Bank loans

[quelmotz]

Okay, so collateral item seems to be only solution. If one wants to get a cash, but doesnt want to sell his item(s), He can get bank loan. After the time has passed, He must pay the loan and revenue to bank too get his item(s) back. If this loan money was used wisely, you dont need to take loans in a while. If used only for skilling without getting anything back, then you are in trouble. Much like in a real life loan situation. You dont pay back, you dont get the item(s) back and revenue starts rising. After exceeding a certain limit, bank starts to take items from your bank. The money you pay to the bank disappears from the game.

 

You expect the money to still stay with the same guy? He'd have spent all the money, and unless there's some identification code for the money, you wouldn't be able to remove it from the game. Furthermore, how is it fair to take away say 500k from a guy who sold items to the guy who refused to pay back his loans?

 

I don't support this idea at all.

This is similar to real life bank loans. You take them to get started. After that you can manage with the money you have made. Then you can pay it back. This idea is not meant to be a quick way to get money, so you can spend them all just for the sake of getting the item. It is simply a little help to get yourself started in money making.

 

What are you talking about? I never said that anyone else than the loan taker himself would have to pay anything. The money stays with the seller as normally. Loaner is the only one who is going to pay for his loan. You make it sound like, lets say, I buy bread from a store for 5 euros. Then when the payback date expires, the bank will take the money from the store owner. I hope you didnt mean this.

 

Oops looks like I misread the thing really badly...

 

Anyway, the fact remains that this bank loan thing is going to be EXTREMELY complex if it's going to be implemented to prevent abuse, and people will get confused and such due to all the rules and regulations, etc etc.

[PraetorDei]

The thing is there is a real world model to follow. So its not THAT hard.

 

(1) You want a loan? You have to have collateral. You have to pay the loan back, with interest, within a certain time period.

(2) You have to be trusted to pay the loan back. So perhaps you have to be able to demonstrate you are a "solid citizen". So maybe you have to have played the game awhile and amassed a certain amount of experience first. Say 2M XP.

(3) Loan repayment can be easily done by extracting the money from your account. Say a 90 day loan -- every x days a certain amount of money (principal plus interest) will be extracted from your account until loan is paid off.

(4) If, at the time a payment is due, and you don't have the cash on hand? Then one or more of your collateral items is take from your account and sold at the GE medium price to make the payment.

 

How do you prevent "deadbeats"? Well....

A. Use the GE pricing as the basis for collateral. That way the "bank" knows that if they have to take the collateral out of your hide, they can take it from your account and dump it on the GE and get their money back.

B. The "bank" can insist that you cannot risk the collateral. Therefore -- you can't loan any of your collateral. You can't wear it either because it might be lost if you die. So for example, if you have one sword, you can put it up as collateral but you can't wear or loan it. if you have two swords of identical type, you can wear one of them, or loan one of them. But you can't loan one and wear the other. The bank won't let you take it out of your account.

C. The bank won't let you sell your collateral items either. So you could sell one sword but not the second one (and if you did, you couldn't use the remaining one at all -- it would stay locked in your account).

 

Therefore you CAN'T rip the bank off because you can't risk the collateral.

 

Doesn't this mean that the only people who can afford a loan don't need one? Yeah, in a way. Just like the real world.

 

So there are advantages. I will give an example. Suppose I want to build my crafting skills by making jewelry. I can put up my armor and weapons as collateral. I then buy the gems, buy the gold, make jewelry, and sell it. When I sell it I either make a small profit or a small loss. If a small loss I make it up out of my own cash. At the end I have gained XP for crafting, and I didn't have to sell my property (weapons and armor) to get the cash to get going. Of course, I COULD have sold my weapons and armor to raise the cash to do my jewelry venture, did it, and then bought back replacement armor and weapons. But the loan approach simplifies matters.

 

But. Suppose you borrow the cash, do your "jewelry making business", and lose money in a big way, and so you don't have the cash on hand to repay at repayment time. AND suppose when the bank grabs and sells your collateral the GE prices for the items have gone down and they get back less than what you owe. Two things could happen then. The bank just goes and grabs your highest valued non-collateral item and sells that. And if necessary the next one and the next one. If that is sufficient to settle the loan, you are paid off. But if not -- if necessary the bank strips your avatar naked. And suppose you STILL owe on the loan? Well, enter "wage garnishment". Unless you quit the game and leave, next what happens is -- you go get the cheap free hatchet and start cutting trees, or the cheap free net and catch fish, and the bank extracts their pound of flesh from your earnings. Again, just like the real world.

