CaJ

It depends on your playing preference and style. I set myself some goals and expect to complete them within a certain time period. Most people go for a 99 so that they can 'max out', or to obtain that skill cape. I find myself training a few skills that I have at 99 beyond the 13M XP, like Thieving and Firemaking. Why? Because I enjoy those skills. 99s are worth every penny. Unfortunately they have been devalued as a result of Skill Capes and GE, thus, encouraging more competition. With every passing day 99s become less significant and more casual. It's like seeing the money in your bank lose it's value to the point where it's only worth what it was originally set out for: Paper.

The reason they aren't getting respect (Cooking, Fletching, Woodcutting, even Firemaking) is because they are deemed TOO easy to get. I know plenty of high level skillers who don't have 99s in those skills, but that's not the point. The point is that Runescape is gradually becoming easier, therefore making Cooking and Fletching a walk in the park. I mean, Rocktails? Sacred Clay Knifes for Magic Longbows? How much easier do you WANT them? The older players deserve respect because they obtained 99s when they were actually WORTH A DAMN. These days it's only skills such as Agility, Runecrafting and Slayer that get respected as skill capes (and 99s) because they are harder and take more time to obtain. No offense but getting a 99 on Runescape Classic and Runescape 2 was much more SIGNIFICANT, much more. Reason, because most people trained a skill only to a point where it was deemed useful, and two, because Skill Capes didn't exist back then. Today I just see a 99 as just another goal, not a major accomplishment. You can argue that I obtained all of the easy 99s first, but those were the skills I WANTED 99 in. It's depressing to see pages full of people with all 99s, and not see the kind of status that 'Zezima' had for years because he was leagues ahead of everybody else. There was a wider gap at the top, and less competition. Runescape was more about friendship and being social rather than grinding away on skills. Today it's all about the stats, wealth, and efficiency of your character. I must say that I don't fit well into this new generation of gamers.

I know plenty of people in their 30s, 40s, and 50s who play Runescape. A good friend of mine is in her 40s and another is in his 30s. I think these kids need to accept that older people play games too. My own dad was in his 40s when he introduced me to games like Warcraft and Command & Conquer.

i only joined to say that fool Now who's the fool here mr 2 posts :S? Ontopic: What skill is the best to train first is a bit unknown. There happen changes all the time, so skills that where like ungetteble 5 years ago are quite easy nowadays. Getting items without GE took ages of typing, forumming and stuff, nowadays you just ask 5K gems and you have them in a couple of hours while training all kind of other skills. Training crafting with gemcutting was close near impossible before GE, nowadays it's like pretty much normal. Without GE Zarfot and Jdela would probably have remained pretty much unknown, or in every case have loads loads loads less xp. If you knew everything beforehand peoples would probably have trained hard skills like rc, wc, 100M fm, agility, fishing, hunter (before loads bots), thieving and a bit of smiting before GE (and buy a pile of rares) and as soon as GE and the money was there all the fast skills of now and slayer (not slayer before otherwise no summoning xp *and effigys). I guess something like that, and neither would they have maxed everything to 200M, they get like 5M free xp because of Dungeon anyway *and effi. It does surprise me btw that the top players don't train skills like hunter a lot whenever there comes some time there are no bots. The hunter bots lower the xp/h quite a lot don't they? So whenever they are gone the xp/h is a lot higher, so whenever there are no or barely any bots just take your chance shouldn't you? But ok who am I ;) and no I'm not a member so I'm not a 100% sure about this. Everything changed with the G.E. I consider the older players like Zezima, The Old Nite, N0valyfe, Lilyuffie88, Daverick, Choppermad, Ltangel, etc. to hold more honor because they did all of that and more. Only two of them, Zezima and N0valyfe, are recognizable with today's audience. The rest I have listed have unfortunately, fallen into obscurity and are now has-beens (in The Old Nites case, death). L6vi was the #1 player a long time ago and now look. My stats are about as equal if not better than his. Same story with M Oldfield. It's the harsh reality that comes with fame and success, so eventually there will be a burn out. The only thing to do now is look for players reaching 200M in a skill. I used to think that nobody would achieve all 99s for a long time. Today, that's nothing more than a flash-in-the-pan, and nothing special.

