Outsanity

Some people get so sensitive over the thought of anything making anything else easier. Something I will never understand. In the history of real world technology, we have always been advancing and making daily tasks easier to complete with less work. Is a game really any different? I for one don't miss the days of classic where everything was painstaking to train and was even more a grind than it is now. So how would adding a miniscule bonus to an achievement cape to revive it's usefulness break the game? I don't think the author's suggesting the Prayer Cape, for example, would fully restore your prayer every hour...or that the Runecrafting Cape would double the production of runes you create. No, he's just saying a little added flavor to the cape would mean more people would wear their capes, especially while doing the activity the cape is specialized for. I think it would be nice to see people wearing their cooking capes while cooking and their slayer capes while on slayer tasks. Small bonuses such as a 5% chance to cut two bows in the time it would take to cut one while wearing your fletching cape, or a 5% chance to not use a dose of your potion while wearing an herblore cape. Something small and fun that would actually make you think twice about wearing your soul wars or fire capes over your achievement capes. It's not like we're saying you should go and kill puppies.

How 'bout we stop adding crappy items to the game for April Fools since it's been done several times now and maybe add something...I'unno...funny?

Just thought this needed a good bump. :)

60k isn't enough for a fair sample, I did 1k pick pockets (43k), got 4 ranarr, 1 snap, 2 torstol, plus 5 or 6 other assorted seeds... so it's likely just a case of RNG being random. Well perhaps you're right, but in all the dozens of times I have thieved master farmers for profit, I've never gone more than 30k without a ranarr seed. It's 43 (or 41, can't remember) exp per steal. That's almost 1,500 steals without a single herb seed other than the 20+ tarromin and 15+ harrolander I got? Seems fishy. I'm not doubting you but I also ask you don't doubt me. I could just as easily say you had extremely good luck. We need people to test this I suppose to really know. I was simply lending my experience with the update. Especially if you only got two types I would say it was just a really bad streak of luck since I was getting a good variety of seeds not just those. Well considering your point was I only theived 60k exp and my information was invalid or bad luck, I could say you thieved less than me and your information is invalid and good luck. I'm not saying this, but I'm making a point. We need people to test this. Perhaps when find some time and the urge to grind out seeds I'll go and thieve a couple hundred thousand thieving exp worth of them and see how it turns out.

Until sweetcorn seeds become so common there's too many of them in the GE and they won't sell even at the small, trivial cost they will drop to.

Can you buy a box of steaks without buying a Bentley? Yes. Can you buy steaks from other vendors besides your Bentley dealer? Yes. Can you get the flag without buying a ticket? It would seem no. Is there any real way then, to separate the buyers who want to attend from the buyers who only want the pixels? No, not really. It's a monopoly situation. If you only want the pixels, you have to buy the ticket, or buy a code from a profiteer. Thanks for playing. well i think you could, from what i could tell (may be wrong haven't being paying too much attention), someone who intends to go could quite easily, not wanting the flag and sell that off to someone else, which would be flat out real world trading.... and judging from the example from world of warcraft posted earlier, it would just reach rediculous levels after the event if they don't do something to prevent it, that is my main issue with this. if in stead of emaling codes they just got everyone's rsn when they went to runefest and made the item magically appear in their toybox, or at diango or whatever after the event, i would not have a problem, i would not be too happy to have missed out on it, but i would get over it just like i got over not having bunny ears and [Caution: Jagex Rule Violation] and the like. I think this is a smart post with a smart idea that should be suggested directly to Jagex. I also think to some people who complain over the material aspect of this should read and re-read this guy's post and take notes. If you want your point heard, do it constructively with CC rather than "I want my banner and it's so unfair I can't get it because I wasn't born in the UK and don't have the money for a plane ticket."

60k isn't enough for a fair sample, I did 1k pick pockets (43k), got 4 ranarr, 1 snap, 2 torstol, plus 5 or 6 other assorted seeds... so it's likely just a case of RNG being random. Well perhaps you're right, but in all the dozens of times I have thieved master farmers for profit, I've never gone more than 30k without a ranarr seed. It's 43 (or 41, can't remember) exp per steal. That's almost 1,500 steals without a single herb seed other than the 20+ tarromin and 15+ harrolander I got? Seems fishy. I'm not doubting you but I also ask you don't doubt me. I could just as easily say you had extremely good luck. We need people to test this I suppose to really know. I was simply lending my experience with the update.

