Slightly off-topic...: Corporate ones, especially poorly designed ones? Yes, they are pretty bad. :( ... Things that get to nose around the PC? Can't be implemented with RuneScape, and are pretty awful in themselves. It would effectively be a case of MicroSoft DRM all over again, but worse. :( ... Personal ones like ZoneAlarm Pro? They aren't bad at all. In fact, they're pretty good. :) ... 'Nuff said. Back to the topic. ~Mr. Devnull