The Confederate Flag

[Greatsilverwyrm]

I was just curious as to what people here thought of the Confederate Flag. IE, would you be offended if you saw it?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Somone at my school evidently had one in their front seat, a friend in my math class saw it and went on a big rant about how ridiculous that was. I tried defending it, saying that it was just the "national redneck symbol", and about 5 other kids jumped on me going "Oh yeah, there's nothing wrong with being racist and etc and etc..."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

As I said earlier, the Confederate Flag has just become the national symbol for the "redneck", it's no more than a fad. Like wearing John Deer trucker hats. I think it's silly to get worked-up about connotations that haven't existed really for over a hundred years.

 

 

 

Sure, there are some people that use it as a rallying symbol for racism or what-ever, but I think those are few and far-between.

[Nadril]

I don't mind it. And over here in kentucky, we have a ton of them (mind you, i'm not a redneck as i just moved here :lol: ) and they usualy are just no more than a "redneck" symbol.

[X_Awesome_X]

I think they are stupid since theres really no point to it and it's not like it's a racist symbol, there were many people in the south fighting not to keep their slaves(if they even had them) but for other reasons. Just because some people who have it are racist doesn't make it a racist symbol.

[Purecheese]

I don't really know what the confederate flag is, but from what I've read it was the symbol of the southern states of america during the civil war?

 

 

 

And now people link it to racism?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here in holland, especially in the part where I live there's a lot of youth wearing lonsdale clothes. Big boots, white strings in them, dutch flag attached to their jacket.

 

 

 

That's a huge display of racism. Last week they threw a bottle through the window of a mosque. Result about 60 people with an islamitic background got into a large fight with about 20 lonsdalers.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In other towns they've burned down a islamic schools. and there have been plenty of attempts to burn down other islamic buildings. Then again there have also been attempts to burn down churches.

 

 

 

And in all honesty many of the youth with an islamic background simply are a problem. Doesn't mean that you must hate them, it means that you together need to find a solution.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

(most of these things happened shortly after theo van gogh who wrote very critical about the islam was brutally murdered by a fanatic)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

To me, these people (lonsdale youth) are a disgrace, I see them walk around everywhere.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So my guess, yea I'd be offended by the flag.

[Greatsilverwyrm]

The confederate flag is this:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It was the flag being used by the southern states that were trying to suceed from the union and start their own country. The civil war was actually more about state's rights than slavery itself. Slavery was just the key state's right's issue at the time.

 

 

 

So, everyone associates the flag with people who are pro-slavery, and therefore racist..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So, not only are these connotations highly outdated, they're not even really right in the first place..

[i_D_r]

I lived in the heart of SC (I am a northerner at heart though), where there was a huge debate whether or not a confederate flag should be flown on some certain government building.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now technically, I do understand why some people want it up there. Stands for conformity, times of unfortunate misguidance, and it's a huge part of our history.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think people directly thinking it's rascist is ludacris.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

However, you can notice down there a lot of the kids/rednecks/immature people's minds are in the wrong paradigm. Some people really do advertise the flag to share their own personal views, which coincidently usually accrue to the same outcome: rebellion. Some people DO hate yankees (northerners). Some people DO hate african americans. And they tend to be more confederate-patriotic if they feel that away about those certain people, particularly because people who felt this way in the past shown the flag with pride. It's slowly dying out, but it's still out there.

[Guest]

It's not that the flag itself its just a symbol that brings back so many bad memories for so many people. How can you comment on it if you or your ancestors have never experienced racism? No matter how much you think you know you have no idea what black people have went through in america. That flag symbolizes everything that was and still is wrong with this country when it comes to racism.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That flag was the flag of the south.....guess what YOU LOST. It doesn't need to be flown anymore. It's fine and dandy to have pride in your heritage and your ancestors but you also need to respect others heritage and ancestors and I gaurantee if you're white and from the south you never experienced anything like blacks did in this country. Whenever you can say your grandfather was beaten to a pulp, hung, then his body drug through the dirt then you have a right to voice your opinion on the matter.

[Pyro]

The Confederate Flag is part of the history of a lot of peoples ancestors. If they wish to display it, I see no reason to stop them. Does anyone actually get offended by it? I don't think so, they just react because they think they are supposed to be offended. Freedom = Good. Restrictions = Bad.

[Guest]

them. Does anyone actually get offended by it? I don't think so,.

you're obviously not from america I can think of a whole race that gets offended by it

[Pyro]

 

them. Does anyone actually get offended by it? I don't think so,.

you're obviously not from america I can think of a whole race that gets offended by it

Why? Becuase the flag was used by people who wanted to enslave them? The same could be said for Europe, where most states have occupied on another numerous times throughout history. Should the Swedish flag be outlawed in Norway because my ancestors enforced our laws on them?

[Barking-Loon]

And I suppose you dont see any problems with nazi symbols either? Its not the symbol that is bad, but what is represents is. Ofcourse it shouldnt be banned but people should understand that is great disrespect to use them.

