Do you believe in God?

[magekillr]

we just dont understand each others logics...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

lets leave it as that....cause now i dont udnerstand ur comparison of that to this

[Not]

if u believe this.....then technically...everything was an accident

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not everything is an accident, everything just is based off of that accident. Everything is based on the laws of probability.

[Death_By_Pod]

heres a logical thing....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

lets say u believe in the big bang theory....or that everything here is here by accident ok?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

if u believe this.....then technically...everything was an accident

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

that means u are an accident

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

that means ur brain is an accident

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

so y should i believe an accident?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's not an accident; the universe has the correct cosmological constants to form life (correct charge of electrons, protons, Correct Mass, Gravitational constant etc.). If it were any different we wouldnÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t be here, pretty simple stuff. If we lived on any other planet on the solar system we would have a hard time living or any other life, however this does not rule out that there are other planets with suitable conditions for life (it is almost impossible to look for life in all corners of the universe). If were such a planet to exist then it would be likely life was to form. Then would you call this life an accident or alien unworthy to live under your god?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You might then say is our combination of cosmological constants, an accident?

 

 

 

Which I would reply that for all you know there could be an infinite amount of alternate universes with different constants but we donÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t know about them because they do not have conditions suitable for life or that they are in another dimension which we are normally not interacting with (too small, too large, outside of viewable space).

 

 

 

Therefore you can come to the conclusion that there must alway be a universe suitable for life.

[magekillr]

 

heres a logical thing....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

lets say u believe in the big bang theory....or that everything here is here by accident ok?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

if u believe this.....then technically...everything was an accident

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

that means u are an accident

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

that means ur brain is an accident

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

so y should i believe an accident?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's not an accident; the universe has the correct cosmological constants to form life (correct charge of electrons, protons, Correct Mass, Gravitational constant etc.). If it were any different we wouldnÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t be here, pretty simple stuff. If we lived on any other planet on the solar system we would have a hard time living or any other life, however this does not rule out that there are other planets with suitable conditions for life (it is almost impossible to look for life in all corners of the universe). If were such a planet to exist then it would be likely life was to form. Then would you call this life an accident or alien unworthy to live under your god?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You might then say is our combination of cosmological constants, an accident?

 

 

 

Which I would reply that for all you know there could be an infinite amount of alternate universes with different constants but we donÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t know about them because they do not have conditions suitable for life or that they are in another dimension which we are normally not interacting with (too small, too large, outside of viewable space).

 

 

 

Therefore you can come to the conclusion that there must alway be a universe suitable for life.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

too coincidental in my opinion...which is another reaosn for my beliefs

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

but i wont force it down any1elses throats....and ill just leave it here as my final post on this topic

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

so...i believe wat i believe....u believe wat u wanna.... :?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

sorry for flamming any1 :oops:

[Astralinre]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I would argue that a life of following Christ is far more rewarding than one of gratifying your sinful nature. When people stop talking to you because of how vulgar your language is, it that more fun? Is it more fun when you get drunk and hurt yourself or a loved one? I would say that you are the one leading purposeless life and denying yourself true joy, even though God would be glad to give it to you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

"I have come that you might have life, and have it abundantly." -Jesus Christ

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Please refrain from insulting people without reason or proof.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Stop insulting non-Christians who do the above in moderation. We are not out of control, sending us on a path to destruction. The Swearing, rambling drunks are a minority group which you just blatantly painted as the majority.

 

 

 

There are many people who drink and swear that lead very gratifying lives.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Notice that I didn't say anything about those who do that in moderation; I only metioned the extreme consequences.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

so y should i believe an accident?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Because there is logical proof backing up that accident.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I believe that what's he's trying to say is this- if your logic came about by natural, imperfect processes, then how can you trust it? Isn't it possible that the evolutionary processes which created your logic are not finished, and your reasoning is still not working properly?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Which I would reply that for all you know there could be an infinite amount of alternate universes with different constants but we donÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t know about them because they do not have conditions suitable for life or that they are in another dimension which we are normally not interacting with (too small, too large, outside of viewable space).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Isn't that basically a religious statement? You're talking about theories that have no proof, and yet you believe them anyway. How is that any different from having faith in a God? For all you know, there could be an infinite personal triune God out there who created the universe, loves you, and is trying to get your attention. And that is every bit as likely as the theory you put forth.

