Best monster money maker?

[gametoffee]

What is the best monster to kill to make gold? Still frost dragons?

[Fire Essling]

I would assume it is between frost dragons and ganodermic's (Are they outdated yet? lol)

Earlier today I was easily getting 2.6m P/H @ frost dragons with: Rapier/torva/dragon defender/cannon/Extreme's/yak

 

Although if you are looking for some fun money making, I think Kiln and QBD are still good money if you are maxed/close to maxed.

[Quyneax]

No single monster, but the Kiln is the highest gp/hr followed by Nex, glacors then frosts.

[Powerfrog]

No single monster, but the Kiln is the highest gp/hr followed by Nex, glacors then frosts.

Pretty sure a good bandos soloer would make more than frosts and probably even glacors.

[Quyneax]

Idk what the gp/hr is for Bandos but hilts are cheap and armour isn't exactly high-value either. You need about 1 Bandos set (top/legs) per 8 hours to compete with frosts, and glacors are a little above that still (but unreliable as hell)?

[Powerfrog]

Idk what the gp/hr is for Bandos but hilts are cheap and armour isn't exactly high-value either. You need about 1 Bandos set (top/legs) per 8 hours to compete with frosts, and glacors are a little above that still (but unreliable as hell)?

Well 40 KPH is very easy to get with maxed stuff in 2 short trips using spec restores on both trips. That gives you 320 kills in the 8 hour period. That means both tassets and bcp need to be under 1/320 drop rate each. From personal experience i would say they are MILES lower, closer to 1/150 each. (1 big drop every 75 kills) the small drops and hilts easily pay for supplies and then some.

 

Unless I've been very lucky (seems unlikely as it's based on 30+ big items and 1000s of kills) it should easily be above frosts.

 

I just wish the drop rates had been proven so it would be easier to confidently assert.

[AHappySeeker]

People trying to crash drastically lowers Bandos income. Even if you use the perfect anticrash method, you'll still lose enough kills to make it not worthwhile.

[Powerfrog]

People trying to crash drastically lowers Bandos income. Even if you use the perfect anticrash method, you'll still lose enough kills to make it not worthwhile.

Not really.

 

First of all, i very very rarely ever get crashed in maxed strengths, sometimes a noob will log in from the corner, shit his pants and log out. (If i had torva it would be even less) and secondly, when i do get crashed, i get literally 90% of the kills (Due to max gear and more importantly, spec rests and getting first hit consistently because most crashers wait for you to tank because they're bad at runescape, or have worse ping as you're using your best world while they're hopping for a crash), the faster kill speed may actually be beneficial towards profit/hour over no crashers.

 

I'd say crashers are a none issue at worst, a help at best.

 

It seriously confuses me when people complain about this, I'd love to see how you actually fight bandos to lose to the average crasher.

[AHappySeeker]

Even them taking 2 kills out of 10 seriously impairs your income. I hope you realise that. More people use spec rests and max gear than you think.

[Powerfrog]

Even them taking 2 kills out of 10 seriously impairs your income. I hope you realise that. More people use spec rests and max gear than you think.

Less people attempt to crash a maxed player in max strength gear than you think. (I've crashed before. If i see a guy in torva+tokhaar+cmaul I'll hop to find a noob or tank gear.)

 

Also i wasn't exaggerating when i said 90%, in fact i was probably being a little conservative, you simply don't lose kills to anyone dumb enough to crash you. (You would lose more often to another maxed player, but most experienced maxed crashers are smart enough to find easier targets)

 

As i said, the faster kill speed pays for the very few lost kills.

[Noxx]

Even them taking 2 kills out of 10 seriously impairs your income. I hope you realise that. More people use spec rests and max gear than you think.

Less people attempt to crash a maxed player in max strength gear than you think. (I've crashed before. If i see a guy in torva+tokhaar+cmaul I'll hop to find a noob or tank gear.)

 

Also i wasn't exaggerating when i said 90%, in fact i was probably being a little conservative, you simply don't lose kills to anyone dumb enough to crash you. (You would lose more often to another maxed player, but most experienced maxed crashers are smart enough to find easier targets)

 

As i said, the faster kill speed pays for the very few lost kills.

