Is God real post your thoughts!

[user1991]

@Ginger - You said something about "There's not proof aboutthere being no god"

 

or something like that

 

 

 

There literally is no proof of God.

 

(or what I have seen/heard)

 

 

 

And someone who said one person became to become a Homosapien,

 

lol no scientology pl0x.

 

 

 

There's literally no proof for or against God's existence which is why I think the burden of proof argument is so silly when applied here.

 

 

 

God - no evidence (in my opinion) for his existence.

 

 

 

Fairies - no evidence (in my opinion) for their existence.

 

 

 

If I say "fairies" don't exist, are you really so pedantic that you wish me to say "fairies do not exist beyond any reasonable doubt."?

 

 

 

Most things we cannot prove 100% anyway, and I've said this before. Saying "fairies do not exist" could technically be wrong because they could indeed exist - BUT - there is no evidence for them existing. As long as there is no evidence for something existing, we might assume it doesn't. We don't go 50/50. If I ask you whether there is a wizard named Jeremiah who lives in a cave on the moon and rides a unicorn whilst waving a confederate flag, you will say no, because there is no evidence for it. Technically, he could exist, but if you want people to clarify every single time and say "God almost certainly does not exist, as there is absolutely no evidence to suggest it" instead of simply saying "God does not exist", then you're just focusing on semantics..

 

 

 

So to clarify, saying "God does not exist" technically means "There is no good evidence for the existence of God therefore he does not exist beyond any reasonable doubt."

[Ginger_Warrior]

Well Zierro it's true there is no proof on God either way,

 

but there's much more proof by Science.

 

Thank you.

 

 

 

I recognised science is a more solid basis to explore the world from ages ago. It has a defined method to it that can always be examined closely by other scientists, and above all else, it's objective. I've never been religious, nor have I ever believed in God.

 

 

 

I don't believe there is a God. I don't believe Jesus was the Son of the God and I certainly don't think he was crucified to rid the world of sin. As far as I'm concerned, religion is the opium of the masses, and I'm an Atheist existentialist. When I die, I'm not having any of that "going to heaven" stuff at my funeral.

 

 

 

I'm merely stating facts: I can't say there is no God. There is no proof of that either. I certainly doubt a few people on Tip.It are gonna post conclusive evidence that will somehow do what thousands of philosophers have failed to do over several thousand years - prove God doesn't exist.

 

 

 

Much as I'm an Atheist who refuses to believe God exists, simplifying God down to the philosophical nature of the Tooth Fairy is just insulting.

[venomai]

It's only unreasonable if you ask theists for proof if they say "God does exist"

 

What do we mean by proof?

 

 

 

If by proof we simply mean support, then I would expect theists to ask me the same if I were to make an assertion that no gods exist. I'll explain my own support in detail, for the sake of argument:

 

 

 

There is no empirical evidence to suggest that a divine being interacts with our universe. Many things that were once attributed to gods and spirits (solar eclipses, floods, earthquakes, sleep paralysis) are now understood as naturally occurring phenomena -- there is no reason to suspect that the same shift in understanding won't continue with other yet-understood phenomena. So-called religious experiences seem to be little more than visions and feelings generated by a change in brain chemistry (e.g. triggered by drugs or meditation).

 

 

 

If, on the other hand, we mean empirical evidence, then you're asking for something that is logically impossible. Of course we can't acquire empirical evidence of an entity that does not exist.

 

 

 

There's literally no proof for or against God's existence which is why I think the burden of proof argument is so silly when applied here.

 

I'll say it again... I'm not using the burden of proof as an argument in support of strong atheism (and, correct me if I'm mistaken, but nobody else is either). It's a logical fallacy that comes up when one party makes an argument flawed in its logic.

 

 

 

For example, the burden of proof fallacy would come up here:

 

 

 

There literally is no proof of God.

 

No proof against Him, either.

 

RayOxide is the "doubter" or "skeptic" to the assertion that god exists, pointing out the lack of evidence to support god's existence. He is not making a positive assertion of god's (non-)existence.

