Greedom1 Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 First, a few caveats: -While this may be a little long, please bear with me as I feel it may be worth your time. -Forum moderators and administrators, please do not lock this unless you feel it is absolutely necessary. IÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢d like to hear some intelligent thoughts on this and would appreciate some time to get some feedback. -If this needs to be moved to the Discussions/Suggestions forum, please feel free. -Please keep all replies civil, thanks. That being said, let me begin. The title of this thread concerns something all of us have encountered during the course of our adventures in Runescape. The term I use is ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¦Ã¢â¬Åvalue;ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâà RSN: Greedom1 | QP 248+ | Combat 116 | Total 1920+ | Skills 95 craft, 99 farm, 88 herb, 91 mage, 85 slayer Values? What do they mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bestsob Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 "A man should not be judged by his skin, but the actions of his heart" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enzeru Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 People do need to put more thought into the second catagory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lim_Dul Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 Well said Greedom. I agree with you completely. Runescape certainly is lacking in respect, empathy and all around decency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfboy Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 What many who place more emphasis on the first category, there's a simple fact that they seem to be forgetting. Those who are well respected in the second category tend to be in (or well on their way to) the first category. Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown; ignorance can be educated and drunkeness sobered, but stupid is forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greedom1 Posted May 9, 2006 Author Share Posted May 9, 2006 What many who place more emphasis on the first category, there's a simple fact that they seem to be forgetting. Those who are well respected in the second category tend to be in (or well on their way to) the first category. This may be true, but my point is that people seem to allow those with riches in their banks or on their heads (phats) to be the defining factor in what they determine someone's character to be. (wolfboy, forgive me as the remainder is not directed at you...) Recent events prove to me that this is a fallacy. It is a misnomer to suggest that merely due to someone's ability to play this game well, or to manipulate the market affords them our respect. This is not just me being whiny and self-righteous. No, what I'm saying is that you're selling yourself short if you heap loads of praise on someone for a skill level or for riches without even considering whether they have broken the rules to get there and whether they have broken any since. As one who attempts to maintain my own dignity and integrity both in-game and in real-life, I'm frankly disappointed by those who are star-struck by pixels or skills and disgusted by those who don't understand or care what integrity means. I'm not a military man -- I teach in college in fact -- but I feel I do know what honor means and also what it means to be judged by the content of your character. Thanks, and happy RSing :) RSN: Greedom1 | QP 248+ | Combat 116 | Total 1920+ | Skills 95 craft, 99 farm, 88 herb, 91 mage, 85 slayer Values? What do they mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfboy Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 What I meant is that people who are well respected for their integrity and character tend to become monetarily rich as well. I, for one, would much rather sell to someone I respect for who they are than someone who became rich by dubious means. For example, say someone who's got a lot of money and no character offers me 650 for my steel bars. (One of my main money-makers, along with air runes) At the same time, someone I've traded with before and know to be honest and respectable offers me 600 or even 550 each. I'd sell to the on I respect, mainly because I know that I can expect them to be a loyal and trustworthy customer. See what I mean? Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown; ignorance can be educated and drunkeness sobered, but stupid is forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assasinknife Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 There will always be those who ruin the game for everyone. However, there will always be people who are helpful, respectful, and reliable in the game. I don't think integrity can be measured. The whole system will end up as a competition and not as what it was originally intended as (just look at rares*.) *I'm not against rares, I have a Santa Hat myself. However, I do believe that the original purpose has been removed from it, like many people believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greedom1 Posted May 9, 2006 Author Share Posted May 9, 2006 What I meant is that people who are well respected for their integrity and character tend to become monetarily rich as well. I, for one, would much rather sell to someone I respect for who they are than someone who became rich by dubious means. For example, say someone who's got a lot of money and no character offers me 650 for my steel bars. (One of my main money-makers, along with air runes) At the same time, someone I've traded with before and know to be honest and respectable offers me 600 or even 550 each. I'd sell to the on I respect, mainly because I know that I can expect them to be a loyal and trustworthy customer. See what I mean? Definitely. I understand what you're saying and wholeheartedly agree. Though this is getting away from my original point, I find myself doing the same several times per week. RSN: Greedom1 | QP 248+ | Combat 116 | Total 1920+ | Skills 95 craft, 99 farm, 88 herb, 91 mage, 85 slayer Values? What do they mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greedom1 Posted May 9, 2006 Author Share Posted May 9, 2006 ...I don't think integrity can be measured... This may be true, but as a Supreme Court Justice (Potter Stewart) famously said in a 1964 case concerning how he would measure (or define) hard-core obscenity*, "I know it when I see it." I may not be able to measure integrity, but I darn well know it when I see it. *Note, when I initially wrote this, the filter turned the word associated with publications like Hustler and Playboy into "Adults Only"... Somewhat funny to me... :) RSN: Greedom1 | QP 248+ | Combat 116 | Total 1920+ | Skills 95 craft, 99 farm, 88 herb, 91 mage, 85 slayer Values? What do they mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ishepp Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 Totally agree. I would rather gain respect among players for my integrity, helpfulness, and generally being friendly, than for being ultra-rich. A lot of people on my homeworld know me, though I don't remember who they all are sometimes, sure I have a fairly decent bank, but that shouldn't be where I get my respect. 