Bit ironic that someone with 2b+ exp is making that comment :P Anyway, it's easy to pick on people that are open. We all have good and bad sides, so of course the bad sides show aswell then. It's just a shame that people decide to judge on them while they have their own flaws aswell, oh well. Last time Aasi and I spoke was in a good fashion, he knew about my hours a day already and was cool with it, so it's quite weird that he's flaming me all of a sudden with nothing that happened in between (not directly atleast). Asked what's up, no reply as of yet. Anyway, let's not discuss this further or continue in PM if you must. This subject doesn't belong on this thread ;) (Deyan, Squish and Peregrin, drop me a pm if something is still up). There, problem solved! On with the thread@@@! XD Bit ironic that you, of course, also has 2B+ XP and yet I consider you, Zarfot and Balmung Pro to be in good competition. The thing coming out of this is our personalities. Stats and time played mean nothing. I remember running into several of the old players (that no longer play) that all had a different approach. It's amazing that you managed to pull in more experience than anyone ever did in a month and yet there is a layer of hot air between you and the next player.

What? I didn't understand anything you said. Korasi's sword could be a decent spec weapon at best, but nothing more. Whip has been useless since dungeoneering, godswords either from their release(as DPS weapons) or since dclaws/EE. The Zamorakian Spear and the Saradomin Sword aren't getting much reputation either. So it makes sense now to just get 80 Dungeoneering and get a Chaotic Rapier/Longsword, despite continuing costs to recharge them.

And, exactly as multiple posts have stated, that doesn't matter. By saying this, you imply that the Times group and Racheya's friends in general are a bunch of people who do their best to remain exclusive, meanwhile forming a defensive circle to discredit those who attempt to criticize anyone of their number. What you also show is that you take bias to mean something else entirely. Each of these supporters of Racheya have proven their arguments with logical thoughs - for example, bashing the author is bad because ___. Note the "because" in there - each person explains their viewpoint; they give reasons for their defense. Just as those who criticize are (mostly) doing. Thus, by doing this, they remove the element of bias. Bias simply means that someone is leaning towards one opinion or other because of some prejudice; however, giving valid reasons for their opiniongives them objectivity - they are not merely defending Racheya because she's their colleague or friend or both, but rather because they have opinions that are backed by logic. Anyway.. this has gone way too far. It's degenerated into insults and so on directed at everyone's writing credentials and skills. (Not that they're not important to show when criticizing someone else's writing skills.) Very true, and unfortunately I've seen this happen to any forum board that ran a story or an article in point. Eventually this will come to a standstill.

We got two topics going about this issue. Same responses... Lovely...

Thus, is why I'm not getting involved in this discussion.

Does this mean that Godswords and Whip are beginning to show their age? If this is what Korassi's Sword does, then I guess this marks a new chapter in Runescape weaponry.

I think it's pretty accurate that Zarfot has the best Average Experience Per Hour out of any player. I posted in a thread on the Official Forums where the discussion was Average XP Per Hour, which is the average experience you get each hour since you created your character. I did pretty good, not near the top but enough to warrant as somewhat efficient. Zarfot topped the list at 135,000 XP per hour. This was before Bonus Weekend was even announced, so he may be over 150,000 XP per hour now. That's the best I've seen from any player. Feel a little sad that Gertjaars doesn't play anymore. I still remember Zezima being tops in just about everything, and I recall he was well ahead of everybody else. Today, he is surpassed by players like the poster above.

I would assume so.

That's a pretty negative way to look at it, but to be honest, I agree. There really isn't anything that makes this quest Grandmaster level. Nomad's Requiem had a dam hard boss, WGS had an epic length compared to every other quest. TVSB has...nothing. The puzzles weren't as hard as what has come before and neither was the boss. I'm not dissapointed with the quest itself or the story, I just don't understand why Jagex slapped the GM label onto it as it clearly isn't of that level. So it makes sense to label it as Master quest? Nomad is the first boss I ever fought that required strategy rather than just brute force. Feels normal for people to die 10+ times before finally beating him. As for While Guthix Sleeps, it was the length that made it stand out. The bosses in that quest were easy.

