THE combat triangle - Comment or ill eat you

[blacksimon]

EDIT: NO UNDEADS, NO SLAYER MASK, NO SALVE AMMY in these calculations, if you need any proof that these hits are possible, please post, I have most maxes saved somewhere on my PC

 

 

 

So here comes another rant about the triangle you might think. This post will remain ALL facts and no opinion (out of me, at least)

 

 

 

The following will show us the maximum damage a player can do in a NPC enviroment

 

--------------------------

 

-NON BARROWS AIDED

 

(NO SPEC)

 

*rAnGeD

 

A ranger can do 60 Damage with a cannon and 25 with msb

 

That is 85 damage in 'one hit'

 

 

 

*AnCiEnT MaGe

 

An ancient mage can max out 30 over a 3*3 block

 

That is 270 damage

 

 

 

*NoRmAl MaGe

 

A normal mage can inflict 30 damage maximum

 

 

 

*MeLeE

 

A meleer can inflict 48 damage with a dragon halberd

 

-------------------------------

 

(Spec)

 

*rAnGeD

 

A ranger can do 60 Damage with a cannon and 50 with msb spec

 

That is 110 damage in 'one hit'

 

 

 

*AnCiEnT MaGe

 

An ancient mage can max out 30 over a 3*3 block

 

That is 270 damage

 

 

 

*NoRmAl MaGe

 

A normal mage can inflict 30 damage maximum

 

 

 

*MeLeE

 

A meleer can inflict 32 damage in each square over 3*3 (D2H)

 

That is 288 damage in 1 spec

 

------------------------------------------

 

The following is BARROWS aided

 

(you notice barrows does not help with NPCs)

 

*rAnGeD

 

A ranger can do 60 Damage with a cannon and 25 with msb

 

That is 110 damage in 'one hit'

 

 

 

*AnCiEnT MaGe

 

An ancient mage can max out 30 over a 3*3 block

 

That is 270 damage

 

 

 

*NoRmAl MaGe

 

A normal mage can inflict 30 damage maximum

 

 

 

*MeLeE

 

A meleer can inflict 32 damage in each square over 3*3 (D2H)

 

That is 288 damage in 1 spec

 

___________________________________________

 

And now in a 1vs1 player enviroment

 

------------------------------------------------

 

NON BARROWS AIDED

 

(no spec)

 

*rAnGeD

 

A ranger will max a 31 potted and prayed with a crystal bow

 

 

 

*AnCiEnT MaGe

 

The ancient mage will max a 30

 

 

 

*NoRmAl MaGe

 

A normal mage can inflict 30 damage maximum aswell

 

 

 

*MeLeE

 

A meleer can inflict 48 damage with a dragon halberd or 44 (for jessy87) with a whip

 

-----------------------------------------------

 

(With spec)

 

*rAnGeD

 

A ranger can inflict 50 damage with a MSB spec

 

 

 

*AnCiEnT MaGe

 

An ancient mage can max out 30

 

 

 

*NoRmAl MaGe

 

A normal mage can inflict 30 damage

 

 

 

*MeLeE

 

A meleer can inflict 74 damage with a 37 37 DDP++ spec

 

-----------------------------------------------

 

BARROWS AIDED

 

*rAnGeD

 

A ranger can inflict 50 damage with a MSB spec

 

 

 

*AnCiEnT MaGe

 

An ancient mage can max out 30

 

 

 

*NoRmAl MaGe

 

A normal mage can inflict 30 damage

 

 

 

*MeLeE

 

A meleer can inflict 90 damage on a player with dharoks

 

_________________________________

 

 

 

Lets look at the facts

 

The following are MAXIMUM hits

 

---

 

ON NPCS

 

MELEE= 288

 

RANGED= 110

 

MAGE= 270

 

---

 

ON PLAYERS

 

MELEE= 90

 

RANGED= 50

 

MAGE= 30

 

 

 

 

 

Keep in mind im not talking about probability, this is assuming you hit your MAX, potted, prayed, 99 in the skill.

 

 

 

:XD: comments plocks?*

 

 

 

EDIT moved the melee max to 90 as that sounds a bit more possible

 

 

 

 

and its the best pic i could find lawl

[blacksimon]

the following shows that a 37 is possible with a Dragon dagger

 

[jessy87]

is this about the pk triangle or the combat triangle?

