Range_This11

I understand perfectly well what "entangling alliances" meant. It is quite obvious if you read into it a little bit. Now for me posting articles, I can really see where you're coming from. I get that you think that I'm just being a copypasta. I'm not. I argued for nearly 4 pages of this thread without using any links or quotes from outside sources. It was when you came in and tried to throw out all my arguments by simply dismissing them as being liberal and biased that I started to post links. Also, you assume that I go out and type in "Iraq War waste of time lol" and paste the first site. That's not what happens. I read the stuff that I post. Just like maybe you should re-read some of your posts to catch some glaring holes in your arguments. But you can rattle on and on about how the media is biased or how my links to reputable news organizations are completely fake (go figure :roll: ), but when the consensus of the nation is that Bush is a bad president and the Iraq war was a bad idea, you just have to come to terms. CNN is one of the most UNBIASED news stations, that's why I took the last poll I used from there. And are you really going to try to tell me that because I have a different opinion than you, that all my sources are false? I don't know if I should really post this, but you're extremely wrong about the UN, and here is why. You've completely forgone the original argument (which was about Iraq) and have dropped to criticizing my credibility after I post countless sources that prove you wrong. Please, I beg you: Find any news article or any Wikipedia article that proves anything I have said about the Iraq War wrong.

Well my marching band (Baldwin-Woodville High School) was a big deal. We do competitive field shows and my senior year we won state in best drumline, musical performance, and overall state champion. This year, they won again. As section leader and center snare of the the drumline, I can honestly say with years of marching experience, stay AWAY from rock shows. Rock stuff is good for pep-band, but if you want to actually impress a crowd, do a concept show. My senior year we did "The Rise and Fall of Rome" by Key Poulan (who writes brass for the Blue Devils) and this year they did "Elements". Now I realize that those shows would be expensive (Rome being nearly $5,000), but there are a lot better shows out there for your money. I would recommend the following for good shows that actually get the crowd's attention. The Mask of Zorro: http://www.msconcepts.com/shows/show-detail.asp?showid=366 This is the show that I did my Sophomore year which got us 3rd place in state. The music is actually fairly difficult for a Movie show. Percussion arrangements are pretty easy for the most part, but they can always be beefed up for the skill level of your line. This was my favorite music to play, and the best part is that you can listen to all three songs online. The Phantom of the Opera: http://www.msconcepts.com/shows/show-detail.asp?showid=30 Another solid show. This was the show we did my Junior year and it got us 2nd place in state and missed best drumline by .05 points. You can listen to 3 of the 4 songs online. Percussion is very easy in this show. Take a watch of this AMAZING performance by Santa Clara Vanguard in 1989 of nearly the same Phantom of the Opera show. It gives me chills every time I watch it. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4346242620404039862&ei=pT0GSYWsM4fq-gGs-O2DCA&q=santa+clara+phantom+of+the+opera&hl=en If you have ANY questions regarding marching band, please ask. I have a huge background in music and marching.

He's coming to St. Cloud State on November 1st. Not gonna see him, but I didn't know anyone really listened to him :?