When the term 'efficiency' gets thrown around that means something different for somebody else, there's bound to be a debate about it. I'm not going to waste my breath for 30 minutes making up a long winded argument on why I think this was bad to begin with. I stand neutral on this pedestal. I don't fully agree with the article, and neither do I fully agree with the opposing side putting their daily grind to making a good counter-argument. In the end nobody wins, it's only a matter of who will let go first. When you put yourself as the Critic and the Defender, you'll putting yourself at risk of sabotage. The only thing to do now is commit ourselves to achieve more, in this case, making the issue of 'efficiency' fair well with both sides. I have yet to see this happen.

There was just 74-75 people on the hiscores just a few days ago when I last checked. It would be great to know some of their secrets. I know that Zarfot was around 1.1 Bil XP during April-May 2009. He gained over 1 Billion XP in just over a year. Don't get me started on Drumgun.

I'm not fully supportive of the 'Make-X' improvements Jagex will implement this month. If that means easier 99s, I am against it. While Guthix Sleeps was not hard, just lengthy with a lot of item requirements. Nomad's Requiem was much shorter, but involved a boss that needed a little strategy to beat. I wonder what will happen on the third strike. I personally feel they should consider adding a second Special Quest into the game. Recipe for Disaster was pretty fun, and I hope Jagex does another one like it. Other than that, I'm looking forward to this month.

That's not really the case. Obviously we can't provide constructive viewpoints without stepping on peoples toes. When the going gets rough we should come to the decision on either wasting our breath or throwing in the towel.

I think we've gone far enough in the 'efficiency' debate. Racheya's article is heavily flawed, but I'm not the one making pointless arguments and hotheaded criticism. If I were her I would find that pretty discouraging. I've seen too many discussions like this devolve into 'which side presents a better point'. Pointing fingers and blaming don't get you anywhere.

Obviously the problem is the people. Tried a couple times to be on a team that would finish the floors quickly and learn effective strategies. Really doesn't work out that way unless you happen to find a team that you know will get the job done. Too many times had I had people stuck on a puzzle, refusing to use the key, dying numerous times on an easy boss, and wasting time trying to find what to do next. Also, people need to lay off those who are lower level. Being 130+ does not mean you are good at Dungeoneering, and neither does that mean that lower levels are actually worse. I only started Dungeoneering a couple months ago and I'm already level 67. I've done most of the floors by myself and I feel comfortable knowing I don't have to rely on others to give me the key or to kill a boss. It's terrible XP, yes, but it's an alternative. I usually spend all of my Penguin Points on Dungeoneering, and I made it a goal to reach level 70 by soloing all the floors. Afterwards I'll have to find a team.

Arctic Bear pouches don't seem to be selling on the GE. Guess I'll have to get the materials myself... If you don't care about making money then catch butterflies leading up to Black Warlocks. They will become quicker than Red Chinchompas but you have to do a bit of running around.

