If a Cure for AIDS was Invented...

[Quoi_Tu]

 

The people.

 

 

 

The state is unjustifiable yet inevitable with the current mentality of the people. And I keep saying this, but there are two ways in which we can change this system.

 

 

 

1. Reform. Look, this is what I see happening. Capitalism isn't going anywhere anytime soon, but if slowly the consensus shifts towards the left and starts to not place so much value and meaning into money, then in a couple hundred years when we have the technology to have everything done for us (oh and transhumanism will play a part, make everyone not selfish + not hate etc because personally I think the only way humanity can 100% rid itself of its problems if we cease to be human) then we can have a system in which everything belongs to everybody and no problems would arise. Now that may sound ridiculous, but it isn't even that far away. I can't remember who said it, but there is a quote and its something like "Future technology is indistinguishable from magic" - which is true. Imagine going back to the 1700s with a laptop and iphones and stuff. Now imagine 300 years into the future. But one thing that needs to be done is we need to rid the people of this neo-conservative, religious mentality. Deism I don't mind that much but theism coupled with neo-conservative values are some of the most troubling things that we face..

 

 

 

2. Revolution. If reform doesn't happen and the state continues on its path toward fascism, there is no other choice.

 

 

 

I think a mixture of capitalism and socialism is a good start to be honest. Maybe I'm going too extreme even with socialism at this point. But they are not ideal, and they are not the best we can do as a species. And you may say I'm looking too far into the future, but really, if the rich elites get a strangehold on the mentality of the people then it may take centuries to relieve it.

 

 

 

Humans are social animals. We naturally form states and communities.

 

 

 

1. You're thinking in quite the ideal manner. Money is not inherently evil, it is neutral. It is a medium used to ease trade between individuals. So even if money becomes philosophically devalued, objects still have value and always will. It is natural to think that a product that takes 100 hours to make is more valuable than one that takes 1 hour to make (assuming more time spent on the product increases its quality). Also, people are selfish. Even the most religious are selfish. However, many religions have cleverly used people's selfishness to help others. (think: good deeds get you into heaven, unless of course you believe John Calvin)

 

 

 

2. Violence is never good. Since I don't see any fascist nations popping up (in developped countries), I see no reason to worry.

 

 

 

Don't worry about the "rich elites." The only one that has enough power to do anything is the goverment. The others don't have anywhere near enough money.

[user1991]

 

The people.

 

 

 

The state is unjustifiable yet inevitable with the current mentality of the people. And I keep saying this, but there are two ways in which we can change this system.

 

 

 

1. Reform. Look, this is what I see happening. Capitalism isn't going anywhere anytime soon, but if slowly the consensus shifts towards the left and starts to not place so much value and meaning into money, then in a couple hundred years when we have the technology to have everything done for us (oh and transhumanism will play a part, make everyone not selfish + not hate etc because personally I think the only way humanity can 100% rid itself of its problems if we cease to be human) then we can have a system in which everything belongs to everybody and no problems would arise. Now that may sound ridiculous, but it isn't even that far away. I can't remember who said it, but there is a quote and its something like "Future technology is indistinguishable from magic" - which is true. Imagine going back to the 1700s with a laptop and iphones and stuff. Now imagine 300 years into the future. But one thing that needs to be done is we need to rid the people of this neo-conservative, religious mentality. Deism I don't mind that much but theism coupled with neo-conservative values are some of the most troubling things that we face..

 

 

 

2. Revolution. If reform doesn't happen and the state continues on its path toward fascism, there is no other choice.

 

 

 

I think a mixture of capitalism and socialism is a good start to be honest. Maybe I'm going too extreme even with socialism at this point. But they are not ideal, and they are not the best we can do as a species. And you may say I'm looking too far into the future, but really, if the rich elites get a strangehold on the mentality of the people then it may take centuries to relieve it.

 

 

 

Humans are social animals. We naturally form states and communities.