[hide=] No. Iraq has never attacked the United States of America and Saddam Hussein also did NOT harbor or help Al-Qaeda. Link: http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/003/033jgqyi.asp You know what is fact? That most Americans think that invading Iraq was a dumb idea. Obviously you're not one of them. Link: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/06/07/AR2005060700296.html After September 11th, Americans felt like they needed to strike back on something, anything. Going to Afghanistan was justified, to me. It was the home of Osama Bin-Laden, but the Iraq war is ridiculous. There was not sufficient evidence. Here's some reasons why: You know what that means? The UN did NOT find evidence for WMDs. Only the United States and United Kingdom's intelligence agencies did. If you're having trouble connecting the dots, unlike most Americans today, here's another quote that has been hammered at you already, but you choose to keep ignoring. So in your opinion, since the United States has a powerful military, we have to take out crazed dictators every time they pop up? No, I think that there were other reasons for going into Iraq. Why aren't we occupying Darfur? Surely you know of the genocide being committed there. What about Hitler and the Jews? We remained neutral until we were attacked. No, the reason we went into Iraq is because it benefited our country. Darfur doesn't benefit us because Africa is a lost cause and after Somalia, I think our country knows better. We need to leave the policing of the world to the United Nations, not the United States. It's what it was designed for. So does George Bush, in fact, he told him to go in there. I'm not debating the facts of what happened. Every American knows them (or should). What I'm trying to say is that George Bush treated it as if nothing happened. I didn't hear an address to the nation on the fact that he got bad information and that he made a mistake, and like I have stated twice now, to me, that means he doesn't care and that is as good as lying to the American Public. We're pouring billions of dollars into the Iraq black hole every year when everyone knows that once we leave, it's just going to go back to the way it was. History shows that that area of the world will NEVER have any form of democracy or peace. [/hide] Most of my quotes and links, I got from Wikipedia. Want another source that says the same thing? http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/08/21/iraq.poll/index.html This was from 2006 and still it was 61% disapproved. Imagine what the rate is 2 years later. Our job is not to police the world. According to our founding fathers we should not engage in "entangling alliances". In other words, WE SHOULD MIND OUR OWN BUSINESS. It is not our job. Regardless of the fact that 60% of our country is not below the age of 30 and older than the age of 18 (which is what percentage disagrees with the War in Iraq and is allowed to vote in polls maintained by the government and news stations), since when does it matter what age a person has to be for their opinion to be voiced? Are you really questioning the UN's competence? They have served as a world peace-keeper for 63 years, yet somehow you doubt their competence to solve an issue. Right, so in all your infinite wisdom, you have come up with such unrefutable evidence to compel me to completely give up my arguments to the likes of "I'd bet $50 that all those 'Iraqi war hating Americans' are below the age of 30." I have yet to see you post ANY links or articles related to your argument. The most you do is rant (with many curses and spelling mistakes present) on your own uneducated, extremely biased opinions. And no, citing your dad as a reporter does NOT count as a credible news source. I can't even begin to address your arguments because they make absolutely no sense. You address none of my points except by asking me pointless questions. Are you done yet?

You know if you limit your swearing, maybe people would be able to take your argument as educated and serious, but I'll just take it for what it's worth: ranting. Greatest place to live and greatest place are two different terms and should not be mixed. I don't think that you should be 'proud to be an American'. There was just as good of a chance that you would have been born in Venezuela or Jordan. We all are genetic accidents. We did ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to be in this country. I think we need to re-title it 'Happy to be an American', because that I definitely am. Pride implies you did something. You didn't. You and everyone else in this country were LUCKY to be Americans.

I'm able to learn a select few Tool songs on drums (Jambi, Schism, Lateralus, Stinkfist, Eulogy) and my band covers Jambi and Schism. When we nail them live, it is the most rewarding thing to play. It's so easy to just get lost in the music.

No. Iraq has never attacked the United States of America and Saddam Hussein also did NOT harbor or help Al-Qaeda. Link: http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/003/033jgqyi.asp You know what is fact? That most Americans think that invading Iraq was a dumb idea. Obviously you're not one of them. Link: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/06/07/AR2005060700296.html After September 11th, Americans felt like they needed to strike back on something, anything. Going to Afghanistan was justified, to me. It was the home of Osama Bin-Laden, but the Iraq war is ridiculous. There was not sufficient evidence. Here's some reasons why: You know what that means? The UN did NOT find evidence for WMDs. Only the United States and United Kingdom's intelligence agencies did. If you're having trouble connecting the dots, unlike most Americans today, here's another quote that has been hammered at you already, but you choose to keep ignoring. So in your opinion, since the United States has a powerful military, we have to take out crazed dictators every time they pop up? No, I think that there were other reasons for going into Iraq. Why aren't we occupying Darfur? Surely you know of the genocide being committed there. What about Hitler and the Jews? We remained neutral until we were attacked. No, the reason we went into Iraq is because it benefited our country. Darfur doesn't benefit us because Africa is a lost cause and after Somalia, I think our country knows better. We need to leave the policing of the world to the United Nations, not the United States. It's what it was designed for. So does George Bush, in fact, he told him to go in there. I'm not debating the facts of what happened. Every American knows them (or should). What I'm trying to say is that George Bush treated it as if nothing happened. I didn't hear an address to the nation on the fact that he got bad information and that he made a mistake, and like I have stated twice now, to me, that means he doesn't care and that is as good as lying to the American Public. We're pouring billions of dollars into the Iraq black hole every year when everyone knows that once we leave, it's just going to go back to the way it was. History shows that that area of the world will NEVER have any form of democracy or peace.