[magekillr]

ill post once more...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

ill just refer back to my orignal post....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i believe...and if im wrong then ive lost nuthing

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

but if ur wrong....uve lost everything

[Guest colsmith]

 

 

I'm a Christian

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No,You are brainwashed and corrupted

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Please refrain from insulting people without reason or proof.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Religion diminishes your life, some peopel dont say swear becuase of religion, some people hate gays and pick on them, becuase of religion, and some people dont drink or have much fun becuase of religion, so you see, religion hurts your life and you dont even know it, you are kept from doing things that you like to do becuase a stupid book in some stupid church says so? It really takes up your life, but you dont even knowit..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I would argue that a life of following Christ is far more rewarding than one of gratifying your sinful nature. When people stop talking to you because of how vulgar your language is, it that more fun? Is it more fun when you get drunk and hurt yourself or a loved one? I would say that you are the one leading purposeless life and denying yourself true joy, even though God would be glad to give it to you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

"I have come that you might have life, and have it abundantly." -Jesus Christ

 

 

 

Sins? what the **** are sins? Oh thats right you are refereing to that [developmentally delayed]ed book called the bible? Oh yeah i forgot that peice of **** existed, There are no such things as sins, if "jesus" didnt want you to do those things, why did he make them? Why did he make people like me? And i never said anything about getting drunk i said drinking, if i wanted to take small sip of a certain drink or 1 beer, who in the right mind would refuse not doing what they want to do like have just 1 small beer, just becuase they are so called "sins"

 

 

 

Is slavery really abolished? i bielve the churches hold slaves and tell them what to do, and you sir, are one of the slaves

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

"To beilive in god is nothing short of Gullible" -My A$$

 

 

 

" I have come that you might have life, and have it abundantly." -Some man who decides to brainwash people with what he belives

[Not]

ill post once more...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

ill just refer back to my orignal post....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i believe...and if im wrong then ive lost nuthing

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

but if ur wrong....uve lost everything

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Unless there is a different "universal being" that punishes Christians and lets everyone else into an afterlife, it is after all just as likely as your theories.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

My believes are slightly more Buddist than athiest, they seem to fit me well. I will believe whatever makes sense to me and that is all I need.

[magekillr]

that guy has "drinking" all wrong....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

drinking to get drunk is morally wrong...as well as a sin

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

but drinking isnt wrong....and the proof is the mere fact that JESUS DRANK WINE!!!!!!!!

[Guest colsmith]

that guy has "drinking" all wrong....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

drinking to get drunk is morally wrong...as well as a sin

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

but drinking isnt wrong....and the proof is the mere fact that JESUS DRANK WINE!!!!!!!!

 

 

 

How many times do i have to say theres no such things as sins, Churches are telling you what do do with your life, such as not sin. You cant do things, becuase "sins" are holding you back. They contorl part of your life

[magekillr]

um..who said they are controllin my life?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

no1s perfect...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i drink...ive smoked weed...i watch porn...i go clubbin'

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

its noit holding any1 back...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i feel convicted after doing these things...but i sitll do them at times

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

not to mention the church does not tell us these things...but the bible

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

and many people and churches have interpreted many things wrong....especially catholics<---very corrupt

[Not]

if "jesus" didnt want you to do those things, why did he make them? Why did he make people like me?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

" I have come that you might have life, and have it abundantly." -Some man who decides to brainwash people with what he belives

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jesus didn't make sins, Society defines them. If you are refering to the 10 commandments, that wasn't Jesus that was the God that led the Jews out of Egypt.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No brainwashing neccesary, God gives people free choice. Jesus just gives people facts and allows people to make up their own mind. All religeons have their "savior" be it Moses, Jesus, or Budda

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No, I'm not trying to convince you to have a religeon, I respect you for you. I am not Christian nor am I Athiest. I am neither an Optimist nor am I a Pessimist, I am a Realist.

