De_Lille_D

That would be a lot of useless work, I think. If you want to help, time yourself making an run and tell me which patches you (don't) use. I'll add it to the guide. This goes for everyone with a clock. The only rule: you have to do it all at once. If you lose any time with for example recharging combat bracelet, your time won't count.

Not quite finished yet, i'll continue later. I think it's a little over an hour, but you have to keep in mind that this can differ from person to person, depending on what plants you chose, what teles/items you have, ... Therefore, I think it's best to time it for yourself, so you know exactly what aplies to you. Rest assured that this is the best xp/time invested.

If you haven't done the new Ardougne Diary, I suggest you get to it. There's a couple of things that might come in handy: - A tele to Ardougne Farming patch (meaning your Combat Bracelets will last twice as long) - Free Daily 100/150 Pure Ess from the wizard in northeast Ardougne - Tele to monastery south of Ardougne (great if I can squeeze the part on Karamja and south ardougne in 1 invo) I'm going to update the guide now and hopefully fix up the layout a bit.

Or, they could announce updates a week beforehand. This way, no agreements are needed and you have time to prepare for the update. I would have loved to know a week in advance that you needed a wild vine, a mature cat and some penguin points to finish the Ardougne diary...

Medium cape gives one Ardy Farming patch tele each day, which should be enough. And even if you don't have it, you can still use Ranging guild or Fishing guild tele.

How to win a game: Join any team, but try to look in front of which portal people are waiting. This is usually where the most highlevels are. When the game start, just try to help out as much as you can and if you decide to go capture their flag, do not let them take their own flag! If you noticed that the other team has a lot of highlevels/a CW clan and they'll win the game, get yourself killed and exit game, then switch teams and keep clicking on the 4 line from the top of your chat screen, even if you have to click for 5 minutes on end. As soon as there's an open spot, you'll join the winning team. Now, you can either help out or just fight for xp, depending on how big your lead is. Alternative: join a CW clan.

Watchtower teleport change is hard task reward Lol, then there's no real reason to start skilling like crazy! It'll just add a little reward when you reach those levels, but nothing that would make not getting those skills less efficient.

Elite rewards: 200k exp: not bad, but anyone with those levels won't care as much about it as anyone who could just finish Hard Diary. Tele to Farming patch: we already have combat bracelet that tele us to Ranging guild or Skill Necklace to Fishing Guild; it's only useful for Farming and even then, it won't save you much time. What's this about the Watchtower tele? Can anyone confirm this is an elite reward only?

I disagree. When simplifying that much code, it's next to imposssible to exactly reproduce the same effects. They could have done more beta testing, but if you want all your updates to be perfect, you'll spend more time testing than anythign else combined. The problem here was the lack of testing. If you add anything from a new strong weapon to new tools, you have to check if they aren't overpowered... They could have easily seen that this was the case here, yet they released it anyway, meaning the testing (if any) was not enough. Wow long read. Basicaly you are saying that pkers aren't complaining because the pots are very strong; they are complaining because they are untradeable and costly. I agree, to an extend. Most pkers would indeed not complain when they receive a better weapon, but some will. There are pkers out there who think that rushers already have too much power as it is and would like a solution to being pjed/rushed. The stronger the weapons, armour and pots become, the more people will agree on this.

The engine bugs were based on code being changed and could not have been avoided. This (the extreme pots) was a conceptual mistake. Anyone knew this was going to affect Pvp, all they had to do is test the limits, which they clearly didn't.

Ok, but super pots are allowed? I would have lowered all pot bonuses and stats by 80% in the games, unless you bring castle wars brace. if you bring brace, you get 100% of your pot bonuses/stats. And even so, why aren't they allowed in Soul Wars?

... Shorter Answer: Jagex should not read the rants of the first week an update has come out. Once time has passed and good, accurate assements can be made, the Jagex should use player feedback, but not as a reason for changing something. I think the main problem is that Jagex doesn't test their updates enough. Instead of anticipating the possible abuses and testing to see if anything is outrageously strong in a certain situation, they release it and wait for responses from the players. They are basically treating us like unpayed beta-testers. Nerfing is something to be done for things you couldn't have forseen. However, here, anyone could have predicted that rushers would become even stronger. So, either they didn't think of it (and they should get smarter staff) or they didn't care and waited to see the players reaction. Either way, this never should have happened. I don't know how or if you pk, but when I do, I always bring pots... I agree that there was no reason to ban it from Castle Wars. Now, if no one has any arguments to support what Jagex did, theres no point in continuing this debate. If you still want to express your discontent, go to the Rants forum.

Does anyone here agree with Jagex releasing something and then removing it again because of "Player Feedback"? If so, what are your arguments?

Wow that's a lot of replies. Is that a personal opinion or do you have any objective reasons to think so? So, you are saying its because the whiny pkers have low Herblore? Would Jagex have acted diferently if a lot of pkers had high Herblore? I think you can keep going higher until you start one-hitting people ... This would have made wilderness so much more dangerous. One day pkers are complaining about wild being too safe and EPers not really risking anything. The next day, Jagex does what they ask for and they start complaining again! As mentoined before, should you add combat levels for how rich you are too then? AGS gives you a clear advantage, yet does not change your combat. I think there would be few people who would get high herblore just for those pts (don't forget they won't boost your stats as much if they are low). You can still look them up on the highscores, just like people with 99 str. High herblore does give you a little advantage, but not big enough to add it to the combat level. That thread can't be controlled. Too many people post to get a decent debate. Are you for nerfing the AGS and D Claws too? They are equally expensive and provide a obvious advantage... 1) So you're saying it would be ok, if the pots were less powerfull? 2) That's another debate :wink:. Personal oppinion? Personal oppinion? How do you decide which minigames should allow extreme pots and why? Is it because you respawn when you die?

