Magic Vs Melee

[Inuashakent]

.......?

 

 

 

If you have the money, you can use just magic. So wait... you're saying cost isn't a factor? It's ALWAYS a factor no matter how rich one is. The defensive style allows you to get *expensive* def points. I don't understand. You get hitpoints, and magic exp. So if you only want to use magic, it's possible, but you lose a lot of money unfortunately. I still don't understand what you're talking about.

 

 

 

But if you don't like melee and prefer not to use here's a word for you: ranged ! Ranged is cheap, the accumulator saves you tons of arrows, and you can make a profit on several monsters.

 

 

 

Wait... this is making no sense? Or is this a response to the OP, and not me? Sorry if it was :XD:

 

 

 

The cost of the Melee armor is not significant, because you can always resell it. Also, while it is true that you can hit 50's with Magic, it really isn't practical. First, because that max is extremely slow due to it taking the time equal to two casts. Second, it can't be used as a KO weapon due to you wasting a whole turn just for the hit to activate. Also, you have much lower defense, as you can't wear actual armor while casting. If they wear Dragonhide armor, they win. You argue that they can switch equipment... so can the one not maging, no?

 

 

 

Magic is strong, but not comparable to Melee and Range. Also, it costs a ton more. It should only be used in conjunction with another combat style, which will synergize Magic.

 

Ehh? Ahrim slash defence > karils slash defence. If you melee, you have the advantage.

 

Veracs skirt + Karils top will make Melee more effective than Mage for the most part, making them Melee.

[compfreak847]

 

The cost of the Melee armor is not significant, because you can always resell it. Also, while it is true that you can hit 50's with Magic, it really isn't practical. First, because that max is extremely slow due to it taking the time equal to two casts. Second, it can't be used as a KO weapon due to you wasting a whole turn just for the hit to activate. Also, you have much lower defense, as you can't wear actual armor while casting. If they wear Dragonhide armor, they win. You argue that they can switch equipment... so can the one not maging, no?

 

 

 

Magic is strong, but not comparable to Melee and Range. Also, it costs a ton more. It should only be used in conjunction with another combat style, which will synergize Magic.

 

Ehh? Ahrim slash defence > karils slash defence. If you melee, you have the advantage.

 

Veracs skirt + Karils top will make Melee more effective than Mage for the most part, making them Melee.

 

Add a veracs skirt to your ahrims?

[Inuashakent]

I was hoping you'll say that.

 

 

 

To start, the reason why Karils has such low defense is because of its Legs. If you take this out, Karils would have more melee defense. This already makes it better, but to add to that, if you wear Verac's skirt you lose a lot of Magic offense, which makes Melee your best option. This, of course, makes Karils better.

[Owned_Nex]

But then again, in the pures of these days, a DDS is going to rip through Karils or Ahrims.

 

 

 

Magic and Range are very similar. They are good for lowering HP, but has VERY low K0ing abilities.

 

 

 

A Blitz+DDS is very good againt pures.

[Argorn5757]

Magic is great if you need to get somewhere fast, you can just tele.

[Zaaps1]

The cost of the Melee armor is not significant, because you can always resell it. Also, while it is true that you can hit 50's with Magic, it really isn't practical. First, because that max is extremely slow due to it taking the time equal to two casts. Second, it can't be used as a KO weapon due to you wasting a whole turn just for the hit to activate. Also, you have much lower defense, as you can't wear actual armor while casting. If they wear Dragonhide armor, they win. You argue that they can switch equipment... so can the one not maging, no?

 

 

 

Magic is strong, but not comparable to Melee and Range. Also, it costs a ton more. It should only be used in conjunction with another combat style, which will synergize Magic.

 

 

 

You make everything sound so smart :lol:

 

 

 

Magic has its applications. Unlike melee and ranged, Magic is tactical. You cannot bring a bunch of ice barrages and hope for the best (whereas you can grab your dds and go). You have to think things through. For example, in the days of Abyssal Pkers, why would anyone fear a melee or ranger? They can't do anything by the time you run away. What we feared most were the Lunar Mages with Ice Barrage and TeleBlock, and Modern Mages right under them.