Can you buy a box of steaks without buying a Bentley? Yes. Can you get the flag without buying a ticket? It would seem no. Thanks for playing. You took a trivial point and tried to use it as a counter argument? What did you prove? Okay, since we're playing games I'll play too and tend to your need for an analogy that suits you. You go to a Broadway play or the Daytona 500 where they have select merchandise only sold at the theatre or the event, and not online. This can vary from small knick knacks like drink coasters, pencils or mugs to things such as tee-shirts or baseball hats. Many of these items can't be purchased online unless through a third party website where someone who actually purchased the item from the theatre/event is selling it to make a profit. Did you go to the Daytona 500 to buy a limited edition annual coffee mug? No, you went to the Daytona 500 to see the race, and the merchandise for the event is simply an added bonus. Did you go see "Wicked" on Broadway so you could buy a tee-shirt only available at the theatre? No, you went to see "Wicked" on Broadway to see "Wicked" on Broadway. Seems you editted and added onto your post after I quoted it so I will respond to the second bit. No, you don't have to buy the ticket. There's is another option a lot of people seem to be forgetting and that is, "Just don't buy it." But not getting the banner which is intended for people to attend the first annual RuneFest is too far beyond the reality of these people. To be honest, if you have a banner in game and didn't attend the event, I'm going to overlook you. It's meant to be a fun way of commemorating those who attended the fesitivities, not as a common holiday item you can pick up in 10 minutes of doing an Easter quest.

I disagree. How is it fair that by accident of simply being born across the ocean from the eventual Jagex HQ that I have absolutely no opportunity to attend this event? Yes I can purchase the ticket and redeem the item if I seriously wanted to, but why would I put that money into an event and get 5% opportunity 'payback' than I would if I actually lived in England and could attend? I don't know. Call me bitter..but this doesn't seem fair. You are being bitter, and I say this in the nicest way possible but I think it's a disgusting quality you should try to drop. If the event were held in the United States would it be "fair" to anyone in any other part of the world? People in the UK who think like you do would say "No, it's unfair!" but the answer is yes. It's entirely just. The Jagex headquarters are in the UK. Why would you ever think they would hold them somewhere else? Do you also think it's unfair that people who were born and raised in Hawaii or LA or Manhattan get to be there but you have to buy a plane ticket and hotel fair? Think about how absolutely irrational you're being. The item in question is like a box of steaks you get when you buy a Bentley. Do people buy a car because they want a free box of steaks? No. They buy a car because they want a car, and the steak is like a little incentive or added bonus. Should people have the money to fork out to buy a ticket to an event they won't go to simply because they want a pixelated banner in game, then let them. How does that negatively effect you? What is it taking away from what you already have?

Likewise however, the chance of most ALL herb seeds minus tarromin (and if I remember correctly from when I thieved the other day) harralander, has gone down immensely. I have 99 thieving and 87 agility (for extra loot) and in more than 60k thieving exp, I didn't get a single herb seed other than the two I mentioned, which I got quite a lot of. What this means to me is that now almost all other herb seeds have become harder to get. In 60k exp at master farmers I could normally get at least 4-5 ranarr seeds. Now? Nothing. It's highly upsetting. Especially since you get a HELL load of Sweetcorn and Strawberry seeds, which now have decreased a lot in price, and will only continue to do so once people get word at how common they are and they begin to flood the GE.

No. Your thieving level only affects how many hankies you can turn in per day (or is it week?) Either way, you can pickpocket and blackjack as many times as you wish. There is no limit.

