My plan on dg binds

[Legionwizard]

I'm drifting towards 100 dg, allowing me a third bind. Right now I have: ssh, prom2h and surgebox.

 

As of now, I'm pretty set on my role as non-keyer (cept that I do key in 117). But in w148 I'm mainly into maximizing my dps. My plan for binding when I hit 100 dg is to have:

- bind celestial staff;

- keep prom2h and surgebox;

- upgrade ring to t8+ blazer (actually doing so now) and set on quick-switch with berserker.

 

So I will deviate from the conventional platebody binding and focus on mage and melee. Does this sound like a good plan? Should I replace prom2h by a primal baxe (for auto surgebox equip at start)? Keep in mind my goal is to maximize dps and that for gd's while people deal with the remaining zombies, archers, ... I plan to switch to mage (wield staff surgebox, switch blazer and select spell), so I look as the little extra time spent in equipping surgebox as neglegible.

[Sy_Accursed]

I'm not sure but when you finalkly get tht 3rd bind isn't armour the best way to go as sure extra offensive options may be nice but better defence from the off gives u more chance to survive with more food and supplies.

[Vex]

If you do not key. Then your job is DPS on GD's.

 

Bind a celestial staff w/ your surgebox, you will not need a plate. I would also recommend you use "DG Sweepers" CC as opposed to 117 & 148, especially if you are remotely competent at DG.

[Helm_Lardar]

Sounds like a good plan, if unconventional.

[green9090]

I've been with people who've done this before, it works rather well.

 

To be even more unconventional, you might consider binding a primal rapier and using magic on anything high defense, rapier on low defense or stab weak. Rapier is good for shades, dogs, mages, and rangers, and okay on zombies. Magic tears up warriors of all descriptions, fire giants, non-mage skeletons, bats, and other high defense monsters (it's quite accurate compared to melee). If you were good about busting out magic or going for low defense monsters first while the team took care of the stuff you wouldn't be so effective against like zombies and mage skeletons, you'd be a very effective team member. All of the stalker bosses (big eyeball guys) are also stab weak I believe. Wouldn't work so well if you had two people on a team with a rapier, but one is good.

 

If you'd rather not be quite that unconventional, I'd go for battleaxe. Less annoyance switching, and it's also better for low defense monsters and worse on monsters you'd usually use the surgebox for. Also keep in mind that you need fire runes if you're binding a catalytic staff- the max of air surge with celestial is lower than the max of fire surge with empowered fire, so there's no point in binding celestial if you aren't going to be good about getting fire runes (monster drops, monster drops, monster drops. Including ess they drop + RC altars you run into while doing GDs).

[Sir_Squab]

I've been with people who've done this before, it works rather well.

 

To be even more unconventional, you might consider binding a primal rapier and using magic on anything high defense, rapier on low defense or stab weak. Rapier is good for shades, dogs, mages, and rangers, and okay on zombies. Magic tears up warriors of all descriptions, fire giants, non-mage skeletons, bats, and other high defense monsters (it's quite accurate compared to melee). If you were good about busting out magic or going for low defense monsters first while the team took care of the stuff you wouldn't be so effective against like zombies and mage skeletons, you'd be a very effective team member. All of the stalker bosses (big eyeball guys) are also stab weak I believe. Wouldn't work so well if you had two people on a team with a rapier, but one is good.

 

If you'd rather not be quite that unconventional, I'd go for battleaxe. Less annoyance switching, and it's also better for low defense monsters and worse on monsters you'd usually use the surgebox for. Also keep in mind that you need fire runes if you're binding a catalytic staff- the max of air surge with celestial is lower than the max of fire surge with empowered fire, so there's no point in binding celestial if you aren't going to be good about getting fire runes (monster drops, monster drops, monster drops. Including ess they drop + RC altars you run into while doing GDs).

 

This is why the damned celestial staff should give unlimited fire runes. Actually, I'd like unlimited elemental runes o_O

[Bassy]

I'm not too certain about Celestial. Within 3 rooms I usually have a Fire Staff (Empowered or not), and it wastes next to no time to make. With a good Blazer and no armour on that pretty much rips apart warriors anyway.

 

Just something to consider the next time you come across a Hexhunter or a Blood Necklace.

