fat_klutz

You know you can go to battle.net enter your CD keys and download digital copies of the game. TD's are fun for like a week but then you figure out the best strategy and it becomes pointless. Play DotA. Its good for the soul. Still though, I guess since everything in RS is repetitive having a TD mini game with construction and stuff would be pretty cool. Would it be PvP or PvM though? Like Line tower wars or like Element TD? I like the idea more and more as I'm typing this lol, it would be a great construction mini game and being able to specialize towers with combat skills would be awesome too.

You know inflation is the product of a strong economy?

Like most mental illnesses autism's severity can very greatly. I don't have a lot of experience with autistic kids but I do know one who plays console video games at a pretty high level. I wouldn't discount the fact that their COULD be people out there playing with autism but I severely doubt they would say it. Just put them on your ignore list.

Ok, great quote there... Ever considered items like logs, bowstrings and nature runes are bound by certain artificially set alch values? Some items are goign to be left behind... And your argument suggests that everyone should spend their GP and buy items, so inflation doesn't hurt them, but you fail to consider that 99% of all transactions these days are players buying fro other players... SOMEONE is going to have to hold the GP because when you buy items, the gold doesnt just dissapear in the GE... Considering that, with ever inflating prices, people are scrambling to buy-buy-buy (its fricken Wall Street on a bad day), pushing prices up further and faster... Obviously you did not read my article all the way to the end, otherwise you would have known that a bit of inflation is normal... Prices jumping to 150% their original value in 4 months is not... You sir, are; - shortsighted for not seeing the grand picture of it all, this goes both to failing to see the grand economy as a whole, as well as ditching on new players, the one thing Runescape relies on. - greedy for insisting that the rise of your valued items is normal, and should continue to do so. - ignorant for thinking that I do not grasp the concept of economics, nor know what I am talking about. - and finally, hereby challenged to write an article for the Times on why you consider the current goings on to be normal... What about F2P RCers!!!!!! They would be hurt agree?

The first article was good but I'm not sure about making essence F2P as well. You say it would only hurt people mining pure essence but wouldn't it also hurt F2P runecrafters. You already need a pretty decent level to break even and the price of essence would rise I bet. Not sure how great an idea that is.

For there to be inflation don't good have to become more expensive while gold remains at the same value? If more gold is coming into the economy and prices are going up too then it really isn't inflation.

I'm not convinced inflation is a problem. The problem is people who try to merchant items for gains. People jump onto items, hoard them, and never let go because they are afraid the price is going to jump up 10% right after they sold them and they are potentially going to miss out on that. Jagex needs to somehow make a system where bought items have to be used so it discourages people from buying items they aren't going to use and taking them from players that actually need them while simultaneously driving the price up. I think potentially spirit shields are a good example. I don't know (I don't think anyone does) what spirit shields are actually worth but the facts are they are probably worth less than what they are going for. The problem is the people who buy them trying to make money off of them instead of using them. And everybody is guilty. You always are hearing players complain about how such and such update made their X item drop 1m gold. It really shouldn't matter. You should be buying items to use them not for their monetary value.

There is no argument left to be made. You think it is ok that combat level doesn't reflect how good you are at.... combat and I think that that is stupid.

If each skill gives a simple +6 like herblore now does then you get +90 in your stats.

So combat level will be further devalued? Why don't we just remove combat level because somebody with lvl 3 combat and 99 in every other skill might be able to end up beating someone with lvl 60 combat the way the trend is going. You realize that is what will happen if updates like this continue. I mean if each skill gives a simple +6 bonus in attack/str/defense your looking at +90 to your stats even if you are at lvl 3 combat.

What is the point of a combat level if it no longer represents your combat ability?

Ok you're all right and I am wrong. I can't wait till Jagex's next high level update. If you have 99 cooking you can now use your aswesome skills to poison an opponents food. Poisoned food does damage equal to what it would heal!!! or maybe You have 99 runecrafting and learned how to DECRAFT runes. You can decraft your opponents runes during combat!!!. I've got my hopes up.