[blacksimon]

is this about the pk triangle or the combat triangle?

 

 

 

it covers both :D

[jessy87]

the following shows that a 37 is possible with a Dragon dagger

 

 

 

 

 

that is not 100% practical in the wilderness.

 

 

 

 

 

i will also review the things slightly better, i skimmed over it and saw a few flaws.

 

 

 

 

 

all my statements are based on what is "seemed" to be the most important aspect of the game which is player killing, i mean NPC's can not argue and say its unfair they got destroyed by a player. so ill try to be realistic in the wilderness

 

 

 

A ranger will max a 31 potted and prayed with a crystal bow

 

 

 

frogmite said 30 was possible like that, but 31 might be pushing it.

 

 

 

*MeLeE

 

A meleer can inflict 48 damage with a dragon halberd or 45 with a whip

 

 

 

uh the halbred might do that damage, but who pks with it? ok but training with it is reasonable. so alrite ill give you the hally being fine, but a 45 with a whip? where? lol i max hit 40s with my whip maybe 41 or 42 if i had a fire cape.

 

 

 

*MeLeE

 

A meleer can inflict 74 damage with a 37 37 DDP++ spec

 

 

 

 

 

not practicale, possible however. i've yet to high anything higher then a 35 with my dagger, and still my gear is not practical wilderness use. its the little things that make those #'s outrageous, and they are the berserker rings and fire capes, and reciepe gloves...not exactly cheap but i can see them being used in the wilderness.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

ON PLAYERS

 

MELEE= 98

 

RANGED= 50

 

MAGE= 30

 

 

 

melee, unrealistic a bear(heres the keyword) could hit a 1 on a guy in dharok on the run to a player.

 

ranged, not often but very doable i agree.

 

mage, of cours this is possible, its some times hard but its obvious theirs a max damage limit for magic.

 

 

 

 

 

blacksimon, the ill eat you thing.. lol, but the topic does have some interesting things into and i appreciate the info, i never really max hit and the tip.it max hit calc is a lil off its always give or take 1 or 2 off the real max hit.

 

 

 

 

 

all in all good job.

[Dork]

I don't really see what you want us to comment on, if someone goes to dagannoths with cannon, they're hitting the most, the fastest, but they're not getting the full xp for what they hit because of cannon giving 1/2 exp. If someone is going to train with d2h, it's going to be extremely slow, and in reality, impossible. Dragon dagger special is very fast experience, if you hit, but you then have to wait for it to charge again. And ancients is both fast hitting and very fast experience.

 

 

 

But I still don't see what we're supposed to be commenting on o.O How it's weird that range 'max per hit' is low? But it's also the fastest if done right. Or what's the fastest experience?

 

 

 

 

 

As for the pk triangle, in my eyes, it's perfect. However there is no one that pks solely with one combat type, it's just not practical. If you don't hybrid you're not going to kill anything unless you get lucky.

 

 

 

But the triangle:

 

A true mage will, in most cases, always beat a true melee

 

A true melee will, in most cases, always beat a true ranger

 

A true ranger will, in most cases, always beat a true mage

 

(Of course there would also be the lucky kill every now and again to the opposite ;))

 

 

 

My meanings:

 

True mage: Robes, entangles (or ice spells), and a hard hitting spell

 

True melee: Low mage defence, high melee defence armour

 

True ranger: Hides, bow

 

 

 

But as I said, if you just use 1 combat type (even if you're just using hides while meleeing, you are hybriding), you're just not going to survive in today's wilderness. It's not Jagex's fault that the pk triangle is messed up, it's no one fault. People have just learned to adapt to hybriding.

[cor3]

Isnt max hit with cannon 30...?

 

 

 

and for max ranged damage without spec, try magic long bow, crystal bow or karils x-bow on accurate mode.

 

 

 

with black mask and that amulet that does 15% more damage to undead can make the damage higher vs npc's

 

 

 

 

 

your player vs npc max melee damage shows 48 with halberd, and you have a pic added with 52s with mace

[phata_elise]

Max hit means nothing. It's about average damage in time and the possibiltiy in knocking your opponent out.

