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And yet you are still here...makes you wonder...

 

 

 

Doesn't make me wonder at all... It might make you wonder... but then I guess a lot of things do.

 

 

 

Are you trying to tell me that by thinking critically I forgo my right to browse a free and publicly available website?

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Dwarfie you do raise good points there. You ask question's which are straight to the point without all the other crap involved. We do have to ask these questions and see why the admins would appose something like user's subscriptions.

 

 

 

Its a great website and we need to look at things logically and straight to the point if people want this website to stay afloat and successful, right? Considering all the pressure people like Silverion go through to keep it running.

 

 

 

Obviously most of these things would be dealt with purely only by the admins but asking these questions shouldn't be frowned on, he's just raising some interesting points which everyone should consider.

 

 

 

I don't see any disrespect with him asking truthful relevant questions, which others wouldn't consider asking.

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I don't see any disrespect with him asking truthful relevant questions, which others wouldn't consider asking.

 

 

 

Thanks for your support. I certainly didn't intend any disrespect. I might be blunt, but I'm certainly not discounting the fine effort that the admin team put into the site.

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DISCLAIMER: Any views I express are my own, and not representative of Tip.It staff in any way!

 

 

 

Terribly sorry for not toeing the line appropriately... perhaps you could point out exactly how my question (not statement) was unreasonable or disrespectful?

 

While I agree that your question isn't disrespectful, I'm still with pokemama on this one. Who are you, I, or anyone on these forums to tell Silverion how to run this site? If you can do a better job, then please go ahead and make a fansite of your own, and maybe you'd understand how hard it is to keep a website with 160,000+ members operating on nothing but advertisement revenue. Then I, or possibly even Silverion, may have more time to debate that question. I can't understand where you get the impression you have a right to ask that question - Tip.It isn't run by a Republic.

 

 

 

Right... so running a Runescape fansite is not a break-even proposition financially. Which begs the question I asked above. What is the motivation for running one - of the many that are out there - when it is only going to cause stress and cost money? The noble and philanthropic aim of providing information is well and truly covered by the dozen or so other fansites... which leaves only one other that I can see.

 

I could get into a fine philosophical debate on this, but I shan't. Why does a surgeon put himself through 14 years of training, if there's other surgeons out there, and it's not financially viable during university, and it causes stress? Why am I intending to do the same thing to train as a General Practioner? I'll tell you why... because the end result of being able to look back and say both "I've achieved something truly great", and "I've helped someone today" is the warmest feeling in the world. If you can't understand that, then don't persue a career in public services.

 

 

 

There are also several large ones... There isn't any content here that can't be found elsewhere.

 

Then why don't you go and use them? Seriously, if you're so unappreciative of the work of all the Tip.it staff, especially the first Admins, then why don't you go to those others? As a Tip.Iter, I obviously don't want you to go, but I'm puzzled as to why you're kicking up a stink here, instead of "walking with your feet".

 

 

 

I'm not saying they don't do a great job, or that tip.it isn't a worthwhile site to visit. I'm merely questioning whether it is appropriate to suggest that the userbase fund it.

 

And I'm questioning the counter - is it appropriate that both the userbase pays nothing (which it did anyway, just with a few ads), and that the site's owners pay everything? Is that really fair? Considering the userbase doesn't actually have to pay anything, and only has to put up with with a few ads. Well, isn't that the same as Free-To-Air television (apart from the BBC)?

 

 

 

I'm intrigued. If the userbase shouldn't pay for usng a site which provides them with a service, who should pay for the site's maintenance and development?

 

 

 

As pokemama said, I'm just truly thankful Silverion made this site in the first place, and then showed the perseverence and determination to make it into arguably the best RS fansite out there. Working fr them on the Crew isn't something which is just 'nice' for me to do - it's actually an honour for all the help Tip.It has provided me and my RS friends over the 18 months we've played the game.

 

 

 

We do have to ask these questions and see why the admins would appose something like user's subscriptions.

 

You have no right to ask these questions. Neither do I, or anyone on these forums apart from the Admins themselves. I'm sorry to amek this sound like an autocracy, but you really don't have much space to question the decisions of Admins whom have worked on this site for six years...

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Would it help if users clicked on the ads like 20 times?
Click fraud can actually end up getting the publisher docked ad revenue or even thier account closed perminantly like someone did one one of my sites a year or two ago. :(

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Mercifull <3 Suzi

"We don't want players to be able to buy their way to success in RuneScape. If we let players start doing this, it devalues RuneScape for others. We feel your status in real-life shouldn't affect your ability to be successful in RuneScape" Jagex 01/04/01 - 02/03/12

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Who are you, I, or anyone on these forums to tell Silverion how to run this site?

 

I wasn't aware that I was telling Silverion, or anyone else, how to do anything at all. Perhaps you missed that part of school where they teach you the difference between asking a question and making a statement?

 

 

 

maybe you'd understand how hard it is to keep a website with 160,000+ members operating on nothing but advertisement revenue.

 

I'm not sure why you seem to be under the impression that I haven't been an Internet development consultant for more than a decade asking exactly the same questions of CEOs and heads of government departments - people who have a great deal more riding on their web presence than the operators of a computer game fan site. You're more than welcome to question my arguments, but questioning my level of expertise in the area is not going to make you look credible.