Man if you can get that feeling off "The Pot" I can't wait until you listen to the likes of Forty Six & 2 or Lateralus. Just listen to their latest 3 albums front to back and prepare to be blown away with knowledge and insight you've never had before.

I've studied Sociology for 2 years now and have witnessed enough of it in person to know that it is just being an American sometimes.

Go to your local mall food court or Texas.

Definitely not phonetically spelled like Jaykub or some dumb [wagon] name with a "y" in it like Kylin or Tylin. It's going to be something proper and old fashioned, the best way names are.

I agree with mage. Americans are filthy, supersized, and arrogant people. I'm ashamed to live here sometimes.

In honor of your 666th post.... Raining Blood-Slayer

It might be over sized, but I absolutely love it. I've had mine for about a year.

Because I felt that this quote: Already addressed half of his statement and I didn't want to repeat the same thing again just for semantics. I know that he was given false intelligence and all the other obvious well-known facts jack put into his last statement, but I already gave my reasoning for why I believe he lied. I'll even repost the quote from page 2.

Why would he have to? Not only did Japan attack us first in Pearl Harbor, but Japanese generals refused to surrender even after the first nuke. Bush shows no remorse for duping his country or for Iraq, even though he was completely wrong for going to war with Iraq. Not a good comparison.

Just saw Blimp in my History of Rock and Roll course here at St. Cloud State. Minnesota's best Led Zep cover band.

We established that when Bush was not remorseful in the least when he invaded a country FOR NO REASON. You can come up with as many reasons as you want to defend him, but when he doesn't even apologize to his own country, let alone the country he completely destroyed, I am pretty dang sure that he would have gone in there for any reason.

I didn't miss any fail, I just fail to see the point in me reierating mysef to the naves. Bush invades a country that is a member of OPEC and gas prices go up. Since we've already established the fact that Bush did not care if he was misinformed and invaded for the wrong reasons, we can also assume that he is there for something entirely different. What would be the obvious assumption? Oil. Or in the case that has been stated already: God. Just because Iraq or Saudi Arabia doesn't supply the U.S. with 99.9% of our oil, doesn't mean we don't want to control the oil we do get from them.

Oops, you fail.

Price of gas when Bush went into office-$1.46 Price of gas now-$2.59 Gas was nearly $4.00 per gallon near me at one point. And you tell me it's not about oil...

I honestly believe that he lied, and this is my reasoning: Even after he found out that he was misinformed, he showed no remorse for invading a country on false evidence. To me, that means he had alterior motives to invading Iraq (of which I do not know 100%, but I would guess some unfinished business by Dad in the 90s and oil). He would have used any reason he had to go into Iraq as soon as it popped up, and that is as good as a lie to me.

So then, by your theory, the media is to blame for George Bush outright lying to the entire world that Saddam Huessein had weapons of mass destruction?

Town about 15 minutes from me. http://www.ufowisconsin.com/news/n1988_0616_pierce.html They even have UFO Days in July as the town's celebration.

Jihad wasn't declared on America until 1998, which was 2 years before Bush took office, so that is a major reason why there was less terrorism in the 90's and more under the bush administration. It is also nearly impossible to stop terrorism, so no need to blame it all on Bush. I definitely agree with you that it shouldn't be blamed on Bush, but Saruman was stating that there was: That is the statement I was trying to disprove.