 

 

 

Apart from causing damage, the three combat classes require different strategies to use succesfull. How do you compare a normal mage to an ancient mage? Normal can TB, entangle and then god spell, while the ancient can freeze and hit multiple targets.

[jessy87]

Isnt max hit with cannon 30...?

 

 

 

and for max ranged damage without spec, try magic long bow, crystal bow or karils x-bow on accurate mode.

 

 

 

with black mask and that amulet that does 15% more damage to undead can make the damage higher vs npc's

 

 

 

 

 

your player vs npc max melee damage shows 48 with halberd, and you have a pic added with 52s with mace

 

 

 

 

 

theirs ways to use a cannon to shoot 2 cannonballs into 1 npc at a single time, its just u have to catch the cannon @ a certain point where it like stops and starts its quarter rotations. technically its 2 shots but its...in the time of a single hit its weird.

 

 

 

i really dont use ranged often and i use a magic longbow evenless, however i know the magic long is the same ranged bonus, but i dont think it causes for a harder hit.

 

 

 

black mask doesnt stack with salve ammulet. or thats what every1 was lead to believe.

[Robert_Rdam]

And on monsters try this.

 

Get an undead slayer monster, get black mask and salve ammy, best str bonus you can get and pot up. :

 

It WILL help.. right?

[topide]

Thats pretty cool work. Dds can hit 45x2 with the specials now, with black mask and salve amulet vs undead slayer monster.

[jessy87]

Thats pretty cool work. Dds can hit 45x2 with the specials now, with black mask and salve amulet vs undead slayer monster.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

no, it cant...cmon people ive said it and other people have said it, salve and black mask DO NOT STACK.

[blacksimon]

To the guy that said 45 with whip was pushing it.

 

Here you go.

 

Also, as I said earlier this is ASSUMING you are MAXED, meaning with dharok, your 1hp. Im not adding factors like plausability, its all MAX

 

[blacksimon]

And on monsters try this.

 

Get an undead slayer monster, get black mask and salve ammy, best str bonus you can get and pot up. :

 

It WILL help.. right?

 

 

 

doesnt stack

 

Ive tried

[jwrm22]

didnt they already hit 100 on shades with darock?

[blacksimon]

didnt they already hit 100 on shades with darock?

 

 

 

yup, but shades arent people

[frogmite]

Somehow I doubt 31 is possible with crystal bow. Not hit higher than a 29, but I havn't done extensive testing. Max for range is like 57 or so with dragonstone (e) bolts however.

[jessy87]

To the guy that said 45 with whip was pushing it.

 

Here you go.

 

 

 

Quote:

 

*MeLeE

 

A meleer can inflict 48 damage with a dragon halberd or 45 with a whip

 

 

 

 

 

uh the halbred might do that damage, but who pks with it? ok but training with it is reasonable. so alrite ill give you the hally being fine, but a 45 with a whip? where? lol i max hit 40s with my whip maybe 41 or 42 if i had a fire cape.

 

 

 

i said the above statement^^^ and 45 was pushing it, i was speaking of Player Vs. Player however, i have pics of me hitting at least 44 with my whip on a slayer monster. NEVER DID I SAY 45 was pushing it for npc's, for player vs. player its definately pushing it and as you see... later on (ill bold and underline it) you said 45 for player vs player with a whip

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

all my posts have been under this peice of your topic, reason being already said, players play this game and have a mind of their own, im sure if every single person of the runescape comunnity free and member, just up and said we want this or that, they could probably get it. an npc is part of the game its not unique it respawns its programmed to do this and that, a player will whine and complain if he gets killed in the wilderness by an unreasonable amount(dont believe me? goto the officials forums a few times) when i mention things in this thread i mean only against players because against NPC's any more their are always little this or thats, like salve amulet and black mask and who all cares. and every time i read this thread i seem to understand more and more about it more then the author. the guy who was hitting a 45 with a whip CLEARLY had a salve amulet on.