Sometimes i'm not sure where you get your "statistics" from, but to be frank it sounds like horse shit. Anyone can crash anyone, especially at Bandos. You can get a guy with Bandos Tassests, Karils Top (or Gano, or whatever people use there now), Dragon Boots, Fury and a DFS and a Fire Cape successfully crashing someone with Bandos, Steads, Imbued Rings, Tokhaar, the works. Of course they're not going to get every kill, but they will get pretty much the same amount as you do in the long run. I don't understand how you can get away with posting misinformation so many times now, but i highly suggest that you stop making up these ridiculous figures in the future and actually do some research or test it yourself (and provide some god damn proof), before you post utter insanely ridiculous information. There is no way Bandos is going to be better GP/H than any of the aforementioned methods because it is simply to easy to get crashed UNLESS you're wearing Torva, CMaul with a Steel Titan. And let's face it, who's going to use Bandos for money making when they have a bank like that?

[ghjkl]

dungeoneering is the best money if you are good

[Hedgehog]

Theoretically another maxed player would have a 50% chance of crashing you.

[Powerfrog]

Even them taking 2 kills out of 10 seriously impairs your income. I hope you realise that. More people use spec rests and max gear than you think.

Less people attempt to crash a maxed player in max strength gear than you think. (I've crashed before. If i see a guy in torva+tokhaar+cmaul I'll hop to find a noob or tank gear.)

 

Also i wasn't exaggerating when i said 90%, in fact i was probably being a little conservative, you simply don't lose kills to anyone dumb enough to crash you. (You would lose more often to another maxed player, but most experienced maxed crashers are smart enough to find easier targets)

 

As i said, the faster kill speed pays for the very few lost kills.

Sometimes i'm not sure where you get your "statistics" from, but to be frank it sounds like horse shit. Anyone can crash anyone, especially at Bandos. You can get a guy with Bandos Tassests, Karils Top (or Gano, or whatever people use there now), Dragon Boots, Fury and a DFS and a Fire Cape successfully crashing someone with Bandos, Steads, Imbued Rings, Tokhaar, the works. Of course they're not going to get every kill, but they will get pretty much the same amount as you do in the long run. I don't understand how you can get away with posting misinformation so many times now, but i highly suggest that you stop making up these ridiculous figures in the future and actually do some research or test it yourself (and provide some god damn proof), before you post utter insanely ridiculous information. There is no way Bandos is going to be better GP/H than any of the aforementioned methods because it is simply to easy to get crashed UNLESS you're wearing Torva, CMaul with a Steel Titan. And let's face it, who's going to use Bandos for money making when they have a bank like that?

I find it hilarious you berate me for misinformation then heavily underestimate how much of an effect maxed gear has over crappy gear when the majority of damage comes from claws. "Pretty much the same amount as you do in the long run" LOL

 

It's not all about how you handle a crash, it's the fact you simply do not get crashed very often at all when you're in maxed gear. WHO CRASHES MAXED GEAR OTHER THAN COMPETITIVE PVP CLANS?

 

I'm basing this all from personal experience (Of 1000+ solo graardor kills). The average person that crashes me is someone hugely unexperienced in crappy gear that lets me get the first hit. I do not get crashed by maxed players, it happened a lot as a lower level but has never happened since about 135 combat (at which point had max gear -torva) because that's what crashers do, pick on low leveled undergeared players while avoiding maxed players.

 

Go try it yourself for a few 1000 kills before you blindly state that I'm wrong and demand impossible to obtain "proof".

 

To shut you up and let this thread continue in the path it should I'll state that nothing i have said is 100% proven fact, it's all based on my experience. In my experience, bandos solo is better money than killing frost dragons. In their inexperience, omg there are 30 maxed crashers on every world just waiting for you and +78 strength claws are equal to +96 strength claws. :rolleyes:

 

Edit: Kill stealers at frost dragons are much more of an issue than bandos crashers. :P

[Noxx]

Even them taking 2 kills out of 10 seriously impairs your income. I hope you realise that. More people use spec rests and max gear than you think.