 

 

 

That being said, I agree with Kent up there. But it's not just with another combat style. It's with anything. Magic is tactical, after all. What's the point of all those special effects of spells? Put them to use. Looking at that Ranging over hte Wildy Ditch topic, think how much more effective a mage would've been. Ice, jump ditch, Teleblock, maybe throw in some weakening spells, Smoke barrage to poison, then mage away. And all this time the meleer can do nothing except eat. (Of course a smart pker would pull out range gear, but that's besides the point. If one side brought an equipment change, would the mager then not simply pull out the dds? Range back? Point being the Mager has the upper hand since he can run and teleport.)

 

 

 

What I think is the biggest pitfall for Magic is that robes provide no melee defense whatsoever. Spitbark was a step in the right direction, but it didn't go far.

[Inuashakent]

The cost of the Melee armor is not significant, because you can always resell it. Also, while it is true that you can hit 50's with Magic, it really isn't practical. First, because that max is extremely slow due to it taking the time equal to two casts. Second, it can't be used as a KO weapon due to you wasting a whole turn just for the hit to activate. Also, you have much lower defense, as you can't wear actual armor while casting. If they wear Dragonhide armor, they win. You argue that they can switch equipment... so can the one not maging, no?

 

 

 

Magic is strong, but not comparable to Melee and Range. Also, it costs a ton more. It should only be used in conjunction with another combat style, which will synergize Magic.

 

 

 

You make everything sound so smart :lol:

 

 

 

Magic has its applications. Unlike melee and ranged, Magic is tactical. You cannot bring a bunch of ice barrages and hope for the best (whereas you can grab your dds and go). You have to think things through. For example, in the days of Abyssal Pkers, why would anyone fear a melee or ranger? They can't do anything by the time you run away. What we feared most were the Lunar Mages with Ice Barrage and TeleBlock, and Modern Mages right under them.

 

 

 

That being said, I agree with Kent up there. But it's not just with another combat style. It's with anything. Magic is tactical, after all. What's the point of all those special effects of spells? Put them to use. Looking at that Ranging over hte Wildy Ditch topic, think how much more effective a mage would've been. Ice, jump ditch, Teleblock, maybe throw in some weakening spells, Smoke barrage to poison, then mage away. And all this time the meleer can do nothing except eat. (Of course a smart pker would pull out range gear, but that's besides the point. If one side brought an equipment change, would the mager then not simply pull out the dds? Range back? Point being the Mager has the upper hand since he can run and teleport.)

 

 

 

What I think is the biggest pitfall for Magic is that robes provide no melee defense whatsoever. Spitbark was a step in the right direction, but it didn't go far.

 

Smart Pkers would bring at least a Black D' hide top. Also, that is AKA farcasting, which is frowned upon. This does matter for pking, because it will cause him to Pray, run, and all other sorts of mess you don't want, because neither of you will be able to get a kill.

[Zaaps1]

The cost of the Melee armor is not significant, because you can always resell it. Also, while it is true that you can hit 50's with Magic, it really isn't practical. First, because that max is extremely slow due to it taking the time equal to two casts. Second, it can't be used as a KO weapon due to you wasting a whole turn just for the hit to activate. Also, you have much lower defense, as you can't wear actual armor while casting. If they wear Dragonhide armor, they win. You argue that they can switch equipment... so can the one not maging, no?

 

 

 

Magic is strong, but not comparable to Melee and Range. Also, it costs a ton more. It should only be used in conjunction with another combat style, which will synergize Magic.

 

 

 

You make everything sound so smart :lol:

 

 

 

Magic has its applications. Unlike melee and ranged, Magic is tactical. You cannot bring a bunch of ice barrages and hope for the best (whereas you can grab your dds and go). You have to think things through. For example, in the days of Abyssal Pkers, why would anyone fear a melee or ranger? They can't do anything by the time you run away. What we feared most were the Lunar Mages with Ice Barrage and TeleBlock, and Modern Mages right under them.