[Panix]

I think people who can't look past the slavery issue with the flag as just as closed minded as the people who are offended by the 'racism' in it. I dislike rednecks as much as the next person and I really don't care much about my background or heritage (I was borned and raised in 'the heart of dixie' :roll:) but I can see how some people could want to fly it for non-prejudice reasons. In my opinion, it's similar to abortion in terms that I'd hate to see someone's options removed just because a group of people don't agree with it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

After reading through some WW2 stuff on wikipedia, I found out that the swastika is the same way. The nazis bastardified a symbol used way back before the time of Christ. It's going through the same fight and losing it just the same.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Dead Kennedys (Napalm Death made a much better cover :P) made a good song for racist, particularly nazis. ;)[/url]

[Bmw]

Its just a flag, drop it I say. So people say it offends them, then just don't wear it! You know most people who wear it just wear it to be cool or w/e, not because its a part of their history. It's like a white guy wearing a shirt saying "your my slave" with my picture on the front. Who knows, maybe thats some fad or something. If I'm offended, let it go. You can wear your * outside of school, but in school just drop it :roll:

 

 

 

Stupid "rebels" :?

[Dark_Tigra]

Let me first start out by saying this - I'm from the South. Born in South Carolina, moved to Minnesota where I reside (unfortunately) now.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I find two things amazing about this subject..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1. People who were never even ALIVE during the Confederacy actually want the flag to be flown all over "with pride"....Why? You lost, baggage up what little pride you stilll have, or seperate from the USA and go elsewhere.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2. People who usually have those flags, almost ALWAYS in their car (truck, rather..) have NO idea what the hell that flag even stands for!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

My sister had a confederate flag in the back window of her car one day...I saw it and asked her, "Hey...You know I'm pretty sure covering your back window is illegal."...That was besides the point, but she said "I don't care, I'm a rebel."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I laughed. That was the dumbest thing I'd heard all day. You're a REBEL? So because you drink and smoke, you now get to fly a flag that stands for a seperated USA, the wanting of slavery, etc? Riiiiight...Call the cops, we've got a badass on our hands.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

People in the South who want the flag raised "out of pride" are idiots. WHAT PRIDE? YOU LOST THE DAMN WAR! Get over it! You weren't even there!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Basically, the flag is now something companies can make a quick buck off from idiots who think it's "cool", that's all. Believe me, in my highschool, there were a few guys that had trucks with Confederate flags all over them like it was a giant Hick-Mobile.

[Pyro]

And I suppose you dont see any problems with nazi symbols either? Its not the symbol that is bad, but what is represents is. Ofcourse it shouldnt be banned but people should understand that is great disrespect to use them.

Irrelevant comparision. The Nazi symbols represent a hatefull ideal, *not* a state. The Swastika is directly representative for the murder of millions, the Confederate flag is not. England claimed ownership over the colonies that now make out the US and thus you could also say they claimed ownership over its citizens, which is basically the same as slavery. Should it be outlawed?

[Dark_Tigra]

 

And I suppose you dont see any problems with nazi symbols either? Its not the symbol that is bad, but what is represents is. Ofcourse it shouldnt be banned but people should understand that is great disrespect to use them.

Irrelevant comparision. The Nazi symbols represent a hatefull ideal, *not* a state. The Swastika is directly representative for the murder of millions, the Confederate flag is not. England claimed ownership over the colonies that now make out the US and thus you could also say they claimed ownership over its citizens, which is basically the same as slavery. Should it be outlawed?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Depends how you look at it. Millions of people from the Union died at the hands of that flag, but it doesn't stand for hatred of the Union, or of African American's, infact, they probably loved African Amercian's...They did all their work for them! However, the Swastika stands for killing in the name of hatred...Or stupidity, rather. :P

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But I don't think people who use the Rebel falg should really be considered "Racist". Noone in the South EVER said "Man, I hate blacks." during that Era I'm sure. Like I said, they did all their work for them...How COULD you hate them? :P

[Barking-Loon]

 

And I suppose you dont see any problems with nazi symbols either? Its not the symbol that is bad, but what is represents is. Ofcourse it shouldnt be banned but people should understand that is great disrespect to use them.

Irrelevant comparision. The Nazi symbols represent a hatefull ideal, *not* a state. The Swastika is directly representative for the murder of millions, the Confederate flag is not. England claimed ownership over the colonies that now make out the US and thus you could also say they claimed ownership over its citizens, which is basically the same as slavery. Should it be outlawed?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Actually so the Swastika is an ancient Sunsymbol and Hitler is directly representative for the murder of millions.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And yes England claimed ownership of the citizens, then the citizens traveled to Africa and claimed ownership of citizens there which they brought home, which were very bad.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The symbols themselves should not be outlawed because they are innocent. (Although it can be considered offensive to wear them by somepeople.)