Can we save the "You're stupid for not getting 99 herblore" and "You're a loser not to be able to buy a GS" etc for the RSOF? It wasn't aimed at you lol (at the one above you). It was just to show the flawed logic: why should high level weaponry be more "compulsory" than high level skills when combatting? - isn't runescape based around skills? BTW I updated my post with a suggestion about how I think it would be fair.. No. Runescape combat is not based around your skills. It is based upon your combat level. You really are stupid. I didn't say people were stupid because they didn't have a level. I said they were stupid because they didn't take advantage of their level. Requirements to wear imbued rings-None If you choose not to use these rings it is your fault. You do not need any stats to use them or acquire them. They are available to every player regardless of their combat/non-combat skills. Extreme potions on the other hand are not available to every player and do require a specific level to use. You have got to stop calling people stupid it's insulting and uncalled for. And as for no requirements to wear the rings you are WRONG, there are requirements, you need to have a high level in mobilising armies, something that, even if you are good, takes a long time to get. Your argument can be applied to herblore equally, as everyone can do herblore (after a short and really easy quest). So by your own argument there is no requirement to use potions as the skill is open to anyone. No. Requirements for extreme potions. 8x-96 herblore. Requirements for imbued rings. None. Effort isn't a requirement. Explain the difference. 40% more damage from magic because they have a high level in herblore. 50 extra defense because they have a high level in smithing. They seem pretty comparable to me. I wasn't insulting people before this. I am sick of arguments that hold no ground. 40% more damage. Able to one hit people. Definitely balanced with regards to effort. I addressed effort before anyway. Why exactly does the effort to get 90 herblore and 94 attack/strength/defense supersede the effort in getting 99 attack/strength/defense? Should we give every player who got 99 range before cannon/chinchompas/etc the ability to hit 60s with an MSB because they put more effort into their account than the player who got 99 range with a cannon/w.e? I put effort into getting 99 cooking. How come I can't use my 99 cooking skills to make my food heal an extra 20hp per bite? I have 99 strength and 75 woodcutting. How come I don't chop trees faster than someone with 1 strength and 75 woodcutting? I am stronger.

Can we save the "You're stupid for not getting 99 herblore" and "You're a loser not to be able to buy a GS" etc for the RSOF? It wasn't aimed at you lol (at the one above you). It was just to show the flawed logic: why should high level weaponry be more "compulsory" than high level skills when combatting? - isn't runescape based around skills? BTW I updated my post with a suggestion about how I think it would be fair.. No. Runescape combat is not based around your skills. It is based upon your combat level. You really are stupid. I didn't say people were stupid because they didn't have a level. I said they were stupid because they didn't take advantage of their level. Requirements to wear imbued rings-None If you choose not to use these rings it is your fault. You do not need any stats to use them or acquire them. They are available to every player regardless of their combat/non-combat skills. Extreme potions on the other hand are not available to every player and do require a specific level to use. Are you serious? You would be ok with fighting somebody your same combat level but him having 50 more defense levels and the same attack, strength, hp, and prayer simply because he has 99 smithing? The fact that you are ok with this shows me how full of [cabbage] you are.

If you can't afford a GS then don't get the levels. It is that simple. You knowingly put yourself at a disadvantage when you raise your combat without means to take advantage of higher levels. If there is a lvl 60 wearing full mith and he has 40 defense most people would say he is stupid. The only difference between him and a lvl 110 who can't afford a GS is that the 110 isn't willing to admit he is stupid.

But that's our point. Equipment does not contribute to your combat level, yet plays a vital role to your combat effiency. And yes, they may be tradeable, but you still must put Effort into raising the required cash. Think of Herblore as a weapon that costs one hundred million GP. You put Effort into raising your Herblore level (by putting in the effort to raise one hundred million GP), and therefore deserve Reward in proportion to your Effort. The only reason you are unsatisfied with the update is that this Reward gives an advantage in combat, but I believe that is a fair reward. And to Italics: Let's be civil, please. I actually meant to respond to this argument yesterday, but was side-tracked by life. Alright, let's hypothetically assume that Dragon Claws required While Guthix Sleeps to use the special. Because by doing the quest, you gain an advantage and no disadvantage, would you or would you not support this update? Equipment does contribute to combat level. That Godsword represents 75 attack/strength. That barrows armor represents 70 defense. You would still need the attack to use Dclaws, which contributes to combat level. If they made it so 99 smithing gave you +50 defense would that be ok because you put the effort in? I mean afterall 99 smithing is a lot of money so it would just be like buying an item that gave +50 defense right? Uh not really.

Read the post before yours. It addresses that. I also addressed things like voids already as well. They are not the best item all around. You sacrifice defense to get the +10% damage or w/e. You sacrifice nothing in using these potions. Read the thread before bringing up arguments that have already been answered.

No because herblore doesn't increase your combat level. Do you not understand that simple fact? Your prowess in COMBAT should be determined by your COMBAT level. Not your NONCOMBAT skills. If Jagex made it so herblore increased your combat level I wouldn't have a problem. Stop trying to make a good argument because you are failing horribly.

