Closed.

[Obtaurian]

 

Players Smart players do not only wear dragonhide, magic pray, and have 99 defense and magic. They have a backup system for when the mage pulls out a dds (or d claws) and a whip. Mages now dont mage with staffs, they use a weapon and unleash a few melee hits to get players to pray melee/wear more melee prone armour. Then when the meleer swaps to melee prayer or melee armour the mage casts a few barrages on them to weaken them.

 

 

 

PS: Zuriels spells lowers melee attacks speed also.

 

 

 

You're confirming what I'm said earlier. You said mages now use a weapon and unleash a few melee hits to get them to switch armors/prayers and expose their weak spots in doing so. Great strat, I admit. But why does a meleer not have to do this? He can just keep right on using melee no matter what the situation is.

 

• [*:lhxbxho3]A meleer does not necessarily need to hybrid to succeed. [*:lhxbxho3]A ranger does not necessarily need to hybrid to succeed. [*:lhxbxho3]A mager will need to hybrid to succeed because his attacks are inadequate. Although I still don't agree with the concept of a hybriding mage because the thing that's hybriding is not a mage, but a meleer/ranger hybriding by using magic every once in a while.

 

 

 

Also, the staff of Zuriel is discounted from the scenario because it's expensive, rare, and impractical. Dragonhide armor is very practical.

 

 

 

THE "TOO LONG, DIDN'T READ" VERSION: Dragonhide armor needs to subtract from melee attack bonuses. This would be consistent, and it would also be fair.

 

 

 

The meleer and ranger absolutely need to hybrid. We've already discussed that a meleer wearing dragonhide is hybriding. I dare you to find a meleer using pure melee gear and pit him against a hybrid. ANY hybrid. I dare you to find a ranger using pure range gear and pit him against a hybrid. ANY hybrid. Let's see what happens.

 

 

 

[spoilerS] The hybrid wins. [/spoilerS]

[Veritas94]

 

You are trying to argue that the Mage suddenly is no longer a mage because they can attack with the whip? That by equipping a a Whip they become a meleer, but in magic robes. If as you have mentioned many times that class is dictated by damage dealt, the Mage can still use magic, regardless of what weapon is equipped. The truth is they are hybriding. The same is said for the Warrior who uses Range armour.

 

 

 

 

By switching to a whip, you're going to use it and magic in order to get the desired effect. Melee does not need to switch the way it attacks because it hit very hard and fast, and has bunch of ridiculous specials. The same goes for ranged, but apparently not for magic.

 

 

 

 

What dictates what you are is both weapon and armour. The easiest way to explain this to you is that the armour has a requirement in the type of combat it is used primarily for. Example being Ahrim's requires 70 Magic, Black Dragon hide requires 70 Range.

 

 

 

 

If this is going to be your definition of hybrid, then why doesn't melee suffer penalties from putting dragonhide armor on when magic & ranged both suffer penalties from putting on plate armor? You shouldn't be the one to tell me how to hybrid. If I want to hybrid, I should be able to put on plate armor just like any other meleer, or meleers shouldn't be allowed to put on dragonhide without penalties. Please, tell me what's unfair about this.

[Veritas94]

 

 

 

The meleer and ranger absolutely need to hybrid. We've already discussed that a meleer wearing dragonhide is hybriding. I dare you to find a meleer using pure melee gear and pit him against a hybrid. ANY hybrid. I dare you to find a ranger using pure range gear and pit him against a hybrid. ANY hybrid. Let's see what happens.

 

 

 

[spoilerS] The hybrid wins. [/spoilerS]

 

 

 

You're still dodging the fact that there are inconsistencies with in-game armor mechanics.

 

 

 

Also, a ranger or meleer will do perfectly well with K0ing hybrid opponents because meleers and rangers hit very hard, fast and have specials designed to act as finishers. Magic cannot stand alone, I repeat.

[Veritas94]

By the way, this letter from the new Jagex CEO gives me hope:

 

 

 

Hi Everyone,

 

 

 

I'd like to introduce myself to you all. My name is Mark Gerhard and I am the new CEO of Jagex, the makers of RuneScape. I have been fortunate enough to have worked at Jagex for some time now and consider us to be first and foremost a games developer. Were driven by teams that not only care passionately about games but also actively enjoy playing the games we create. We are going to be making a number of improvements to the game, I'm also keen to clear up a few misconceptions about RuneScape at the same time and I also believe there are a few things we have done wrong in the past that I want to apologise for.

 

 

 

To start off with, we want to be more open and listen to our players. Some of you may consider Jagex a secretive and closed-off company which isn't how we want to be perceived moving forward. Unlike most other companies, it just isn't our style to spend our time self marketing or shouting about how great we are, we prefer to just get on with it and make cool games, but that doesn't mean we don't listen to what you have to say.

 

 

 

A good example of this is that a lot of free players told us they found our video adverts before the game annoying to the point it was putting them off playing, so we've scrapped them with immediate effect. We now appreciate that it can be frustrating having to sit through a video advert when you just want to play RuneScape, so we have to put our hands up to admit we made a mistake and say that we're sorry. To be completely candid with you, video adverts generate significantly more revenue than other adverts, but as one of our fundamental philosophies is that having fun is more important to us than making as much money as possible, we have removed video adverts from the game.

