Getting defenders with Ring of Wealth

[ZorathZ]

Hey

 

When Warriors Guild came out several people, me included, could not get a defender past bronze. I personally spent 3-4k tickets and didn't even get an iron. I showed the defender to the woman outside and everything. I had a couple of friends who even quit in anger over this.

 

Fast forward several years to a month ago: I came back to the game after several years of absence and decided to give the defender another shot. 1,5k tokens later I still did not get a bronze defender. I tried asking around the RSOF, but people just called me the most unlucky guy of all time. I tried submitting a bug report to Jagex, but since the bug was older than a couple of months they no longer consider it a bug, it's now a feature and so my bug report was rejected out of hand.

 

Yesterday however i came to the realization that I had been using the RoW since my first short unlucky streak all those years ago. Especially since the ring was said to give me a 10% better shot at getting rare drops or something, according to what Jagex said at the time. I tried looking up some information on the ring and it turnes out it actually remove lower tier drops completely! And of course, in Jagex enduring wisdom, a defender, the only item you could possibly care about getting from cyclopes are considered one of those "worthless" things the RoW removes from the drop table.

 

After taking off the RoW I got the iron defender after 3 minutes and all the other defenders after a little over an hour.

 

Time spent to get iron defender with RoW: Approx 10 hours, did NOT drop

Time spent to get iron defender without RoW: 3 minutes.

 

Also, Tip It GURUS: This line:

 

"Many players have reported that wearing a Ring of Wealth appears to increase the chances of a Cyclops dropping a defender."

 

From your guide on the Warriors guild needs to be removed! It may hold true for the higher tiers of defenders, but I'm not going to be wearing that ring up there ever again.

[Dax]

I disagree. It took me 1,500 tokens to get a Bronze without RoW. I took the time, got one and it only took me anoth 1,500 to get from there to Rune. So it fixed me up.

[ZorathZ]

I disagree. It took me 1,500 tokens to get a Bronze without RoW. I took the time, got one and it only took me anoth 1,500 to get from there to Rune. So it fixed me up.

Yes, it took me that amount of time to get Bronze as well, but from bronze to iron i seriously used 10 hours without getting a single one! Then took it off and the defenders came in flying. Disagree all you want, but there is no denying facts.

 

Perhaps the RoW has different affects on different players? :S

[Aiel]

RoW only removes/decreases nothing drops..

[Bad911]

I did periods of 1.5k tokens with and without the RoW at bronze-to-iron defender and I saw no differences. In the end, I got it with the RoW on, at 5k+ tokens (I lost track, could easily be 6k+). The usual consensus is that you either have a hard time getting either the bronze/iron defender or the adamant/rune defender. I wouldn't read too much into it, your probably looking at only a minimal percentile change if the RoW does affect the chance of it dropping.

[Juhnie]

http://www.runescape.com/kbase/guid/letters24

If thou consider the possessions of an enemy to be like a roulette wheel, then the 'rare' items so coveted by players are located on a second roulette wheel, that will only be spun shouldst thou roll a specific number on the first wheel.

The ring of wealth affects not the number which thou may achieve upon the first wheel, but should thou gain the precise number to allow thee access to the second, the ring will make thy chances of gaining an object on that second roulette wheel all the greater.

My analogy is flawed, for death is not like roulette, but I hope that thou see the truth within this.

Long story short: if you manage to hit the "rare drop" section on the first imaginary wheel of drops, RoW increases the sizes of the "rare drop" sections on the second wheel while decreasing the "no drop" sections' sizes.

 

The RoW is a mysterious thing, but I highly doubt that it actually removes any drops. Its effect is hard to test too due to the fact that it's all based on chances - to eliminate that variable you would need a HUGE sample, and even then it would not be 100% reliable.

[ZorathZ]

I still fail to see how 3 minutes compared to never isn't a good sample size, or at least something worthy of noting down. I would at the very least update your guides and note that some players (at least one) reports that RoW makes it impossible to get a defender. you should at least aknowledge the possibility that the RoW makes it impossible or extremely imporbable to get a defender rather than hint at using it is a good thing since you clearly have no facts to support either theory.