 

 

 

That being said, I agree with Kent up there. But it's not just with another combat style. It's with anything. Magic is tactical, after all. What's the point of all those special effects of spells? Put them to use. Looking at that Ranging over hte Wildy Ditch topic, think how much more effective a mage would've been. Ice, jump ditch, Teleblock, maybe throw in some weakening spells, Smoke barrage to poison, then mage away. And all this time the meleer can do nothing except eat. (Of course a smart pker would pull out range gear, but that's besides the point. If one side brought an equipment change, would the mager then not simply pull out the dds? Range back? Point being the Mager has the upper hand since he can run and teleport.)

 

 

 

What I think is the biggest pitfall for Magic is that robes provide no melee defense whatsoever. Spitbark was a step in the right direction, but it didn't go far.

 

Smart Pkers would bring at least a Black D' hide top. Also, that is AKA farcasting, which is frowned upon. This does matter for pking, because it will cause him to Pray, run, and all other sorts of mess you don't want, because neither of you will be able to get a kill.

 

 

 

For argument's sake, let's say both of these pkers are highly prejudiced toward their combat style, and don't use any other.

 

 

 

Pker 1 is melee, 2 is magic (Lunar) they are at the ditch.

 

 

 

Pker 2 can pull off that Smoke/Ice combo, say it slams a 45. Pker1 is now poisoned and frozen. Next tern he is teleblocked. Pker 2 now has 3 turns to finish Pker 1 before he can run. Even then, Pker2 can entangle.

 

 

 

I don't know how long Spellbook Swap takes to cast. If it's too long, ignore the ancients stuff and pretend it's Claws or Flames (Charged). On top of that, Pker2 can Veng, just in case Pker1 does get in a high hit. (Speaking of that, it's another Magic advantage, 2 hits in 1. It would be effective since meleers hit so high.)

 

 

 

My point is, Magic is tactical based, and it needs other resources for support, be them melee/range/obstacles/etc.

[highlanders]

.......?

 

 

 

If you have the money, you can use just magic. So wait... you're saying cost isn't a factor? It's ALWAYS a factor no matter how rich one is. The defensive style allows you to get *expensive* def points. I don't understand. You get hitpoints, and magic exp. So if you only want to use magic, it's possible, but you lose a lot of money unfortunately. I still don't understand what you're talking about.

 

 

 

But if you don't like melee and prefer not to use here's a word for you: ranged ! Ranged is cheap, the accumulator saves you tons of arrows, and you can make a profit on several monsters.

 

 

 

Wait... this is making no sense? Or is this a response to the OP, and not me? Sorry if it was :XD:

 

Lol, yah it was to the d00d who posted the topic. (Omgz magikz r impossiblez without malee!)

[compfreak847]

Ok, so mage isn't the best combat style against rangers by itself... But no one does that, so what are you trying to say?

 

 

 

Mage has so many applications besides 'just' fighting with mage. A player who simply melees is going to get owned by a mage, unless he has range armor - then the mage can simply equip a dd++ and tear him into nice small pieces. No mage is going to try to kill a ranger without magic armor - obviously this isn't going to work. Same goes for mage against a meleer wearing range - the mage can simply melee in his armor, with virtually the same slash defence. Yes, Karils top or +7 so slash defence compared to ahrims top, and the bottom is -7 or so. Tiny difference that aren't really going to do much - in ahrims, I have over 250 slash defence with a large mage bonus. That and a whip\dd++ are going to take out any meleer out there - and a DH plate will take care of the rangers. Plus, even if I'm simply meleeing or ranging, vengeance is going to give me a virtually guaranteed win against any one with levels similar to mine.

 

 

 

If you took melee out of the game, combat levels would be lowered, there would be a reduction in PKers, and some boss monsters would become tougher. Slayer would become harder.