 

 

 

1. You're thinking in quite the ideal manner. Money is not inherently evil, it is neutral. It is a medium used to ease trade between individuals. So even if money becomes philosophically devalued, objects still have value and always will. It is natural to think that a product that takes 100 hours to make is more valuable than one that takes 1 hour to make (assuming more time spent on the product increases its quality). Also, people are selfish. Even the most religious are selfish. However, many religions have cleverly used people's selfishness to help others. (think: good deeds get you into heaven, unless of course you believe John Calvin)

 

 

 

Transhumanism will play an integral part. And it isn't far away. I'm thinking about the future of mankind rather than my time here on Earth. The transition between type 0 and type 1 civilisation is the most dangerous. We need to settle these stupid differences otherwise sooner or later they're going to come crashing down.

 

 

 

 

 

2. Violence is never good. Since I don't see any fascist nations popping up (in developped countries), I see no reason to worry.

 

 

 

Don't worry about the "rich elites." The only one that has enough power to do anything is the goverment. The others don't have anywhere near enough money.

 

 

 

Violence should only ever be used as a last resort. If you're in a situation where it's a choice between the progression of our species or submitting to a fascist regime, you should overthrow that regime by any means necessary.

 

 

 

The elites + government constantly worry me, in fact it worries me that it has become this bad. And fascism, fascism is on the breakfast table of every single person in a position of coercive authority. Fascism is not something you can let happen before you fight against it. You need to cut it down from the root.

[Quoi_Tu]

[hide=]

 

The people.

 

 

 

The state is unjustifiable yet inevitable with the current mentality of the people. And I keep saying this, but there are two ways in which we can change this system.

 

 

 

1. Reform. Look, this is what I see happening. Capitalism isn't going anywhere anytime soon, but if slowly the consensus shifts towards the left and starts to not place so much value and meaning into money, then in a couple hundred years when we have the technology to have everything done for us (oh and transhumanism will play a part, make everyone not selfish + not hate etc because personally I think the only way humanity can 100% rid itself of its problems if we cease to be human) then we can have a system in which everything belongs to everybody and no problems would arise. Now that may sound ridiculous, but it isn't even that far away. I can't remember who said it, but there is a quote and its something like "Future technology is indistinguishable from magic" - which is true. Imagine going back to the 1700s with a laptop and iphones and stuff. Now imagine 300 years into the future. But one thing that needs to be done is we need to rid the people of this neo-conservative, religious mentality. Deism I don't mind that much but theism coupled with neo-conservative values are some of the most troubling things that we face..

 

 

 

2. Revolution. If reform doesn't happen and the state continues on its path toward fascism, there is no other choice.

 

 

 

I think a mixture of capitalism and socialism is a good start to be honest. Maybe I'm going too extreme even with socialism at this point. But they are not ideal, and they are not the best we can do as a species. And you may say I'm looking too far into the future, but really, if the rich elites get a strangehold on the mentality of the people then it may take centuries to relieve it.

 

 

 

Humans are social animals. We naturally form states and communities.

 

 

 

1. You're thinking in quite the ideal manner. Money is not inherently evil, it is neutral. It is a medium used to ease trade between individuals. So even if money becomes philosophically devalued, objects still have value and always will. It is natural to think that a product that takes 100 hours to make is more valuable than one that takes 1 hour to make (assuming more time spent on the product increases its quality). Also, people are selfish. Even the most religious are selfish. However, many religions have cleverly used people's selfishness to help others. (think: good deeds get you into heaven, unless of course you believe John Calvin)

 

 

 

Transhumanism will play an integral part. And it isn't far away. I'm thinking about the future of mankind rather than my time here on Earth. The transition between type 0 and type 1 civilisation is the most dangerous. We need to settle these stupid differences otherwise sooner or later they're going to come crashing down.

 

 

 

 

 

2. Violence is never good. Since I don't see any fascist nations popping up (in developped countries), I see no reason to worry.