So? Thats how the game works. You either have the lvl and get the bonuses or you don't have the level and can't use the weapon/prayer/spell/bow.

I'd still like an explanation for why other instances of non-combat skills resulting in combat advantages are permissible. The closest analogy I see is Piety (the following is meant to apply only to the Extreme Attack, Strength, Defense, and Range potions. Other potions are addressed afterward.) - To earn the right to use Piety, you need to complete a quest, and its pre-requisite quests, which requires several non-combat skills. To earn the right to use Extreme Potions, you need at the minimum, 82 Herblore. The concept is the same, and if your objection is that the latter is harder, then that invalidates your entire argument, as "harder" is a perspective - something easy for you may be hard for a brand new player at level 3, while something easy for me could possibly be nearly impossible for you. - To actually use Piety, there is a requirement of 70 prayer. Similarly, to actually benefit from Extreme Potions, you need Attack/Strength/Defense/Range levels. That is to say, two players with level 1 strength will get the same boost if one uses a Super Strength Potion, and the other uses an Extreme Strength Potion. You can use it, but to no benefit. As you level up, the benefit increases, but only slightly. The +7 advantage is divided over 98 levels, resulting in approximately +1 per 14 levels. The point I'm trying to get across is that it doesn't matter whether you think skills should be integrated or not, the fact is, they already are. Piety is only the tip of the iceberg. Ancient Magicks requires thieving, firemaking, and fletching. RFD Barrow Gloves requires cooking. Fremmenick Trials has its own requirements, as does the Fremmenick Isles. The new Hand-Cannons benefit in a similar fashion from firemaking - the higher the firemaking the greater the benefit. Agility has a HUGE advantage in bounty hunter worlds. Someone with 1 Agility can not use the GE without hopping, which means if they for some unforeseen reason need to purchase an item to finish a fight, they waste extra minutes of their limited timer. Which means they, and not their opponent, will be penalized if the fight ends in a draw. Agility doesn't count as a combat skill, does it? Finally, there's the fact that the potions are NOT overpowering. If increasing the max hit ever so slightly results in an overwhelmingly dangerous PvP environment, the problem exists elsewhere, and should be addressed elsewhere. As far as the other potions go, Extreme Magic has a major PvP effect, unlike the others. However, this isn't because it by itself is overpowering, in fact, it gives magic a necessary edge to keep up with other forms of combat. Rather, the issue is that there is no alternative. If, for example, Magic Potions gave +4 Magic and 30% Increased Magic Damage, and Extreme Magic Potions gave +6 Magic and 40% Increased Magic Damage, like the other situations, it would be fairly balanced. Super Antifire Potions are irrelevant to some degree, because they have no impact on PvP (you would think it would help against Dragon Bolts (e) or Dragonfire Shield, but it doesn't). Extreme Prayer Potion is outperformed by Super Restore Potion, as the latter restores your other stats, making Saradomin Brew / Zamorak Brew viable, as well as countering curses. Special Restore is an interesting case. They nerfed Dark Bows to prevent what was potentially the most "severe" abuse of this potion. Now, it drains 65%, leaving you with 35% (Potions restores you to 60, insufficient for another special.) In any case, I really don't know enough about it to say anything on it right now that's not entirely theoretical. My biggest objection is this whole attitude - handing something good to people who've been training herblore for years, waiting for their turn for a high level update... and taking almost all of it away with the other hand. And yes, almost all of it. These potions are essentially useless in PvM, in today's defensively-oriented PvM environment. In any case of PvM, so much time is spent reaching the monster and killing the respawns that slightly improving kill speed has little effect in the long run. Pretty much any monster in the game can already be defeated alone, and the benefit these new potions add is insignificant. More and more, people at places like God Wars and Dagannoth Kings don't even bring Super Potions; space must be conserved for Super Restore Potions and Saradomin Brews which extend your trip, thus leading to more efficient trips. What are these potions good for, then? Max hits? That's really all I can think of. I currently have 20 Extreme Sets + 10 Extreme Attack/Strength Potions, and no idea where to use them. The only one case I thought of is actually, ironically enough, PvP in the one instance Jagex did not think to correct: Free-for-all Corporeal Beast. I can use them in a direct player-versus-player competition to deal the fastest damage to a boss, and this is literally the only case I can think of where the minor boost is necessary. Does 70 prayer add to your combat level? Does your magic level influence your combat level? Does Herblore influence your combat level? Yes, yes, no.