Less people attempt to crash a maxed player in max strength gear than you think. (I've crashed before. If i see a guy in torva+tokhaar+cmaul I'll hop to find a noob or tank gear.)

 

Also i wasn't exaggerating when i said 90%, in fact i was probably being a little conservative, you simply don't lose kills to anyone dumb enough to crash you. (You would lose more often to another maxed player, but most experienced maxed crashers are smart enough to find easier targets)

 

As i said, the faster kill speed pays for the very few lost kills.

Sometimes i'm not sure where you get your "statistics" from, but to be frank it sounds like horse shit. Anyone can crash anyone, especially at Bandos. You can get a guy with Bandos Tassests, Karils Top (or Gano, or whatever people use there now), Dragon Boots, Fury and a DFS and a Fire Cape successfully crashing someone with Bandos, Steads, Imbued Rings, Tokhaar, the works. Of course they're not going to get every kill, but they will get pretty much the same amount as you do in the long run. I don't understand how you can get away with posting misinformation so many times now, but i highly suggest that you stop making up these ridiculous figures in the future and actually do some research or test it yourself (and provide some god damn proof), before you post utter insanely ridiculous information. There is no way Bandos is going to be better GP/H than any of the aforementioned methods because it is simply to easy to get crashed UNLESS you're wearing Torva, CMaul with a Steel Titan. And let's face it, who's going to use Bandos for money making when they have a bank like that?

I find it hilarious you berate me for misinformation then heavily underestimate how much of an effect maxed gear has over crappy gear when the majority of damage comes from claws. "Pretty much the same amount as you do in the long run" LOL

 

It's not all about how you handle a crash, it's the fact you simply do not get crashed very often at all when you're in maxed gear. WHO CRASHES MAXED GEAR OTHER THAN COMPETITIVE PVP CLANS?

 

I'm basing this all from personal experience (Of 1000+ solo graardor kills). The average person that crashes me is someone hugely unexperienced in crappy gear that lets me get the first hit. I do not get crashed by maxed players, it happened a lot as a lower level but has never happened since about 135 combat (at which point had max gear -torva) because that's what crashers do, pick on low leveled undergeared players while avoiding maxed players.

 

Go try it yourself for a few 1000 kills before you blindly state that I'm wrong and demand impossible to obtain "proof".

 

To shut you up and let this thread continue in the path it should I'll state that nothing i have said is 100% proven fact, it's all based on my experience. In my experience, bandos solo is better money than killing frost dragons. In their inexperience, omg there are 30 maxed crashers on every world just waiting for you and +78 strength claws are equal to +96 strength claws. :rolleyes:

 

Edit: Kill stealers at frost dragons are much more of an issue than bandos crashers. :P

 

Proof please.

Until proof is provided i will assume that you sucked on your thumb to get a few figures.

I can easily say that in my experience i've been crashed, or someone has attempted to crash me 99 times out of a 100 times at Bandos while i was wearing Torva, etc. Since there is no proof to prove me wrong, everyone has to assume i'm speaking the truth. Or at least that's what you're getting at.

With your overall melee exp of ~37.5m vs my ~126m i can also easily say that i have at least 3 times more experience at Bandos than you do, if not more (which i would be willing to bet i do), i can once again say that your figures are false and you should not misinform people about rates (on anything).

Please stick to things you can provide proof on.

Claws does a lot of damage, i agree. But who doesn't have a pair of claws anymore these days?

If someone is going to crash you at Bandos, whether you are in maxed gear or not, they're going to have claws and they're going to steal kills and they're going to slow you down and they're going to make Bandos as inefficient at picking flax.

Now i think that nothing more should be said on this matter, on your part, because your misinformation is against posting rules.

[AHappySeeker]

Nox's experiences are consistent with mine. It worked when nobody packed spec restores aside from me but now, everyone does. RS players generally being spastics, me being maxed hasn't stopped people from trying to crash me even if they're using CLS vs my maul.