My take on this is decrease the amount of XP given. We had a lot of people rant and rave about Summoning the 1st Weekend, and Herblore the 2nd Weekend. You do realize, that more people had gotten 99 Summoning on the 1st Weekend than there ever was beforehand, so it was a big slap in the face for anyone who spent all their money on leveling the skill a few days before. During the 2nd Weekend, it was calculated that within the first 2-3 hours it was possible to gain 2-3 Million Experience per hour making Overloads in Herblore. Extremes are already overpowered, so this showed me again how the wealthy got the benefit and the others, left out. To be honest I think that all buyable skills should be eliminated. I said this before and I'll say it again. Allowing them to be given the 2.7X modifier messed up the GE. The first day the Bonus Weekend was announced, I couldn't buy anything that was related to Herblore or Construction. Non-buyable skills like Fishing, Agility and Thieving are fine because they don't involve mass supplies in order to gain experience in. Lower the XP rate to around 2.0-1.5, and bring it down to 1.0 in 9-10 hours. That little 1.1X boost at the end was put there to convince players to keep playing, which does not constitute fair play. The non-buyable skills will at best, only save you 10-30 hours as opposed to training them normally. With Herblore, and Summoning, you simply save hundreds of hours, and that is far too much to be considered tolerable. Jagex did this for the profit, how can we not see that? It proves that we are living in a recession, and player interests are changing. But how do we know if more players play today? How are we to assume that years ago, the 200,000+ players that were on at the same time were mostly bot accounts (with the default look)? Well, hey, I'm contradicting myself here, however I can't fully trust Jagex, and I can't fully trust the players either. Then again, posts like these are often swept by the rug. I am just one person, and a sole person is nothing. Therefore we must commit ourselves to being team players, that this Bonus Weekend can be put as a event that fares well with the general public. Jagex have said that 2010 would be one of their biggest years yet, unfortunately they don't keep that promise if we get a Bonus Weekend, a skill name change, a pair of boots that alch for 40K+, and a reputation that is yet to be answered. I still don't support the Weekend, and as long as I see big, unfair advantages come out of it, I won't commit to being excited about it. The changes I suggest, the removal of buyables, and a decrease in the XP Modifier, will perhaps balance out or maybe even counter-act the damage done to the economy, furthermore, the devaluation of skilling. It can be hard to maintain fairness, and life is never fair. What my ideas come through to some prove to be the opposite for many. I find it obvious that people who support the weekend and the people at Jagex implementing another possible weekend, are those who don't see the long term effects it will put on the game. The very thing I would suggest not doing is to contribute to a massive inflation and overproduction of goods. You can say the Bonus Weekend helped restore the prices that the botters manipulated to skyrocket or plummet down on the price scale. However, just the other day I was surprised to find that Soul Runes went from 175 GP to 283 GP on the 5th of September, which is a 63% increase. Fortunately the price has gone down to 200 GP. Really though, how can you say that certain items will be made affordable and reasonable, when they made record highs and lows, especially with the Climbing Boots fiasco? How does this benefit and flourish the economy for the player community? Certainly it isn't good to just turn the XP modifier on and off. Do you realize how this allows players to greatly exploit such skills as Summoning, Herblore, Farming, and Construction? You would see RECORD GAINS all across the board. I usually keep track of Runetrack.net and Runetracker, to analyze the daily records and compare them to the all-time highs. Okay, so a few people like Drumgun didn't take the advantage. I actually thought that the 1.1X cap on Summoning was a somewhat good decision, Jagex just didn't go far enough. The more weekends they plan on visualizing and putting into action, the worse my reputation goes with them. I'll say it again. If I just spent everything on had to level up Herblore or Construction to 99, just before the announcement of a Bonus Weekend, I would be red angry wouldn't I? It's been a big disappointment, and yet when you level up your stats to a level you otherwise wouldn't be able to reach without the XP Modifier, you don't feel the effect. The journey of getting somewhere is the best experience, and when you end it, it's all over. There is a heave of sigh at the end, knowing you made it happen. You may as well consider the weekend to be cheating, especially after I see one user here who suggests turning on and off the XP modifier in order to get the most XP he can get. That's being far too generous and convincing that you will get that level you dreamed about. I don't see how that doesn't encourage grinding by having an on/off switch. For instance, I can make Mahogany Tables for Construction and benefit greatly in this way. I turn the modifier on right when I make the tables. I turn it off and ask the demon butler to bring me planks from the bank. As soon as he delivers them to me, I turn the modifier back on and make more tables. Making Extremes for Herblore? Same story. A few players on the Runescape Official Forums made real concise calculations on how this saves them hundreds of hours, which can add up to several days. Honestly guys, how is that fair play? I certainly wish the Bonus Weekend didn't have to boil down on how wealthy you are and where you stand in skills. I conclude that many of the players who got 99 Summoning the first weekend and 99 Herblore the next weekend, truly don't deserve earning them. It was a big shortcut all the way through and it broke open the minds of what Jagex was really going after. Makes sense to gain some profit for the business and see some short-term membership for that extra push. Had it been more reasonable and more disciplined, I wouldn't be wasting this time on these boards making a bonfire out of it. Please explain why the 2-weeks notice is beneficial. Please explain why this offers more opportunities to the Grand Exchange, and to the economy in particular. Nobody ever saw this coming before the end of February, and in my experience, nobody suggested this on the boards. It just came along as a complete surprise and threw many of us off-track. Merchant clans were having a field day, because all they do is find a good item to flip that the leader recommends trying at the GE. What really gets me is why this had to happen nine years in the making. There are many people who still see a vivid, colorful picture of Runescape's future. However, on the other end of the spectrum, doing a Bonus Weekend 2-3 times each year (if Jagex actually plans on doing this) may prove to be fatal for the long term. If Jagex decides to hold various contests on their updates page and reward the winners a life time membership of Runescape, they may as well keep that promise. Same comes to FunOrb if they ever decide to host contests over there as well. The thing many players don't want to see is Runescape fading away, that a dark cloud will come over and rain on Jagex for their decisions made at the meeting hall. We seen this happen with too many businesses already. Let's hope and persuade Jagex to not make the same mistake. This is why, for many, that the Bonus Weekend proves to be one of the most controversial updates yet. I would rather have something I can be happy about for years to come, then to get an artificial boost that isn't much different from botting your way to a high level.