Were not going to agree. You clearly see the integration of non-combat skills into combat as a good thing which is fine. I think it is a terrible mistake by Jagex considering their already unbalanced and broken combat system. I hope you genuinely do recognize I am not happy they removed these potions from PVP because I want high LVLS to suffer.

I doubt herblore is as slow as RC. Your comparison is bad. Mine wasn't. I compare even stats to even stats. You compare uneven to even. Trust me. These potions would end up being profitable. People are willing to pay 19m for bandos plate even though it has far less defense than other things simply to get that +4 str bonus. If you don't think pkers will pay an arm and a leg for these potions for the chance to hit higher your crazy. Especially the mage potion. Hitting 40% more (or w.e it is) would be a necessity and people would pay. Come on, be realistic. Before this update, there was no reason to train your herblore at all, yet every single potion made you lose money to make it. Still people made those pots. The only people who bothered training it were ones with a lot of cash to waste and who already had high levels in every other skill. That is why there is no profit from potions because the only people wiling to make them don't care what they have to pay to get fast exp. And 18k people have 80 herblore. That is not a lot. And I assume because you didn't comment on it you think it is ok for someone 5 combat levels lower than you to have just as good a chance to win?

The R2H downside is also that it requires more combat levels. There is no downside to the extreme potions. They have no negatives compared to supers. The exp comparison is fair enough. I looked at the RS wiki and the formula is LVL*.20+7+LVL. Therefor you need lvl 93 to match someone using a super set. So you can have 26,933,219 which is roughly 12 million less EXP and 5 less combat levels. Herblore might take a long time but I bet it is less effort to get that 27m experience than it is to get that 39m experience. Plus that 5 combat levels? You should not have a 50/50 chance of winning against somebody 5 combat levels lower. Why would price of potions ever drop below what it costs to make them? Monsters don't drop them so the only way they can be acquired is if a player makes them. Why would a player make them if they could not make money off of them? Exp? Probably not. Once you can make them there is no reason to really train your herblore higher. I doubt herblore is as slow as RC. Your comparison is bad. Mine wasn't. I compare even stats to even stats. You compare uneven to even. Trust me. These potions would end up being profitable. People are willing to pay 19m for bandos plate even though it has far less defense than other things simply to get that +4 str bonus. If you don't think pkers will pay an arm and a leg for these potions for the chance to hit higher your crazy. Especially the mage potion. Hitting 40% more (or w.e it is) would be a necessity and people would pay.

No they wouldn't. Supply and demand buddy. It would end up balancing it all out. You might point to other potions and say how come supply and demand doesn't hold true for them and my response would be because they are used to train levels. Since these potions are at the highest levels you wouldn't use them to train so the only ones being produced would be used. If it got to the point where it was unprofitable to make them people would stop, supply would go down and demand would increase and the potion would reach equilibrium again. Here is another argument for why it was smart to take the potions out. 99 strength 13,034,431exp 99 attack 13,034,431exp 99 defense 13,034,431exp 1 herblroe 0exp Total 39,103,293exp Using super set would result in 118 Strength 118 Attack 118 Defense 96 Strength 9,684,577exp 96 Attack 9,684,577exp 96 Defense 9,684,577exp 90 Herblore 5,346,332exp Total 34,400,053exp With extreme pots would result in >118 Strength >118 Attack >118 Defense If someone can provide me the exact formula that would be nice. My point is people say I worked hard to get such a high level herblroe I should have the advantage. However EXP wise you SHOULDN'T have the advantage because that person you are now stronger than has more total EXP. Why should someone with less EXP be better than someone with more? Now for the argument that we should remove all items from the game obtained by skillers like Dhide and such. No. These items are tradeable and as such available to everybody. Logically from this argument comes the argument that we should remove thinks like Void because they are UNTRADEABLE. Once again no. The difference between something like Void and these potions is how they are compared to their respective gear. These potions ARE THE BEST. Period. Nothing beats them. Things like void or the barrelchest anchor on the other hand aren't. They may hit the highest or be the best STR weapon at that stage of the game but they are not as good at other things like providing defense or hitting fast. The extreme potions have no downsides compared to super sets. Quest related skills and items. This point is sort of valid but the difference is RS has ALWAYS been like this. If RS had always had it so you had to make your own potions or fletch your own bows this update wouldn't have been a problem. As it is though RS was not like this and suddenly changing it to this is not a realistic thing to do.