Explain? Seeing as how everyone has an equal shot at the double exp during this period of time, the competitiion is not unfairly distributed. Anyone who has a 99 and a rank in it can continue training it on double exp day to stay the same distance ahead of the people underneath them as they were before the double exp weekend, or simply get a one up and train another skill for double exp. Other than it being hard to buy materials off the GE, there is no downside to this. People who dislike the idea are simply very self-minded. So far I've seen "Well I won't be able to afford or buy anything off the GE!" and "I don't want to be stressed about having to collect materials so I can train the skill of choice on the double exp weekend!" Tough. If you want the exp in that skill of choice, you'll find a way to train it on the weekend, otherwise you train something else. What "stresses" you out (something that is not mandatory but you seem to think it is) will help out many other people in the process. There's no need to be greedy. And this is someone talking who has many, many 99s. I don't care if it "devalues" my 99s. Why should I have reason to be so bitter and unfriendly towards an idea that makes unbearable grinding just a little more bearable?

This is 100% true. I agree entirely. They are trying to keep it so "Only they will have this idea and no one will steal it," but then how that hurts them is they don't truly know how their "audience" is going to react.

Just the basics that most players who play any portion of WoW would even know. The concept of 5 player raiding, the existance of tier armor and weapons the concept of items being soulbound and only being able to destroy them. Those are just to name a few. Also, I know the concept of a multi-layered dungeon is a lot like the pit of trials or whatever it's called in the Zelda series. Randomly generated dungeons, as many have said before, is a concept from Diablo (If I am mistaken, correct me) and the rest of dungeoneering is mixes between pre-existing runescape concepts like the already existant skills and Stealing Creation. I just don't see how a single bit of it is innovative in any way.

No I love and play WoW and am currently experiencing the very end game content of WoW and I agree that this has a lot of similarities to WoW. Not enough to say they completely copied it from WoW, but they're smart enough not to do that aren't they? They simply took many concepts of wow, mixed it with runescape and maybe another game or two, and then tried to call it new and revolutionary...which it is not by any means. Do I find it fun? Yes. Is it innovative? Hell no.

Well they better change this attitude when it comes to catastrophies like this skill. A lot of us are worried about if this skill is eventually going to have a use for training it, not just 1 reward for 80 levels of hard work. Take a look at the Blizzard corporation and how much more successful their game is. Even though WoW costs essentially 3x more to play, they have around 3x as many people who pay to play it. It's because when it comes to major game updates they let you know WAY in advance when something will happen to the gameplay mechanics so that you have time to prepare and/or share your opinion on it. Then, once the content is finished, they put it into beta testing with select players on test realms which means that upon official release the content will virutally be bugless, excluding perhaps one or two bugs that aren't game breaking like the ones Jagex releases. If they want to be considered a serious major corporation, they better start acting like one. Hiding major game decisions from your players without allowing them initial feedback just solely for the fact of "we want it to be a surprise," is not a good enough justification. I want to know if my game is going in a direction I'm at least content with before I keep subscribing. I don't like being left in the dark about something I pay for simply because they think it'll be fun like a surprise birthday party.

Well it just goes to show you my idea can never be too perfect for my tastes. After reading through again, I spotted a major flaw in my design that ultimately I just couldn't live with. Originally, with rock samples dug up from SES's, you still needed the overall Arch level to clean them, so Giant samples retrieved from al kharid (level 23 to excavate) would only be able to be cleaned at level 75+. I realize now how broken that concept was, as by level 75 the miniscule rewards from that particular SES would not be worth it to an Archaeologist. The section has been changed and revived to quote the following: What this means is essentially Archaeologists won't feel they are being gypped out of immediate rewards by digging at SES's but also means should they choose to wait longer to clean the samples they will have a better chance of successfully recieving loot. I feel this is a fair way to balance out this new concept with the old one. Let me know your thoughts on this. I am always up for ideas. P.S. I also added the experienced gained for cleaning all SES rock samples, which oddly enough, I had forgotten to add in the original draft. Enjoy. EDIT: So I also realized that with the new forum server change, somehow all the lines in my guide were doubled. So I went through and backspaced about a million times so that the original (almost) format of the guide is now restored. This should help you in reading, as it is no longer confusing and information that should be grouped together, is.