There is a choice if you want to go to Rants and complain, or whether you decide if it's not worth the time. If it's not worth the time, don't bother posting. I see too many people on these boards say they are 'sick' of 'said topic' yet they continue to post the same bullcrap when it all can be arranged. Just ignore it. This issue has been going on for over a year. I tend to think that when the Grand Exchange was added and the trade limit was removed, this gave people a new opportunity to manipulate and exploit. Mining Rune Essence is indeed outdated, and is no longer a popular method for any 'legitimate' player. Botters are taking advantage because it doesn't come with a price tag, and they don't have to spend several hours killing monsters that drop essence. There are a lot of monsters that drop mass quantities of essence, so mining essence isn't that good anymore. I can never fully agree with most of you here, all that happens is you go to whine and complain. I've done it myself but I'm not trying to contradict myself either. I would hope that most people here agree that the botting problem needs to be taken into serious consideration. The difference between years ago and now is that it seems that a lot of people actually think that this botting does a little good for the game as a whole. They like cheap resources so that they can get their next 99 and later merchant the resources off on the GE. There used to be a no tolerance policy on botting, if someone saw you do it or if Jagex found you were using a macro program, you will get banned. Now I see all these high levels and the like who don't seem to care, that it's okay to take that easy way out because you're not sitting in your chair at home doing all the clicking and pressing buttons. Times have changed and this newer breed of bots are harder to detect and report because we don't know if the person is using a program or has Public Chat off. I'm certain however that when this entire problem passes through and becomes history, we will talk about it in a meaningful, descriptive manner, and by that time, there will be a whole new generation of players that weren't there to see it.

I'll see if this method is up-to-date, seeing as I saw Soul Runes skyrocket a few weeks ago (therefore it was cheap to level to 99 Mage with Stun). I'll probably need 200k Astral Runes which I can't afford yet. I don't know, I'll have to calculate.

You are fooling yourself. There are methods to make money while skilling (Grenwalls/Pawyas give you 500-1M GP per hour, making Natures with a Graak at 91+ RC nets you 1M+ GP per hour). With your sore attitude and pointing fingers, you are actually the one whining here. Jagex has taken notice of the bots and the programs they use, so you can't tell us we don't have any proof. Oh and on the "Mining Guild" and "Varrock Mine", lots of F2pers still use those places, so we're not just talking about members. This topic isn't a waste of time. You are the one wasting your own time.

* EDIT, WILL SOON ADD PICTURES *