 

If you took range out of the game, there would be a small reduction in PKers, and corporal beast would become tougher

 

If you took magic out of the game, there would be a huge reduction in PKers (Anyone could run and tele without restraint; not many people, offered the choice between clicking that tablet 'without honor' or dying and losing everything to be 'honorable' are going to stand there and die. Not many boss monsters would become harder, but the entire economy would collapse. Skills such as fletching, woodcutting, and runecrafting would die. All GP would eventually be drained out of the system, and training summoning would become much harder. There would be no teleporting, so everyone would be walking. It could truly 'kill' runescape. Castle wars and FOG

 

 

 

Using magic with melee\range is invaluable and will give an enormous advantage to whoever uses it. Magic, by itself, is very powerful, and in rare cases where it does not suffice, a whip and a backup armor will give a huge advantage over your opponents dragonhide - which, if he is dumb enough to take off, can be barraged then sidestepped for 5-6 hits without taking any damage, then resuming normal combat with much higher defence then him. Nice editing of your OP, though. You completely changed the thread after you were proven wrong -.-

[Inuashakent]

Ok, so mage isn't the best combat style against rangers by itself... But no one does that, so what are you trying to say?

 

 

 

Mage has so many applications besides 'just' fighting with mage. A player who simply melees is going to get owned by a mage, unless he has range armor - then the mage can simply equip a dd++ and tear him into nice small pieces. No mage is going to try to kill a ranger without magic armor - obviously this isn't going to work. Same goes for mage against a meleer wearing range - the mage can simply melee in his armor, with virtually the same slash defence. Yes, Karils top or +7 so slash defence compared to ahrims top, and the bottom is -7 or so. Tiny difference that aren't really going to do much - in ahrims, I have over 250 slash defence with a large mage bonus. That and a whip\dd++ are going to take out any meleer out there - and a DH plate will take care of the rangers. Plus, even if I'm simply meleeing or ranging, vengeance is going to give me a virtually guaranteed win against any one with levels similar to mine.

 

 

 

If you took melee out of the game, combat levels would be lowered, there would be a reduction in PKers, and some boss monsters would become tougher. Slayer would become harder.

 

If you took range out of the game, there would be a small reduction in PKers, and corporal beast would become tougher

 

If you took magic out of the game, there would be a huge reduction in PKers (Anyone could run and tele without restraint; not many people, offered the choice between clicking that tablet 'without honor' or dying and losing everything to be 'honorable' are going to stand there and die. Not many boss monsters would become harder, but the entire economy would collapse. Skills such as fletching, woodcutting, and runecrafting would die. All GP would eventually be drained out of the system, and training summoning would become much harder. There would be no teleporting, so everyone would be walking. It could truly 'kill' runescape. Castle wars and FOG

 

 

 

Using magic with melee\range is invaluable and will give an enormous advantage to whoever uses it. Magic, by itself, is very powerful, and in rare cases where it does not suffice, a whip and a backup armor will give a huge advantage over your opponents dragonhide - which, if he is dumb enough to take off, can be barraged then sidestepped for 5-6 hits without taking any damage, then resuming normal combat with much higher defence then him. Nice editing of your OP, though. You completely changed the thread after you were proven wrong -.-

 

 

 

It should only be used in conjunction with another combat style, which will synergize Magic.

[compfreak847]

Ok, so mage isn't the best combat style against rangers by itself... But no one does that, so what are you trying to say?

 

 

 

Mage has so many applications besides 'just' fighting with mage. A player who simply melees is going to get owned by a mage, unless he has range armor - then the mage can simply equip a dd++ and tear him into nice small pieces. No mage is going to try to kill a ranger without magic armor - obviously this isn't going to work. Same goes for mage against a meleer wearing range - the mage can simply melee in his armor, with virtually the same slash defence. Yes, Karils top or +7 so slash defence compared to ahrims top, and the bottom is -7 or so. Tiny difference that aren't really going to do much - in ahrims, I have over 250 slash defence with a large mage bonus. That and a whip\dd++ are going to take out any meleer out there - and a DH plate will take care of the rangers. Plus, even if I'm simply meleeing or ranging, vengeance is going to give me a virtually guaranteed win against any one with levels similar to mine.