[Vex]

There is no consideration if you are lucky enough to get a HexHunter drop. Idk about blood necklace though.

[green9090]

Blood necklace has a significant melee DPS boost, I'd unquestioningly override a celestial staff bind for it and just use empowered fire with a primal baxe.

[Noxx]

If you do not key. Then your job is DPS on GD's.

 

Bind a celestial staff w/ your surgebox, you will not need a plate. I would also recommend you use "DG Sweepers" CC as opposed to 117 & 148, especially if you are remotely competent at DG.

I would rather stick with w117 and w148 as aposed to DG Sweepers. With w148/w117 it's normal to skill if your survival depends on it (by this i mean Fishing and Cutting some logs for a fire). In DSG i've found that if you're on the brink of death its either you Soul Split yourself up to full LP, hope to the gods you get a food drop, or suicide for full LP. Fishing is frowned upon. Stick to w148/w117.

[green9090]

If you do not key. Then your job is DPS on GD's.

 

Bind a celestial staff w/ your surgebox, you will not need a plate. I would also recommend you use "DG Sweepers" CC as opposed to 117 & 148, especially if you are remotely competent at DG.

I would rather stick with w117 and w148 as aposed to DG Sweepers. With w148/w117 it's normal to skill if your survival depends on it (by this i mean Fishing and Cutting some logs for a fire). In DSG i've found that if you're on the brink of death its either you Soul Split yourself up to full LP, hope to the gods you get a food drop, or suicide for full LP. Fishing is frowned upon. Stick to w148/w117.

Floors are 20-40% faster in DGS than 148 on average, one death loses you 13% exp. I die MAYBE 1/5 floors I do, and I key. It's pretty hard to die as DPS unless you're really bad at praying or you get extremely unlucky with not having enough for an altar.

 

As a keyer, I won't flip out if there's nothing to do and someone fishes, but I will say that it's very rare for the fish to get cooked before we find a GD that drops more than enough food for everyone to survive. The no fishing isn't just to be a [bleep] and ensure everyone dies, it's just that fishing is legitimately a waste of time 90% of the time, and nobody has to die for that to be true.

 

That said, if your attitude is that we make up arbitrary [cabbage] to get you killed, yeah, you probably suck enough that we don't want you anyway.

[Noxx]

If you do not key. Then your job is DPS on GD's.

 

Bind a celestial staff w/ your surgebox, you will not need a plate. I would also recommend you use "DG Sweepers" CC as opposed to 117 & 148, especially if you are remotely competent at DG.

I would rather stick with w117 and w148 as aposed to DG Sweepers. With w148/w117 it's normal to skill if your survival depends on it (by this i mean Fishing and Cutting some logs for a fire). In DSG i've found that if you're on the brink of death its either you Soul Split yourself up to full LP, hope to the gods you get a food drop, or suicide for full LP. Fishing is frowned upon. Stick to w148/w117.

Floors are 20-40% faster in DGS than 148 on average, one death loses you 13% exp. I die MAYBE 1/5 floors I do, and I key. It's pretty hard to die as DPS unless you're really bad at praying or you get extremely unlucky with not having enough for an altar.

 

As a keyer, I won't flip out if there's nothing to do and someone fishes, but I will say that it's very rare for the fish to get cooked before we find a GD that drops more than enough food for everyone to survive. The no fishing isn't just to be a [bleep] and ensure everyone dies, it's just that fishing is legitimately a waste of time 90% of the time, and nobody has to die for that to be true.

 

That said, if your attitude is that we make up arbitrary [cabbage] to get you killed, yeah, you probably suck enough that we don't want you anyway.

Not all GDs have great food drops. Mind you i've seen quite a large portion of the that drop a few Heims and Red-Eyes and nothing more. And i'm not referring to everyone in my previous statement but some of the members in the group (and i don't want to mention any names) find it "leechy" behaviour when you're 5 seconds late on a GGS call because you don't wish to die for the 3rd/4th time. Sure floors might be a bit faster (i won't go with 20 - 40%, maybe 10% [15% at the most]) but the 13% exp loss on death kind of makes the time saved worthless at the end of the day. On more than half od the occasions i've done floors with DGS i (and atleast 1 or 2 other members of the groups) would die atleast once.