[Powerfrog]

You've pretty much just misinterpreted everything I've said. I mentioned claws as they are more effected by armour offensive boosts than primary weapons (Which are also significantly effected.)

 

My lack of proof VS your lack of proof on something impossible to prove does not equate to you being correct.

 

Let's look at the things that are provable that we disagreed on, shall we?

 

"You can get a guy with Bandos Tassests, Karils Top (or Gano, or whatever people use there now), Dragon Boots, Fury and a DFS and a Fire Cape successfully crashing someone with Bandos, Steads, Imbued Rings, Tokhaar, the works. Of course they're not going to get every kill, but they will get pretty much the same amount as you do in the long run." No. No they will not. Not even close.

 

"If someone is going to crash you at Bandos, whether you are in maxed gear or not, they're going to have claws and they're going to steal kills and they're going to slow you down and they're going to make Bandos as inefficient at picking flax." If they consistently allow you to get first hit, have terrible gear and levels, no spec rests, you will get over 95% of kills and their help will speed up kills, reduce use of supplies and thus give you greater profit. Even in the worst case scenario of them being maxed gear and managing to get first hit you will get over 30% of kills and make much more than you would at flax fields. (At which point you should just crash another world though, obviously)

 

Ok we're done. 2-0. Thanks for playing.

 

Nox's experiences are consistent with mine. It worked when nobody packed spec restores aside from me but now, everyone does. RS players generally being spastics, me being maxed hasn't stopped people from trying to crash me even if they're using CLS vs my maul.

I've seen a few frustrated players like this that have hopped several times to maxed players end up attempting to crash me, but it's incredibly rare and only ever occurs at peak times. I imagine it would be even less likely in torva.

 

My experiences are mostly based on off peak hour trips, so there may be more of an issue with crashing than I've portrayed if you play at those times. (But again, frosts and even glacors are also packed at these times)

[Noxx]

You've pretty much just misinterpreted everything I've said. I mentioned claws as they are more effected by armour offensive boosts than primary weapons (Which are also significantly effected.)

 

My lack of proof VS your lack of proof on something impossible to prove does not equate to you being correct.

 

Let's look at the things that are provable that we disagreed on, shall we?

 

"You can get a guy with Bandos Tassests, Karils Top (or Gano, or whatever people use there now), Dragon Boots, Fury and a DFS and a Fire Cape successfully crashing someone with Bandos, Steads, Imbued Rings, Tokhaar, the works. Of course they're not going to get every kill, but they will get pretty much the same amount as you do in the long run." No. No they will not. Not even close.

 

 

Ok we're done. 2-0. Thanks for playing.

 

Nox's experiences are consistent with mine. It worked when nobody packed spec restores aside from me but now, everyone does. RS players generally being spastics, me being maxed hasn't stopped people from trying to crash me even if they're using CLS vs my maul.

I've seen a few frustrated players like this that have hopped several times to maxed players end up attempting to crash me, but it's incredibly rare and only ever occurs at peak times. I imagine it would be even less likely in torva.

 

My experiences are mostly based on off peak hour trips, so there may be more of an issue with crashing than I've portrayed if you play at those times. (But again, frosts and even glacors are also packed at these times)

Now you're just grasping at air...

Someone with low levels and terrible gear crashing?

Come on, use your brain god damn.

Who ever said a lvl 100 with Dhide is going to crash anyone? Or try for that matter.

You're making this a ridiculous discussion with your remarks.

 

Once again, i suggest you misinform people because right now it's getting too much.

 

"You can get a guy with Bandos Tassests, Karils Top (or Gano, or whatever people use there now), Dragon Boots, Fury and a DFS and a Fire Cape successfully crashing someone with Bandos, Steads, Imbued Rings, Tokhaar, the works. Of course they're not going to get every kill, but they will get pretty much the same amount as you do in the long run." No. No they will not. Not even close.

 

CharliBrown (Blind_Auror) and i used to do a lot of Duo Bandos. We pretty much always had similar gear, sometimes i would use Karil Top (this was before Gano) and i pretty much always got the majority of the kills. If someone has gear even close to what you're wearing, they're going to give you a tough time. I have said this i don't even know how many times, and i'll say it until you admit that you're lying about your information.