 

So I think it would be fairly easy to implement, and it can be constructed in a useful way, and it can be constructed to prevent problems.

[sees_all1]

So I think it would be fairly easy to implement, and it can be constructed in a useful way, and it can be constructed to prevent problems.

So address my 5 issues...

[Zaaps1]

Abuse is too easy, plus how can you ensure a player pays back the loan without taking drastic measures?

[JoeDaStudd]

Abuse is too easy, plus how can you ensure a player pays back the loan without taking drastic measures?

Bill and Ben the debt collecting men pop up.

They start chasing you around and when they catch up to you they take measures.

1. They spam your IM/CC with abuse which can't be blocked

2. Reduction on max hp by 10% increasing to 90%.

3. They remove your ability to run.

4. They remove your ability to wield in the right hand.

5. They remove your ability to wield in the left hand.

 

And yes I was bored when typing this.

[Zaaps1]

That's simply unfair, though. It's too restrictive. What if the players honestly can't pay back the loan (they died with what they bought or whatever). Is it really fair to restrict his or her ability to pay back the loan?

 

If I took out a 70m loan for an SGS, but then died with it. How can you expect me to raise 70m when my HP is below 10 at all times, when I can't run, and can't wield anything?

[friedtomato7]

That's simply unfair, though. It's too restrictive. What if the players honestly can't pay back the loan (they died with what they bought or whatever). Is it really fair to restrict his or her ability to pay back the loan?

 

If I took out a 70m loan for an SGS, but then died with it. How can you expect me to raise 70m when my HP is below 10 at all times, when I can't run, and can't wield anything?

kill tons of chickens for the feathers

[RSBDavid]

How about this, make a system where money you borrow can not be used on the Grand Exchange or traded with players. This will be mainly used for buying items from shops. You will then have the satisfaction of earning money to buy items from players or the Grand Exchange.

[Raezk]

I like the idea, but I do think that there should be a penalty if you fail to pay the loan back- Otherwise, it's just free money.

 

How about this' date=' make a system where money you borrow can not be used on the Grand Exchange or traded with players. This will be mainly used for buying items from shops. You will then have the satisfaction of earning money to buy items from players or the Grand Exchange.

[/quote']

 

Now this Idea has my support. The money should not be able to be used in transactions with other players or over the grand exchange, but instead with shopkeepers. Otherwise, you're just going to cause more inflation...

[Zaaps1]

Making the money usable at shops doesn't stop inflation, because those items you buy can almost always be sold to the GE. It also fails to address the problem I mentioned earlier. Technically, you are still spending currency in the GE, just in a different form.

[geekdude]

What about this:

 

1. You go to a banker.

2. You request a loan of x amount.

3. You receive bank tokens of the requested amount.

3. when you buy Y item it will appear as "Item Name(B)" the "b" means it is bought using borrow money.

4. This item can not be transferred, dropped, or lost when death occurs. . Items you borrow can not be taken to PVP worlds or bounty hunter worlds.

5. You have a set period of time based on the amount you borrowed.

6. if you do not pay the loan back on time , you will have to pay interest. If you are over 4 weeks past due date, the bankers will confiscate your item and will not lend you any bank tokens for 3 months.

7. If you pay it back on time, nothing will happen.

 

This will help lower levels who need to borrow money to get something like a rune hatchet or something to make money.

[Zaaps1]

That also would not work because it means that the items would have disappeared from the game. And with loans being so easy to obtain, many items will drastically increase in price and likely never fall anywhere near where they where before.

[Skeptical]

Cool idea, but I think you need to flesh it out.

 

- Maybe the size of the loan you can get is related to how much xp/how many QP you have?

- What about down payments?

Most importantly, what will happen if you don't pay back your loans?

[Fellfrosch6]

we should be teaching kids to avoid relying on credit

 

such a dangerous mentality

THIS!

 

We're just coming out of a global economic recession because of Credit expenditures. Incorporating this into the game completely sends the wrong RL message to the RS population. The last thing you want is encouraging people to rely on borrowed money for their daily activities.

[Xena_Dragon]

Hey there, not long ago I read the Bank interest topic, and it gave me and idea of Bank loans.

 

What if you could loan money from banks and pay them back as large sums quickly or in smaller sums slower?

 

Very bad idea considering the fact Runescape is played by lots of young people. It would be bad to send those a message that loaning money for quick wins is a good idea. I'd rather introduce a system where saving money (piggy bank?) will earn them some extra money.