 

Do you guys really think that I would have gotten the defenders even with the RoW after trying 10 hours without getting it? I'd say thats a conincidence the size of me finding a lottery ticket on the ground with a 10million jackpot. 6 defenders in 1 hour vs. no defender in 10 hours - the only change is the ring - the ring has one purpose and it is to manipulate droprates......

 

Also, while wearing the RoW other places I have noticed a change in what drops and doesn't. While killing dust devils I have never seen a mithril bar drop, until a day I forgot to bring the ring, I then saw multiple drops in a single slayer task.

[Aiel]

I still fail to see how 3 minutes compared to never isn't a good sample size, or at least something worthy of noting down. I would at the very least update your guides and note that some players (at least one) reports that RoW makes it impossible to get a defender. you should at least aknowledge the possibility that the RoW makes it impossible or extremely imporbable to get a defender rather than hint at using it is a good thing since you clearly have no facts to support either theory.

 

Do you guys really think that I would have gotten the defenders even with the RoW after trying 10 hours without getting it? I'd say thats a conincidence the size of me finding a lottery ticket on the ground with a 10million jackpot. 6 defenders in 1 hour vs. no defender in 10 hours - the only change is the ring - the ring has one purpose and it is to manipulate droprates......

 

Also, while wearing the RoW other places I have noticed a change in what drops and doesn't. While killing dust devils I have never seen a mithril bar drop, until a day I forgot to bring the ring, I then saw multiple drops in a single slayer task.

Thats runescape. ROW does not deserve a mention, and mith bars is a common drop from dusties.

[Markup]

Without RoW, 1000 tickets no defender

With RoW, 1200 tickets, bronze to rune (rune 20 tickets after adamant) 300 of the tickets were wasted because I was semi afk.

 

I still fail to see how 3 minutes compared to never isn't a good sample size

 

Thats a range, not a sample size

[MstrMonopoly]

RoW can comfort some people psychologically... other than that, meh. get a warrior/zerker ring. Only time a ring really matters is Onyx (i) at FFA Corp.

[Saunamajuri]

I got all of the defenders in under 1,5k tickets WITHOUT Row. Got from the start to mithril easily, then it stopped for long and finally adamant and rune almost instantly in a row.

[Bladewing]

Small sample size, and it is well known that ROW has no effect on defenders anyway.

[funion987]

I still fail to see how 3 minutes compared to never isn't a good sample size

 

Thats a range, not a sample size

 

Technicalities aside, there are only five people on this thread giving accounts of various RoW/token/defender statistics. All of the samples, as they could be called, vary greatly from each other (some had better results with(out) RoW, some took lots of tokens vs. very little tokens, etc), and as a result, a good statistical analysis cannot be made. Juhniz makes a good point that you would need a huge sample, i.e. hundreds or thousands of players' experiences with RoW and defender drops. And, as he also pointed out, even then only averages could be made as every player's drop rates differ.

[pgmr185]

Guys, I don't think that this should be dismissed so quickly.

 

I agree that the RoW (as described by Jagex) should not affect monster specific drops in any way. However........

 

1) Jagex may not be telling us the whole story. Defenders drop in a way that is unique among all monster drops. It is possible that they chose to implement the drops in a way that the RoW interferes with. Maybe those "empty" spaces are populated with defenders for Cyclops.

 

2) The RoW may be bugged and is filtering out defenders.

 

It is pretty well known that people have really long dry streaks when trying to get defenders, so the information provided by the OP isn't really PROOF that the RoW is doing something here, but it still does look a little fishy.

 

If it's not the case, then this should be really easy to disprove. We would only need one person to go and get a defender as a drop while wearing a RoW.

[funion987]

If it's not the case, then this should be really easy to disprove. We would only need one person to go and get a defender as a drop while wearing a RoW.

 

Look up ^

 

I disagree. It took me 1,500 tokens to get a Bronze without RoW. I took the time, got one and it only took me anoth 1,500 to get from there to Rune. So it fixed me up.