 

 

 

If you took melee out of the game, combat levels would be lowered, there would be a reduction in PKers, and some boss monsters would become tougher. Slayer would become harder.

 

If you took range out of the game, there would be a small reduction in PKers, and corporal beast would become tougher

 

If you took magic out of the game, there would be a huge reduction in PKers (Anyone could run and tele without restraint; not many people, offered the choice between clicking that tablet 'without honor' or dying and losing everything to be 'honorable' are going to stand there and die. Not many boss monsters would become harder, but the entire economy would collapse. Skills such as fletching, woodcutting, and runecrafting would die. All GP would eventually be drained out of the system, and training summoning would become much harder. There would be no teleporting, so everyone would be walking. It could truly 'kill' runescape. Castle wars and FOG

 

 

 

Using magic with melee\range is invaluable and will give an enormous advantage to whoever uses it. Magic, by itself, is very powerful, and in rare cases where it does not suffice, a whip and a backup armor will give a huge advantage over your opponents dragonhide - which, if he is dumb enough to take off, can be barraged then sidestepped for 5-6 hits without taking any damage, then resuming normal combat with much higher defence then him. Nice editing of your OP, though. You completely changed the thread after you were proven wrong -.-

 

 

 

It should only be used in conjunction with another combat style, which will synergize Magic.

 

But that's basically true with any combat. Only a single combat style is doomed to failure, with the possible exception of range tanks. Magic is the easiest to do multiple combat styles with of the three; and is arguably even more useful outside of PVP. And miasmic barrage pretty much ends any 'mage sucks' arguments, except for the cost - but if you only use the staff for 2-3 seconds per cast, it isn't that bad.

[Inuashakent]

That's not true for any combat, unless we are talking about Protection prayers...

 

 

 

And if we're talking about Miasmic, what stops the new Javalins from qualifying as reasonable weapons?

[compfreak847]

^^

 

Cost, and lack of testing. Miasmic is using the staff for ~2 seconds for a 2:1 advantage that lasts nearly a minute.

[Inuashakent]

Effects for Magic lasts half on PvP. It's been tested, the Javelin frikin owns. It costs 30k each, but it could be picked up.

[compfreak847]

Effects for Magic lasts half on PvP. It's been tested, the Javelin frikin owns. It costs 30k each, but it could be picked up.

 

Even at half it's cheaper then the 30k per shot javelin- honestly, who would spend that much for pking? There's a fine line between 'spending a lot of money to hit a bit harder' and 'spending massive amounts of money to hit a bit harder' :|

[Inuashakent]

Who would risk 10m for Maging when they could just Melee?

[Ravenkana]

Who would risk 10m for Maging when they could just Melee?

True, but considering that the staff would probably the most valuable item in any mage set up, you'll probably keep it.

 

 

 

Oh, and I love your "Verac Obama" signature.

[Inuashakent]

Who would risk 10m for Maging when they could just Melee?

True, but considering that the staff would probably the most valuable item in any mage set up, you'll probably keep it.

 

 

 

Oh, and I love your "Verac Obama" signature.

 

True, but you'll be risking other items as well. And there is a chance of losing it.

[compfreak847]

Who would risk 10m for Maging when they could just Melee?

True, but considering that the staff would probably the most valuable item in any mage set up, you'll probably keep it.

 

 

 

Oh, and I love your "Verac Obama" signature.

 

True, but you'll be risking other items as well. And there is a chance of losing it.

 

I had to use it because you were advocating 'pure' combat styles - yes, mage fails against range armor. Pull out a whip and own, though... With ice\blood\shadow\smoke barrage, you have the upper hand, period.