 

 

 

We are also planning to change the way we communicate with you. We are going to be bringing back Development Diaries but making them more regular and focused on some of the different projects we're currently working on for you. These will replace Behind the Scenes, which we have found a creative constraint on our developers as the promised content has to come out as communicated in order to avoid disappointment and prevented us from surprising you with better or different content. It has also led to compromises in quality that we've not been happy with and, most importantly, pieces of content being released which you, our players, have not enjoyed as much as you should. A side benefit of this is that we'll be releasing more content which will be a complete surprise to you, so keep your eyes peeled for updates!

 

 

 

We'd also like to clear up a few issues surrounding the free game. RuneScape is different from all other MMOs in that the free game has an epic amount of content (we'd estimate over 2,000 hours worth to get all your skills up to 99 and complete all the quests) and isn't merely a demo for the members version. If anything, we see the members version as an expansion pack for those that really love the game and we feel both games are substantive in their own right. I want to apologise for habitually over-promoting the benefits of membership to our free players. I strongly believe if you love the free game you will equally love the members content and that is sufficient promotion to me. If you can't enjoy the free game in its own right then we're not doing our jobs properly. We will continue to improve the free game and, crucially, make it as fun as possible because we know that this is the way that everyone first discovers RuneScape.

 

 

 

We also have a long-term commitment to improving all the aspects of the game from overall graphical enhancements through to new gameplay mechanics.

 

 

 

Another thing that has cropped up in recent times, which we'd like to clear up once and for all, is the common belief that RuneScape is a game aimed at kids. This is absolutely not the case. We can see how this view has fostered, however, thanks to our over-zealous chat filter, Quick Chat worlds, dumbing down of certain bits of humour and storylines, as well as certain areas of the game like the Stronghold of Security, which do provide solid security advice but perhaps come across as a little condescending to the vast majority of our older players. I unreservedly apologise for this and to rectify this we have already removed a number of words from the chat filter and are currently working on reviewing and amending any content we feel is too kid-focused.

 

 

 

RuneScape benefits from one of the most diverse player demographics in the industry and is truly reflective of the worldwide population. As a responsible company we have had to comply with certain regulatory obligations to ensure online safety for any younger players and as a result we introduced Quick Chat for players under a certain age, but this was to meet our legal responsibilities rather than who the game is designed for, its probably also worth noting that we have a total of 4 Quick Chat worlds in a total of 165 RuneScape worlds. As I said earlier, we are gamers at heart and we try to design games and content which we ourselves would enjoy playing. Im an active RuneScape player and Im ever so slightly over 21 :)

 

 

 

We are also committed to working with our fans in the RuneScape community to make the game a more enjoyable place to be. We will be running community events, tournaments and JMod participation in-game to provide more support to you and make RuneScape an even better place to be.

 

 

 

To kick things off in this new era of openness I'm going to be answering your questions. For the next week we will open a thread in the News and Announcements forum for questions, and in a weeks time I will post answers to a selection of your questions. So please feel free to drop-in and ask a question or tell me what you think of the game.

 

 

 

If you're a free player, you won't be able to post on the forums, but you can email me at [email protected]. This email address will work for the next week, so you've got plenty of time to get your questions and comments in.

 

 

 

Have fun!

 

 

 

Mod MMG

 

Jagex CEO

 

[Obtaurian]

 

You are trying to argue that the Mage suddenly is no longer a mage because they can attack with the whip? That by equipping a a Whip they become a meleer, but in magic robes. If as you have mentioned many times that class is dictated by damage dealt, the Mage can still use magic, regardless of what weapon is equipped. The truth is they are hybriding. The same is said for the Warrior who uses Range armour.

 

 

 

 

By switching to a whip, you're going to use it and magic in order to get the desired effect. Melee does not need to switch the way it attacks because it hit very hard and fast, and has bunch of ridiculous specials. The same goes for ranged, but apparently not for magic.

 

 

 

You're not going to be hitting at all if you're up against another hybrid using mage/melee.

 

 

 

 

What dictates what you are is both weapon and armour. The easiest way to explain this to you is that the armour has a requirement in the type of combat it is used primarily for. Example being Ahrim's requires 70 Magic, Black Dragon hide requires 70 Range.

 

 

 

 

If this is going to be your definition of hybrid, then why doesn't melee suffer penalties from putting dragonhide armor on when magic & ranged both suffer penalties from putting on plate armor? You shouldn't be the one to tell me how to hybrid. If I want to hybrid, I should be able to put on plate armor just like any other meleer, or meleers shouldn't be allowed to put on dragonhide without penalties. Please, tell me what's unfair about this.

 

 

 

It doesn't need to be changed. By putting on range armor, you suffer having very low melee defense. You take the chance knowing your opponent might switch to melee gear. But, it's good to see that you finally agree that both armor and weapons count towards combat class.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The meleer and ranger absolutely need to hybrid. We've already discussed that a meleer wearing dragonhide is hybriding. I dare you to find a meleer using pure melee gear and pit him against a hybrid. ANY hybrid. I dare you to find a ranger using pure range gear and pit him against a hybrid. ANY hybrid. Let's see what happens.

