RayOxide Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Although there are probably some politics threads here, I dont think any really sit in on this, but, this is something I have been thinking of lately, and I have no one to discuss it with in real life, so I came here :P . So, does anyone really think religious beliefs (or personal beliefs) should be pushed upon a country/continent/etc if the president/etc is catholic/etc? Personally, I just dont think its right. I honestly think that ever since most of these countries have more people from different areas of the globe (thus having different religions obviously) shouldnt conform to a, say, catholic-influenced life. Also, since less people believe in religions now-a-days, I think it shouldnt even be debated. Example being, abortion. It's only 'wrong' because of religions. (If im wrong, sorry, just what i expect) I dont need a siggy no moar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenticular_J Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 No, it shouldn't. And I find abortion wrong because I see it as taking a life. catch it now so you can like it before it went so mainstream Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayOxide Posted January 28, 2009 Author Share Posted January 28, 2009 Thats fair. I also feel its taking a life, but the embryos can help a living person, I guess. Well not anymore :? Anyway thats offtopic kinda. If it wasnt for it being "against" religions, I dont think it would be such a huge problem, much like prostitution and all this. I dont need a siggy no moar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhaloguy Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Religion is pointless to bring into politics. Somebody will always think your wrong in mostly any situation because of one reason. Usually that being Race or Religion. If you do things right people won't be sure you've done anything at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsavi Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Religion and politics should be two entirely different things. Fundamentally, they are, but quite a few countries have brought them together for whatever stupid reason. Moral and politics, however, should be as close as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nom Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 That's why we have the Separation of Church and State doctrine. See? America doesn't do everything wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayOxide Posted January 28, 2009 Author Share Posted January 28, 2009 ^America isnt the only place where some states/counties are run by someone with religious beliefs, pushing them onto the public. It's nice to see people get me though o.o I dont need a siggy no moar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1_man_army Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 I don't feel that religion should have a place in politics. A politician's job is to represent all of their constituents regardless of race or religion therefore, to base your policies solely upon your religious beliefs means you are only representing a single select group. Sure, you can use your religion to instil a set of morals but you have to have greater reasoning to your views/policies than "it's in the bible" (or whatever religious text that you follow). That's why we have the Separation of Church and State doctrine. See? America doesn't do everything wrong. While America does have the legal seperatation of church and state, religion plays a big (yet indirect) role in politics. I mean just look at the election, both candidates went out of their way to appeal to religious groups, it was a big part of Palin's appeal. Slightly off topic but I can't see an atheist President in America in my lifetime but if there is one, I wonder how they'd deal with the oath of office. He who learns must suffer, and, even in our sleep, pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart,and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus (525 BC - 456 BC) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThurinEthir Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Unless there is a state religion (Which there generally isn't in the west?), separation of church and state is ideal. It's usually fine if the leader's morals stem from religion, and then he uses those morals to rule, but doing something "because the Bible says so" is just stupid. Cenin pân nîd, istan pân nîd, dan nin ú-cenich, nin ú-istach.Ithil luin eria vi menel caran...Tîn dan delu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faux Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Thats fair. I also feel its taking a life, but the embryos can help a living person, I guess. Well not anymore :? Anyway thats offtopic kinda. If it wasnt for it being "against" religions, I dont think it would be such a huge problem, much like prostitution and all this. One of the girls I graduated elementary with have had three (that I know of) abortions before we even turned 18. I don't have to be religious to see that that's [bleep]ed up. Nothing is wrong with abortion imo if there's a good enough reason. Rape victims, medical complications, etc. But when people just keep having abortion because of fear of the consequences of the things they willfully acted on, then it becomes wrong. :: Guess the Movie Contest Champion: pfilc23 :: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magekillr Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2Kh-xzerjE /thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayOxide Posted January 28, 2009 Author Share Posted January 28, 2009 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2Kh-xzerjE /thread. I love obama I dont need a siggy no moar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nom Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 That's why we have the Separation of Church and State doctrine. See? America doesn't do everything wrong. While America does have the legal seperatation of church and state, religion plays a big (yet indirect) role in politics. I mean just look at the election, both candidates went out of their way to appeal to religious groups, it was a big part of Palin's appeal. But they're not forcing religion on anyone. In fact they are fundamentally recognizing a person's right to his own choice of religion in trying to appeal to it. You really can't expect religion to be completely cut off from any political influence in any kind of society, but the separation of church and state ensures that religion and politics can't unite into something like a theocracy and deny the freedom of religion to citizens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayOxide Posted January 28, 2009 Author Share Posted January 28, 2009 Religious president (for example) may make laws of his country based on his religion, making people who disagree with it have to leave or conform. This could be something like, all white people have to stay on THIS side of alabama I dont need a siggy no moar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1_man_army Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 That's why we have the Separation of Church and State doctrine. See? America doesn't do everything