[magekillr]

 

if "jesus" didnt want you to do those things, why did he make them? Why did he make people like me?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

" I have come that you might have life, and have it abundantly." -Some man who decides to brainwash people with what he belives

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jesus didn't make sins, Society defines them. If you are refering to the 10 commandments, that wasn't Jesus that was the God that led the Jews out of Egypt.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No brainwashing neccesary, God gives people free choice. Jesus just gives people facts and allows people to make up their own mind. All religeons have their "savior" be it Moses, Jesus, or Budda

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No, I'm not trying to convince you to have a religeon, I respect you for you. I am not Christian nor am I Athiest. I am neither an Optimist nor am I a Pessimist, I am a Realist.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

u totally get my point...

[Astralinre]

 

that guy has "drinking" all wrong....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

drinking to get drunk is morally wrong...as well as a sin

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

but drinking isnt wrong....and the proof is the mere fact that JESUS DRANK WINE!!!!!!!!

 

 

 

How many times do i have to say theres no such things as sins, Churches are telling you what do do with your life, such as not sin. You cant do things, becuase "sins" are holding you back. They contorl part of your life

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You seem to understand that quite well, from what you just said. Sin does hold you back, it keeps you from experiencing the wonderful joy that God gives. That's why He went through so much suffering to free you from your sin. He took the penalty for your sin so that you don't have to.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You mentioned earlier that the church keeps you slave by saying not to sin. No one is forcing me to abide by the rules in the Bible, I obey them out my my thankfulness to GOd. I constantly fall short of His standard- I'm arrogant, I'm lustful, I'm hateful- but He loves me anyway, has fogiven me of my sins, and is making me more like Him each day. And He want to work the same way in all of your lives.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

According to the Bible, we were all slave to sin. However, Christians have been bought with Christ's blood, and are now "slaves to Christ," as the apostle Paul said. While the idea of belonging to Christ may be hurtful to our egos, we cannot truly become ourselves unless we deny ourselves and live for God's purpose.

[katonglaksa]

 

 

I'm a Christian

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No,You are brainwashed and corrupted

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Please refrain from insulting people without reason or proof.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Religion diminishes your life, some peopel dont say swear becuase of religion, some people hate gays and pick on them, becuase of religion, and some people dont drink or have much fun becuase of religion, so you see, religion hurts your life and you dont even know it, you are kept from doing things that you like to do becuase a stupid book in some stupid church says so? It really takes up your life, but you dont even knowit..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I would argue that a life of following Christ is far more rewarding than one of gratifying your sinful nature. When people stop talking to you because of how vulgar your language is, it that more fun? Is it more fun when you get drunk and hurt yourself or a loved one? I would say that you are the one leading purposeless life and denying yourself true joy, even though God would be glad to give it to you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

"I have come that you might have life, and have it abundantly." -Jesus Christ

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

om g(GOT)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

actually plz refrain from saying Omg,talk about PI!

[magekillr]

 

 

that guy has "drinking" all wrong....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

drinking to get drunk is morally wrong...as well as a sin

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

but drinking isnt wrong....and the proof is the mere fact that JESUS DRANK WINE!!!!!!!!