 

 

 

Don't worry about the "rich elites." The only one that has enough power to do anything is the goverment. The others don't have anywhere near enough money.

 

 

 

Violence should only ever be used as a last resort. If you're in a situation where it's a choice between the progression of our species or submitting to a fascist regime, you should overthrow that regime by any means necessary.

 

 

 

The elites + government constantly worry me, in fact it worries me that it has become this bad. And fascism, fascism is on the breakfast table of every single person in a position of coercive authority. Fascism is not something you can let happen before you fight against it. You need to cut it down from the root.

[/hide]

 

 

 

Well, I can't argue with paranoia and idealism. All I can say is that, fascism will not occur in any power-holding country without outside interference. The world has already learned that lesson from World War 2. If the elites try to influence government towards fascism, the first signs of such influence will be met with protest from the people. You underestimate the power that the people hold.

[user1991]

[hide=]

 

The people.

 

 

 

The state is unjustifiable yet inevitable with the current mentality of the people. And I keep saying this, but there are two ways in which we can change this system.

 

 

 

1. Reform. Look, this is what I see happening. Capitalism isn't going anywhere anytime soon, but if slowly the consensus shifts towards the left and starts to not place so much value and meaning into money, then in a couple hundred years when we have the technology to have everything done for us (oh and transhumanism will play a part, make everyone not selfish + not hate etc because personally I think the only way humanity can 100% rid itself of its problems if we cease to be human) then we can have a system in which everything belongs to everybody and no problems would arise. Now that may sound ridiculous, but it isn't even that far away. I can't remember who said it, but there is a quote and its something like "Future technology is indistinguishable from magic" - which is true. Imagine going back to the 1700s with a laptop and iphones and stuff. Now imagine 300 years into the future. But one thing that needs to be done is we need to rid the people of this neo-conservative, religious mentality. Deism I don't mind that much but theism coupled with neo-conservative values are some of the most troubling things that we face..

 

 

 

2. Revolution. If reform doesn't happen and the state continues on its path toward fascism, there is no other choice.

 

 

 

I think a mixture of capitalism and socialism is a good start to be honest. Maybe I'm going too extreme even with socialism at this point. But they are not ideal, and they are not the best we can do as a species. And you may say I'm looking too far into the future, but really, if the rich elites get a strangehold on the mentality of the people then it may take centuries to relieve it.

 

 

 

Humans are social animals. We naturally form states and communities.

 

 

 

1. You're thinking in quite the ideal manner. Money is not inherently evil, it is neutral. It is a medium used to ease trade between individuals. So even if money becomes philosophically devalued, objects still have value and always will. It is natural to think that a product that takes 100 hours to make is more valuable than one that takes 1 hour to make (assuming more time spent on the product increases its quality). Also, people are selfish. Even the most religious are selfish. However, many religions have cleverly used people's selfishness to help others. (think: good deeds get you into heaven, unless of course you believe John Calvin)

 

 

 

Transhumanism will play an integral part. And it isn't far away. I'm thinking about the future of mankind rather than my time here on Earth. The transition between type 0 and type 1 civilisation is the most dangerous. We need to settle these stupid differences otherwise sooner or later they're going to come crashing down.

 

 

 

 

 

2. Violence is never good. Since I don't see any fascist nations popping up (in developped countries), I see no reason to worry.

 

 

 

Don't worry about the "rich elites." The only one that has enough power to do anything is the goverment. The others don't have anywhere near enough money.

 

 

 

Violence should only ever be used as a last resort. If you're in a situation where it's a choice between the progression of our species or submitting to a fascist regime, you should overthrow that regime by any means necessary.

 

 

 

The elites + government constantly worry me, in fact it worries me that it has become this bad. And fascism, fascism is on the breakfast table of every single person in a position of coercive authority. Fascism is not something you can let happen before you fight against it. You need to cut it down from the root.