 

 

 

It is indisputably clear that the burden of proof does not lie on RayOxide. To then switch the burden of proof, as Lenticular_J has done, is what we call a logical fallacy.

 

 

 

Furthermore, Lenticular_J's point, that there is "no proof against Him, either," is moot. Imagine I was to point out that "There is literally no proof of the Invisible Tooth Fairy," and Lenticular_J was to retort with "there is no proof against her, either." Does this strengthen the argument of the Invisible Tooth Fairy's existence? Absolutely not. Most adults recognize that the Invisible Tooth Fairy does not exist not because we have proof of her non-existence, but because we have no proof of her existence (and, as we've established, absence of evidence is often evidence of absence).

 

 

 

Note, though, that the burden of proof is not being used to support strong atheism; rather, it is being used to point out the flaw in Lenticular_J's rebuttal.

 

 

 

simplifying God down to the philosophical nature of the Tooth Fairy is just insulting.

 

I find it no more insulting than pointing out to a "alien abductee" that their experience was more likely a construct of their imagination with no basis in reality.

 

 

 

I'm certainly not about to withdraw my argument in order to "save the dignity" of those who devote their lives to such a 'delusion'.

[folmer_veeman]

i've got proof for the fact that the toothfairy doesn't exist, it's always the parents or other family who remove the tooth from beneath the pillow, or it doesn't happen

[user1991]

Well Zierro it's true there is no proof on God either way,

 

but there's much more proof by Science.

 

Thank you.

 

 

 

I recognised science is a more solid basis to explore the world from ages ago. It has a defined method to it that can always be examined closely by other scientists, and above all else, it's objective. I've never been religious, nor have I ever believed in God.

 

 

 

I don't believe there is a God. I don't believe Jesus was the Son of the God and I certainly don't think he was crucified to rid the world of sin. As far as I'm concerned, religion is the opium of the masses, and I'm an Atheist existentialist. When I die, I'm not having any of that "going to heaven" stuff at my funeral.

 

 

 

I'm merely stating facts: I can't say there is no God. There is no proof of that either. I certainly doubt a few people on Tip.It are gonna post conclusive evidence that will somehow do what thousands of philosophers have failed to do over several thousand years - prove God doesn't exist.

 

 

 

Much as I'm an Atheist who refuses to believe God exists, simplifying God down to the philosophical nature of the Tooth Fairy is just insulting.

 

 

 

Philosophically they're different, but as assertions they aren't.

 

 

 

I see no evidence for either of them. To me, God is in the same realm as unicorns/elves/pixies/fairies etc... I'm sorry if that insults people but that just how I view it. I don't see "design" all around me, sure I feel intrigue but I'm not about to claim therefore that an ancient archaic text is true. Sly Wizard has posted various links apparently showing why the Bible is good enough evidence to believe in such things, I've read those links and I still disagree.

 

 

 

It's not simply that God cannot be proven, it's that in my opinion, there really isn't any evidence for his existence. Therefore I make the toothfairy analogies because to me it's the same thing really. Children are told that santa/toothfairy exists and when they're older their parents tell them that they don't. The only difference between that and God is that with God they continue it for the rest of their lives.

 

 

 

And @ Lenticular J. I think I owe you an apology because when I'm referring to Christians, I don't really mean people like you. I mean the gay marriage banning, praise or burn, tongue-speaking Christians.. Your idea of God, from what I can see from your posts anyway, is totally different to the mainstream Christian idea so if in the past I've insulted you and labelled you under the generic "Christian" label then I'm sorry. By nature, the God you believe in, in your own words is "contradictory" and cannot be proven, and if you believe it I respect what you believe. It is only when people start to oppress others that I really have a problem, and with this whole proposition 8 business I think that Christians have done just that. (Not that they hadn't before, but I mean this is in modern times so it's even more disturbing.)

[user1991]

i've got proof for the fact that the toothfairy doesn't exist, it's always the parents or other family who remove the tooth from beneath the pillow, or it doesn't happen

 

 

 

How do you know the tooth fairy hasn't used some undiscovered quantum technology to take control of your parents and make it seem as if they are doing it, in order to test your faith?