 

 

 

[spoilerS] The hybrid wins. [/spoilerS]

 

 

 

You're still dodging the fact that there are inconsistencies with in-game armor mechanics.

 

 

 

Also, a ranger or meleer will do perfectly well with K0ing hybrid opponents because meleers and rangers hit very hard, fast and have specials designed to act as finishers. Magic cannot stand alone, I repeat.

 

 

 

It has already been established that magic also has finishing moves. Magic also has special effects that freeze, heal you, lower attack, and poison. No combat class can stand alone against a hybrid.

[pureprayer]

 

You are trying to argue that the Mage suddenly is no longer a mage because they can attack with the whip? That by equipping a a Whip they become a meleer, but in magic robes. If as you have mentioned many times that class is dictated by damage dealt, the Mage can still use magic, regardless of what weapon is equipped. The truth is they are hybriding. The same is said for the Warrior who uses Range armour.

 

 

 

 

By switching to a whip, you're going to use it and magic in order to get the desired effect. Melee does not need to switch the way it attacks because it hit very hard and fast, and has bunch of ridiculous specials. The same goes for ranged, but apparently not for magic.

 

A mager can stand up to a meleer without having to use any melee weapon.

 

 

What dictates what you are is both weapon and armour. The easiest way to explain this to you is that the armour has a requirement in the type of combat it is used primarily for. Example being Ahrim's requires 70 Magic, Black Dragon hide requires 70 Range.

 

 

 

 

If this is going to be your definition of hybrid, then why doesn't melee suffer penalties from putting dragonhide armor on when magic & ranged both suffer penalties from putting on plate armor? You shouldn't be the one to tell me how to hybrid. If I want to hybrid, I should be able to put on plate armor just like any other meleer, or meleers shouldn't be allowed to put on dragonhide without penalties. Please, tell me what's unfair about this.Ahrim is stronger then black dragonhide.

[compfreak847]

Look, morning rise is doing a good job with this (Yell if you get tired, I'll pick up where you leave off :P ) but your missing a BIG point, Elusefelier. Mage is ARMORED based - the largest mage boost I can possibly get from my weapon is +20; I can get over +100 boost from my armor. Melee and to a lesser extent range are all weapon based. How come the meleer can switch armors without changing his 'attack style' but mage can't switch weapons? Mage is an ARMORED BASED combat style, and it's one of their advantages. Stop whining about it.

[Veritas94]

 

You're not going to be hitting at all if you're up against another hybrid using mage/melee.

 

 

 

It doesn't need to be changed. By putting on range armor, you suffer having very low melee defense. You take the chance knowing your opponent might switch to melee gear. But, it's good to see that you finally agree that both armor and weapons count towards combat class.

 

 

 

 

 

 

It does need to be changed. Magic and ranged both suffer penalties to their ATTACK BONUS by wearing plate but melee does not suffer penalties to its ATTACK BONUS by putting on dragonhide. This needs to be changed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

It has already been established that magic also has finishing moves. Magic also has special effects that freeze, heal you, lower attack, and poison. No combat class can stand alone against a hybrid.

 

 

 

Magic does not have a practical finishing move. It has something which doesn't even begin to compare to the specials ranged and melee dish out (The delay effect is what you're referring to, which I'm aware of through the use of mage only arena staking, which I used to do long ago).

 

 

 

Compfreak himself made a thread about the overpoweredness of dragon claws. I can direct you to it, if you'd like.

[Veritas94]

Look, morning rise is doing a good job with this (Yell if you get tired, I'll pick up where you leave off :P ) but your missing a BIG point, Elusefelier. Mage is ARMORED based - the largest mage boost I can possibly get from my weapon is +20; I can get over +100 boost from my armor. Melee and to a lesser extent range are all weapon based. How come the meleer can switch armors without changing his 'attack style' but mage can't switch weapons? Mage is an ARMORED BASED combat style, and it's one of their advantages. Stop whining about it.

 

 

 

Melee is only weapon based? Is this a serious conclusion you're making? Then why do dozens of types of armor sets exist for melee? Can you explain your statements further?

 

 

 

P.S. Look at how many sets of armor melee has for every 10 levels. Now that I think about it, I REALLY don't understand what you're saying.

[Obtaurian]

 

You're not going to be hitting at all if you're up against another hybrid using mage/melee.

 

 

 

It doesn't need to be changed. By putting on range armor, you suffer having very low melee defense. You take the chance knowing your opponent might switch to melee gear. But, it's good to see that you finally agree that both armor and weapons count towards combat class.

 

 

 

 

 

 

It does need to be changed. Magic and ranged both suffer penalties to their ATTACK BONUS by wearing plate but melee does not suffer penalties to its ATTACK BONUS by putting on dragonhide. This needs to be changed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

It has already been established that magic also has finishing moves. Magic also has special effects that freeze, heal you, lower attack, and poison. No combat class can stand alone against a hybrid.

