Michaael

Edit: Faked :shame:

Mass inflation and economic ruin aren't under the category of "destroy"? What if I rephrased it with "greatly reduced playing enjoyment due to gp being worthless and raw materials at sky high prices*"? *Due to the problem of 26king bringing in so much cash Edit: added the *

Summer of '04. Good times :thumbup:

[hide=] The positive effect of PVP's stimulus to materials is nowhere near sufficient to offset the incurred inflation driven by cash-based drops ranging into the several million GP realm. So long as this method remains the best way to make money, the game will continue to skew towards imbalance. Raws, such as yews, mithril/adamant/rune, herbs, etc. will continue to be driven higher and higher, until the pursuit of those items becomes a relatively desirable activity again. While this seems like "normal order", it is not. The game is based on a delicate pricing balance wherein items such as yew log prices drive several other indices, as well as potential use of skills such as fletching, magic, etc. When raws [bleep]e, those that skill are absolutely -crushed- by this influx of cash. Additionally, your gold pile is fast approaching Enron stock status as toilet paper, as the buying power of gold is continually driven further and further down by the influx of cash to the game. The fact that PVP is naturally desirable from a fun AND profit perspective creates an imbalance that, left unhindered, will destroy the game. [/hide] Spot on. In all respect to PKers, I would rather see them upset over a PvP overhaul than have the entire game ruined. Whole Game > PvP

Don't get me wrong I am all for stopping it at any cost, but I think making it bannable would 1) Leave the door open for 26king to be done, even if it was greatly reduced 2) People banned for Jagex thinking they were 26king, even if they weren't

I can just see a lot of problems with a rule saying: "You can kill each other in PvP, just not in a certain way". There's just too many options for 26king to go through. What if they did make it bannable, and people go around dying with 26k on them? Are the people who kill them going to be banned? They need a solid update to kick it without creating more hassle for themselves.

Wouldn't it be a bit hard to ban for 26king though? It's more of an opinion thing IMO, who's to stop somebody and their buddy from gearing up in minimal armor and dying to each other? It may look like an actual PK to Jagex, but I think there are a lot of loopholes to be exploited if they didn't back it up with criteria to fall under. But again, if they said "here's a list of things we count as 26king and will ban you for", you'll have people doing barely above what Jagex will ban for, creating another gray area of legality... It's a shaky ladder to climb if they make it a bannable offense. I have faith that whatever they decide would most likely be better than our current situation... [EDITS]

My bad Acenator. I guess I didn't think that through all the way. Although the bones are being used, the money is still in existence. Wouldn't introducing the items back into the game be just as bad though? Although it isn't pure cash, a whip is still 1.8M worth of GP being thrown into the game Maybe they should just pull the plug on PvP until they find something that actually works...

Yeah I get what you mean. It shouldn't be the average person's responsibility to PvP daily just so they can afford the resources that are skyrocketing because of the people who do it 24/7.

Exactly :wall: What we also need to keep in mind is that people might spend the money they earn on summoning, construction, chinchompas for ranging, dragon bones, anything that can drain the money they made. Whether or not we see dragon bones rise 1k each depends on how soon they can get this under control :ohnoes:

What people don't realize is that the more GP flooded in, the less it becomes worth. Sure you can make 2.5M in an hour, but when the prices of items are soaring, that 2.5M becomes proportionately like having 250k.

Our idea that we're discussing though, is that you would have to be gaining xp in order to gain EP. They could incorporate minigames and boss fighting to build EP quickly, but the bottom line is kicking out AFK EP builders

[hide=] They could... 1) Toy mouses unusable on PvP worlds (as well as any other toy-mouse type things) 2) XP requirements to build EP that are large enough to rule out toy mouses as a good EP builder 3) Easier skills to manipulate will only build EP at higher wilderness levels, maybe multi combat areas? But then what if you're an honest player doing some activity that gives slow xp? What kind of slow xp do you mean? And maybe they could make different EP building levels. Like if you are mining or something slow like that, your ep would build faster than somebody alching with magic brawlers. This would also depend on risk, level of wilderness, ect. For example, fighting a boss monster, playing a minigame like Shades of Mort'ton, collecting snape grass, and so on. [/hide] Who does any of that to build EP as it is, let alone get XP (if any xp can be gained from collecting snape grass, please enlighten me how! :shock: )

They could... 1) Toy mouses unusable on PvP worlds (as well as any other toy-mouse type things) 2) XP requirements to build EP that are large enough to rule out toy mouses as a good EP builder 3) Easier skills to manipulate will only build EP at higher wilderness levels, maybe multi combat areas? But then what if you're an honest player doing some activity that gives slow xp? What kind of slow xp do you mean? And maybe they could make different EP building levels. Like if you are mining or something slow like that, your ep would build faster than somebody alching with magic brawlers. This would also depend on risk, level of wilderness, ect. Thats what I was thinking. Seems to be people complaining about how they make better use of their time and people who are lazy should be punished. So it needs to be nerfed because you get money+xp, where as others just get money. People will complain about anything. Tip.It is starting to become RSOF. I think the underlying problem is the tidal wave of GP being generated, not the fact that people are earning it for nothing.