 

 

"If someone is going to crash you at Bandos, whether you are in maxed gear or not, they're going to have claws and they're going to steal kills and they're going to slow you down and they're going to make Bandos as inefficient at picking flax." If they consistently allow you to get first hit, have terrible gear and levels, no spec rests, you will get over 95% of kills and their help will speed up kills, reduce use of supplies and thus give you greater profit. Even in the worst case scenario of them being maxed gear and managing to get first hit you will get over 30% of kills and make much more than you would at flax fields. (At which point you should just crash another world though, obviously)

 

I don't even understand what you're thinking saying this because we all know that the problem is not the level 120 logging in and staying for a kill or two, it's the level 135+.

 

As for the two things i bolded, can you please provide some proof on this? Or i will have to assume that once again, you're pulling numbers out of thin air and thus giving misinformation.

Edited June 16, 2012 by Kimberly
Please refrain from personal attacks

[old skiller]

Noxx:

 

I think you are missing a rather major point. Crashers can actually speed up your kills and drop rates if you have an edge in combat. I don't have a lot of experience at Bandos, but I can tell you that I have used this to my advantage at the Tzhars when they were loaded with ~lvl 100 bots. I dont remember the exact numbers, but say if I solo the kets, and my avg hit is for 200 and it takes 6 hits on avg for me to kill them. That would mean they have 1200 hp. I used a whip, and lets say it takes 4 sec per hit. So an avg solo kill for me would be one every 24 sec. Now suppose 5 bots and I simultaneously attack a ket. They are level 100s, and their avg hit is say 100. I still lost kills because there are 5 of them, and sometimes they get a good hit in and I splash or hit on the low side, but suppose they just hit their avgs, and so do I. The 5 of them hit for a total of 500, and I hit for 200. We hit a second time, and now the ket is dead from the additional 700 hp. Those two hits took 8 seconds. If I only get half the kills, I get a drop every 16 sec, which is a faster drop rate than what I would get solo (every 24 sec). On average, I did get well over half the kills, except when there were so many bots that I got overwhelmed.

 

On the other hand, if there were tons of bots, it was more likely that one of them would get lucky, and my success rate would go down. So in fairness to your argument, a band of crashers with moderately inferior levels or equipment, could greatly reduce your kills, just because their is better odds one of them getting lucky.

[Powerfrog]

I like to give accurate estimates based on educated guesses instead of making vague useless blanket statements, so sue me.

 

You got more kills because you probably got the first hit, there are a lot of variables but it is a FACT you will deal considerably more damage with maxed gear and thus get the majority of the kills.

 

It's also a fact that you will average a lot more than flax at bandos as a maxed player even in the worst case scenario of being crashed. I was just using these examples as they're things i can prove that you were wrong about. I can't technically prove the other obvious stuff, but you can't disprove anything I've said.

 

I'm the one spreading misinformation indeed. :rolleyes:

[Hedgehog]

We know all of graar's levels. Why don't we just calculate it? :D

[old skiller]

Toffee:

 

You have a number of suggestions. My advice is you try them all and see which you enjoy more or which suits you best.

[Noxx]

Noxx:

 

I think you are missing a rather major point. Crashers can actually speed up your kills and drop rates if you have an edge in combat. I don't have a lot of experience at Bandos, but I can tell you that I have used this to my advantage at the Tzhars when they were loaded with ~lvl 100 bots. I dont remember the exact numbers, but say if I solo the kets, and my avg hit is for 200 and it takes 6 hits on avg for me to kill them. That would mean they have 1200 hp. I used a whip, and lets say it takes 4 sec per hit. So an avg solo kill for me would be one every 24 sec. Now suppose 5 bots and I simultaneously attack a ket. They are level 100s, and their avg hit is say 100. I still lost kills because there are 5 of them, and sometimes they get a good hit in and I splash or hit on the low side, but suppose they just hit their avgs, and so do I. The 5 of them hit for a total of 500, and I hit for 200. We hit a second time, and now the ket is dead from the additional 700 hp. Those two hits took 8 seconds. If I only get half the kills, I get a drop every 16 sec, which is a faster drop rate than what I would get solo (every 24 sec). On average, I did get well over half the kills, except when there were so many bots that I got overwhelmed.