[/hide]

 

 

 

Well, I can't argue with paranoia and idealism. All I can say is that, fascism will not occur in any power-holding country without outside interference. The world has already learned that lesson from World War 2. If the elites try to influence government towards fascism, the first signs of such influence will be met with protest from the people. You underestimate the power that the people hold.

 

 

 

No, we haven't learnt our lessons. Listen to these religious neo-con nutjobs. People are all too willing to throw away their freedoms in the name of safety until it is too late. People are the same. We haven't changed. You underestimate the power of fear.

 

 

 

I do not underestimate the power of the people. We just look at things differently. You think I'm paranoid, I think you're naive.

 

 

 

No army can stop an idea whose time has come. I'm just trying to make it easier, when the time is right, for that idea to come.

[Faux]

You overestimate the power of those neo-con nutjobs. Hello, look at who became the president-elect. I thought that too before. I never thought a black man had a chance over a white war veteran. But look at what happened.

 

 

 

Tbh, your insanity is at the same level as those neo-cons

[Quoi_Tu]

 

No, we haven't learnt our lessons. Listen to these religious neo-con nutjobs. People are all too willing to throw away their freedoms in the name of safety until it is too late. People are the same. We haven't changed. You underestimate the power of fear.

 

 

 

I do not underestimate the power of the people. We just look at things differently. You think I'm paranoid, I think you're naive.

 

 

 

No army can stop an idea whose time has come. I'm just trying to make it easier, when the time is right, for that idea to come.

 

 

 

"Neo-con nutjobs" are small in number similar to how Muslim terrorists are. Fear is a strong motivator, but fear tactics haven't been used by the current US administration since the terrorist attacks of 9/11 and look how those tactics have created a strong disliking of Bush. As well as a disliking, politicians are wary of passing things they don't know enough about these days. For example, one of the reasons cited by congress members as to why they voted against the first bailout plan? They knew little about it and equated this ignorance to invading Iraq. People change and learn.

 

 

 

That bolded line sounds quite a lot like a militant revolutionary who overthrows an oppresive regime to become oppresive himself. Politcal instability can have horrible consequences on a country. It's why a lot of people are starving and killed.

[user1991]

You overestimate the power of those neo-con nutjobs. Hello, look at who became the president-elect. I thought that too before. I never thought a black man had a chance over a white war veteran. But look at what happened.

 

 

 

Tbh, your insanity is at the same level as those neo-cons

 

 

 

He's black.. and what?

 

 

 

He's only just better than Bush/Cheney.

 

 

 

Biden is an imbecile.

 

 

 

Obama is a smart guy yes, but he is still centre-right. All these people who automatically think it's all good cause a black guy got in, and therefore America must be tolerant. Don't get me wrong, I mean McCain and Palin were even worse, they are some of the worst people in the world I could think of to put into power of a superpower.. but you need to quit pretending that Obama will solve all your problems.

 

 

 

And no, I am not insane. I see light in the people. You've just been conditioned to think the way you do. You live in a world and you don't want change cause you're happy how it is - and I get it. But you have to understand, this is more than you or me. This is more than America, Europe.. this is about ideas. This is about our species as a whole..

 

 

 

Any atheist who isn't an anarchist is a hypocrite because the burden of proof works exactly the same when you apply it to the state. The burden of proof is on them to show that their authority, to which I did not consent, is legitimate, and if they do not, it must be TORE DOWN.

 

 

 

And sorry, when I say nutjobs, they aren't what you would classify as nutjobs - they are what society would consider "normal" people. And I know that I'm in the minority, and thus I am crazy, but never forget - long live the people..

[Quoi_Tu]

Obama is a smart guy yes, but he is still centre-right. All these people who automatically think it's all good cause a black guy got in, and therefore America must be tolerant. Don't get me wrong, I mean McCain and Palin were even worse, they are some of the worst people in the world I could think of to put into power of a superpower.. but you need to quit pretending that Obama will solve all your problems.