 

 

 

It's the tooth fairy's word until you prove it isn't. The burden of proof is on you, heretic.

 

 

 

Tooth, Guns, And Glory!

 

 

 

Do I really need to put sarcasm tags?

[venomai]

I've got proof suggesting that God didn't create the Earth over several days.

 

 

 

But does disproving a single claim attributed to god or the tooth fairy disprove that entity altogether?

[user1991]

I've got proof suggesting that God didn't create the Earth over several days.

 

 

 

But does disproving a single claim attributed to god or the tooth fairy disprove that entity altogether?

 

 

 

You will never disprove the tooth fairy!

 

 

 

She exists in our hearts, minds, embryos, stem cells and souls!

 

 

 

The evidence is all around you. You have teeth don't you? Look at the world. Where did it come from? The Big Bang theory? But it's a theory! It isn't the Big Bang Fact! You stupid scientists. I also have a theory, and therefore, simply because of the fact that it is a theory, it equally has as much credibility as your theory. Checkmate, scientists!

 

 

 

Oh, you have proof that the Universe is 13.5-14 billion years old, calculated by observing background radiation? Can you prove it 100% down to the exact DAY how old it is? No? Well in that case, you are totally wrong. Due to the slightly small margin of error in scientific measurements, and the lack of 100% certainty in scientific claims, the Earth MUST be 10,000 years old, and my ancient archaic unverifiable text written by desert nomads is therefore the most plausible explanation for the origins of the world. Checkmate scientists

 

 

 

I believe that there exists Tooth the father, tooth the son, and tooth the holy spirit. Tooth the son died for your sins, do you know that? You are forever in Her debt. Praise, or you will burn for all eternity in the depths of tooth-hell.

 

 

 

Can you prove the tooth fairy doesn't exist? No you say? AHA! Checkmate scientists! Simply because you cannot prove She doesn't exist 100%, therefore it means that both assertions have equal credibility. Checkmate, scientists! And you believe there is no evidence for Her existence? AHA! Look all around you. Feel it in your brain. Feel it in your soul. Wait.. you aren't feeling anything? Oh, that's because you aren't trying hard enough. Only the chosen may feel it.

[Howlin0001]

 

Here's the thing, Christians CAN'T accept Big Bang or Evolution, the Bible leaves no room for it.

 

 

 

 

 

Really? Then why is it going to be discussed about the in a few months by the church?

[BlueLancer]

 

Can you prove the tooth fairy doesn't exist? No you say? AHA! Checkmate scientists! Simply because you cannot prove She doesn't exist 100%, therefore it means that both assertions have equal credibility. Checkmate, scientists! And you believe there is no evidence for Her existence? AHA! Look all around you. Feel it in your brain. Feel it in your soul. Wait.. you aren't feeling anything? Oh, that's because you aren't trying hard enough. Only the chosen may feel it.

 

 

 

The only reason why the theory of God as a creator of universe has any more plausibility than the spaghetti monster or toothfairy, is because there isn't conclusive scientific evidence as to what put atoms and the big bang in motion. In theory, until proven otherwise, anything could be the origin of the universe.

 

 

 

If there is ever enough scientific evidence to prove beyond doubt what/how the universe was precisely created, we can discredit all the false theories. Until then in a purely logical debate, none of them can be "disproven".

 

 

 

The flatness of Earth was an equally, hotly disputed 'fact' during the Middle Ages. It had both proponents and opponents. Even though we now know you can't fall out of Earth's edges by sailing to the 'world's end', how would you had convinced the proponents of the theory during a time when astrology and sciences were still in baby shoes and there was no conclusive evidence either way until many centuries down the road?

 

 

 

Likewise, regardless of the truth that exists without us knowing it yet (like the Earth not being flat despite people having radically different views), in the absence of evidence, all theories hold some credibility, including theistic creationism. If science advances radically there's a chance creationism/tooth fairies/gods could be discredited.. Until then, they are just another possibility.