 

 

 

How many times do i have to say theres no such things as sins, Churches are telling you what do do with your life, such as not sin. You cant do things, becuase "sins" are holding you back. They contorl part of your life

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You seem to understand that quite well, from what you just said. Sin does hold you back, it keeps you from experiencing the wonderful joy that God gives. That's why He went through so much suffering to free you from your sin. He took the penalty for your sin so that you don't have to.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You mentioned earlier that the church keeps you slave by saying not to sin. No one is forcing me to abide by the rules in the Bible, I obey them out my my thankfulness to GOd. I constantly fall short of His standard- I'm arrogant, I'm lustful, I'm hateful- but He loves me anyway, has fogiven me of my sins, and is making me more like Him each day. And He want to work the same way in all of your lives.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

According to the Bible, we were all slave to sin. However, Christians have been bought with Christ's blood, and are now "slaves to Christ," as the apostle Paul said. While the idea of belonging to Christ may be hurtful to our egos, we cannot truly become ourselves unless we deny ourselves and live for God's purpose.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

u get my other point...as well as God's purpose and point

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

amen brother....

[katonglaksa]

 

if "jesus" didnt want you to do those things, why did he make them? Why did he make people like me?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

" I have come that you might have life, and have it abundantly." -Some man who decides to brainwash people with what he belives

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jesus didn't make sins, Society defines them. If you are refering to the 10 commandments, that wasn't Jesus that was the God that led the Jews out of Egypt.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No brainwashing neccesary, God gives people free choice. Jesus just gives people facts and allows people to make up their own mind. All religeons have their "savior" be it Moses, Jesus, or Budda

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No, I'm not trying to convince you to have a religeon, I respect you for you. I am not Christian nor am I Athiest. I am neither an Optimist nor am I a Pessimist, I am a Realist.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

its buddha not budda

[Not]

 

 

 

its buddha not budda

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Shows how affiliated I am with "Budda"

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¦Ã¢â¬ÅitÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢sÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâÃ

[Zealot]

 

if "jesus" didnt want you to do those things, why did he make them? Why did he make people like me?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

" I have come that you might have life, and have it abundantly." -Some man who decides to brainwash people with what he belives

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jesus didn't make sins, Society defines them. If you are refering to the 10 commandments, that wasn't Jesus that was the God that led the Jews out of Egypt.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No brainwashing neccesary, God gives people free choice. Jesus just gives people facts and allows people to make up their own mind. All religeons have their "savior" be it Moses, Jesus, or Budda

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No, I'm not trying to convince you to have a religeon, I respect you for you. I am not Christian nor am I Athiest. I am neither an Optimist nor am I a Pessimist, I am a Realist.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If society defines sin, then why is it that you and I both look back at the holocaust in disguist? (I assume, of course that you aren't among the minority who are hard core anti-semitists, and either applauds or denies the holocaust...) I would imagine though that the vast majority here would say that the mass-murder of people based on race is not "right." However, if it is simply society that defines sin, then we have no right to say that the holocaust was wrong, because the society that preformed it thought they were "right." So we are left with a predicament: either the holocaust wasn't bad, or there has to be some ultimate good that is more important than society. If there is a good that superceeds society, then where did it come from? The simplest answer is that if it can be established that there is a higher morality then simply the good of society, there has to have been a creator for this morality. (after all, it takes intelligence to define right or wrong) The only being who could have the right to define right and wrong for a human being would be the One who made that human... ie. God.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm not going to go into proving that there is a higher morality at the moment; sufficing to say that if you believe that the holocaust was wrong, you already accept the belief that there is some ultimate code of ethics that the morality of the NAZI party was farther from then the moral code you abide by (or believe in, if you don't do such a good job of abiding by it :wink: )

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also, Colsmith, is it God's fault that you choose to defy Him? If there truely is free will, then it isn't anybodies' but your own fault... If on the other hand, we're a bunch of glorified puppets, then it would be impossible to truely blaim God, because casting blame would require a concious choice (ie. free will) :wink:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On the other hand, why would God create people who would defy Him? Why would the all-knowing CREATOR AND SUSTAINOR of everything choose to create me even though He knew that I would, in my natural state, choose to murder Him, rather then love Him? Interestingly enough, the Apostle Paul dealt with this issue almost 2,000 years ago... What he said in a nut-shell is that God uses our fallen state to emphasise His Holyness... (it's in the book of Romans, but I don't remember the exact verses if I have time, I'll post it tomorrow) Simmilarly, a candle is much more appriciated in a dark room then outside at noon.