 

 

 

Magic does not have a practical finishing move. It has something which doesn't even begin to compare to the specials ranged and melee dish out (The delay effect is what you're referring to, which I'm aware of through the use of mage only arena staking, which I used to do long ago).

 

 

 

Read Compfreak's post.

 

 

 

It IS practical, and with a little practice, not difficult to do. Not only does it hit high, but it has special effects which I'm sure you know by now.

[Veritas94]

 

You're not going to be hitting at all if you're up against another hybrid using mage/melee.

 

 

 

It doesn't need to be changed. By putting on range armor, you suffer having very low melee defense. You take the chance knowing your opponent might switch to melee gear. But, it's good to see that you finally agree that both armor and weapons count towards combat class.

 

 

 

 

 

 

It does need to be changed. Magic and ranged both suffer penalties to their ATTACK BONUS by wearing plate but melee does not suffer penalties to its ATTACK BONUS by putting on dragonhide. This needs to be changed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

It has already been established that magic also has finishing moves. Magic also has special effects that freeze, heal you, lower attack, and poison. No combat class can stand alone against a hybrid.

 

 

 

Magic does not have a practical finishing move. It has something which doesn't even begin to compare to the specials ranged and melee dish out (The delay effect is what you're referring to, which I'm aware of through the use of mage only arena staking, which I used to do long ago).

 

 

 

Read Compfreak's post.

 

 

 

It IS practical, and with a little practice, not difficult to do. Not only does it hit high, but it has special effects which I'm sure you know by now.

 

 

 

I apologize for having to BACK UP when I'm trying to do it, and I apologize for being pjed in the middle of my attempts. I also apologize for the fact that mine don't seem to do all that much damage in comparison to the 48-48 potential of dbow and the 80+ of melee.

 

 

 

So silly of me.

[Veritas94]

I have to go again. I'll check back here as soon as possible to address any further lingering concerns you may have about the validity of improving magic in its current state.

[pureprayer]

Look, morning rise is doing a good job with this (Yell if you get tired, I'll pick up where you leave off :P ) but your missing a BIG point, Elusefelier. Mage is ARMORED based - the largest mage boost I can possibly get from my weapon is +20; I can get over +100 boost from my armor. Melee and to a lesser extent range are all weapon based. How come the meleer can switch armors without changing his 'attack style' but mage can't switch weapons? Mage is an ARMORED BASED combat style, and it's one of their advantages. Stop whining about it.

 

 

 

Melee is only weapon based? Is this a serious conclusion you're making? Then why do dozens of types of armor sets exist for melee? Can you explain your statements further?

Why do dozens of types of armor sets for melee suck?

 

 

 

Ps read this [hide="Quoted from]I stumbled onto this deadly combination completely by accident. I do remember watching a video several years ago of a player managing some type of Obsidian Ring + Blitz combo, and did try to duplicate it, but wasnt successful, and quickly dispelled the idea. However, after my attention was drawn toward it again by one of my friends, I decided to grab some runes, Karils Cross, and try again. Lo-and-behold, I figured out how to effectively turn this technique into one of the most deadly attacks Ive ever delivered. Because it both uses magic and range in a varying sequence, it cannot be completely negated by prayers or armor. It works best when only fighting one person, but this can be adopted to use multi-combat spells and Chinchompas, however I do not recommend it.

 

Well, onto the actual Combination. You will need at least 88 Magic and a decent Range level to pull it off. You will need either Karils Crossbow or Obsidian Rings, and it is imperative that they are set on RAPID. These should be equipped, and you should be wearing magic armor. I prefer to keep my Mage Attack boosted as much as possible, but remember, Ahrims Robes reduce Ranged attack. If you arent hitting accurately enough with range, swap Ahrims Robe Bottoms with Chaps.

 

This combination utilizes Slow and Instant spells (Section 1.2) WITH an additional range attack, to add extra damage, and make this combo impossible to completely defend against. Throw on the Eagle Eye prayer, and cast an Ice Blitz, and start to click on your target until you throw a ring or shoot a bolt rack. Once you raise your arm/weapon to fire, cast an Instant spell on your opponent, either Blood Barrage or Shadow Barrage. This will result in all three attacks hitting in quick succession, almost without delay between them. This leads to potentially massive damage (Up to, and maybe even over 80 hp) and also freezes and weakens you opponent, should you cast Shadow Barrage.

 

Another devastating side-effect of this is that, because it uses both magic and range quickly and alternates, it is impossible to pray against, and you will nearly always penetrate your enemies armor. Metal armors will be hammered by the spells, magical armor cannot defend against the crossbow, and even Dragon Hide cannot defend itself against all magic or range attacks.

 

The ability to inflict massive damage, the speed in which this works, the fact that it can be cast in quick succession, and its accuracy make it some-what of a Dragon Claw equivalent, without the special bar needed.[/hide]

[Obtaurian]

 

You're not going to be hitting at all if you're up against another hybrid using mage/melee.

 

 

 

It doesn't need to be changed. By putting on range armor, you suffer having very low melee defense. You take the chance knowing your opponent might switch to melee gear. But, it's good to see that you finally agree that both armor and weapons count towards combat class.