wrong. While America does have the legal seperatation of church and state, religion plays a big (yet indirect) role in politics. I mean just look at the election, both candidates went out of their way to appeal to religious groups, it was a big part of Palin's appeal. But they're not forcing religion on anyone. In fact they are fundamentally recognizing a person's right to his own choice of religion in trying to appeal to it. You really can't expect religion to be completely cut off from any political influence in any kind of society, but the separation of church and state ensures that religion and politics can't unite into something like a theocracy and deny the freedom of religion to citizens. I'm not saying that they're forcing it on people but I'm saying that it does play a big role in American politics, certain policies are always pushed to appeal to religious groups. America is miles away from being a theocracy but religion plays a bigger role in American politics than it does in many others. In Britain for example Alistair Campbell (Tony Blair's Spin Doctor) famously claimed "We don't do God" I just couldn't imagine any American political figure ever saying that. He who learns must suffer, and, even in our sleep, pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart,and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus (525 BC - 456 BC) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magekillr Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Well there is an atheist Congressman from California, publicly atheist. I don't think he was publicly when he first ran, but he has since: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pete_Stark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieMcD Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 There's two things that should never be combined, religion and politics. There's so many country's which have tried it and either been built on intolerance or simply just failed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zierro Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 So, does anyone really think religious beliefs (or personal beliefs) should be pushed upon a country/continent/etc if the president/etc is catholic/etc? Who's gonna say yes to that? Nobody wants forced religion except the people who try to force it on others, but in reality, they don't want it either because I'm sure they wouldn't want someone from a different religion shoving their views down their throats. And that's what would happen if it were allowed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alg Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Though there isn't much wrong with supporting a decision that complies with your religious beliefs, or the values that stem from religion. I personally see the problem if the religious values/doctrines are forced on the people though. I painted some stuff and put it on tumblr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p51mustang23 Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Opinion: I think that religion should not be allowed as a driving factor behind laws. If you are religous then DONT GET an abortion. Due you need a law to stop yourself? however less religious/ nonreligious people do not need to be governed by [for example] the churches rules. no government should ever impose a religion.!! i would revolt lol Though there isn't much wrong with supporting a decision that complies with your religious beliefs, or the values that stem from religion. I personally see the problem if the religious values/doctrines are forced on the people though. agreed and understood, but when the religious group is a majority, sometimes supporting your own belief can drown out someone else's. eg. if 60% of people were "religous" and all agreed that abortion is wrong then they might all vote for an anti abortion law. Thus you have now imposed your belief on your own people, but others as well. im not saying its wrong, im just trying to stimulate some discussion. Robin hood x1 - D left half x1 - Karils coif x1Sara plate x1 - D legs x1 - Black mask x2Zammy plate x1 - Torags hammers x1 - granite maul x1Red mystic top x2 - Red mystic bottom x 6 - __________________________________ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assassin_696 Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 I think religion and governance are best kept at arms length, and for this reason I think the US Constitution has got it exactly right (although in practice relgious lobbyists have enormous influence in Washington). "Da mihi castitatem et continentam, sed noli modo" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p51mustang23 Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Slightly off topic but I can't see an athiest President in America in my lifetime but if there is one, I wonder how they'd deal with the oath of office. and 2 years ago i didnt expect a black president anytime soon. its possible. ------- "i swear on the holy bible that i will be... blah blah blah... defend constitution... and not take over the world" "ok you are now president" "ok good. first order of business: taking over the world" "but you just swore you wouldnt!" "yea....on the BIBLE" Robin hood x1 - D left half x1 - Karils coif x1Sara plate x1 - D legs x1 - Black mask x2Zammy plate x1 - Torags hammers x1 - granite maul x1Red mystic top x2 - Red mystic bottom x 6 - __________________________________ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p51mustang23 Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Where do you separate religious opinions form non-religious ones? :/ Robin hood x1 - D left half x1 - Karils coif x1Sara plate x1 - D legs x1 - Black mask x2Zammy plate x1 - Torags hammers x1 - granite maul x1Red mystic top x2 - Red mystic bottom x 6 - __________________________________ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1_man_army Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Slightly off topic but I can't see an atheist President in America in my lifetime but if there is one, I wonder how they'd deal with the oath of office. and 2 years ago i didnt expect a black president anytime soon. its possible. I don't see it personally but America does have a knack of proving me wrong so it's still vaguely possible. He who learns must suffer, and, even in our sleep, pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart,and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus (525 BC - 456 BC) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p51mustang23 Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Slightly off topic but I can't see an atheist President in America in my lifetime but if there is one, I wonder how they'd deal with the oath of office. and 2 years ago i didnt expect a black president anytime soon. its possible. I don't see it personally but America does have a knack of proving me wrong so it's still vaguely possible. i know i know. Robin hood x1 - D left half x1 - Karils coif x1Sara plate x1 - D legs x1 - Black mask x2Zammy plate x1 - Torags hammers x1 - granite maul x1Red mystic top x2 - Red mystic bottom x 6 - __________________________________ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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