 

 

 

And no, I am not insane. I see light in the people. You've just been conditioned to think the way you do. You live in a world and you don't want change cause you're happy how it is - and I get it. But you have to understand, this is more than you or me. This is more than America, Europe.. this is about ideas. This is about our species as a whole..

 

 

 

Any atheist who isn't an anarchist is a hypocrite because the burden of proof works exactly the same when you apply it to the state. The burden of proof is on them to show that their authority, to which I did not consent, is legitimate, and if they do not, it must be TORE DOWN.

 

 

 

And sorry, when I say nutjobs, they aren't what you would classify as nutjobs - they are what society would consider "normal" people. And I know that I'm in the minority, and thus I am crazy, but never forget - long live the people..

 

 

 

Obama is left. Not socialist left or very left, but he is left.

 

 

 

God =\= Government We can control our government, we cannot control our God.

 

 

 

At the college I go to, we call people like you pit preachers. I only say this because that was a very preachy way to say your point.

[user1991]

Obama is a smart guy yes, but he is still centre-right. All these people who automatically think it's all good cause a black guy got in, and therefore America must be tolerant. Don't get me wrong, I mean McCain and Palin were even worse, they are some of the worst people in the world I could think of to put into power of a superpower.. but you need to quit pretending that Obama will solve all your problems.

 

 

 

And no, I am not insane. I see light in the people. You've just been conditioned to think the way you do. You live in a world and you don't want change cause you're happy how it is - and I get it. But you have to understand, this is more than you or me. This is more than America, Europe.. this is about ideas. This is about our species as a whole..

 

 

 

Any atheist who isn't an anarchist is a hypocrite because the burden of proof works exactly the same when you apply it to the state. The burden of proof is on them to show that their authority, to which I did not consent, is legitimate, and if they do not, it must be TORE DOWN.

 

 

 

And sorry, when I say nutjobs, they aren't what you would classify as nutjobs - they are what society would consider "normal" people. And I know that I'm in the minority, and thus I am crazy, but never forget - long live the people..

 

 

 

Obama is left. Not socialist left or very left, but he is left.

 

 

 

God =\= Government We can control our government, we cannot control our God.

 

 

 

At the college I go to, we call people like you pit preachers. I only say this because that was a very preachy way to say your point.

 

 

 

Obama isn't left..he's centre right.

 

 

 

The abundance of right wing douche bags makes it seem as if he is left, admittedly he is more left than them.. but they're far right. He isn't left though, that's for sure.

 

 

 

[BlueLancer]

So whilst I'm against government and despise authority to the core of my being, if there are going to be changes, I have to be pragmatic about things.

 

 

 

If you were also to be absolutely objective, you'd see complete absence of government is impossible in human societies.

 

 

 

Assuming you follow international news, you probably know about the state affairs in Somalia and Afghanistan. This is a great look into how close to anarchy people can get. Besides the western-installed puppet regimes in the capital cities, the governments have zero control over the country's affairs.

 

 

 

In both countries, in the absence of government, power has been taken over simply by those with the arms & ammunition available, i.e. islamist and splinter faction rebels in Somalia & the Taleban and tribal leaders in Afghanistan. Their power derives from no legitimate authority, they simply possess rule over those who don't have the force of weapons to instill their own will, by AK47 rifles, satellite phones, jeeps and rockets.

 

 

 

Complete anarchy is so utterly utopistic as a concept I'm surprised anyone really think it's a viable form of living. Power and authority amongst humans, even in the 21st century, will always be taken up by the person or group who can physically coerce and intimidate other humans by the threat of violence or death into working, paying taxes or fighting.

 

 

 

If you disagree, you're always free to visit a country such as Somalia. The border controls are inexistent, there is an absolute absence of formal government everywhere except Khartoum. It's an insight into "anarchy" that exists as we speak. You'll still notice individuals with weapons have nearly all the power even in absence of the State. Authority will never cease to exist as long as humans exist.