1) I know, that's why I started this thread. 2) I recognize that your solution would mean more loses for RWTers, but they do not care! They'll just ask double or triple the money the are asking now. The point of this thread is to come up with a way to completely stop RWTing.

This basically explains the issue: http://www.tip.it/runescape/?times=346 So: should you be able to use these extremely effective pots in Pvp and minigames or not? And most importantly, why? Are they really overpowered for PvP, or did the whiny pkers get what they wanted again?

The first article was very true and I agree with everything except the 50% of shards thingy. My simple solution: let Jagex control prices. This would free up hardware (that are now monitoring and storing all sales on GE) and would allow to keep things fair. It's also impossible to price manipulate...

1) That depends how you look at it. Sure, you can't make money in pvp to use in normal worlds. But in pvp, the real "money" are your Pk Points, as they determine how much starting cash you get after a reset. 2) I agree. Thanks. -------------------- I've been thinking: should you be able to train skills like prayer or herblore in these worlds? People could use the money they make from pking to "buy" xp, since the money's going disappear anyway after a while, but the xp you gained will not. Some possible solutions (these are multiple ideas, not 1 idea explained in several steps): - Make a new game: Runescape PVP. This would mean no interaction between the games at all; not even accounts. - Any xp gotten in normal worlds adds to your level in Pvp, but not the other way around. If you woodcut in Pvp, you get exp, but if you level there, you wouldn't level in normal worlds. - Only some skills are trainable: woodcutting, melee,... Others aren't: herblore, firemaking, ... (any buyable skills) - Some items can't be sold or traded: bones, herbs, secondary items, logs, ... You can still train all skills, but you'll have to get your own resources in Pvp worlds (for example, hunt green dragons to bury the bones). Any thoughts?

I like your enthusiasms, but I'm afraid it's not RWTing-proof. Adding probability will almost never solve a problem like this. RWTers would just take the cash and lose it anyway ... They don't care that they'll lose maybe 20 mill. It'll be the customers who will have to pay for that. And if the buyer bring a lot of money of his own, he'll have an even better chance at the loot. If you consider an update where the killer only gets half the loot the lower lost, there can still be RWTing (just bring 2 AGS instead of 1 and make the customer pay double). Sure, your idea allows for 1 gp, but it also allows for (total -1 gp), so they basically do the same. Neither of them stops RWTing.

1) These worlds aren't mean to attract skillers. In such worlds, cut off from normal economy, there will be constant loss of money (food/pots eaten, runes/arrows used, loot left on the ground...). Therefore, some pkers will run out of gear/money and will have to skill to get new gear. Jagex can adjust prices for resources, so that skilling is more profitable than it is in normal worlds (thus making it easier to earn back money), and as a result, pkers will be more inclined to hunt these skilling pkers. If you don't like pking, there's no real reason to go to these worlds. 2) I doubt that the best pkers will only get their Pk Points from friend deaths, as the amount you gain depends on how much Points the other person had/lost. If these friends had 0 Pk Points (from dieing too much), they wouldn't give any Pk Points to the person they died to. Sure, it's possible to get a few good pkers together and channel all their Pk Points in 1 account, but If you add that dieing to the same account several times a week will result in no Pk Points or loot being transfered, that problem is also solved. 3) Still, even if there is only 1 world, RWTers will just bring extremely good gear (giving them an advantage in gear and stats) and ask their buyers to come at low hours (middle of US night). Then suppose you have 50 RWTers for maybe 10 buyers, after a while, you'll have transfered all the money (gear) you wanted... RWTers of different sites might even merge to reduce loses (if a RWTer meets a RWTer from a different site) and I don't think getting them more organized is a good idea. You can't count on probability to solve your problem. You have to make it impossible, not unlikely, to RWT! Also, I said there would be several worlds because you just can't fit all those pkers in 1 world. Jagex wouldn't release a minigame that's only accessible to only 2000 people at a time. Oh and if you doubt there'll be enough RWTers in a world to make this efficient, think of it this way: when RWTing was allowed, it became a major problem, meaning they were doing good business. Now, when you tell a child he can't watch TV during the week, he'll spend his entire weekend watching it. Why? Because you don't know what you have until it's gone. Same could be said for the Runescape community: if you make RWTing possible, RWTers will be making even more money than before!

BUMP

Oh Lol, cool, even though your profile says you're 27 ... We all love to exaggerate, he? :wink: The way I see it: the past can't be changed, you can only learn from it. You shouldn't judge judge Jagex by the past, you should judge them by how they've used it to improve their game. Not really ... With a release rate, you can control exactly how many items get into the game (assuming more people will be buying than you are putting items in). With a drop rate, you put an item in the game every x kills. So, unless you know about how many kills there will be, you can't control it. Also, I'm not in favor of only releasing some items, because I don't see why you can't sell one to everyone.

I don't see why people would have to wait to get one... They finish the quest, click on their varrock tab and can buy 1 right away from the GE instantly, even if no one bothers to try and get the drop. It's funny how many people (mostly adolesents) really think they know better than Jagex, a successful company who have been making one of the biggest MMOs around for almost 9 years and employes over 350 adults. When you think about it, I'd rather have Jagex making the decisions than that bunch of teenagers...

In a player-to-GE economy, even if no one ever had a D pickaxe drop, people would still to be able to get one from the GE, and frankly, I don't see what's wrong with that. If they want people to go after it themselves, they can just raise the price until monster hunting dworges because a good money making method. I have faith that Jagex will balance out the item's stats, the drop rate and the price at release; they're a big company after all, I don't think it would really be that hard.

I'd like to hear the arguments of anyone who is against such an economy (where Jagex controls the prices and you don't trade goods between players, but they get created/destroyed instead).