 

 

 

 

 

 

And now in a 1vs1 player enviroment

 

------------------------------------------------

 

NON BARROWS AIDED

 

(no spec)

 

*rAnGeD

 

A ranger will max a 31 potted and prayed with a crystal bow

 

 

 

*AnCiEnT MaGe

 

The ancient mage will max a 30

 

 

 

*NoRmAl MaGe

 

A normal mage can inflict 30 damage maximum aswell

 

 

 

*MeLeE

 

A meleer can inflict 48 damage with a dragon halberd or 45 with a whip

 

-----------------------------------------------

 

(With spec)

 

*rAnGeD

 

A ranger can inflict 50 damage with a MSB spec

 

 

 

*AnCiEnT MaGe

 

An ancient mage can max out 30

 

 

 

*NoRmAl MaGe

 

A normal mage can inflict 30 damage

 

 

 

*MeLeE

 

A meleer can inflict 74 damage with a 37 37 DDP++ spec

 

-----------------------------------------------

 

BARROWS AIDED

 

*rAnGeD

 

A ranger can inflict 50 damage with a MSB spec

 

 

 

*AnCiEnT MaGe

 

An ancient mage can max out 30

 

 

 

*NoRmAl MaGe

 

A normal mage can inflict 30 damage

 

 

 

*MeLeE

 

A meleer can inflict 90 damage on a player with dharoks

 

_________________________________

[blacksimon]

 

the guy who was hitting a 45 with a whip CLEARLY had a salve amulet on.

 

 

 

 

Or did he? :-k

[jessy87]

 

the guy who was hitting a 45 with a whip CLEARLY had a salve amulet on.

 

 

 

 

Or did he? :-k

 

 

 

 

 

wow, have you seen a salve ammulet? i infact knew some1 would say this and i reproduced it all. as soon as i upload this image ill prove to you its salve amulet.

 

 

 

 

 

heres the thing, the salve amulet is the most unique amulet in the game in looks and in chacateristics. their is no other ammy that i know of that has any look that you could consider looking relatively similar to what it looks like, for 1. its purple...2, its got a white string around it, and its prodominately white to, its not like how a thread looks it looks like a white ROPE. the ONLY other amulets that are considerable similar in design are the gnome defense(glarias amulet to i guess..) amulet and the fury amulet, which are 1 in the same for design the coloring is just different i believe and stats the both hand down lower then the string in a block type formation, where as the glory or str or whatever else amulet thats made from a gem is, its a round item. and its very noticeable which is which

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

http://kbase.runescape.com/lang/en/aff/ ... le_id=2714

 

 

 

half way down theirs a picture of a salve amulet.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[blacksimon]

 

best i could find, ill look around for a higher hit

 

 

 

i could have sworn id seen a 44 somewhere :-k

[S_M_JaGeD]

its easier if the atacked person isnt wearing armor and with low defense :

[0Firzen0]

ok since the name of the post is the combat triangle, not max hit, then you should take into consideration that in a duel (or any other normal pvp fight) your not gonna hit 45s with whips (or whatever the max hit is). even if you do pull off a max hit with a whip, it may be followed by 0's. Also, with dharocks, you may be able to pull off a 90 but its so slow that you will be dead before you will be able to hit again, and even if you were able to get another hit in, you most likely will not hit a 90 let alone anything. Most people dont understand this, and is why people generaly like strength over attack. For this reason i like range because of its speed and accuracy. if you want to judge the combat triengle, then instead of max hit, you should calculate average damage.

[runevirage]

ok since the name of the post is the combat triangle, not max hit, then you should take into consideration that in a duel (or any other normal pvp fight) your not gonna hit 45s with whips (or whatever the max hit is). even if you do pull off a max hit with a whip, it may be followed by 0's. Also, with dharocks, you may be able to pull off a 90 but its so slow that you will be dead before you will be able to hit again, and even if you were able to get another hit in, you most likely will not hit a 90 let alone anything. Most people dont understand this, and is why people generaly like strength over attack. For this reason i like range because of its speed and accuracy. if you want to judge the combat triengle, then instead of max hit, you should calculate average damage.

 

 

 

 

 

^Agreed.

 

 

 

Btw blacksimon how do you get incorrectly banned for macroing, I thought RS used a foolproof system of detecting it?

[Rebdragon]

^Agreed.

 

 

 

Btw blacksimon how do you get incorrectly banned for macroing, I thought RS used a foolproof system of detecting it?

 

Lol, yes, we know all their bans are fair from past experiences thanks to their so-called "foolproof system" :roll: :P . For all we know, their foolproof system could be nothing more than a legion of reporthappy 8 year olds.