[Death_By_Pod]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Which I would reply that for all you know there could be an infinite amount of alternate universes with different constants but we donÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t know about them because they do not have conditions suitable for life or that they are in another dimension which we are normally not interacting with (too small, too large, outside of viewable space).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Isn't that basically a religious statement? You're talking about theories that have no proof, and yet you believe them anyway. How is that any different from having faith in a God? For all you know, there could be an infinite personal triune God out there who created the universe, loves you, and is trying to get your attention. And that is every bit as likely as the theory you put forth.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Actually I personally do not really believe in an Internal Multi-verse or M-theory's P-Brane Worlds larger then the universe, I was just highlighting them as an example of incorporating infinite possibilities. I also like the P-Brane World scenario because it help explains gravities weakness as well as leading to a possibility of communication between universes (via gravitons).

 

 

 

(if you really want I suppose that you could draw to a conclusion that if you use extremely! fine methods of sending and receiving gravitons via different universes in a Brane World scenario that there could be an alien in another universe who has contacted us and it interested and willing to learn more about us. However the fact remains that it is impossible for the alien to have influenced our creation.)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now to get to re-answer your question in a new light;

 

 

 

I believe in a Universe that undergoes an infinite amount of big-bangs and big-crunches. Basically the universe expands from a Planck (smallest length that exists, which you can not make anything smaller than) sized nugget, reaches a critical point where gravity overwhelms expansion and a collapse occurs back to the Planck sized nugget. From here it expands back again.

 

 

 

This idea of an infinite universe coupled with the Anthropic Principle suggests a self contained unit unnecessary of an external environment.

 

 

 

(The Anthropic principle:

 

 

 

A doctrine that explains why the universe has the properties we observe are that, were the properties different it is likely that life would not form and therefore we would not be here to observe the changes).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The problems that a lot of people dislike is the idea of probability, or that they tend to dislike the idea that it was all just chance. But history tells us that everything we do comes down to chance. It was chance that decided that our famous scientists did not die of diseases and prevent us from moving forward. It was chance that Hitler came to power and started WW2. It was chance that some inventors think of a revolutionary idea overnight. The whole world is based on human flaw that creates instability over the actions we take. Sometimes itÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s good, others itÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s bad but without it we would live in a static world (sometimes likened to the period where Christian rule in Europe slowed progress by disallowing revolutionary science and ideas to occur. Rather sticking to a tried and tested set of life).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Btw theory that was constructed to explain things (string theory) is only around 20 years old and the latest revolution (from super-string to M-theory) is only 9 Years old. These refinements are getting developed faster and faster (it was only a hundred years ago when we just started to use electricity for all our needs).

 

 

 

Give it 50 years and I will probably have the answer to religion.

[BlueLancer]

heres the way i look at it

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

first off...ill say I DO believe in God....but theres a difference betweeen believeing in God...and believing in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

anywayz....heres the way i see things

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If the Christians and I are right... and you believe that Jesus died for you and your sins with your heart....then ull gain salvation...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

its not based on works...or how good you are...u could be a serial killer and gain salvation....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

but bac to my point...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

if u believe and the Christians are actually wrong in the end...then you really havent lost anything

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

but if u dont believe....and the Christians were RIGHT....then youve lost everything

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So I can murder you and your family, and I'll gain salvation as long as I believe that Jesus died for my sins? Do you think God really wants that? Now I can finally start living a mafia-drugsmuggler life in a huge mansion ordering poorer people that work for me to kill others without having to worry about the christians telling me I'm bad. I'll just tell them I believe Jesus died for my sins, buying hookers, selling illegal drugs for hundreds of millions, killing people that are after me, laundering money, etc, right? I suppose it would be more fun than the ordinary american life of working for a few thousand bucks a month. Why bother when I can get tens of millions a month, and blame it all on Jesus.