 

 

 

 

 

 

It does need to be changed. Magic and ranged both suffer penalties to their ATTACK BONUS by wearing plate but melee does not suffer penalties to its ATTACK BONUS by putting on dragonhide. This needs to be changed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

It has already been established that magic also has finishing moves. Magic also has special effects that freeze, heal you, lower attack, and poison. No combat class can stand alone against a hybrid.

 

 

 

Magic does not have a practical finishing move. It has something which doesn't even begin to compare to the specials ranged and melee dish out (The delay effect is what you're referring to, which I'm aware of through the use of mage only arena staking, which I used to do long ago).

 

 

 

Read Compfreak's post.

 

 

 

It IS practical, and with a little practice, not difficult to do. Not only does it hit high, but it has special effects which I'm sure you know by now.

 

 

 

I apologize for having to BACK UP when I'm trying to do it, and I apologize for being pjed in the middle of my attempts. I also apologize for the fact that mine don't seem to do all that much damage in comparison to the 48-48 potential of dbow and the 80+ of melee.

 

 

 

So silly of me.

 

 

 

Eh? I always assumed that mages were advantageous at a distance. I would be backing up anyway if I were casting freezing spells to keep my opponent out of melee range. Why are you standing next to your opponent as you try to KO them with mage? Your magic KO does upwards of 50 damage while also having special effects, which your opponents do not have.

 

 

 

Your PJ comment is irrelevant, as you shouldn't be fighting near spots that are known to be swarmed with PJers. Those are melee PKing spots.

[compfreak847]

Look, morning rise is doing a good job with this (Yell if you get tired, I'll pick up where you leave off :P ) but your missing a BIG point, Elusefelier. Mage is ARMORED based - the largest mage boost I can possibly get from my weapon is +20; I can get over +100 boost from my armor. Melee and to a lesser extent range are all weapon based. How come the meleer can switch armors without changing his 'attack style' but mage can't switch weapons? Mage is an ARMORED BASED combat style, and it's one of their advantages. Stop whining about it.

 

 

 

Melee is only weapon based? Is this a serious conclusion you're making? Then why do dozens of types of armor sets exist for melee? Can you explain your statements further?

 

 

 

P.S. Look at how many sets of armor melee has for every 10 levels. Now that I think about it, I REALLY don't understand what you're saying.

 

Ok. Feel free to show me just how many melee armors give a melee bonus 5 times what the weapon does. Way to miss the point :roll:

[Sir_Kurity]

Thats the great thing about mage, its not reliant on the staff, so you can combine it with range and melee easily.

 

 

 

It seems magic was almost meant to hybrid, and not to be used on it's own, which though i agree is slightly annoying, doesn't really matter when you can train range and melee without leveling up if magic is your primary stat.

[compfreak847]

Thats the great thing about mage, its not reliant on the staff, so you can combine it with range and melee easily.

 

 

 

It seems magic was almost meant to hybrid, and not to be used on it's own, which though i agree is slightly annoying, doesn't really matter when you can train range and melee without leveling up if magic is your primary stat.

 

The thing is, your using your magic to give you a 3 to 1 hitting advantage, PLUS the threat of mage keeping your opponent in weak armor - and that's the BEST "defence" a meleer can provide. It's a lose-lose situation for them, win-win for mage. Hence why mage needs a nerf - range can do very well against a meleer, generally beating a similar level; mage can do very, very well against a ranger, usually able to defeat him, meleer can... tele from the mage, or fight him while getting hit 3 to 1 with less food and lower defence.

[warrior5024]

 

Players Smart players do not only wear dragonhide, magic pray, and have 99 defense and magic. They have a backup system for when the mage pulls out a dds (or d claws) and a whip. Mages now dont mage with staffs, they use a weapon and unleash a few melee hits to get players to pray melee/wear more melee prone armour. Then when the meleer swaps to melee prayer or melee armour the mage casts a few barrages on them to weaken them.

 

 

 

PS: Zuriels spells lowers melee attacks speed also.

 

 

 

You're confirming what I'm said earlier. You said mages now use a weapon and unleash a few melee hits to get them to switch armors/prayers and expose their weak spots in doing so. Great strat, I admit. But why does a meleer not have to do this? He can just keep right on using melee no matter what the situation is.

 

• [*:29eubq45]A meleer does not necessarily need to hybrid to succeed. [*:29eubq45]A ranger does not necessarily need to hybrid to succeed. [*:29eubq45]A mager will need to hybrid to succeed because his attacks are inadequate. Although I still don't agree with the concept of a hybriding mage because the thing that's hybriding is not a mage, but a meleer/ranger hybriding by using magic every once in a while.

 

 

 

Also, the staff of Zuriel is discounted from the scenario because it's expensive, rare, and impractical. Dragonhide armor is very practical.

 

 

 

THE "TOO LONG, DIDN'T READ" VERSION: Dragonhide armor needs to subtract from melee attack bonuses. This would be consistent, and it would also be fair.

 

 

 

 

 

Since when was 1.6m expensive, especially to a magician?