 

On the other hand, if there were tons of bots, it was more likely that one of them would get lucky, and my success rate would go down. So in fairness to your argument, a band of crashers with moderately inferior levels or equipment, could greatly reduce your kills, just because their is better odds one of them getting lucky.

The problem is not the amount of crashers. On a non LS world it's not going to matter if there's 1 or 10. It's the fact that you cannot make a stupid statement like "my gear is better so i'll get 95% of the kills". That's utterly stupid and just plain wrong.

Crashers can speed up your kills, yes. But it's going to have to be a level 120 wearing Rune and Dhide (or even if he were to wear Bandos). But that is just not the fact. A level 120 is not going to try and crash someone who's 135+.

A 135+ is going to do that instead. And now let's be realistic. What do most crashers wear? Bandos. They are not bothered about taking hits because they know that 2 people in that room is going to take away a lot of the damage he would have takes had he been on his own. So they're most likely going to bring a Steel Titan or Unicorn. This means they'll spend less time on lower stats (since brews reduce stats, even if just for a few seconds), meaning they'll be able to do a lot of damage.

A crasher is not going to let you have the first hit, he's going to take it. He wants to you to waste your time and help him. NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND.

He'll most likely have more Spec Restores than you can imagine, meaning he'll be able to pull of 2 Specs per Kill. So you're going to have to do the same to be even close to competing. In this event kills are likely to go in his favor more times than not.

 

Now let's look at another scenario where the crasher does not have maxed gear. Lets say he wears average solo gear. Tassests and Gano Top.

He's going to have slightly less attack and str bonus than the guy wearing full Bandos. This is such a slight difference that at Bandos it WILL NOT MAKE A DIFFERENCE. I'll also me more than willing to provide proof on this. I'd be more than willing to do ~250 kills wearing non-maxed gear vs a player with maxed gear and prove that i'll get a big enough amount of kills to make Bandos terrible money.

 

And i have not even mentioned Dreadnips yet. Those can make a difference too.

 

The problem i'm seeing is that Powerfrog is being too idealistic. He's assuming the crasher is some lvl 130 with Dragonhide and 90 melees. He's assuming the crasher does not have overloads nor spec restores. He's assuming the crasher is bothered by being inefficient.

That is as far from realism as can be.

Like i have said before (more than once, im sure), a crasher is going to have Maxed or close to Maxed gear, so he'll be willing to take on anyone with Maxed or close to Maxed gear because he knows at the end of the day he's going to get enough kills to make it worth his while, which is most likely going to be anywhere from 50%of the kills to 30% of the kills.

Edited June 16, 2012 by Kimberly
Please refrain from personal attacks

[old skiller]

If you are solo, and another solo person of roughly equal gear and skill levels crashes, and you get roughly equal kills between the two of you, you should still make pretty good money, because the two of you will kill twice as fast as only one. There would be a loss of income, due to the wait time for him to respawn, and that depends on how crowded the world is, so I would be interested in seeing the actual numbers there. And I agree that only a small difference is not going to throw an advantage one way or the other, the hits are just too random for that.

 

But if I was going to crash, I wouldn't want to crash someone the same level as me. I would look around for a solo world first, or someone lower level, because then my drop rate will be better.

[Quyneax]

This discussion is pointless as neither of you (Noxx and Powerfrog, that's you) are providing any proof besides your experience. Next time when you make a claim, please provide verifyable numbers when asked to back it up. When you falsify a claim, please provide verifyable numbers to back it up.

 

In this case, calculate the breakoff percentage of kills that makes killing Graardor better gp/hr than frosts. But you do that over PM.

 

Please get back to the main discussion - this bickering is not helping the topic creator.

Edited June 16, 2012 by Kimberly