[pgmr185]

If it's not the case, then this should be really easy to disprove. We would only need one person to go and get a defender as a drop while wearing a RoW.

 

Look up ^

 

I disagree. It took me 1,500 tokens to get a Bronze without RoW. I took the time, got one and it only took me anoth 1,500 to get from there to Rune. So it fixed me up.

 

 

When he said "got one" I figured that he meant "got a bronze defender", not "got a RoW". I may have been reading it wrong.

[funion987]

I see, the grammar is a bit unclear. In that case:

 

Without RoW, 1000 tickets no defender

With RoW, 1200 tickets, bronze to rune (rune 20 tickets after adamant) 300 of the tickets were wasted because I was semi afk.

[stonewall337]

http://www.runescape.com/kbase/guid/letters24

If thou consider the possessions of an enemy to be like a roulette wheel, then the 'rare' items so coveted by players are located on a second roulette wheel, that will only be spun shouldst thou roll a specific number on the first wheel.

The ring of wealth affects not the number which thou may achieve upon the first wheel, but should thou gain the precise number to allow thee access to the second, the ring will make thy chances of gaining an object on that second roulette wheel all the greater.

My analogy is flawed, for death is not like roulette, but I hope that thou see the truth within this.

Long story short: if you manage to hit the "rare drop" section on the first imaginary wheel of drops, RoW increases the sizes of the "rare drop" sections on the second wheel while decreasing the "no drop" sections' sizes.

 

The RoW is a mysterious thing, but I highly doubt that it actually removes any drops. Its effect is hard to test too due to the fact that it's all based on chances - to eliminate that variable you would need a HUGE sample, and even then it would not be 100% reliable.

 

WRONG WRONG WRONG

 

The Ring of Wealth

 

The ring of wealth's magical power can sometimes have an effect on the drops that you receive from defeated NPCs. To understand how it works, we first need to define some terms.

 

100% drop - Most creatures have what is called a '100% drop' which they will drop every time they are defeated (e.g. bones or ashes).

Main drop - This will be an item drawn from an NPC's 'drop table' based upon a random 'roll' (imagine a dice roll or roulette wheel).

Drop table - This is a list of all items that an NPC could possibly drop. The percentage chance of receiving each item varies depending upon the item's relative value.

Secondary drop - Some creatures also have a secondary drop. So far, this only consists of charms used in Summoning.

Quest drops - in some instances, an NPC will drop a quest-specific item (e.g. the unique bones required for the Rag and Bone Man or Fur 'n' Seek quests).

 

On most NPCs' drop tables, there is a small chance that instead of receiving an item from its own drop table, you will instead get a roll again on the 'rare drop table'. The rare drop table contains some of the more exclusive items in the game, including, but not limited to, dragon items, certain rune items, shield halves, key parts and uncut gems. The rare table also contains 'empty slots' - the end result of landing on these empty slots is often referred to as receiving 'no drop' or 'bone drop'. We keep these slots empty for any future drops that we want to add to this table.

 

The rare drop table is shared between a variety of NPCs - e.g. goblins, fire giants, most Slayer creatures. A good way to tell is that if an NPC is known to drop a half key, then it will drop other items from the rare drop table. There are, however, certain very rare drops that are not on the rare drop table, because they are specific to certain NPCs or NPC types (e.g. the draconic visage is only ever dropped by dragons; godsword pieces only by the God Wars Dungeon bosses) and it would not make sense for these items to be dropped by, say, a fire giant.

 

The ring of wealth comes into play whenever you are rolling on the rare drop table, its ability effectively removing most of the empty slots, drastically increasing your chances of receiving an item from the rare drop table. The actual percentage increase differs between NPCs. Adventurers who make regular use of a ring of wealth should find that they receive fewer 'no drops' than adventurers who do not, and, therefore, receive more rare drops and, in the long run, gain more wealth.

 

 

http://www.runescape.com/kbase/guid/magic_non_combat_magic

 

Only influences things such as shield left half, half keys, gems, etc. Not specialized drops, such as whips, SOL, d boots, etc.

[tedbundty]

I think you're right because I experienced something extremely similar.

 

Wearing a RoW, I got nothing but a bronze defender for the first day of fighting (I used at least 500-1000 tokens). Then I spent 5 more days, using at least 500-1000 per day and never got even an iron defender. Finally, in great despair, on the last day of the week I got rid of my RoW and in less than an hour I got all the way up to a rune defender.

 

I don't think it's impossible to get Iron + defenders (at least not anymore - maybe it was back then) while wearing a RoW, though, because plenty of people claim they got while wearing.

[Aiel]

http://www.runescape.com/kbase/guid/letters24

If thou consider the possessions of an enemy to be like a roulette wheel, then the 'rare' items so coveted by players are located on a second roulette wheel, that will only be spun shouldst thou roll a specific number on the first wheel.

The ring of wealth affects not the number which thou may achieve upon the first wheel, but should thou gain the precise number to allow thee access to the second, the ring will make thy chances of gaining an object on that second roulette wheel all the greater.

My analogy is flawed, for death is not like roulette, but I hope that thou see the truth within this.

Long story short: if you manage to hit the "rare drop" section on the first imaginary wheel of drops, RoW increases the sizes of the "rare drop" sections on the second wheel while decreasing the "no drop" sections' sizes.

 

The RoW is a mysterious thing, but I highly doubt that it actually removes any drops. Its effect is hard to test too due to the fact that it's all based on chances - to eliminate that variable you would need a HUGE sample, and even then it would not be 100% reliable.

 

WRONG WRONG WRONG

 

The Ring of Wealth

 

The ring of wealth's magical power can sometimes have an effect on the drops that you receive from defeated NPCs. To understand how it works, we first need to define some terms.

 

100% drop - Most creatures have what is called a '100% drop' which they will drop every time they are defeated (e.g. bones or ashes).

Main drop - This will be an item drawn from an NPC's 'drop table' based upon a random 'roll' (imagine a dice roll or roulette wheel).

Drop table - This is a list of all items that an NPC could possibly drop. The percentage chance of receiving each item varies depending upon the item's relative value.

Secondary drop - Some creatures also have a secondary drop. So far, this only consists of charms used in Summoning.

Quest drops - in some instances, an NPC will drop a quest-specific item (e.g. the unique bones required for the Rag and Bone Man or Fur 'n' Seek quests).

 

On most NPCs' drop tables, there is a small chance that instead of receiving an item from its own drop table, you will instead get a roll again on the 'rare drop table'. The rare drop table contains some of the more exclusive items in the game, including, but not limited to, dragon items, certain rune items, shield halves, key parts and uncut gems. The rare table also contains 'empty slots' - the end result of landing on these empty slots is often referred to as receiving 'no drop' or 'bone drop'. We keep these slots empty for any future drops that we want to add to this table.

 

The rare drop table is shared between a variety of NPCs - e.g. goblins, fire giants, most Slayer creatures. A good way to tell is that if an NPC is known to drop a half key, then it will drop other items from the rare drop table. There are, however, certain very rare drops that are not on the rare drop table, because they are specific to certain NPCs or NPC types (e.g. the draconic visage is only ever dropped by dragons; godsword pieces only by the God Wars Dungeon bosses) and it would not make sense for these items to be dropped by, say, a fire giant.

 

The ring of wealth comes into play whenever you are rolling on the rare drop table, its ability effectively removing most of the empty slots, drastically increasing your chances of receiving an item from the rare drop table. The actual percentage increase differs between NPCs. Adventurers who make regular use of a ring of wealth should find that they receive fewer 'no drops' than adventurers who do not, and, therefore, receive more rare drops and, in the long run, gain more wealth.

 

 

http://www.runescape.com/kbase/guid/magic_non_combat_magic

 

Only influences things such as shield left half, half keys, gems, etc. Not specialized drops, such as whips, SOL, d boots, etc.

for an idea of these things it influences, look at the drops at DKs that appear off to the side of the bones/hides, these are all the items that (atleast at DKs) are influenced by a RoW.

