IHasChicken

That's fine, if you really think that asking people to effectively pay 250k tokens instead of 200 on their first chaotic and you DON'T think that will drive people away, then that is fine. I'm not saying that you need to have people running around with t1 zerker until 90, I agree that there need to be guidelines and at least t7 is EASY to get by 80, t8 in just berserker ring is fine, but t8 in 2 rings by 83 might be a bit hard for some people considering how marginal the benefits are, but how game changing chaotics are. All of you have been such a high DG level for so long that I think maybe you forget how hard it was to struggle for your first rapier. The clan isn't really aimed at people dungeoneering merely for chaotic equipment, though; we're trying to target the people who truly like dungeoneering and who want to get better at it. I agree that the ring tiers may be somewhat harsh, but after you've got your first chaotic, how many more do you really, really need? Anyway after your first chaotic it's not like you're accruing tokens at the same crummy rate as you were before. That's fine, and it's not a bad thing to want that. A bad way to approach it though is to punish people for having the common sense to be shrewd with their tokens. You don't get a rapier until 81 anyway (assuming you unlock all resource dungeons/use TOG/Penguins/other exp to 50 DG,) and the scroll of life, cleansing, and arcane stream are all nearly must haves these days, so we don't want to push people away who are in the 80-85 level range, are fed up with 117, and are willing to learn but are intimidated by the requirements. Just bump the 83 req up a little bit, and the other ones are all perfectly reasonable (considering there are only really 3-4 chaotics that are useful, and most of the other rewards are VERY niché, I'd actually advocate T10 berserker being a requirement at 100 DG flat (which is over 14m exp allowing for 1.1m tokens to be spent on a CCB, Maul, Rapier, Rigour, and one of the dungeoneering shields, as well as a couple of the other rewards), with a t9 secondary ring.) I'd actually be happy to write up a "Suggested Token Expenditure Order," for new players to DGS so they know EXACTLY what each reward is useful and not useful for, and to prevent fail expenditures (such as a CLS as a first chaotic...ugh.)

That's fine, if you really think that asking people to effectively pay 250k tokens instead of 200 on their first chaotic and you DON'T think that will drive people away, then that is fine. I'm not saying that you need to have people running around with t1 zerker until 90, I agree that there need to be guidelines and at least t7 is EASY to get by 80, t8 in just berserker ring is fine, but t8 in 2 rings by 83 might be a bit hard for some people considering how marginal the benefits are, but how game changing chaotics are. All of you have been such a high DG level for so long that I think maybe you forget how hard it was to struggle for your first rapier. Just maybe bump the 83 req up to 85 or even 84 and it'd be much more reasonable, the other ones are fine.

This isn't a "fuss", I just feel that some people, especially new people to the clan, might feel a little bit intimidated about the importance of the rings, and how you may be judging people a little bit too harshly for being a bit hesitant to upgrade their ring for such a minor damage increase, when tokens are so important especially in the earlier levels of dungeoneering. I'm fine personally, i have 2 t8 rings now and I spent all my excess tokens on my ring, and I intend on getting t10 berserker by 102-103 DG, so it's all good.

I will be getting ready. I'm fine with the 2 or 3 week introductory period, although I do think it's slightly unfair because finals are around the corner for most people and I am not immune from them, but that's what they've decided, and that's what i'll stick to.

EEKS is useful for solo armadyl and Nex, provided you don't have a divine or elysian (which is fair enough, not all of us can just have money.) Maul is useful for TDS, PVP, Slayer, and Nex. CLS is ARGUABLY useful for Bandos, and that's it. And, as far as anyone who says that being hacked was "my fault," I went 7 YEARS without it happening, and it, quite frankly, isn't your place to comment on my "bs reasons" or talk about my account security.

I don't know what your problem with me specifically is, but NOTHING deserves this sort of reaction. You need to take a good hard look at yourself and how you address others, because that's just not a fair call at all.