[tryto]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_of_the_gaps

 

 

 

Thousands of years ago, in this scenario, God would have been responsible for lightning, and other easily explainable natural phenomenon today. It's also an argument from ignorance- "We don't know what caused it, therefore God."

 

 

 

If I'm not mistaken, the Spaghetti Monster is claimed to have created life and the Big Bang. If not, I could make up a supernatural entity that I say is responsible for these, and it would have the same plausibililty of God.

[Ginger_Warrior]

 

Here's the thing, Christians CAN'T accept Big Bang or Evolution, the Bible leaves no room for it.

 

 

 

 

 

Really? Then why is it going to be discussed about the in a few months by the church?

 

The thing is, there's been Christians saying for generations that when the Bible talks about how God made life over several days, the days really stand for stages in evolution. Of course, I regard that as "covering your tracks" rather than any real knowledge about evolution, but it's still a valid opinion.

 

 

 

I don't know what part of Christianity you're a member of Saru, but not all Christians will literally accept the Bible word-for-word, and there are plenty of Christian organisations that will accept the Bible has scope to accept evolution.

[user1991]

 

Can you prove the tooth fairy doesn't exist? No you say? AHA! Checkmate scientists! Simply because you cannot prove She doesn't exist 100%, therefore it means that both assertions have equal credibility. Checkmate, scientists! And you believe there is no evidence for Her existence? AHA! Look all around you. Feel it in your brain. Feel it in your soul. Wait.. you aren't feeling anything? Oh, that's because you aren't trying hard enough. Only the chosen may feel it.

 

 

 

The only reason why the theory of God as a creator of universe has any more plausibility than the spaghetti monster or toothfairy, is because there isn't conclusive scientific evidence as to what put atoms and the big bang in motion. In theory, until proven otherwise, anything could be the origin of the universe.

 

 

 

If there is ever enough scientific evidence to prove beyond doubt what/how the universe was precisely created, we can discredit all the false theories. Until then in a purely logical debate, none of them can be "disproven".

 

 

 

The flatness of Earth was an equally, hotly disputed 'fact' during the Middle Ages. It had both proponents and opponents. Even though we now know you can't fall out of Earth's edges by sailing to the 'world's end', how would you had convinced the proponents of the theory during a time when astrology and sciences were still in baby shoes and there was no conclusive evidence either way until many centuries down the road?

 

 

 

Likewise, regardless of the truth that exists without us knowing it yet (like the Earth not being flat despite people having radically different views), in the absence of evidence, all theories hold some credibility, including theistic creationism. If science advances radically it's a possibility it could be discredited.. Until then it's just another possibility.

 

 

 

(A possibility with absolutely no testable evidence.)

 

 

 

Why is God more credible than the tooth fairy as being the creator of the universe? I believe the tooth fairy created the universe, and this is because when I talk to the tooth fairy at night my prayers are answered. I ask to be alive the next day, and when I wake up alive, I know, beyond doubt, that the tooth fairy has answered me. Checkmate, scientists!

 

 

 

The tooth fairy also tells me that black/asian/latino people cannot marry because teeth are white and therefore by getting married they are defiling the ancient institution of marriage. Checkmate, civil rights activists!

 

If they want to get married, they should just choose not to be black! Afterall, being black is a choice. No scientific evidence for such a claim? Well I don't care about science, the tooth fairy wouldn't have created a Universe in which people would be born with genetic differences and therefore have different physical/mental attributes. What a stupid theory! The tooth fairy created man in her image. Teeth are white. Therefore, minorities cannot marry. Checkmate scientists!

[folmer_veeman]

 

Here's the thing, Christians CAN'T accept Big Bang or Evolution, the Bible leaves no room for it.

 

 

 

 

 

Really? Then why is it going to be discussed about the in a few months by the church?

 

The thing is, there's been Christians saying for generations that when the Bible talks about how God made life over several days, the days really stand for stages in evolution. Of course, I regard that as "covering your tracks" rather than any real knowledge about evolution, but it's still a valid opinion.

 

 

 

I don't know what part of Christianity you're a member of Saru, but not all Christians will literally accept the Bible word-for-word, and there are plenty of Christian organisations that will accept the Bible has scope to accept evolution.

 

 

 

 

 

exactly ginger, that's what i've been trying to explain people for years....

 

 

 

i don't really think many things in the bible have really happened, but they are metaphors.

 

let me explain, jesus walks over water, water is perilous and thus this might be a metaphor for 'walking over' your problems \

[user1991]

 

Here's the thing, Christians CAN'T accept Big Bang or Evolution, the Bible leaves no room for it.

 

 

 

 

 

Really? Then why is it going to be discussed about the in a few months by the church?

 

The thing is, there's been Christians saying for generations that when the Bible talks about how God made life over several days, the days really stand for stages in evolution. Of course, I regard that as "covering your tracks" rather than any real knowledge about evolution, but it's still a valid opinion.

 

 

 

I don't know what part of Christianity you're a member of Saru, but not all Christians will literally accept the Bible word-for-word, and there are plenty of Christian organisations that will accept the Bible has scope to accept evolution.

 

 

 

 

 

exactly ginger, that's what i've been trying to explain people for years....

 

 

 

i don't really think many things in the bible have really happened, but they are metaphors.

 

let me explain, jesus walks over water, water is perilous and thus this might be a metaphor for 'walking over' your problems \

 

 

 

Jesus is a fake God! Only the tooth fairy exists! Why? Because it says so in this ancient text I have with me here.

 

 

 

Whenever I read the toothle, it says "Love your neighbor as yourself, if someone asks you for help, help them" and "Give all your money to the poor." - clearly, what this actually means is that we should create an unjustifiable capitalist system in which true equality can never prosper, deny the civil/human rights of certain minorities by using our oppressive consensus to silence them into agreement, and we should never help anyone who is poor and sick because they should pull themselves up by their bootstraps, even if they are literally dying at our feet. As well as this, it also implies that we should invade foreign countries and have a huge, huge arsenal of weapons, that could easily be used to destroy the world, at our disposal.

 

 

 

Checkmate, socialists/scientists/pacifists!

[Howlin0001]

 

Here's the thing, Christians CAN'T accept Big Bang or Evolution, the Bible leaves no room for it.

 

 

 

 

 

Really? Then why is it going to be discussed about the in a few months by the church?

 

Genesis isn't a science book: Vatican to study evolution

 

Opps sorry I forgot to add a link.

 

Looks like there they are going to accept evolution (or something like that-I think).

[folmer_veeman]

 

Jesus is a fake God! Only the tooth fairy exists! Why? Because it says so in this ancient text I have with me here.

 

 

 

Whenever I read the toothle, it says "Love your neighbor as yourself, if someone asks you for help, help them" and "Give all your money to the poor." - clearly, what this actually means is that we should create an unjustifiable capitalist system in which true equality can never prosper, deny the civil/human rights of certain minorities by using our oppressive consensus to silence them into agreement, and we should never help anyone who is poor and sick because they should pull themselves up by their bootstraps, even if they are literally dying at our feet. As well as this, it also implies that we should invade foreign countries and have a huge, huge arsenal of weapons, that could easily be used to destroy the world, at our disposal.

 

 

 

Checkmate, socialists/scientists/pacifists!

 

 

 

you are true of your name, let me tell you that..

 

 

 

jesus was never considered a god :ugeek: , and still, what are you trying to tell is with the rest of your blabbity?

[user1991]

 

Jesus is a fake God! Only the tooth fairy exists! Why? Because it says so in this ancient text I have with me here.

 

 

 

Whenever I read the toothle, it says "Love your neighbor as yourself, if someone asks you for help, help them" and "Give all your money to the poor." - clearly, what this actually means is that we should create an unjustifiable capitalist system in which true equality can never prosper, deny the civil/human rights of certain minorities by using our oppressive consensus to silence them into agreement, and we should never help anyone who is poor and sick because they should pull themselves up by their bootstraps, even if they are literally dying at our feet. As well as this, it also implies that we should invade foreign countries and have a huge, huge arsenal of weapons, that could easily be used to destroy the world, at our disposal.