They could... 1) Toy mouses unusable on PvP worlds (as well as any other toy-mouse type things) 2) XP requirements to build EP that are large enough to rule out toy mouses as a good EP builder 3) Easier skills to manipulate will only build EP at higher wilderness levels, maybe multi combat areas?

Brilliant :thumbup:

I think the problem is that no matter how times they fix it, there will ALWAYS be a loophole for people to exploit. When they tested the statuettes in the Jagex offices, I'm sure it seemed great. But when they released it to thousands of players, a much bigger scale than they could simulate, they were probably thinking "WTF were we thinking??" And with the target thing, I don't think they could ever have thought that people would die using nettles to both get drops. There's just more players than them, and the players are always going to be one step ahead in terms of manipulating any system they put in place, unfortunately. I wouldnt call it manipulating the system tough. How is it not manipulating the system? PvP worlds were made for (in my own opinion): Players gearing up and killing other players, but having an equal chance of being killed. It's a matter of skill and weaponry. Obviously, it's not that way so much anymore with claws/rushing/ect, but you get the idea. Legitimate kills is what I'm getting at. What I believe manipulates the system is sitting in the wild with the minimum needed to build EP, and then arranging a death with somebody to get good drops (while both having the minimum requirements to get a drop). Nothing is a legitimate "PK" in that scenario, besides the obvious fact that a player killed a player. How can you not call that manipulation?

I think the problem is that no matter how times they fix it, there will ALWAYS be a loophole for people to exploit. When they tested the statuettes in the Jagex offices, I'm sure it seemed great. But when they released it to thousands of players, a much bigger scale than they could simulate, they were probably thinking "WTF were we thinking??" And with the target thing, I don't think they could ever have thought that people would die using nettles to both get drops. There's just more players than them, and the players are always going to be one step ahead in terms of manipulating any system they put in place, unfortunately.

I think the system could use some serious changes, such as some sort of point system. The rewards could be coins, weapons, armor ect ect, and would obviously be harder to earn than cash is through the statue system. To really get a grip on the 26kers, they could make it so that the system detects when a player dies with only 26k or so on them, and gives a less than rewarding drop. To further combat it (although maybe a bit much), they could require instead of risking 76k to get drops, you must have 170k -or some number around there - and require that you have 6 pieces or armor adding up to an additional 170k or something like that. Ep could take longer to obtain, or could go up proportionately with how much you are risking, level of wilderness, multi or single combat, things like that. Maybe even bring the revanents (sp?) back for the high levels of wilderness and secluded spots to combat EP sitters and not actual PKers. They could attack people carrying cash or something like that. I guess the disheartening thing is that people will ALWAYS find some sort of loophole. I don't think Jagex could ever even dream that people would abuse the target system using nettles. They'll always find a way to 26k, but Jagex could make it so tough that it wouldn't be worth it. I'm not saying it needs to be stopped right this second, and I'm not even all that against it. Heck, I made 25m over the weekend doing it. But in all reality it just can't be good for the game and needs to stop at some point, and those are just some suggestions...Anyone agree that it should be harder to 26k?

The prayer article was very enjoyable, and the economy article was interesting too. We can only hope Jagex will do something against Merchant clans :ohnoes:

Master Smither just released a tidal wave of nostalgia on me..Good times :

what you should really be saying to Jagex. 'working hard, or hardly working?' And you know exactly what they're doing with their time? A scientist goes to work. He accidentally messes up a step. He has to publish his paper a month late. Did he just spend a month doing nothing or did he spend a month fixing his mistakes? Brilliantly said :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

Excellent updates! The only people who deserve whip drops are slayers, or if it was legitimately dropped in a fight from lack of pray or something. Same goes for DFH/visage, ect No Mobolising Armies though :cry:

Transport or convoy made me think of going new places, maybe some sort of new island where abandoned or dead monsters go? But on the other hand, with the KB spellbook image with the Mobolising Armies icon, I think that's a better bet than anything else.

Some new teleport it looks like? Sweet, nice find :thumbup: