Israel vs Palestine

[The_Gabe]

It did not matter whether or not the British did have control of it, but the fact was it was very unorganized. When the civil war started Palestine government collapsed and Israel government did not. "The Arab states contributed to the chaos by being able neither to determine Arab Palestine's political future nor to let the Palestinians shape their own destiny."

Here's a quote from another article "When riots broke out, middle-class Palestinians sent their families to neighboring countries and joined them after the situation deteriorated." Another example of how it wasn't an evacuation.

 

First of all, let's look at this graph.

 

Source.

 

You can see that between 1941 and 1950 there's a sudden rise in the jewish population. This, we can attribute to the end of WWII, and the end of the British Mandate and the application of the Partition Plan, okay? Now, about the partition plan, as its name implies, it was the idea to split the territory of Palestine, where palestinians (and a very small jewish minority) lived in prior to the dissolution of the British Mandate, and give each party (The Zionists and the Palestinians) roughly half of the lands. Now, common sense should tell you that if you split a land you are taking a part from the total. The total belonged to the palestinians before the jews came. Therefore, land was taken from the palestinians and given to the Jews. Now, if lands were taken from the Palestinians, this means that before this happened those lands were rightfully theirs, and with the partition, they stopped having the right to inhabit those lands. Therefore, the palestinians who inhabited those lands had to leave. That is, they were evacuated and jewish immigrants were accomodated in those lands.

 

Wrong. No one forced them to leave their homes. They were even encouraged to stay by the new Israeli government. They were not evacuated until the war where it was essential for security.

 

 

Because if none of this happened, then there would have been no reason for a civil war to take place. Because everything would have been fine and the palestinians would be living in their lands. But they weren't. Because they were evacuated. And that was the beggining of the conflict.

 

Wrong again. They just did not want a Jewish state. They were not evacuated because of that. The beginning of the conflict was the Arab countries attacking the newly independent Jewish state.

 

Are you saying it's OK to violate human rights to coerce someone into giving in to your demands?

I'm not saying that, but sometimes, there's really no other way to protect and secure your people. If existing means having to violate a bit of human rights of those who refuse to acknowledge you exist, then I do.

 

So basically you are saying that Israel is above the law and it should be left to their opinion wether they decide to follow the human rights or not. How does that make you any better than the so called terrorists who want their lands back?

 

The law is solid, but the cases are not. Why do you think there is the International Court of Justice? The Only reason Israel is bypassing this law is because of the special requirements and land size that must be kept secured. One mistake could kill millions, and that's just not an option. I'll ask this again: Have you listened to Netanyahu's speech to Congress?

[Napalm]

Wrong. No one forced them to leave their homes. They were even encouraged to stay by the new Israeli government. They were not evacuated until the war where it was essential for security.

Okay, earlier I quoted wikipedia, you said it wasn't a trusted source. Here, then, this is a direct quote from the UN General Assembly Resolution 181 (Partition Plan), November 29, 1947.

 

 

A. TERMINATION OF MANDATE, PARTITION AND INDEPENDENCE

 

The Mandate for Palestine shall terminate as soon as possible but in any case not later than 1 August 1948.

The armed forces of the mandatory Power shall be progressively withdrawn from Palestine, the withdrawal to be completed as soon as possible but in any case not later than 1 August 1948.

The mandatory Power shall advise the Commission, as far in advance as possible, of its intention to terminate the mandate and to evacuate each area. The mandatory Power shall use its best endeavours to ensure that an area situated in the territory of the Jewish State, including a seaport and hinterland adequate to provide facilities for a substantial immigration, shall be evacuated at the earliest possible date and in any event not later than 1 February 1948.

 

And another quote:

 

The administration of Palestine shall, as the mandatory Power withdraws its armed forces, be progressively turned over to the Commission, which shall act in conformity with the recommendations of the General Assembly, under the guidance of the Security Council. The mandatory Power shall to the fullest possible extent coordinate its plans for withdrawal with the plans of the Commission to take over and administer areas which have been evacuated.

In the discharge of this administrative responsibility the Commission shall have authority to issue necessary regulations and take other measures as required.

The mandatory Power shall not take any action to prevent, obstruct or delay the implementation by the Commission of the measures recommended by the General Assembly.

 

Wrong again. They just did not want a Jewish state. They were not evacuated because of that. The beginning of the conflict was the Arab countries attacking the newly independent Jewish state.

 

War hardly ever is the beginning of a conflict. It is more an action taken to solve an already existing conflict, which at the time was that the Israelis decided that since the british left now a chunk of Palestine was theirs.

 

The law is solid, but the cases are not. Why do you think there is the International Court of Justice? The Only reason Israel is bypassing this law is because of the special requirements and land size that must be kept secured. One mistake could kill millions, and that's just not an option. I'll ask this again: Have you listened to Netanyahu's speech to Congress?

 

And exactly what is the case of people having homes that is threatening to the lives of millions? With that same excuse you might as well kill all the palestinian on sight, under the eyes of Israel they are all obviously threatening terrorists. A line needs to be drawn, and that's what laws are for.

 

And no, I haven't seen the speech.

[The_Gabe]

Wrong. No one forced them to leave their homes. They were even encouraged to stay by the new Israeli government. They were not evacuated until the war where it was essential for security.

Okay, earlier I quoted wikipedia, you said it wasn't a trusted source. Here, then, this is a direct quote from the UN General Assembly Resolution 181 (Partition Plan), November 29, 1947.

 

 

A. TERMINATION OF MANDATE, PARTITION AND INDEPENDENCE

 

The Mandate for Palestine shall terminate as soon as possible but in any case not later than 1 August 1948.

The armed forces of the mandatory Power shall be progressively withdrawn from Palestine, the withdrawal to be completed as soon as possible but in any case not later than 1 August 1948.

The mandatory Power shall advise the Commission, as far in advance as possible, of its intention to terminate the mandate and to evacuate each area. The mandatory Power shall use its best endeavours to ensure that an area situated in the territory of the Jewish State, including a seaport and hinterland adequate to provide facilities for a substantial immigration, shall be evacuated at the earliest possible date and in any event not later than 1 February 1948.

 

And another quote:

 

The administration of Palestine shall, as the mandatory Power withdraws its armed forces, be progressively turned over to the Commission, which shall act in conformity with the recommendations of the General Assembly, under the guidance of the Security Council. The mandatory Power shall to the fullest possible extent coordinate its plans for withdrawal with the plans of the Commission to take over and administer areas which have been evacuated.

In the discharge of this administrative responsibility the Commission shall have authority to issue necessary regulations and take other measures as required.

The mandatory Power shall not take any action to prevent, obstruct or delay the implementation by the Commission of the measures recommended by the General Assembly.

 

Wrong again. They just did not want a Jewish state. They were not evacuated because of that. The beginning of the conflict was the Arab countries attacking the newly independent Jewish state.

 

War hardly ever is the beginning of a conflict. It is more an action taken to solve an already existing conflict, which at the time was that the Israelis decided that since the british left now a chunk of Palestine was theirs.

 

Unless my reading is incorrect (which it shouldn't be) then the two quotes you've provided talk about evacuation of the British armed forces, not the citizens. Plus the "chunk" you're talking about was stated in the UN partition of 1948 in the two state idea.

 

The law is solid, but the cases are not. Why do you think there is the International Court of Justice? The Only reason Israel is bypassing this law is because of the special requirements and land size that must be kept secured. One mistake could kill millions, and that's just not an option. I'll ask this again: Have you listened to Netanyahu's speech to Congress?

 

And exactly what is the case of people having homes that is threatening to the lives of millions? With that same excuse you might as well kill all the palestinian on sight, under the eyes of Israel they are all obviously threatening terrorists. A line needs to be drawn, and that's what laws are for.

 

And no, I haven't seen the speech.

 

Out of those people, it takes only a small majority that could be terrorists to threaten security greatly. Mind I remind you that terrorists look like normal people (shocking, I know). Go watch the speech.

 

Here's the video:

 

I found a quote that I really liked so I'll post it.

We have one Baruch Goldstein. They have thousands.

We teach our children to hate how he became. They teach their children to be just like him.

We hang our heads in shame when we hear that a Jew has does something terrible to an innocent Arab. They hold a street party when innocent Jews are killed.

We guard our children with our lives. They strap bombs to the waists of theirs.

We value life. They value death.

If they would stop firing, we would be at peace. If we would stop firing, they would come and kill us all.

There is no comparison and anyone who thinks there is can only be called a sick Jew-hater.

[Napalm]

Wrong. No one forced them to leave their homes. They were even encouraged to stay by the new Israeli government. They were not evacuated until the war where it was essential for security.

Okay, earlier I quoted wikipedia, you said it wasn't a trusted source. Here, then, this is a direct quote from the UN General Assembly Resolution 181 (Partition Plan), November 29, 1947.

 

 

A. TERMINATION OF MANDATE, PARTITION AND INDEPENDENCE

 

The Mandate for Palestine shall terminate as soon as possible but in any case not later than 1 August 1948.

The armed forces of the mandatory Power shall be progressively withdrawn from Palestine, the withdrawal to be completed as soon as possible but in any case not later than 1 August 1948.

The mandatory Power shall advise the Commission, as far in advance as possible, of its intention to terminate the mandate and to evacuate each area. The mandatory Power shall use its best endeavours to ensure that an area situated in the territory of the Jewish State, including a seaport and hinterland adequate to provide facilities for a substantial immigration, shall be evacuated at the earliest possible date and in any event not later than 1 February 1948.

 

And another quote:

 

The administration of Palestine shall, as the mandatory Power withdraws its armed forces, be progressively turned over to the Commission, which shall act in conformity with the recommendations of the General Assembly, under the guidance of the Security Council. The mandatory Power shall to the fullest possible extent coordinate its plans for withdrawal with the plans of the Commission to take over and administer areas which have been evacuated.

In the discharge of this administrative responsibility the Commission shall have authority to issue necessary regulations and take other measures as required.

The mandatory Power shall not take any action to prevent, obstruct or delay the implementation by the Commission of the measures recommended by the General Assembly.

 

Wrong again. They just did not want a Jewish state. They were not evacuated because of that. The beginning of the conflict was the Arab countries attacking the newly independent Jewish state.

 

War hardly ever is the beginning of a conflict. It is more an action taken to solve an already existing conflict, which at the time was that the Israelis decided that since the british left now a chunk of Palestine was theirs.

 

Unless my reading is incorrect (which it shouldn't be) then the two quotes you've provided talk about evacuation of the British armed forces, not the citizens. Plus the "chunk" you're talking about was stated in the UN partition of 1948 in the two state idea.

 

The law is solid, but the cases are not. Why do you think there is the International Court of Justice? The Only reason Israel is bypassing this law is because of the special requirements and land size that must be kept secured. One mistake could kill millions, and that's just not an option. I'll ask this again: Have you listened to Netanyahu's speech to Congress?

 

And exactly what is the case of people having homes that is threatening to the lives of millions? With that same excuse you might as well kill all the palestinian on sight, under the eyes of Israel they are all obviously threatening terrorists. A line needs to be drawn, and that's what laws are for.

 

And no, I haven't seen the speech.

 

Out of those people, it takes only a small majority that could be terrorists to threaten security greatly. Mind I remind you that terrorists look like normal people (shocking, I know). Go watch the speech.

 

Here's the video:

 

I found a quote that I really liked so I'll post it.

We have one Baruch Goldstein. They have thousands.

We teach our children to hate how he became. They teach their children to be just like him.

We hang our heads in shame when we hear that a Jew has does something terrible to an innocent Arab. They hold a street party when innocent Jews are killed.

We guard our children with our lives. They strap bombs to the waists of theirs.

We value life. They value death.

If they would stop firing, we would be at peace. If we would stop firing, they would come and kill us all.

There is no comparison and anyone who thinks there is can only be called a sick Jew-hater.

 

 

It talks about the withdrawal of british armed forces, and also talks about the evacuation of the lands. I beleive it's two separate matters, and the evacuation refers to the actual emptying and removal of citizens (it also gives 2 different deadlines for both things, which if they were the same wouldn't make much sense at all). Or at least, that's how I see it. To be honest, now that you pointed that out I'm not sure, I'd like someone elses opinion on this.

 

And well, the end line of your quote pretty much summs it up. If you are anti-zionist, they'll call you anti-semitic and demonize you. Israel shouldn't be there in the first place. Israel is the root of the conflict. Why? Because the existance of Israel means that Palestine is not being allowed to have their rightful lands. It's as simple as that.

 

Oh, and excuse me by this, and I may sound arrogant, but I'm not going to spend 47 minutes watching that video. No offence meant.

[The_Gabe]

You really should. It's not a waste of 47 minutes. It's an amazing 47 minutes.

[Nifflin]

 

I found a quote that I really liked so I'll post it.

We have one Baruch Goldstein. They have thousands.

We teach our children to hate how he became. They teach their children to be just like him.

We hang our heads in shame when we hear that a Jew has does something terrible to an innocent Arab. They hold a street party when innocent Jews are killed.

We guard our children with our lives. They strap bombs to the waists of theirs.

We value life. They value death.

If they would stop firing, we would be at peace. If we would stop firing, they would come and kill us all.

There is no comparison and anyone who thinks there is can only be called a sick Jew-hater.

 

Lets break down your lovely quote.

 

We have one Baruch Goldstein. They have thousands.

[citation needed]

 

We hang our heads in shame when we hear that a Jew has does something terrible to an innocent Arab. They hold a street party when innocent Jews are killed.

This article from the New York Times begs to differ, 10,000 Israelis turning out to honor the man who massacred Palestinians while they were praying;

 

http://www.nytimes.com/1994/04/01/world/hundreds-of-jews-gather-to-honor-hebron-killer.html?pagewanted=1

 

We guard our children with our lives. They strap bombs to the waists of theirs.

A bit of a hasty generalization right there. I guess it's just an example of how the Israelis indoctrinate their own citizens and Jews worldwide to view the Palestinians as animalistic and crude.

 

We value life. They value death.

Again, this is just an attempt to create a black and white view of the situation. Both sides value their own freedom, perhaps being killed fighting for the freedom of ones people is worth more to Palestinians then living a life where they are oppressed. Israelis need to learn to empathize with Palestinians.

 

If they would stop firing, we would be at peace. If we would stop firing, they would come and kill us all.

If I remember correctly, the first acts of terrorism in the region were by Zionists during the mandate period. I've shown extensive evidence to prove this. That being said this quote is a lie. If the Palestinians stopped fighting eventually there would be no West Bank, no Gaza, only Israeli settlements. Of course that would be a peaceful resolution for the Israelis, but there are two sides to this. This part of the quote is myopic propaganda.

 

There is no comparison and anyone who thinks there is can only be called a sick Jew-hater.

And a nice accusation of "anyone who disagrees is anti-semitic," typical Israeli fall back, one that really disgusts me. It is wrong for obvious reasons. Perhaps people who disagree don't hate your religion or race or identity. Perhaps they just hate what you do.

[ISREAL63]

We hang our heads in shame when we hear that a Jew has does something terrible to an innocent Arab. They hold a street party when innocent Jews are killed.

This article from the New York Times begs to differ, 10,000 Israelis turning out to honor the man who massacred Palestinians while they were praying;

 

Every time I bring I link you claim it is to bias to use so I will say the same for your source. Here is proof to just how bias it is.

The New York Times, Associated Press and other major media outlets published a photo of a young man bloodied and battered crouching beneath a club-wielding Israeli policeman. The caption identified him as a Palestinian victim of the recent riots with the clear implication that the Israeli soldier is the one who beat him

The victims true identity was revealed when Dr. Aaron Grossman of Chicago sent the following letter to the Times:

 

Regarding your picture on page A5 of the Israeli soldier and the Palestinian on the Temple Mount that Palestinian is actually my son, Tuvia Grossman, a Jewish student from Chicago. He, and two of his friends, were pulled from their taxicab while traveling in Jerusalem, by a mob of Palestinian Arabs, and were severely beaten and stabbed.

 

That picture could not have been taken on the Temple Mount because there are no gas stations on the Temple Mount and certainly none with Hebrew lettering, like the one clearly seen behind the Israeli soldier attempting to protect my son from the mob.

.

Here is the picture

 

Unlike you even if you are using a bias source I will reply. I like how you pick threw the numbers of the article it says hundreds came, later it says 10,000 came for a deferent purpose then what you said.

 

We guard our children with our lives. They strap bombs to the waists of theirs.

A bit of a hasty generalization right there. I guess it's just an example of how the Israelis indoctrinate their own citizens and Jews worldwide to view the Palestinians as animalistic and crude.

We value life. They value death.

Again, this is just an attempt to create a black and white view of the situation. Both sides value their own freedom, perhaps being killed fighting for the freedom of ones people is worth more to Palestinians then living a life where they are oppressed. Israelis need to learn to empathize with Palestinians.

 

Here my answer to both of your replies,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTGbP55HGi8&feature=related

You are denying the fact that they teach their kids to blow themselves up. They are not die for freedom they are dieing in the name of terrorism there is a big difference.

 

If they would stop firing, we would be at peace. If we would stop firing, they would come and kill us all.

If I remember correctly, the first acts of terrorism in the region were by Zionists during the mandate period. I've shown extensive evidence to prove this. That being said this quote is a lie. If the Palestinians stopped fighting eventually there would be no West Bank, no Gaza, only Israeli settlements. Of course that would be a peaceful resolution for the Israelis, but there are two sides to this. This part of the quote is myopic propaganda.

 

If the Palestinians stopped fighting there would be peace, which is all Israel wants. No there still would be the west bank and Gaza and under their control but they prefer terrorism then peace.

 

Ring world I dont understand are you denying the holocaust?

[Nifflin]

I was addressing Gabe, not you. The New York Times isn't biased, it's one of the premier news agencies in America. In fact their entire livelihood is based on being unbiased news. The link you gave is from an Israeli run agency, whose goal is to protect Israel from biased new. The article you linked too reaffirms how the NY Times is unbiased. It shows how the NY Times pulled an article after finding out it used bad information. Of course, you selectively quoted it and missed out on the part where they pulled the article to maintain their integrity. Also, you did not address all my concerns.

 

Since the article I linked on Israelis supporting Baruch Goldstein is still in circulation, it just shows that the facts it is based on have yet to be disproven.

 

As for your video on child soldiers, I agree that it is wrong for children to be exposed to war. I never denied that some children might be. That is why I used the term hasty generalization. The parents who endorse this are certainly at fault. However, it is even worse to take a few isolated incidents and say that all Palestinian parents and children are like that. That is blatant misinformation. Ironically one of my close Palestinian friends here in Jordan was raised without even being allowed to play with BB guns or play violent video games because his parents were so adamant about not raising their children to use aggression.

 

I guess the bottom line for me is that it really makes me upset when this is viewed as such a black and white situation. Not all Palestinians are terrorists. Not all Israelis are pro-expansion. Not all Palestinians want a state. Not all Israelis want peace. People need to understand how complex this is.

 

Gabe, still I look forward to your responses on my dissection of that quote.

 

Edit: I would give ANYTHING to have a tournament level policy debate with Israel or Gabe on the establishment of a Palestinian state, in a formal setting their arguments would be ripped apart.

[ISREAL63]

I was addressing Gabe, not you. The New York Times isn't biased, it's one of the premier news agencies in America. In fact their entire livelihood is based on being unbiased news. The link you gave is from an Israeli run agency, whose goal is to protect Israel from biased new. The article you linked too reaffirms how the NY Times is unbiased. It shows how the NY Times pulled an article after finding out it used bad information. Of course, you selectively quoted it and missed out on the part where they pulled the article to maintain their integrity. Also, you did not address all my concerns.

 

Since the article I linked on Israelis supporting Baruch Goldstein is still in circulation, it just shows that the facts it is based on have yet to be disproven.

 

I already did answer it you just don't want to accept the truth. The fact is you messed up in reading in article.

it “says hundreds came”' date=' later it says 10,000 came for a different purpose then what you said. [/quote']

 

As for your video on child soldiers, I agree that it is wrong for children to be exposed to war. I never denied that some children might be. That is why I used the term hasty generalization. The parents who endorse this are certainly at fault. However, it is even worse to take a few isolated incidents and say that all Palestinian parents and children are like that. That is blatant misinformation. Ironically one of my close Palestinian friends here in Jordan was raised without even being allowed to play with BB guns or play violent video games because his parents were so adamant about not raising their children to use aggression.

 

It isn't a few isolated incidents, 100,000+ children will be attending camps in the Gaza strip run by terrorist this summer.

 

I guess the bottom line for me is that it really makes me upset when this is viewed as such a black and white situation. Not all Palestinians are terrorists. Not all Israelis are pro-expansion. Not all Palestinians want a state. Not all Israelis want peace. People need to understand how complex this is.

 

You are wrong what Israeli's want the most is peace, but it can't be achieved when Palestinians raise their children to be terrorist.

[Nifflin]

I was addressing Gabe, not you. The New York Times isn't biased, it's one of the premier news agencies in America. In fact their entire livelihood is based on being unbiased news. The link you gave is from an Israeli run agency, whose goal is to protect Israel from biased new. The article you linked too reaffirms how the NY Times is unbiased. It shows how the NY Times pulled an article after finding out it used bad information. Of course, you selectively quoted it and missed out on the part where they pulled the article to maintain their integrity. Also, you did not address all my concerns.

 

Since the article I linked on Israelis supporting Baruch Goldstein is still in circulation, it just shows that the facts it is based on have yet to be disproven.

I already did answer it you just don't want to accept the truth. The fact is you messed up in reading in article.

it “says hundreds came”' date=' later it says 10,000 came for a different purpose then what you said. [/quote']

That doesn't even make sense. Read the articles. Stop picking and choosing your quotes. If you made a mistake because your English isn't very good that't totally fine, just acknowledge it.

 

As for your video on child soldiers, I agree that it is wrong for children to be exposed to war. I never denied that some children might be. That is why I used the term hasty generalization. The parents who endorse this are certainly at fault. However, it is even worse to take a few isolated incidents and say that all Palestinian parents and children are like that. That is blatant misinformation. Ironically one of my close Palestinian friends here in Jordan was raised without even being allowed to play with BB guns or play violent video games because his parents were so adamant about not raising their children to use aggression.

It isn't a few isolated incidents, 100,000+ children will be attending camps in the Gaza strip run by terrorist this summer.

Citation needed, please don't make another hasty generalization (it's a logical fallacy).

 

I guess the bottom line for me is that it really makes me upset when this is viewed as such a black and white situation. Not all Palestinians are terrorists. Not all Israelis are pro-expansion. Not all Palestinians want a state. Not all Israelis want peace. People need to understand how complex this is.

You are wrong what Israeli's want the most is peace, but it can't be achieved when Palestinians raise their children to be terrorist.

Again, citation needed.

 

More or less you're just making claims with no evidence to back them up or using logical fallacies.

[The_Gabe]

Nifflin, before the quote, I said "a quote I really liked". I liked how it was written and such, but I never did say it was true. That's why I posted it at the bottom of my post. I'm not including it in the debate. Of course it's a faulty quote, you don't have to be a genius to see that. I didn't actually expect you and Isreal63 would debate it.

 

 

Edit: I would give ANYTHING to have a tournament level policy debate with Israel or Gabe on the establishment of a Palestinian state, in a formal setting their arguments would be ripped apart.

 

I could say the near damn thing to you. You're not ahead of us, even though you seem to think you are.

 

To the zionists on the thread, Jews aren't above terrorism.

 

This group who actively questions the validity of the holocaust has been the target of it in the past.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institute_for_Historical_Review

 

 

 

Also lol at the typical "if you disagree you are anti-jewish" response. I wonder which is worse, being a Jew in Germany in 1935 or being a Palestinian in Israel in 2005 [that fact that there are ANY similarities is case enough for my stance that Israel is a tyranical and oppresive state to the palestinians]

 

Not even going to bother replying to this. It's not even worth the time to explain the insanity of your post.

[ISREAL63]

it says hundreds came' date=' later it says 10,000 came for a different purpose then what you said. [/quote']

That doesn't even make sense. Read the articles. Stop picking and choosing your quotes. If you made a mistake because your English isn't very good that't totally fine, just acknowledge it.

 

Do you even understand what you said? If yes then use your own advice for yourself i understood the article i don't think you did.

 

i will post it here so you can understand

hundreds today to recite afternoon prayers at the grave of Baruch Goldstein, They were a small group from among 10,000 or more Jews who descended on this Israeli settlement to rally against the Government for agreeing to post foreign observers in neighboring Hebron.

IT says it right here " They were a small group from among 10,000"

 

you are wrong its OK you can admit it

 

It isn't a few isolated incidents, 100,000+ children will be attending camps in the Gaza strip run by terrorist this summer.

Citation needed, please don't make another hasty generalization (it's a logical fallacy).

 

Future terrorist in summer camps

Childrten going to hamas terrorist summer camps

Terroist summer camp

 

More or less you're just making claims with no evidence to back them up or using logical fallacies.

 

Claim to what that Palestinians raise their children to be terrorist i already did but if you wish to ignore it that is your fault.

[The_Gabe]

Since the article I linked on Israelis supporting Baruch Goldstein is still in circulation, it just shows that the facts it is based on have yet to be disproven.

 

Actually it shows you can't read. It said hundreds, not 10,000 people praised him. That's just showing there's a few bad apples. It's nothing new. I don't support it, and you bet your ass I condemn it.

 

Again, this is just an attempt to create a black and white view of the situation. Both sides value their own freedom, perhaps being killed fighting for the freedom of ones people is worth more to Palestinians then living a life where they are oppressed. Israelis need to learn to empathize with Palestinians.

 

They want us dead. What's there to empathize?

[Napalm]

They want us dead. What's there to empathize?

 

Not dead, just out of Palestine.

[The_Gabe]

They want us dead. What's there to empathize?

 

Not dead, just out of Palestine.

 

No thanks, we don't want more rockets launched at us.

[Napalm]

They want us dead. What's there to empathize?

 

Not dead, just out of Palestine.

 

No thanks, we don't want more rockets launched at us.

 

There would be no more rockets if you weren't in Palestine.

[The_Gabe]

They want us dead. What's there to empathize?

 

Not dead, just out of Palestine.

 

No thanks, we don't want more rockets launched at us.

 

There would be no more rockets if you weren't in Palestine.

 

Except they don't want us to exist at all. So no, there would be more. We wouldn't be in this discussion if you actually saw the video I linked.

[Nomrombom]

They want us dead. What's there to empathize?

 

Not dead, just out of Palestine.

 

No thanks, we don't want more rockets launched at us.

 

There would be no more rockets if you weren't in Palestine.

 

Except they don't want us to exist at all. So no, there would be more. We wouldn't be in this discussion if you actually saw the video I linked.

 

I'm fairly sure that if you got up and left completely (to somewhere decently far away, like somewhere in Africa, Russia, Europe, etc.) then they would leave you alone.

[ISREAL63]

I'm fairly sure that if you got up and left completely (to somewhere decently far away, like somewhere in Africa, Russia, Europe, etc.) then they would leave you alone.

 

So basically you are trying to say the Jewish State of Israel doesn't have a right to exist. Good to know where you stand.

[Nomrombom]

I'm fairly sure that if you got up and left completely (to somewhere decently far away, like somewhere in Africa, Russia, Europe, etc.) then they would leave you alone.

 

So basically you are trying to say the Jewish State of Israel doesn't have a right to exist. Good to know where you stand.

 

Oh lawd, talk about putting words in one's mouth.

 

Please show me where I say anything about Israel not having a right to exist.

[ISREAL63]

So basically you are trying to say the Jewish State of Israel doesn't have a right to exist. Good to know where you stand.

 

Oh lawd, talk about putting words in one's mouth.

 

Please show me where I say anything about Israel not having a right to exist.

 

First off i didn't put words in your mouth so don't lie, i said what i understood from your post. You said if Israel just got up and left their would be know problem.

[Nomrombom]

So basically you are trying to say the Jewish State of Israel doesn't have a right to exist. Good to know where you stand.

 

Oh lawd, talk about putting words in one's mouth.

 

Please show me where I say anything about Israel not having a right to exist.

 

First off i didn't put words in your mouth so don't lie, i said what i understood from your post. You said if Israel just got up and left their would be know problem.

 

If Israel got up and left there would be no problem =/= Israel does not have a right to exist.

[The_Gabe]

They want us dead. What's there to empathize?

 

Not dead, just out of Palestine.

 

No thanks, we don't want more rockets launched at us.

 

There would be no more rockets if you weren't in Palestine.

 

Except they don't want us to exist at all. So no, there would be more. We wouldn't be in this discussion if you actually saw the video I linked.

 

I'm fairly sure that if you got up and left completely (to somewhere decently far away, like somewhere in Africa, Russia, Europe, etc.) then they would leave you alone.

[Napalm]

I'm fairly sure that if you got up and left completely (to somewhere decently far away, like somewhere in Africa, Russia, Europe, etc.) then they would leave you alone.

 

So basically you are trying to say the Jewish State of Israel doesn't have a right to exist. Good to know where you stand.

 

I do believe Israel shouldn't have been created. They should have either be sent back to where they lived before the holocaust, or if they wanted to be in that land, the should have gotten a palestinian citizenship. Then there would be no Israeli state, the palestinians would still have their lands, and ta-dah, conflict avoided.

[The_Gabe]

I'm fairly sure that if you got up and left completely (to somewhere decently far away, like somewhere in Africa, Russia, Europe, etc.) then they would leave you alone.

 

So basically you are trying to say the Jewish State of Israel doesn't have a right to exist. Good to know where you stand.

 

I do believe Israel shouldn't have been created. They should have either be sent back to where they lived before the holocaust, or if they wanted to be in that land, the should have gotten a palestinian citizenship. Then there would be no Israeli state, the palestinians would still have their lands, and ta-dah, conflict avoided.

 

I do believe America shouldn't have been created. They should either be sent back to where they lived before exploration, or if they wanted to be in that land, they should have become Native Americans. There would be no America, and the Native Americans would still have their land, and ta-dah, conflict avoided.

 

Do you realize how absurd you sound?