[Danabis]

 

 

And I suppose you dont see any problems with nazi symbols either? Its not the symbol that is bad, but what is represents is. Ofcourse it shouldnt be banned but people should understand that is great disrespect to use them.

Irrelevant comparision. The Nazi symbols represent a hatefull ideal, *not* a state. The Swastika is directly representative for the murder of millions, the Confederate flag is not. England claimed ownership over the colonies that now make out the US and thus you could also say they claimed ownership over its citizens, which is basically the same as slavery. Should it be outlawed?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Actually so the Swastika is an ancient Sunsymbol and Hitler is directly representative for the murder of millions.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And yes England claimed ownership of the citizens, then the citizens traveled to Africa and claimed ownership of citizens there which they brought home, which were very bad.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The symbols themselves should not be outlawed because they are innocent. (Although it can be considered offensive to wear them by somepeople.)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Actually the Swastika and the sun symbol are different. I think the Swastika is flipped horizontally, and rotated 45 degrees. They're similar, but not the same.

[Pyro]

 

 

 

Actually so the Swastika is an ancient Sunsymbol and Hitler is directly representative for the murder of millions.

 

 

 

The original meaning wasn't what I mean though. If you ask people what the Confederate flag stands for, you'll get various answers. If you ask people what the Swastika stands for, 99% will answer something related to Hitler, the holocaust or the third reich. I do not believe people should be allowed to wear the swastika today, but I do believe they should be able to wear the Confederate flag. There's a thin line between what should logically be considered offensive and what could be considered offensive if one really wanted to. I can understand why people would want that flag banned, but I would never support such a decision.

[Pete_the_Viscous]

I'd just like to add:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

"1833 Abolition of Slavery Act ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Ãâ Britain abolishes slavery and provides for the emancipation of enslaved people in the British West Indies, to take effect in August 1834." = UK

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

"1865 The Thirteenth Amendment marks the abolition of slavery in the USA at the end of the American Civil War." = US

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In case anyone was getting any funny ideas. We didn't enslave everybody, or anything.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

About flags: I quite like that confederate flag. I think it looks nice. I'm not saying that I endorse whatever it stands for; I don't know what it stands for.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The swastica... while I recognise that it's not always meant what it means today... Nowadays it does mean that. However many million people dying under something is enough to give it a bit of a bad image.

[Barking-Loon]

 

 

 

 

Actually so the Swastika is an ancient Sunsymbol and Hitler is directly representative for the murder of millions.

 

 

 

The original meaning wasn't what I mean though. If you ask people what the Confederate flag stands for, you'll get various answers. If you ask people what the Swastika stands for, 99% will answer something related to Hitler, the holocaust or the third reich. I do not believe people should be allowed to wear the swastika today, but I do believe they should be able to wear the Confederate flag. There's a thin line between what should logically be considered offensive and what could be considered offensive if one really wanted to. I can understand why people would want that flag banned, but I would never support such a decision.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ok now I understand you better and I will not pursue this any further.

[logic-is-overrated]

The black people at my school get offended by the white people hanging that flag from their cars. Yet they could care less about the Dixie shirts that actually display southern scenes (some including black people picking cotton, and other slave acts). Go figure.

[Evil_Elf]

Nobody here cares at all, theres a bunch of people that wear it on their shirts (Dixie Outfitters or something), have a sticker on their car etc. The sticker's motto is "Heritage not Hate." The real big rednecks have flagposts with it outside their houses, but they aren't allowed in actual developments, just small houses along the road.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I live in the capital of the whole confederacy thing though, so I guess its to be expected.

[Guest]

 

 

them. Does anyone actually get offended by it? I don't think so,.

you're obviously not from america I can think of a whole race that gets offended by it

Why? Becuase the flag was used by people who wanted to enslave them? The same could be said for Europe, where most states have occupied on another numerous times throughout history. Should the Swedish flag be outlawed in Norway because my ancestors enforced our laws on them?

I dont think anything that happened in europe could compare to slavery. I doubt any of your ancestors were enslaved and made to work for a person and if they didnt want to they they were whipped, hung, beaten, and finally mrudered. A bunch of vikings pillaging and plundering doesnt' compare to slavery.

[Peter]

I don't really care about it. But I don't think it should be flown, for a couple of reasons. First of all, that's what the United States' flag is for. Next, there's a state flag. I see no actual reason for the Confederate flag to be flown with two other superior flags. It's just a symbol, and for some it might remind them of the past. It's unfortunate that many don't even know the symbolism, the very people that find it offensive.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There was a local instance where a middle school teacher hung a Nazi flag up for supposed educational purposes, he was teaching about the Holocaust. Needless to say a few parents got angry and took it to the school district, and the poor teacher is having a hard time nowadays.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I personally don't feel that the mention, symbolism, etc., of Nazis or any other hate supremist group should be deemed offensive. They don't even deserve that.