[HugATree]

ill post once more...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

ill just refer back to my orignal post....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i believe...and if im wrong then ive lost nuthing

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

but if ur wrong....uve lost everything

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not really, if you're wrong there is a near infinite of other possibilities that could happen. You're using the logic if you're wrong then there is nothing, but if this powerful being(s) exist but happens not to match your criteria aren't you still technically wrong?

[JohnnySmum]

So I can murder you and your family, and I'll gain salvation as long as I believe that Jesus died for my sins?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No matter what you've done, if Jesus has taken your sins away, you're saved from judgement.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Do you think God really wants that?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

God doesn't want anyone to perish, but that all would come to Him.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now I can finally start living a mafia-drugsmuggler life in a huge mansion ordering poorer people that work for me to kill others without having to worry about the christians telling me I'm bad.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But you see, a true Christian wouldn't do those things. This is addressed in the Bible, where people claimed that Jesus was their Lord, yet continued living as they had been. You can recognise true Christians by the fact that they are different: they don't blaspheme, get drunk, have sex outside of marriage etc.

[magekillr]

But you see, a true Christian wouldn't do those things. This is addressed in the Bible, where people claimed that Jesus was their Lord, yet continued living as they had been. You can recognise true Christians by the fact that they are different: they don't blaspheme, get drunk, have sex outside of marriage etc.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

exactly...they might still do these things...but the Holy Spirit convicts the people...and they realize what they have done is wrong....and then repent and ask God to strengthen these weaknesses

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

but still...Paul the apostle was a criminal and murderer

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

and plenty of people like this have accepted Christ...and will still gain Salvation

[Guest colsmith]

 

 

that guy has "drinking" all wrong....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

drinking to get drunk is morally wrong...as well as a sin

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

but drinking isnt wrong....and the proof is the mere fact that JESUS DRANK WINE!!!!!!!!

 

 

 

How many times do i have to say theres no such things as sins, Churches are telling you what do do with your life, such as not sin. You cant do things, becuase "sins" are holding you back. They contorl part of your life

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You seem to understand that quite well, from what you just said. Sin does hold you back, it keeps you from experiencing the wonderful joy that God gives. That's why He went through so much suffering to free you from your sin. He took the penalty for your sin so that you don't have to.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You mentioned earlier that the church keeps you slave by saying not to sin. No one is forcing me to abide by the rules in the Bible, I obey them out my my thankfulness to GOd. I constantly fall short of His standard- I'm arrogant, I'm lustful, I'm hateful- but He loves me anyway, has fogiven me of my sins, and is making me more like Him each day. And He want to work the same way in all of your lives.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

According to the Bible, we were all slave to sin. However, Christians have been bought with Christ's blood, and are now "slaves to Christ," as the apostle Paul said. While the idea of belonging to Christ may be hurtful to our egos, we cannot truly become ourselves unless we deny ourselves and live for God's purpose.

 

 

 

Wow, look at you, look at the things you say, you have been succesfully brainwashed, dam your a lost hope, "but he loves me" give yourself a break and free your mind, its getting out of control its all a bunch of crap man, for your own sanity, let it go. You say your not forced to not sin, but you are forced, no matter what you say theres no such thin, see people like me, people with free minds and not enslaved by others, just LISTEN to yourslef, its horrible "That's why He went through so much suffering to free you from your sin. He took the penalty for your sin so that you don't have to." Thats the worst statemnt, theres no such thing as "him" Theres no SOLIDE proof whatsover he "exists"

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The things churches do to people these days. TSK TSK

 

 

 

Out of concern, i have one message for you man, i respect you and i have one bit of advice that i HOPE you will follow,

 

 

 

Please, free your mind