 

Magic does NOT need to hybrid. Why? Rune pures were/are idiots. After you kill them once with magic, they will come back to you, without hides or a bow, as Ralph Wiggum posted on page 3.

 

By the way, meleers do need to hybrid to be successful. I've hardly ever been beaten by a guy who only used metal armor. Mages aren't harmless, they are just tactical and tricky to understand and utilize at first. Go out and try some tricks, I think you'll change your tune.

 

 

 

No name calling, no harshness, just a suggestion.

[compfreak847]

You can easily get away killing the typical stupid meleer without hybriding, but for the few smart people who wear d hide the above maging method I mentioned will take them down easily.

[Veritas94]

Eh? I always assumed that mages were advantageous at a distance. I would be backing up anyway if I were casting freezing spells to keep my opponent out of melee range. Why are you standing next to your opponent as you try to KO them with mage? Your magic KO does upwards of 50 damage while also having special effects, which your opponents do not have.

 

 

 

Your PJ comment is irrelevant, as you shouldn't be fighting near spots that are known to be swarmed with PJers. Those are melee PKing spots.

 

 

 

Lets consider your supposed blitz/barrage combo for a moment. You (mage) and a meleer are fighting. Naturally, hell be praying (And so will you), and every 10 seconds hell be able to reach you. When he gets to low health, youre going to try to pull off a blitz/barrage combo. Chances are, when youre far away, casting at him, hes going to be eating like a maniac. This is normally the way it works when you try to farcast someone in PvP. There will be far less instances for you to try to finish him then you might first assume. The advantage of melee and ranged specials is that they have the element of surprise. Once you back up and farcast, they start eating.

 

 

 

Also, Id like to quote Huta in order to address the fundamental issue with incorporating miasmatic spells in your calculations (He is a respected tip-iter, no?):

 

 

 

I will admit I haven't seen the miasmic spells in action, so things may have changed some, but even then, they encourage using magic as a sidearm for melee or range rather than addressing the issues magic still has. A mage may be able to kill melee now, but a ranger would do a better job after using mias and ice. Magic needs to stand on its own, and nice as the new spell is, it just expands hybrids. Magic gets an effective new toy, but magic isn't any more its own skill other than mages are no longer as squishy as they were.

 

Thread link: viewtopic.php?f=66&t=773288&hilit=magic+combos&start=20

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ok. Feel free to show me just how many melee armors give a melee bonus 5 times what the weapon does. Way to miss the point :roll:

 

 

 

The "5 times" part clarified things - I see what you're trying to say. What I don't understand is how that has anything to do with allowing meleers to wear d'hide without suffering penalties to their magic bonuses. Can you explain exactly why you think they shouldn't suffer those penalties?

 

 

 

Also, look at all the types of armor readily available to melee players and then look at all the types of armor available to mages. Why the disparity? When was the last time magic got a decent armor update?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ill quote Huta again, Compfreak, if you want to make this a session of theorizing about possible hybrids.

 

 

This is my anti-mage outfit, the one I beat most mages in. It has the same defense against slash your outfit has, give or take 10 points, with 146 magic defense against your 74 accuracy.

 

 

 

I use other outfits as well, depending on the situation (e.g I would trade out the boots for infinity when fighting a range/mage hybrid) but these were my basic two that I took to practically every pits and clan wars game. If I start playing again I would probably pick up one of the new shields to start with.

 

Lastly, earlier in the debate, Compfreak, you and I were arguing about the nature of ranged vs. magic combat, and you kept making up ways magic had the upper hand over ranged. Then I came across another thread ( viewtopic.php?f=66&t=768165&hilit=magic+combos&start=60 ), where you directly and confidently assert ranged has the upper hand over mage. This leads me to believe that youre not really arguing with me for the sake of improving anything about the tip it communitys view of game mechanics, but rather you just want to prove me wrong, no matter what the subject is. I quote you on the following:

 

 

 

It (Magic) really doesn't suck. Range will destroy it (Magic); range certainly has the upper hand in the combat triangle. But mage is very effective against meleers; I can't even imagine trying to win a game of castle wars without magic.

 

 

 

Regards,

 

E.

[Veritas94]

I'll be logging off for now. I hope we have more interesting discussions tomorrow.

[Obtaurian]

Eh? I always assumed that mages were advantageous at a distance. I would be backing up anyway if I were casting freezing spells to keep my opponent out of melee range. Why are you standing next to your opponent as you try to KO them with mage? Your magic KO does upwards of 50 damage while also having special effects, which your opponents do not have.

 

 

 

Your PJ comment is irrelevant, as you shouldn't be fighting near spots that are known to be swarmed with PJers. Those are melee PKing spots.

 

 

 

Lets consider your supposed blitz/barrage combo for a moment. You (mage) and a meleer are fighting. Naturally, hell be praying (And so will you), and every 10 seconds hell be able to reach you. When he gets to low health, youre going to try to pull off a blitz/barrage combo. Chances are, when youre far away, casting at him, hes going to be eating like a maniac. This is normally the way it works when you try to farcast someone in PvP. There will be far less instances for you to try to finish him then you might first assume. The advantage of melee and ranged specials is that they have the element of surprise. Once you back up and farcast, they start eating.