[stonewall337]

Or any monster. I always get D spear off to the side.

[oropher]

I always used ROW at cyclopses, worked just fine for me...

[Juhnie]

[hide]

http://www.runescape.com/kbase/guid/letters24

If thou consider the possessions of an enemy to be like a roulette wheel, then the 'rare' items so coveted by players are located on a second roulette wheel, that will only be spun shouldst thou roll a specific number on the first wheel.

The ring of wealth affects not the number which thou may achieve upon the first wheel, but should thou gain the precise number to allow thee access to the second, the ring will make thy chances of gaining an object on that second roulette wheel all the greater.

My analogy is flawed, for death is not like roulette, but I hope that thou see the truth within this.

Long story short: if you manage to hit the "rare drop" section on the first imaginary wheel of drops, RoW increases the sizes of the "rare drop" sections on the second wheel while decreasing the "no drop" sections' sizes.

 

The RoW is a mysterious thing, but I highly doubt that it actually removes any drops. Its effect is hard to test too due to the fact that it's all based on chances - to eliminate that variable you would need a HUGE sample, and even then it would not be 100% reliable.

 

WRONG WRONG WRONG

 

The Ring of Wealth

 

The ring of wealth's magical power can sometimes have an effect on the drops that you receive from defeated NPCs. To understand how it works, we first need to define some terms.

 

100% drop - Most creatures have what is called a '100% drop' which they will drop every time they are defeated (e.g. bones or ashes).

Main drop - This will be an item drawn from an NPC's 'drop table' based upon a random 'roll' (imagine a dice roll or roulette wheel).

Drop table - This is a list of all items that an NPC could possibly drop. The percentage chance of receiving each item varies depending upon the item's relative value.

Secondary drop - Some creatures also have a secondary drop. So far, this only consists of charms used in Summoning.

Quest drops - in some instances, an NPC will drop a quest-specific item (e.g. the unique bones required for the Rag and Bone Man or Fur 'n' Seek quests).

 

On most NPCs' drop tables, there is a small chance that instead of receiving an item from its own drop table, you will instead get a roll again on the 'rare drop table'. The rare drop table contains some of the more exclusive items in the game, including, but not limited to, dragon items, certain rune items, shield halves, key parts and uncut gems. The rare table also contains 'empty slots' - the end result of landing on these empty slots is often referred to as receiving 'no drop' or 'bone drop'. We keep these slots empty for any future drops that we want to add to this table.

 

The rare drop table is shared between a variety of NPCs - e.g. goblins, fire giants, most Slayer creatures. A good way to tell is that if an NPC is known to drop a half key, then it will drop other items from the rare drop table. There are, however, certain very rare drops that are not on the rare drop table, because they are specific to certain NPCs or NPC types (e.g. the draconic visage is only ever dropped by dragons; godsword pieces only by the God Wars Dungeon bosses) and it would not make sense for these items to be dropped by, say, a fire giant.

 

The ring of wealth comes into play whenever you are rolling on the rare drop table, its ability effectively removing most of the empty slots, drastically increasing your chances of receiving an item from the rare drop table. The actual percentage increase differs between NPCs. Adventurers who make regular use of a ring of wealth should find that they receive fewer 'no drops' than adventurers who do not, and, therefore, receive more rare drops and, in the long run, gain more wealth.

 

 

http://www.runescape.com/kbase/guid/magic_non_combat_magic

 

Only influences things such as shield left half, half keys, gems, etc. Not specialized drops, such as whips, SOL, d boots, etc.

[/hide]

Please point me to the part where I implied that it increases the amount of specialized drops.

Thanks for narrowing the Jagex definition of rare drop down, but my explanation was not wrong. A bit vague, at most.

[Zaaps1]

The RoW should not affect defender drops. They are considered a "special" drop, thus they are neither hindered nor helped by the RoW.

 

Although that still makes the guide you cited wrong, you are right.