Isn't it more like: We don't have any thing more planned but the things we already have planned, which we may or may not actually have planned. After what we may or may not have planned, we may or may not have more things planned, but post any ideas here, and we may or may not think about the things you think we should have had plans about (like, you know, other dungeons!!). Also, we may or may not be discussing the possibility of giving you a straight answer in an undisclosed location. Also, we have our heads so far up our new skill that even we are suprised that we can still use a computer. (even I had to read it twice to keep why I said straight) Totally agree with that one! Read my edit on my above post too. Pretty much sums up everything I took away from this Q&A in a few simple quotes. Ridiculous!

Oh for real? I thought it was: This is our game [bleep]s, and we have no plans to let your input influence our decisions. Now go [bleep] yourselves you [bleep]s. Just saying... That is their unofficial tagline they use around the office, silly. Oh and if anyone is doubting me on why I feel this way, here are just a few of the quotes from the mods themselves: "We have no official plans for adding content unlocked via Dungeoneering outside of Daemonheim, but it is a possibility. " "Unfortunately we can't give you any ETAs on the second batch of rewards. " "Whether or not you will meet Bilrach would unfortunately be too big of a spoiler for me to answer. " "At the moment, it doesn't look like it. " "We don't have any official plans at the moment, so only time can tell what will be included in the future. " "No plans for this yet, sorry. " "Unfortunately I can't answer most of this question as it would be discussing future updates.. but I guess that is an answer in itself?" "We'll see." "A good question... and one I shall be asking my superiors very shortly." "Probably not straight away, but who knows what the future holds?" "We have no official plans for this at the moment, but there are lots of possibilities." Notice anything? Yeah, occasionally you get an answer out of them, but a lot of this supposed Q&A session is a bunch of wishy-washy, evasive tactical wording. They appear to answer your question but really all they've done is talked for a few sentences and looped you back to the start, making you feel like you got something out of them but really did not. If you cannot answer a question, just simply don't answer it! Don't waste your time and ours by spending your precious (what was it, two hours?) time beating around the bush? I'm also not happy with the fact they don't have official plans to release any dungeoneering content outside of Daemonheim. What the hell is the POINT of this "skill," if I can never use it outside of this dungeon where I don't even get to keep what I loot? Poor designing. I can make better skills than Jagex can.

For anyone who has read the "Live New Skill Q&A" thread on the RSOF, you will know what I mean when I say the following is Jagex's new tagline: Jagex ltd: We have no official plans to do anything, and unfortunately we are currently discussing the possibility of giving you a straight answer.

Well I just came back from being away from the game for about 6 months. I'll be honest, Dungeoneering and the urge to level it brought me back, but I decided to also get some of my old goals out of the way from before I quit. I left with 98 farming and 550k exp to go, and for 6 months it sat there with dust on it. Tonight that changed! And my snazzy new outfit, complete with shiny new cape: The significance of 12 99s is that before the release of Dungeoneering it would have meant half of my skills were max level. That is no longer the case. =-p But almost. 12.5 99s is half now. =-p

It's funny that so many of you are still stuck on the "Hey I like Dungeoneering, it's very fun!" concept and you use that to bash the original poster with. Yeah, I like it too, but if any of you were around for the previous few skill releases, what the OP is saying is absolutely true. They did fail in many aspects. He's not saying they ultimately failed or the concepts themselves failed. He's saying they were extremely buggy and major flaws within the mainframe of the skills had slipped through the testing phases without notice. How does Jagex release a skill with "Dungeoneering level" requirements for the rewards when in actuality those same rewards require a much, much higher level to actually obtain. Okay...so I can "use" a Bone Grinder at level 21 dungeoneering, but in actuality I can't use it until level 74, because without spending ANY of my tokens, that is the first level I would have even tokens saved up from to make the purchase. So why have the 21 dungeoneering level requirement? Why not be honest with ourselves and slap the 74+ dungeoneering level requirement on it? It makes no sense to me how they let a major flaw like this slip. Here's something to ponder. What is the reason you like this skill? It's like a minigame but you get exp for it in a skill that you level up. Fair enough. I like skilling and minigames so having one be the other is only a plus. However, what is really innovative about this idea? Nothing. While at first glance it seems very "new" to runescape, all it is really is a combination of a couple of runescape aspects mixed with aspects of other games, which I would be perfectly fine with had Jagex not stroked themselves off and claimed it to be so earth shattering and innovative. My points to back this up: It's Stealing Creation in the very sense that you begin with nothing and have to craft everything from scratch. It is a dungeon in the sense that there are monsters in rooms that eventually lead up to a boss. (Much like Godwars) You get to play "instanced dungeons" along with 2-4 other players. This, my friends, is a direct rip from World of Warcraft. Instanced dungeons in WoW allow up to 5 players in the dungeon at once. Raids allow 10-40. You use every skill to train this skill. So really...what's new about that? I'm using the same old smithing to make the same old bars to make the same old armor to take part in the same old combat. Nothing innovative about that. There are several little pieces of silver here and there that shine. Tiny new items and such that help to give it a "newer" feel, but really those things should have just been added via their respective skills. Basically in one sentence what I'm saying is the reason we all like Dungeoneering so damn much is because essentially it's the same game put into a slightly altered format and given a "universal" exp. Does liking it mean the skill is not broken? Hell no. It's highly broken, and I don't really see Jagex making any attempts to fix the major flaws within it. It's been a week. Where are the patch fixes? Where is all of our feedback going to? I don't expect Rome to be built in a day, but I do expect a small patch with even some minor glitches fixed. At least something to show me that Jagex cares about its customers.