[Ginger_Warrior]

Anarchy is a viable way of living. But it depends on one thing - for all of humanity to have established principles that they will follow out by themselves without the existence of a state to enforce those principles.

 

 

 

I wouldn't go as far to say human society at large is at fault. But quite clearly, humanity isn't at a point in its development where it can be principled without a state government forcing those principles on them.

[Quoi_Tu]

[hide=]

Obama is a smart guy yes, but he is still centre-right. All these people who automatically think it's all good cause a black guy got in, and therefore America must be tolerant. Don't get me wrong, I mean McCain and Palin were even worse, they are some of the worst people in the world I could think of to put into power of a superpower.. but you need to quit pretending that Obama will solve all your problems.

 

 

 

And no, I am not insane. I see light in the people. You've just been conditioned to think the way you do. You live in a world and you don't want change cause you're happy how it is - and I get it. But you have to understand, this is more than you or me. This is more than America, Europe.. this is about ideas. This is about our species as a whole..

 

 

 

Any atheist who isn't an anarchist is a hypocrite because the burden of proof works exactly the same when you apply it to the state. The burden of proof is on them to show that their authority, to which I did not consent, is legitimate, and if they do not, it must be TORE DOWN.

 

 

 

And sorry, when I say nutjobs, they aren't what you would classify as nutjobs - they are what society would consider "normal" people. And I know that I'm in the minority, and thus I am crazy, but never forget - long live the people..

 

 

 

Obama is left. Not socialist left or very left, but he is left.

 

 

 

God =\= Government We can control our government, we cannot control our God.

 

 

 

At the college I go to, we call people like you pit preachers. I only say this because that was a very preachy way to say your point.

[/hide]

 

 

 

Obama isn't left..he's centre right.

 

 

 

The abundance of right wing douche bags makes it seem as if he is left, admittedly he is more left than them.. but they're far right. He isn't left though, that's for sure.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Who made this graph? Because it seems horribly biased. I wouldn't suggest using it to classify politicians.

 

 

 

Oh yeah, republicans in general are more libertarian than they are authoritarian. You might not know that because of Bush, who is an ultra conservative extremist, but not all republicans are like Bush.

[Satenza]

Anarchy is a viable way of living. But it depends on one thing - for all of humanity to have established principles that they will follow out by themselves without the existence of a state to enforce those principles.

 

 

 

I wouldn't go as far to say human society at large is at fault. But quite clearly, humanity isn't at a point in its development where it can be principled without a state government forcing those principles on them.

 

 

 

Nor ever will it be.

[user1991]

Anarchy is a viable way of living. But it depends on one thing - for all of humanity to have established principles that they will follow out by themselves without the existence of a state to enforce those principles.

 

 

 

I wouldn't go as far to say human society at large is at fault. But quite clearly, humanity isn't at a point in its development where it can be principled without a state government forcing those principles on them.

 

 

 

Nor ever will it be.

 

 

 

Not even with transhumanism..?

[Lenticular_J]

We don't even really know if that would ever happen, and I wouldn't really be one to speculate on our evolution, although I help it has many paths at once.

 

 

 

I WANT WINGS.

[l0l0lpur32]

Anarchy is a viable way of living. But it depends on one thing - for all of humanity to have established principles that they will follow out by themselves without the existence of a state to enforce those principles.

 

 

 

I wouldn't go as far to say human society at large is at fault. But quite clearly, humanity isn't at a point in its development where it can be principled without a state government forcing those principles on them.

 

 

 

Nor ever will it be.

 

 

 

Not even with transhumanism..?

 

no

[user1991]

Anarchy is a viable way of living. But it depends on one thing - for all of humanity to have established principles that they will follow out by themselves without the existence of a state to enforce those principles.

 

 

 

I wouldn't go as far to say human society at large is at fault. But quite clearly, humanity isn't at a point in its development where it can be principled without a state government forcing those principles on them.

 

 

 

Nor ever will it be.

 

 

 

Not even with transhumanism..?

 

no

 

 

 

Really?