:shock: When that guy is finished and is wearing full dragon, be sure to let me know :D I was thinking about...tears of guthix! first do some easy quests that give no cb xp and get 43 QP get the following skills: of course, I now assume you get at the end of lumby cave alive and havent trained def at all :lol: but if it were to work, you would have to do the following: Do the mini-game as good as you can, watch it, you might only have one chance to do it right! get over 6K xp for def which would mean at least 25, not? don't know whether it might work, just trying my best :P