You seem to be under the impression that DGS exists only as a tool for you to obtain chaotics with. DGS is not about overworld rewards, it is about creating better dungeoneers and making floors fast, efficient, and a learning experience. If that extra 2% DPS from 4/5 people is needed to be more efficient (especially when the token cost isn't that high for someone at your level), everyone should strive to upgrade his or her ring. It isn't unreasonable to ask for one to better their skills if the levels they are at are in fact detrimental to the team (i.e. sub 60s in all door skills). However, you seem to have misinterpreted and bastardized my argument. Please don't put words into my mouth for me. If you're going for 300k tokens, wouldn't it make sense to upgrade your ring first so that you can get those 300k tokens faster? I don't know about you, but saving time is good. In fact, you can even use that extra time to go do some Nex, if that's what you desire. I will agree that DG tactics are far more important that an additional 1-2% DPS increase from the RoK, but really, it's not like that extra DPS is hard to get (actually, it doesn't take anymore effort. Think of it as free, additional DPS). Tokens are not hard to obtain once you are at a higher Dungeoneering level. Are there any numbers for an approximate number of Lifepoints for the sum of all monsters in all guardian doors for an average dungeon? I feel that that number could give a rough graph on how much time can be saved per floor by upgrading the RoK. You can be a dungeoneering purist. That's fine for you. This clan, while focusing on people who want to get to 120 and not people who just stop at 85, still isn't a dungeoneering PURIST clan. It'd be unreasonable for these guys to slap a load of restrictions on everything, just to make their floor times look good, and this would just make the environment less fun to work with. It is a GAME firstmost, and dungeoneering is a hobby for me, not the entire experience. I've lost THREE chaotics, not just one, so it's not really even a single chaotic, that's nearly half my DG exp worth of rewards, gone. And don't even get me started on bastardizing arguments. You've turned this around and told me to basically inhibit my whole entire enjoyment of being able to play the game how I want for the difference between a t8 and a t10 ring, which is a 2% increase in a SINGLE combat style. You word your answers so you sound smart. You try to act helpful with a slight tinge of disrespect. But you've never Dungoneered with this clan, you've never talked to anyone, you're not even IN the clan. Keep the opinions to the ranks, and considering your FIRST post on this thread, nay, not even on this thread but on this entire BOARD was talking about how you "hope to get a rank", I don't have much faith in you in having anyone's best interests at heart.

I'll upgrade it to t8, but i'm not doing t9 until I get my EEKS and Maul back. For an exponentially scaling ring, that's unreasonable.

If someone ranked wants to correct me on the DGS stance on this, go ahead. I'd just like to state my own opinion. Overworld rewards are not the focus of DGS. If you intend to use DGS, you should better yourself in every possible way to aid your team. Spending your tokens on Chaotics and neglecting your RoK is quite selfish. I've had a tier eight berserker ring since I was about 75 dungeoneering. Not to sound like a [puncture], but only having tier 7 at your dungeoneering level is kind of pathetic (for lack of a better word). If anything, should you have more chaotics, you should be expected to have a higher tier ring. Yes, it does suck to be hacked, and I sympathize, but bettering your RoK speeds up your dungeons which helps both your teammates and yourself. All of that would be completely and utterly valid... If the difference between t7 and t9 wasn't 2%, and the difference between a chaotic and the nearest substitute is far more than 2%. I'm a maxed player. I rely on Nex for my income, and I need plenty of chaotics for Nex. If losing 2% of ONE STYLE of damage in a dungeon ensures that I can Nex, I'll do it every time. By your logic, no one should DG unless they are maxed, otherwise they're a detriment to their team. No one should DG without 92 herblore for the overload trick, otherwise they're a detriment to their team. There are a million other examples of this - bind choices, stat builds, all of which are accomodated for. Why should someone in my position not be allowed to prioritise? I will get the ring upgraded in 300k tokens - and if i decide to go for 120, I'd've only had t7 for 13 out of 103 million exp. DGing is far more about tactics and attitude than raw damage output anyway, and I feel I hold my own as far as damage goes, so as long as the ranks are fine with it, I'm fine with it. tl;dr As long as I don't run around buying CLS's or Law Staves before upgrading my ring, I feel that I should be allowed to prioritise.