 

Oh and i love how the kids alway run straight at the personal insults. Shows a lot about the kind of person you are :roll:

[muuuuuuuuuu]

If you do not key. Then your job is DPS on GD's.

 

Bind a celestial staff w/ your surgebox, you will not need a plate. I would also recommend you use "DG Sweepers" CC as opposed to 117 & 148, especially if you are remotely competent at DG.

I would rather stick with w117 and w148 as aposed to DG Sweepers. With w148/w117 it's normal to skill if your survival depends on it (by this i mean Fishing and Cutting some logs for a fire). In DSG i've found that if you're on the brink of death its either you Soul Split yourself up to full LP, hope to the gods you get a food drop, or suicide for full LP. Fishing is frowned upon. Stick to w148/w117.

Floors are 20-40% faster in DGS than 148 on average, one death loses you 13% exp. I die MAYBE 1/5 floors I do, and I key. It's pretty hard to die as DPS unless you're really bad at praying or you get extremely unlucky with not having enough for an altar.

 

As a keyer, I won't flip out if there's nothing to do and someone fishes, but I will say that it's very rare for the fish to get cooked before we find a GD that drops more than enough food for everyone to survive. The no fishing isn't just to be a [bleep] and ensure everyone dies, it's just that fishing is legitimately a waste of time 90% of the time, and nobody has to die for that to be true.

 

That said, if your attitude is that we make up arbitrary [cabbage] to get you killed, yeah, you probably suck enough that we don't want you anyway.

Not all GDs have great food drops. Mind you i've seen quite a large portion of the that drop a few Heims and Red-Eyes and nothing more. And i'm not referring to everyone in my previous statement but some of the members in the group (and i don't want to mention any names) find it "leechy" behaviour when you're 5 seconds late on a GGS call because you don't wish to die for the 3rd/4th time. Sure floors might be a bit faster (i won't go with 20 - 40%, maybe 10% [15% at the most]) but the 13% exp loss on death kind of makes the time saved worthless at the end of the day. On more than half od the occasions i've done floors with DGS i (and atleast 1 or 2 other members of the groups) would die atleast once.

 

Oh and i love how the kids alway run straight at the personal insults. Shows a lot about the kind of person you are :roll:

if you've died 3x already you might as well give the floor up and help finish it as fast as possible, your xp is already shot.

[green9090]

Re: the bad GD drops, it DOES happen, but the thing is there seems to be a pattern where right when the team is really running out of food and things are looking bleak, there's a monster that drops like 10 salves and everything's okay again. Every time I allow fishing, this seems to correlate to right when the guy's halfway done fishing a spot and hasn't started cooking yet, and the fish end up unused and dropped. Every time. That's why fishing is frowned upon- it's faster 95% of the time to just keep killing stuff and wait for that food drop.

 

I'm not sure what keyers you've been with, but I can tell you how I run things. When someone is out of food and dying, I'll order them out of a room unless everyone's similarly near death. I really try hard not to let anyone on my team die. If someone on my team dies, it's more often than not their own damn fault for being a hero and/or lag related. Or it's me because I needed prayer and there's no altar yet. I'm not going to order you to your death.

 

I also tend to key floors in about 35 minutes on average, maybe a bit faster. 148 teams seem never to be done before 45 minutes, and often creep on into hour+ territory. I'll be nice and give them an average of 50 minutes. That's a 40% difference. At a 45 minute average on 148, which I think is overly generous, the difference is 29%. Even if DGS floors average 40 minutes and 148 floors average 45 minutes, that's a 12.5% difference. You can decide what numbers you want to believe, but I'm inclined to say it's a lot closer to the first one.

 

I didn't mean it to be a personal insult, but I've never met anyone with a self-pitying everyone against me attitude like that who wasn't an awful dungeoneer.

[Saradomin_Mage]

Actually, Nox's problem atm is that he doesn't have a hood, hence he suffers a lot when he clears gds with us.

[green9090]

Ah, yeah, hoodless is a problem. Still, that's a problem on 148 too if you don't want to go full leech. Which, to be fair, it sounds like Nox does.

[Noxx]

Ah, yeah, hoodless is a problem. Still, that's a problem on 148 too if you don't want to go full leech. Which, to be fair, it sounds like Nox does.