 

 

 

Also, Id like to quote Huta in order to address the fundamental issue with incorporating miasmatic spells in your calculations (He is a respected tip-iter, no?):

 

 

 

I will admit I haven't seen the miasmic spells in action, so things may have changed some, but even then, they encourage using magic as a sidearm for melee or range rather than addressing the issues magic still has. A mage may be able to kill melee now, but a ranger would do a better job after using mias and ice. Magic needs to stand on its own, and nice as the new spell is, it just expands hybrids. Magic gets an effective new toy, but magic isn't any more its own skill other than mages are no longer as squishy as they were.

 

Thread link: viewtopic.php?f=66&t=773288&hilit=magic+combos&start=20

 

 

 

 

I'll address this part of your post. If the opponent that you're farcasting is in melee armor, you'll hit 30's and 20's in rapid succession while he attempts to eat in futility. If he's in range armor, you wont be farcasting, you'll be up in his face with a whip, forcing him to switch armor once again. When he succumbs and switches back to melee armor, you back up and throw another few 20's with mage. The hybrid using mage and melee weapon will beat the hybrid using melee and range armor.

 

 

 

Miasmic barrage helps both mages and hybrids. If a pure mage is up against a pure warrior, the miasmic spell will render the warrior helpless. I'd call it overkill. If it's a hybrid match, the guy with miasmic spells will probably win.

 

 

 

You know, I'd even say that a pure mage with miasmic barrage could potentially beat a ranger with little trouble, though I can't back that statement up. Compfreak will know more about it, I'm sure.

[Veritas94]

 

 

 

I'll address this part of your post. If the opponent that you're farcasting is in melee armor, you'll hit 30's and 20's in rapid succession while he attempts to eat in futility. If he's in range armor, you wont be farcasting, you'll be up in his face with a whip, forcing him to switch armor once again. When he succumbs and switches back to melee armor, you back up and throw another few 20's with mage. The hybrid using mage and melee weapon will beat the hybrid using melee and range armor.

 

 

 

Miasmic barrage helps both mages and hybrids. If a pure mage is up against a pure warrior, the miasmic spell will render the warrior helpless. I'd call it overkill. If it's a hybrid match, the guy with miasmic spells will probably win.

 

 

 

You know, I'd even say that a pure mage with miasmic barrage could potentially beat a ranger with little trouble, though I can't back that statement up. Compfreak will know more about it, I'm sure.

 

 

 

#1. If you're up in his face with a whip, and he's wearing Huta's ranged armor, you won't be forcing him to do anything. The hybrid using mage and melee will not beat the hybrid using melee and ranged. You're gimping yourself by using magic, essentially.

 

 

 

#2. I don't think you understood what Huta said about Miasmic barrage. Discounting the fact that it's expensive and you would be hard pressed to take it with you into a PvP world, using Miasmic barrage and then using either Ranged or Melee would be far better than using Miasmic barrage and then magic. Magic is slow, and hits for a hell of a lot less. Miasmic barrage encourages hybridization rather than giving mages a skill which they can use to stand alone. Do you understand what I'm trying to say?

 

 

 

#3. If you're fighting pure warriors, then you haven't really experienced real PvP. People will do anything they can to stay alive, and that includes bringing ranged armor. It's probably true, though, that a mage with miasmic barrage might beat a warrior with dragonhide. But as has been said, miasmic barrage would be far better combined with melee or ranged than with magic. You'd beat them to the ground twice as hard, since you're combining the slows with the specials of melee and ranged, respectively.

 

 

 

#4. Pure mage and Pure range? Weren't we just talking about ultra-super-ninja hybrids, in which case everyone and their mother will be miasmic barraging you every minute or so? I thought you guys were advocating the point that you never see "pure classes" in "real" Runescape PvP worlds. Even if that matchup did occur, I would NOT be in favor of the mage winning. That would be overpowered. Mages need to be beaten by rangers; this is the way things work. If I had to make a change to miasmic barrage, I'd make sure it didn't affect ranged, and I'm still a little puzzled as to why it does.

 

 

 

EDIT: 2 # 3s, hehe

[Obtaurian]

 

 

 

I'll address this part of your post. If the opponent that you're farcasting is in melee armor, you'll hit 30's and 20's in rapid succession while he attempts to eat in futility. If he's in range armor, you wont be farcasting, you'll be up in his face with a whip, forcing him to switch armor once again. When he succumbs and switches back to melee armor, you back up and throw another few 20's with mage. The hybrid using mage and melee weapon will beat the hybrid using melee and range armor.

 

 

 

Miasmic barrage helps both mages and hybrids. If a pure mage is up against a pure warrior, the miasmic spell will render the warrior helpless. I'd call it overkill. If it's a hybrid match, the guy with miasmic spells will probably win.

 

 

 

You know, I'd even say that a pure mage with miasmic barrage could potentially beat a ranger with little trouble, though I can't back that statement up. Compfreak will know more about it, I'm sure.