Yeah, I really wish it just said the tier when you moved your cursor over the ring, like "Ring of kinship (berserker t10)". I trust the vast majority of DGSers to upgrade their rings accordingly. If there's ever any doubt you can request a screenshot, which I know some keyers have done before. I would probably do this for people who try to use the clan chat who clearly have not read the guidelines. It's a hassle, but whatever. We'll make due. EDIT: But as previously mentioned, everyone will have a couple weeks before I start going all nazi-efficiency-clown on the chat. Yeah, about that. I've lost 3 chaotics to hacking, and I'm nearly 99 DG with only t7 berserker. Will you take in account how many chaotics someone has before slamming them about the 2-3% bonus their ring would give them? Because by the time I get my maul back and an EEKS, i'll be 101 DG with still only t7 berserker.

I accidentallied myself.

Okay. I'm going to have to ask you to settle down. Just as you hate "Jagex hugging brats," I equally hate people who seem to think it's edgy and cool to criticize Jagex for everything that they do and to basically discount any of their efforts whatsoever, because that's the flavour of the month. Any system's first priority is to stop false positives from occuring. I'm sure Jagex would rather leave 10 bots unbanned than ban 1 legitimate player falsely. I know a LOT of people in this game, and not ONCE have I heard of anyone getting legitimately falsely banned at all. A sample space of one, unconfirmed example isn't enough to just start yelling "FU FU JAMFLAX OMFG STOP BANNING LEGIT PLAYERS YOU MAKE ME SICK!!!" And the comments made about the parenting wasn't about the ban - it was about the fact that, as a parent, OP obviously has no trust in their children because they went all net-nanny on their 10 year old, instead of taking the time to try and explain to their child what is right or wrong to do on the internet, and to let them apply this knowledge themselves. Using this cavalier approach of just trying to ban them from running any executable files will just cause their children to question why these restrictions are in place, and hence, try to find a way around them - it's human nature. Also, if the child is 10 years old, they really shouldn't be playing the game, unless under adult supervision. An internet blocking device is just a plain lazy way to avoid actually having to watch your child. Open communication will do far more than any online filter can do. Reply was so dumb I nearly didn't even bother responding to it. Jagex famously banned the first person to 99 range because they didn't think it was real, he later went to Andrew with his laptop to show him it was legit. Jagex had no control or idea of the famous dupe, so they banned anyone with 'suspicious' amounts of items. Countless among countless wrongly banned people on these forums, with screenshots of conversations with TEMPLATE replies because their customer support system is beyond a joke. From sleeping bags to random events, Jagex can't do [cabbage] about Bots, and the only system they have is players hitting the report button and wrongly accused accounts get no further look unless you pay them money, pathetic. (Don't argue here please, there is way too much evidence). Please, and please, don't [bleep]ing post if you don't know [cabbage]. Jagex have terrible customer support - fact. Jagex have no resources to control exploits in their game and pinpoint disasters ( Durial, row, dupe, knife bug, the list goes on forever). Countless people have been wrongly banned and [cabbage] all has been done about it. This is a rant section where players will whinge about this and people placed in similar positions can relate and discuss. What ruins these forums is the pathetic jagex huggers who don't know [cabbage] and actually believe they do the correct thing. You're discussion on parenting matters isn't worth my time, you sound like a University student with 0 idea so I'm not even going to try to contest you're dumb views. Maybe you shouldn't have bothered posting and went with your gut instinct because all that post proved was that you're not a very nice person.

Unless you're being beaten if you don't meet your ZMI quotas, hmm? That would be the worst, most inhumane, cruel, and despicable action ever committed by anyone in the history of this planet.