Hard to leech when you're stuck having to key to find a team. But cool story non the less :thumbup:

[green9090]

Wait, you key AND fish?

 

...Wow.

[Saradomin_Mage]

Ah, yeah, hoodless is a problem. Still, that's a problem on 148 too if you don't want to go full leech. Which, to be fair, it sounds like Nox does.

Hard to leech when you're stuck having to key to find a team. But cool story non the less :thumbup:

To be frank, most people I play with on 148 are pretty bad. The hooded guys I've played with are definitely more leechy. I've got a friend who just had to key for a bunch of hoodeds well above his DG level, and they'd hog food, ask for the GGS to be moved one door down, and other stereotypical stuff.

It's hard to move fast in a 148 team when the rest of the team does their garbage, slowing you down by making solo'ing gds suicide.

 

Anyway, slightly on topic, the celestial staff bind would be worth looking into, but I'm pretty sure that if you ever end up coming across a blood neck, it'd be a lot more worth it to gain that Melee DPS boost. I'm just hassled by the changing between weapons and autocast, though that's probably not the case for you.

[Legionwizard]

Well back on topic, I can say I'm not too worried about food. I rarely fish if ever cook, I might buy some salves right before the boss room. I know my prayers and how to lure, people should do it more. You have the highest chances of dying by foolishly entering a room without quick inspection or ggs'ing to "follow the leader" and ending in the middle of an onslaught.

 

Concerning the fire runes, I get those pretty rapid in the dungeon.

 

The blood necklace I might consider, think with blazer I'll already have high enough dps surging warriors, would be a nice addon if I'd decide to go for rapier/baxe.

 

As for the hex, yes I would bind it and replace surgebox with arrows. I'd rely on other non-keyer teammates to possess a surgebox, as it isn't thaaat rare.

[Noxx]

Wait, you key AND fish?

 

...Wow.

Obviously not at the same time. Jesus i find it a wonder you manage to dress yourself in the morning, or are you just really [bleep]ing ignorant. Probably a bit of both.

[green9090]

No, you don't understand me. Your entire point of leaving DGS for 148 was so that you'd be allowed to fish. Now you're telling me you key, too. Do you suicide key, or do you sit around fishing as the keyer?

[Bassy]

Well back on topic, I can say I'm not too worried about food. I rarely fish if ever cook, I might buy some salves right before the boss room. I know my prayers and how to lure, people should do it more. You have the highest chances of dying by foolishly entering a room without quick inspection or ggs'ing to "follow the leader" and ending in the middle of an onslaught.

 

Concerning the fire runes, I get those pretty rapid in the dungeon.

 

The blood necklace I might consider, think with blazer I'll already have high enough dps surging warriors, would be a nice addon if I'd decide to go for rapier/baxe.

 

As for the hex, yes I would bind it and replace surgebox with arrows. I'd rely on other non-keyer teammates to possess a surgebox, as it isn't thaaat rare.

 

I find Fire and Earth Runes are the most commonly supplied by monster drops, stick with one of those, or make an elemental staff from a log drop. Either way you'll have Fire/Earth surges within the first few rooms. The Blood necklace comes with +11 strength and the ability to deal minor damage that heals you as well, so it's like a strength boost and a passive soul split, which I'd consider a benefit for a Rest of the Team.

[Noxx]

No, you don't understand me. Your entire point of leaving DGS for 148 was so that you'd be allowed to fish. Now you're telling me you key, too. Do you suicide key, or do you sit around fishing as the keyer?

Obviously i wouldnt fish during the floors i key. I've been lucky enough to DG with people who either share the food drops or share what they have fished. It turns a 35 minute floor into a 40 minute floor at most. 5 minute delay for 13% extra exp is worth it.

[green9090]

That's some ridiculous luck on 148 teammates. I regularly have to kick 148ers for having a worldbearer with ALL of the food and refusing to share when everyone else is on 1-2 food. I similarly find it unbelievable that you can regularly do floors that quickly with pure 148 teams, no hood, and having people fish.

 

Either way, I'd think you'd be better off keying floors with DGSers, because they'll actually share food. It's not required to be a ranked keyer to advertise your own floor.