 

 

 

#1. If you're up in his face with a whip, and he's wearing Huta's ranged armor, you won't be forcing him to do anything. The hybrid using mage and melee will not beat the hybrid using melee and ranged. You're gimping yourself by using magic, essentially.

 

 

 

#2. I don't think you understood what Huta said about Miasmic barrage. Discounting the fact that it's expensive and you would be hard pressed to take it with you into a PvP world, using Miasmic barrage and then using either Ranged or Melee would be far better than using Miasmic barrage and then magic. Magic is slow, and hits for a hell of a lot less. Miasmic barrage encourages hybridization rather than giving mages a skill which they can use to stand alone. Do you understand what I'm trying to say?

 

 

 

#3. If you're fighting pure warriors, then you haven't really experienced real PvP. People will do anything they can to stay alive, and that includes bringing ranged armor. It's probably true, though, that a mage with miasmic barrage might beat a warrior with dragonhide. But as has been said, miasmic barrage would be far better combined with melee or ranged than with magic. You'd beat them to the ground twice as hard, since you're combining the slows with the specials of melee and ranged, respectively.

 

 

 

#3. Pure mage and Pure range? Weren't we just talking about ultra-super-ninja hybrids, in which case everyone and their mother will be miasmic barraging you every minute or so? I thought you guys were advocating the point that you never see "pure classes" in "real" Runescape PvP worlds. Even if that matchup did occur, I would NOT be in favor of the mage winning. That would be overpowered. Mages need to be beaten by rangers; this is the way things work. If I had to make a change to miasmic barrage, I'd make sure it didn't effect ranged, and I'm still a little puzzled as to why it does.

 

 

 

Interestingly enough, we now seem to be arguing PvP situations rather than the strength of the magic skill in comparison to range and melee. In this post, you've acknowledged that armor is considered class specific, and you've acknowledged the difference between hybrid vs. pure and hybrid vs. hybrid. Bravo! I have nothing left to argue, as I'm not very interested in arguing ridiculous circumstances.

 

 

 

So that's it? You agree that mage is on par with range and melee?

[Veritas94]

 

 

 

I'll address this part of your post. If the opponent that you're farcasting is in melee armor, you'll hit 30's and 20's in rapid succession while he attempts to eat in futility. If he's in range armor, you wont be farcasting, you'll be up in his face with a whip, forcing him to switch armor once again. When he succumbs and switches back to melee armor, you back up and throw another few 20's with mage. The hybrid using mage and melee weapon will beat the hybrid using melee and range armor.

 

 

 

Miasmic barrage helps both mages and hybrids. If a pure mage is up against a pure warrior, the miasmic spell will render the warrior helpless. I'd call it overkill. If it's a hybrid match, the guy with miasmic spells will probably win.

 

 

 

You know, I'd even say that a pure mage with miasmic barrage could potentially beat a ranger with little trouble, though I can't back that statement up. Compfreak will know more about it, I'm sure.

 

 

 

#1. If you're up in his face with a whip, and he's wearing Huta's ranged armor, you won't be forcing him to do anything. The hybrid using mage and melee will not beat the hybrid using melee and ranged. You're gimping yourself by using magic, essentially.

 

 

 

#2. I don't think you understood what Huta said about Miasmic barrage. Discounting the fact that it's expensive and you would be hard pressed to take it with you into a PvP world, using Miasmic barrage and then using either Ranged or Melee would be far better than using Miasmic barrage and then magic. Magic is slow, and hits for a hell of a lot less. Miasmic barrage encourages hybridization rather than giving mages a skill which they can use to stand alone. Do you understand what I'm trying to say?

 

 

 

#3. If you're fighting pure warriors, then you haven't really experienced real PvP. People will do anything they can to stay alive, and that includes bringing ranged armor. It's probably true, though, that a mage with miasmic barrage might beat a warrior with dragonhide. But as has been said, miasmic barrage would be far better combined with melee or ranged than with magic. You'd beat them to the ground twice as hard, since you're combining the slows with the specials of melee and ranged, respectively.

 

 

 

#3. Pure mage and Pure range? Weren't we just talking about ultra-super-ninja hybrids, in which case everyone and their mother will be miasmic barraging you every minute or so? I thought you guys were advocating the point that you never see "pure classes" in "real" Runescape PvP worlds. Even if that matchup did occur, I would NOT be in favor of the mage winning. That would be overpowered. Mages need to be beaten by rangers; this is the way things work. If I had to make a change to miasmic barrage, I'd make sure it didn't effect ranged, and I'm still a little puzzled as to why it does.

 

 

 

Interestingly enough, we now seem to be arguing PvP situations rather than the strength of the magic skill in comparison to range and melee. In this post, you've acknowledged that armor is considered class specific, and you've acknowledged the difference between hybrid vs. pure and hybrid vs. hybrid. Bravo! I have nothing left to argue, as I'm not very interested in arguing ridiculous circumstances.

 

 

 

So that's it? You agree that mage is on par with range and melee?

 

 

 

I've agreed it needs to be buffed massively in order to stand alone with ranged and melee.

 

 

 

Thanks for trying, though.