Because people on these forums think they have a university degree in behavioral science and know exactly what everyone wants and needs to do all the time always.

What wife bashing bit? There's no wife bashing here, no no. waits for the FBI to swoop down onto my house even though I live in Australia and there's no FBI here...

When I marry you in-game, you're only getting a ring of forging. It's just as useless as you are. [/burn]

I think this applies to everyone and Chicken I [bleep]ing lol'd so goddamn hard. The concert sucked. I don't get how people can enjoy shows like that with bands that are not good in the slightest. BUT, one of my best friends happened to be there, so that was nice. We went to her house afterwards and fooled around, so that was fun. It's now 4:30am. But on the other hand, she's kinda weird. Whatever. Not like I'm marrying this girl. Just marry her in-game. Diamond rings are only 8,975gp, or you could give her a ring of life for 329gp extra so she teleports to Lumbridge after you finish trying to jump in and defend her when some ruffian attacks her in Varrock and you fight him off but the guy hits her down to 1lp and she Rings of Lifes away and she's like "OMFG YOU SAVED MY LIFE" and they all go home and drink chocolate milk and go to bed early.

Too late, I am already crying tears of laughter from the sheer stupidity of this entire conversation.

Regardless of all of these factors, being beaten, playing for 12 hours straight, and all of the harsh injustices that are completely NOT a laughing matter and destroy people's lives and are morally and politically WRONG in every way... It still beats training Runecrafting.

Okay. I'm going to have to ask you to settle down. Just as you hate "Jagex hugging brats," I equally hate people who seem to think it's edgy and cool to criticize Jagex for everything that they do and to basically discount any of their efforts whatsoever, because that's the flavour of the month. Any system's first priority is to stop false positives from occuring. I'm sure Jagex would rather leave 10 bots unbanned than ban 1 legitimate player falsely. I know a LOT of people in this game, and not ONCE have I heard of anyone getting legitimately falsely banned at all. A sample space of one, unconfirmed example isn't enough to just start yelling "FU FU JAMFLAX OMFG STOP BANNING LEGIT PLAYERS YOU MAKE ME SICK!!!" And the comments made about the parenting wasn't about the ban - it was about the fact that, as a parent, OP obviously has no trust in their children because they went all net-nanny on their 10 year old, instead of taking the time to try and explain to their child what is right or wrong to do on the internet, and to let them apply this knowledge themselves. Using this cavalier approach of just trying to ban them from running any executable files will just cause their children to question why these restrictions are in place, and hence, try to find a way around them - it's human nature. Also, if the child is 10 years old, they really shouldn't be playing the game, unless under adult supervision. An internet blocking device is just a plain lazy way to avoid actually having to watch your child. Open communication will do far more than any online filter can do.

It doesn't matter if it's your kid, or Barack Obama. If Jagex bans someone for botting, they usually, 99% of the time, have done something duplicitous. You as a parent have the responsibility to teach your child that actions have consequences, and it is clear from the circumstances that he has found some sort of a way to circumvent your system and macro.

Stay thirsty, my friends.

They do. Even when I use a cannon, jungles still profit and deserts DEFINITELY profit. Those potato cactus/papaya/pess/herb drops pay for the ppots, and the other drops add up very quickly too. Plus elite clues are a nice distraction and are OK profit too.

B& from DGS I went out for dinner with my junior college classmates, initially it was supposed to be 3 guys and 6 girls showing up, but due to last minute changes (idk how) I was the only guy who showed up :mellow: We ate at some Indian place and all the spice and curry has done cabbage to my system. Waiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit. Wait wait wait. Hold the phone. You're a guy? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a1Y73sPHKxw

mvp is whoever gets the most xp during that floor. I never get the most xp in a floor. Ever. My skills suck, so all of the hunter/rc/mining/thieving/agility etc. exp from doors, I never usually get. EDIT: WOO 3000th post L