 

 

 

Oh, and the 'verac obama' is good, but I'm still voting Mccain :P

[Inuashakent]

Who would risk 10m for Maging when they could just Melee?

True, but considering that the staff would probably the most valuable item in any mage set up, you'll probably keep it.

 

 

 

Oh, and I love your "Verac Obama" signature.

 

True, but you'll be risking other items as well. And there is a chance of losing it.

 

I had to use it because you were advocating 'pure' combat styles - yes, mage fails against range armor. Pull out a whip and own, though... With ice\blood\shadow\smoke barrage, you have the upper hand, period.

 

 

 

Oh, and the 'verac obama' is good, but I'm still voting Mccain :P

 

As a student, I must say that McCain needs to go and to Mexico and never come back. Or something.

 

 

 

But that's not the point. Pull out a whip with V skirt + K top and own more.

[compfreak847]

Who would risk 10m for Maging when they could just Melee?

True, but considering that the staff would probably the most valuable item in any mage set up, you'll probably keep it.

 

 

 

Oh, and I love your "Verac Obama" signature.

 

True, but you'll be risking other items as well. And there is a chance of losing it.

 

I had to use it because you were advocating 'pure' combat styles - yes, mage fails against range armor. Pull out a whip and own, though... With ice\blood\shadow\smoke barrage, you have the upper hand, period.

 

 

 

Oh, and the 'verac obama' is good, but I'm still voting Mccain :P

 

As a student, I must say that McCain needs to go and to Mexico and never come back. Or something.

 

 

 

But that's not the point. Pull out a whip with V skirt + K top and own more.

 

At least Mccain was born in the US.. But I won't turn this into a politics debate :P

 

 

 

K top has.. +7 more slash defence then ah top? It's basically a dead tie, except sooner or later the melee person will try to switch back to melee armor, especially if you put on dh top also - fast clicking means you can switch armor and barrage right after a whip attack, so you can freeze and sidestep to get 5-6 melee hits without touching him.

[Inuashakent]

So you're assuming the Mager has a faster reaction.

 

 

 

And if you're so keen on how much a Karils top sucks, why not switch it for D hide?

 

 

 

I didn't know you had to be born in America for your opinion to be valid enough to be a leader. We are finally freed from the bush that has messed up our economy.

 

 

 

(Ok we seriously have to end this here :XD: )

[compfreak847]

So you're assuming the Mager has a faster reaction.

 

 

 

And if you're so keen on how much a Karils top sucks, why not switch it for D hide?

 

 

 

I didn't know you had to be born in America for your opinion to be valid enough to be a leader. We are finally freed from the bush that has messed up our economy.

 

 

 

(Ok we seriously have to end this here :XD: )

 

I agree. But according to the constitution, one of the requirements for a president is a 'natural born US citizen'. 8th grade constitution all over again :lol:

 

 

 

Mage doesn't have to have a faster reaction - he's planning it, he can simply switch to ahrims top and bottom and barrage before the meleer knows whats going on. Fairly simple; for slow clickers, just an ahrims top should be simple with keyboard shortcuts - and still very likely to hit; with a -4 mage bonus in void, I hit at least 3\4ths the time. See avatar for details :P

[ShadowTwisted]

Much as I love a good political debate, it seems rather off-topic, so let's get back on track

 

 

 

Well, here's where I think the main argument should be: Combat Triangle

 

 

 

Melee beats Range: Melee armor has high defense against range, making it easier to survive the arrow volley required to get up close and personal.

 

 

 

Range beats Mage: Range armor provides excellent magic protection, and no worries on distance from foe for the kill.

 

 

 

Mage gets pwned by anything: Magic armor does little to protect you from anything. The only reason it gets an edge on melee is due to melee gear's magic defense penalties. The only things to save a mage from meeting their doom is ice spells.

 

 

 

I love mage, but in most pvp situations, it seems that it would do little to actually live up to its part of the combat triangle.