more than three hexes on a team can be detrimental due to the lack of CSBs. In such occurrences, the hex users should take care to pick up all mage runes to compensate. This is especially problematic on low warped floors. - Gravecreeper/entgallow longbows should be salvaged from dead forgotten rangers to be used on ranged-weak, non-hexable monsters like brutes and dogs. [spoiler=Primal pickaxe.]Just kidding. [spoiler=A Slight Diversion: Two-handed swords and Primal battleaxes.] / vs. - Two-handed swords and battleaxes serve different purposes when room-clearing. Battleaxes should focus on zombies, most skeletons, and lower defense/level monsters. Two-handed swords should focus on t11 rangers and other monsters with non-trivial defense. Assuming ideal conditions, proper room-clearing strategy, and efficient turmoil/piety-flashing, battleaxe users should deal out more damage than 2h users over time. However, 2hs are more useful on un-rager'd bosses than a battleaxe, which isn't uncommon. - 3rd bind choice largely affects main bind choice, and all pairings recommended in this guide are for the purpose of maximizing overall DPS and effectiveness (pairing a battleaxe with a rapier, for example, is largely redundant; the two weapons encroach on each other's territory in guardian rooms). - Because a battleaxe is more difficult to use properly, it is highly recommended that all players stick to a prom 2h until they've learned proper room-clearing strategy and prioritization. - All players should learn to turmoil/piety-flash consistently and efficiently to make the most out of either weapon. [spoiler=Credits.]First and foremost I'd like to thank myself for existing; it's not easy being the epitome of awesome. However, praise must be awarded to certain dudes and dudettes who offered criticism, knowledge, research, and advice that was immensely helpful in getting this guide written in a timely manner. Certain sections were written by and/or paraphrased from said dudes/dudettes. My unwitting sheep esteemed colleagues are, in what may or may not be a very particular order: - Green Rect - Grimy Bunyip - 0xpx0 - Michael - Cheeesy - Rocked - The Bemis - Accept Death - The Ancient - Matt Marche - xAYSx DPS - Enaid Anwen - Nikcevich - Gwynrwyn - Vexn - Jmmy - Pachelbel - Tui - Losing Games - A Final Name - Golvellius

teach me how to dougie skill without wanting to kill myself.