89/99 farming Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transcript80 Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 well...it's a game. I play it as such. I couldn't care less if someone repects me or not. I agree that paople should not scam and "swear" in game, but I never do "honorable" stuff. I play the game by the rules made by JaGEx, and I am playing the game for FUN (and skills), not for respect. I'll get my share of respect in RL. Yes, that's a lot of I's in a row. But then again, it's just me playing the game, I have no "friends" in RS, I pefer my RL ones. I'm not trying to be obnoxious or anything, and I try to be polite in game, but all I'm really interested in, when playing RS is MY guy after all. And having fun, of course. As soon as fun disappears, I'll be SO outta RS, and nobody will "mourn" for me. In which I didn't see the point anyways.... Other data was removed when acoount got hacked... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gothic_Hell Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 People value bank instead of the character because its a game, peopel do not feel that they are entitled to be nice because you simply dont knwo the person that ur trading with on the other side of screen. To people its a game and thats what it is in the end of the day, they dont need to be nice to get anything (i.e. be nice and u get money) becaus eits simply doent work in the net world.Peopel realise that they need to work and thats when you loose the character of the person in determination and stivign to achieve your ultimate goal - to be popular and how you goign to achieve that? By being rich! Money bring you faim, fortune and that all that people need. You refeer to the PMod that was breaking rules and subsequently got banned from the game - that is the whole other topic. And as much as i want to comment on that i will withold my view. People have differant ambitions in life , they hide the character ( beign nice). People and society from runescape reflects life OUT there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogfever Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 I can see a couple of issues being discussed here, firstly the attitude and honour of those playing the game and using forums and secondly the attribution of value to different player characteristics. For the first point I will only say that with so many activities juvenile and petty attitudes are clearly in evidence, although I would say still in the minority in both f2p and p2p, especially among higher levels. As for value, I think value is unduly associated with possesions for two reasons, firstly as a virtual game possesions and skills are the most easily measurable and demostrable qualities of a player. The mistake made is to confer any respect, beyond that due for tenacity and hard work, upon the player being rated. Secondly the high regard for wealth is something of a reflection on the capitalist nature of the societies in which we live, predominantly western / first world asian I would imagine. I personally only respect players who are polite and helpful on the boards or with whom I have had good experiences in game. As a first glance combat level can indicate the likelihood of noobish behaviour but it is not a definitive measure by any means. In brief value is worth nothing compared to respect, because respect can't be bought, only earned. df Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gouwenaartje Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 i personally only respect players who are at least TRYING to be nice and polite, in game and in real life. It would also be nice if they were honest and a bit loyal to friendship. myself, i dont find it hard to be polite, but i also have some... disagreements sometimes. Then i will never curse with diseases, family or religions. I will just say something like; "shut up, i hope i will never see you again." and walk away. Some people also give you credits in friendship by how many stuff you give away. myself, i hate those people more than any other. They often stalk you, trying to catch every gp or air rune they can. When you give them steel stuff, they will ask for mithril, when you give them mithril, they will ask for adamant and so on. normally i will just put those people on my ignore list and switch worlds. then you have the people who are absolute beggars. they will ask you for the money you worked for, because they are too lazy to make it theirselves, and call you [bleep] or idiot (depending on the gender of your character) when you arent willing to give them anything. some people call them noobs, i just think they are people who are too immature to see they are not respected by anyone at all. i think i feel sorry for them. they are probably non-social 10 y.o. kids... then you have the people who keep on asking you help during a quest, to repeat the thing you explained three times in that very same minute. they are annoying, not respected by anyone (not because they dont know it, but because they dont have the brains to remember things), and dont know enough of the game to go and check this site for the quest guides and other guides... Proud Member of G.U.I.L.D.S., a new kind of Community! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greedom1 Posted May 10, 2006 Author Share Posted May 10, 2006 I can see a couple of issues being discussed here, firstly the attitude and honour of those playing the game and using forums and secondly the attribution of value to different player characteristics. For the first point I will only say that with so many activities juvenile and petty attitudes are clearly in evidence, although I would say still in the minority in both f2p and p2p, especially among higher levels. As for value, I think value is unduly associated with possesions for two reasons, firstly as a virtual game possesions and skills are the most easily measurable and demostrable qualities of a player. The mistake made is to confer any respect, beyond that due for tenacity and hard work, upon the player being rated. Secondly the high regard for wealth is something of a reflection on the capitalist nature of the societies in which we live, predominantly western / first world asian I would imagine. I personally only respect players who are polite and helpful on the boards or with whom I have had good experiences in game. As a first glance combat level can indicate the likelihood of noobish behaviour but it is not a definitive measure by any means. In brief value is worth nothing compared to respect, because respect can't be bought, only earned. df You bring up an interesting point in regards to capitalism... On the isse of combat level suggesting respect, it reminds me of a topic that occasionally pops up. Some have said it would be a good idea to perhaps include skill totals or quest points in addition to the combat level next to someone's name. Personally, I think that could get quite messy, but it could be interesting if they were to include an "Honor" rating, or maybe a "Respect" rating somewhere. The criteria for this would not be based on in-game play exclusively, but could be based on any black marks on record, kudos from other players, or potentially on the number of successful abuse reports. I see that it would be difficult to implement, and naturally would have drawbacks, but thoughts anyone? RSN: Greedom1 | QP 248+ | Combat 116 | Total 1920+ | Skills 95 craft, 99 farm, 88 herb, 91 mage, 85 slayer Values? What do they mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogfever Posted May 10, 2006 Share Posted May 10, 2006 A bit like ebay. If I buy from forums I will tend to post a thankyou along with a compliment on their service if they are good but thats about all you can do atm. I like the idea but it might be open to abuse I guess. df Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greedom1 Posted August 20, 2006 Author Share Posted August 20, 2006 I will bump this as I feel this topic is still rather pertinent. Thanks :) RSN: Greedom1 | QP 248+ | Combat 116 | Total 1920+ | Skills 95 craft, 99 farm, 88 herb, 91 mage, 85 slayer Values? What do they mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agresivul Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 Dude... anyone can click a mouse. Well almost anyone, to expand on that. 13 year olds and under that age act like clowns and completely ruin this game in every way shape and form. That's why I and I know others don't bother acting all "nice" and wasting their time explaining things to people who need to go through puberty first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drawde_3 Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 Good one =D> ! I 100% agree with you! TThanks for taking your time to carefully write a great post! A mad scientist in the attic, the owner is a vampire that dwells in the basement, a witch, skeletons, ghosts....And you thought YOUR neighbors were weird! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lygeia Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 Personally, I have always felt that integrity and common courtesy was far more important than financial status. As my grandfather always told me, "Money comes and goes, but a good reputation can never be replaced." This is why I always try to be friendly and helpful whenever I can in the game...after all, every one of us was new at one time. I try to treat people the way I would like to be treated. It may be trite, but it's an attitude that has worked for me on more than one occasion. Lygeia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brave Posted August 21, 2006 Share Posted August 21, 2006 On the issue of combat level suggesting respect. In my view all combat level indicates is that the charcater can kill monsters, and as such gets no respect from me. I am also one of those people who think that combat level should be replaced by total skills level as this would be a much better indicator of the players status. The only time combat level should be displayed is in the Wilderness, where it is essential to know the combat level of the person you are attacking. In fact the displaying of combat levels is one of the last remnants of RSC, where you needed to know everyones combat levels as you could fight almost anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agresivul Posted August 21, 2006 Share Posted August 21, 2006 Combat levels are there so that just before your in the wilderness... you can see who's coming in. That way you won't be surprised or confused by other people in the heap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fredz Posted March 27, 2007 Share Posted March 27, 2007 First, a few caveats: The title of this thread concerns something all of us have encountered during the course of our adventures in Runescape. The term I use is ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¦Ã¢â¬Åvalue;ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâà 21 lag piles, 4 Pjs, 2 Party hat kills, 67 newbs teached. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greedom1 Posted March 27, 2007 Author Share Posted March 27, 2007 Its a long way from spoken words to action. Most people would claim value #2 is what they see as true value. But most people still seem to embrace value #1 with their in game behavior. I like your post, a lot. too bad I cant seem to find any words to form a long reply. Lol, no problem - I'm glad you enjoyed the post and thanks for replying. Given that it is a game, I do appreciate the fact that people may indulge in their fantasies of bad behavior and such. Still, it's good to know that many players are decent and kind folk. RSN: Greedom1 | QP 248+ | Combat 116 | Total 1920+ | Skills 95 craft, 99 farm, 88 herb, 91 mage, 85 slayer Values? What do they mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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