 

 

 

I can't understand where you get the impression you have a right to ask that question - Tip.It isn't run by a Republic.

 

I have the right to ask any questions I damn well like. Silverion has the right to choose to either answer them, dismiss them, or tell me to pack my bags. To this point he's done none of the above.

 

 

 

I'll tell you why... because the end result of being able to look back and say both "I've achieved something truly great", and "I've helped someone today" is the warmest feeling in the world. If you can't understand that, then don't persue a career in public services.

 

Right... for your own personal gratification. You can couch it in whatever platitudes you like, but in the end you're in it for your own reward. That reward may not be financial, but it's your reward.

 

 

 

Then why don't you go and use them? Seriously, if you're so unappreciative of the work of all the Tip.it staff, especially the first Admins, then why don't you go to those others? As a Tip.Iter, I obviously don't want you to go, but I'm puzzled as to why you're kicking up a stink here, instead of "walking with your feet".

 

I'm not kicking up a stink... if anything it's you and pokemama who've carried on with the histrionics. I merely asked a question - albeit a fairly pointy one. And I think I've gone to great pains to acknowledge the work that has been done here.

 

 

 

As to why I'm "still here"... This was the first fan site I found when I went looking nearly 2 years ago. I'm familiar with the layout and functionality of the site. I don't use tip.it exclusively, but it is the one that I have the most amount of experience with. Believe it or not it is possible to question something without disowning it.

 

 

 

 

 

And I'm questioning the counter - is it appropriate that both the userbase pays nothing (which it did anyway, just with a few ads), and that the site's owners pay everything? Is that really fair? Considering the userbase doesn't actually have to pay anything, and only has to put up with with a few ads. Well, isn't that the same as Free-To-Air television (apart from the BBC)?

 

 

 

I'm intrigued. If the userbase shouldn't pay for usng a site which provides them with a service, who should pay for the site's maintenance and development?

 

 

 

Is it fair? Of course it's fair. Since the dawn of the web, site operators have been footing the bill for running their sites. Quid pro quo, you get to have your own site to do with what you please, ergo you pay for the hosting and bandwidth costs. There are strategies for recouping those costs... ie selling something, be it advertising space, content, or your company's services or products. But the responsibility for paying the bills lies squarely on the shoulders of the one running the site. The same principle applies to publishing your own magazine. Either you foot the bill, you charge people for the content, or you sell advertising space.

 

 

 

If you want the profits from running an e-business site, you take the gamble that no-one wants to buy your products. If you want the warm fuzzies from running a community site, you either take the hit to your hip pocket or you hope that people will chip in out of the goodness of their hearts.

 

 

 

 

 

You have no right to ask these questions. Neither do I, or anyone on these forums apart from the Admins themselves. I'm sorry to amek this sound like an autocracy, but you really don't have much space to question the decisions of Admins whom have worked on this site for six years...

 

There's no need to apologise for making it sound like an autocracy. Web sites are autocratic by their very nature. Flipping around what I said previously... Quid pro quo, you pay the bills you get to do whatever the hell you want. Silverion can change it into a My Little Pony fansite if he wants to. But until such time as he decides to cancel our accounts, we can ask whatever damn questions we want.

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Would it help if users clicked on the ads like 20 times?
Click fraud can actually end up getting the publisher docked ad revenue or even thier account closed perminantly like someone did one one of my sites a year or two ago. :(

 

 

 

 

 

Well I am going to click on one ad every time I go to tip.it

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Having just returned from a few days working away from home (and my PC :cry: ), I am happy to see that a number of factors (people power being among them I hope) have resulted in the ditching of the 'pop-up' ad system. However, I would still like to see Tip.It exploring the idea of a paid-for service (initially on a limited basis, as someone suggested), if revenue for the site is becoming a problem.

 

Hands up who would rather pay for Tip.It than have no Tip.It at all?

Why is 'common sense' so named, when there is so little of it about?

Welcome to puberty, we've been expecting you.

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I think this topic has gotten a little off-topic and a cold flame war is already happening...

 

 

 

I think we know now that dwarfie does know what he talks about, and there's no point in arguing on what he says in the ways that are happening now.

 

Besides, those who have argued with dwarfie thus far, have been pwntthus far.

 

 

 

I guess the question remains... if your site cannot pay for itself, why run it? There are plenty of runescape fan sites out there... why not let them cope with the hosting and bandwidth costs and you can keep your hard earned cash in your pocket and not have the stress either. Unless of course you are simply running the site for the prestige of running a website, in which case, why shouldn't you pay for it?

 

 

 

Anyways, Dwarfie is right about the content can be found anywhere else on the internet, however, it can't be found as largely in one website, as it does on tip.it. I firmly believe tip it has the most knowledge of RuneScape in one place, then does rsc, runehq, salsrealm, or any other rs fansite, even the RSKnowledge base. I even dare say Tip.It explains, and guides the user much more easier then does any of the previous mentioned sites. That's why Tip.It should be run, and ads and all should be discussed about, Dwarfie.

 

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I agree though, Dwarfie did sound a little disrespectful, but he does make up for it, and I believe him when he says he's blunt. but, this is a public board, and I do back up Dwarfie in his questions, along with Eel.

 

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Actually focus on what Dwarfie says, rather then how he appeared to be disrespectful, even though all tifers are protective, very protective, of the admins, and other tifers.

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