Snce someone has already posted Primal Boots, I won't post my picture, but I will contribute by saying they High alch for 60,000gp.

Wow. I took a brief retirement from Runescape 6 months ago to go play WoW (Which, hate me or love me, I actually enjoy it a lot) and recently came back with the release of Dungeoneering. I decided for old time's sake I'd come swing by this thread to see how badly it has deteriorated, and, to my surprise, found that it is still actually on the front page. It seems my idea has lasted the test of time, even without me adding or improving the idea. This is amazing to me, and I wanted to say thank you to everyone who has been keeping this idea alive since I left. It still has much potential and a chance to be added in game. Interestingly enough, Dungeoneering was actually an idea by a player on the RSOF a LONG time back. I read it, and didn't like the concept, personally, but it was recieving a lot of good feedback. Now, over a year or two later, Jagex releases a skill very similar to that same idea I read on the forums. This gives me hope that maybe someday Archaeology will see it's way into the game's arms. Who knows. Now, to clarify, I was working on Astronomy before I left, and then my laptop died and took all my information along with it, including Astronomy. I was very secretive about it because of the innovation surrounding the idea, but now that months later I have left you with nothing, I will give you the overall idea of what I was aiming for. Astronomy was an idea based around being the "Skilling of Slayer." Ultimately, your goal was to discover and unlock cosmic portals hidden around Runescape, that would teleport you to otherworldly places where you would be able to complete assignments given to you by a Master Astronomer. While completing these tasks you would earn not only astronomy experience (for completing an entire task) but also the skilling experience. So if you had to fish 50 "Celestial Guppies" you would not only earn the (We'll throw out a random number here) 500 Astronomy experience after the task was complete, but also the fishing experience along the way. The point I was aiming for in this idea was simple: Give more reason to skill using non-combat skills, while also adding rewards for almost every skill available. An example of this is the addition of celestial orange and white dragons, which would drop new dragonhide used to make new d'hide armor. Another example was the addition of new log types which could be fletched and crafted with to make new higher level bows as well as hunter traps which could capture multiple hunter creatures (of the same type) within them before needing to be opened. Now, I can't make promises, but this idea is still a potential project for me. However, for me to be able to do it correctly, I have to re-introduce myself to the game and all of the new mechanics that have been released since I left. Once I do this, and I feel comfortable throwing out suggestions for game improvement, I may pick my skill idea up once more. In the meantime, should you see Astronomy somewhere else, with the same or similar concept to what you've read above, you know that person probably read this and took my idea. While I can't say they aren't allowed to do that, I will say this: They won't make it as good as I will. ;)

You can get 70k exp an hour with agility. But if it takes around 1 month for 99 at around 13m exp, 120 is around 104m exp (or somewhere around there) so logically it would take at least 8 months, but surely nobody could keep that intensity of no lifing up for 8 months. But what you'e forgetting, again, is that by that time new levels of Daemonheim will be released and I'm sure people will be making 100k+ exp per hour with this skill.