 

 

 

Checkmate, socialists/scientists/pacifists!

 

 

 

you are true of your name, let me tell you that..

 

 

 

jesus was never considered a god :ugeek: , and still, what are you trying to tell is with the rest of your blabbity?

 

 

 

You don't realise that my entire post is sarcasm?

[folmer_veeman]

 

Jesus is a fake God! Only the tooth fairy exists! Why? Because it says so in this ancient text I have with me here.

 

 

 

Whenever I read the toothle, it says "Love your neighbor as yourself, if someone asks you for help, help them" and "Give all your money to the poor." - clearly, what this actually means is that we should create an unjustifiable capitalist system in which true equality can never prosper, deny the civil/human rights of certain minorities by using our oppressive consensus to silence them into agreement, and we should never help anyone who is poor and sick because they should pull themselves up by their bootstraps, even if they are literally dying at our feet. As well as this, it also implies that we should invade foreign countries and have a huge, huge arsenal of weapons, that could easily be used to destroy the world, at our disposal.

 

 

 

Checkmate, socialists/scientists/pacifists!

 

 

 

you are true of your name, let me tell you that..

 

 

 

jesus was never considered a god :ugeek: , and still, what are you trying to tell is with the rest of your blabbity?

 

 

 

You don't realise that my entire post is sarcasm?

 

 

 

ofcourse i realised that :wall:

 

 

 

but what are you trying to tell us by posting that blabbity?

[user1991]

 

Jesus is a fake God! Only the tooth fairy exists! Why? Because it says so in this ancient text I have with me here.

 

 

 

Whenever I read the toothle, it says "Love your neighbor as yourself, if someone asks you for help, help them" and "Give all your money to the poor." - clearly, what this actually means is that we should create an unjustifiable capitalist system in which true equality can never prosper, deny the civil/human rights of certain minorities by using our oppressive consensus to silence them into agreement, and we should never help anyone who is poor and sick because they should pull themselves up by their bootstraps, even if they are literally dying at our feet. As well as this, it also implies that we should invade foreign countries and have a huge, huge arsenal of weapons, that could easily be used to destroy the world, at our disposal.

 

 

 

Checkmate, socialists/scientists/pacifists!

 

 

 

you are true of your name, let me tell you that..

 

 

 

jesus was never considered a god :ugeek: , and still, what are you trying to tell is with the rest of your blabbity?

 

 

 

You don't realise that my entire post is sarcasm?

 

 

 

ofcourse i realised that :wall:

 

 

 

but what are you trying to tell us by posting that blabbity?

 

 

 

If you can't see what I'm saying, then there really isn't any reason for me to explain.

[Sly_Wizard]

let me explain, jesus walks over water, water is perilous and thus this might be a metaphor for 'walking over' your problems \

 

 

 

Yeah... No.

[Obtaurian]

That's kind of how people feel when other people completely dismiss science. You can deny and deny until you're blue in the face, but evolution is real, the big bang happened, and the Earth is 4 billion years old.

 

I know the first one, pretty sure about the second, but I dunno about the last one. Can't really be too positive about that yet.

 

 

 

 

The actual figure is ABOUT 4.5 billion. Feel free to look it up though, it's quite interesting.

[Ginger_Warrior]

let me explain, jesus walks over water, water is perilous and thus this might be a metaphor for 'walking over' your problems \

 

 

 

Yeah... No.

 

So Jesus did literally walk on water then, in your view?

[Sly_Wizard]

let me explain, jesus walks over water, water is perilous and thus this might be a metaphor for 'walking over' your problems \

 

 

 

Yeah... No.

 

So Jesus did literally walk on water then, in your view?

 

 

 

Yessum.

[user1991]

let me explain, jesus walks over water, water is perilous and thus this might be a metaphor for 'walking over' your problems \

 

 

 

Yeah... No.

 

So Jesus did literally walk on water then, in your view?

 

 

 

Yessum.

 

 

 

Do you really think the Bible is good enough evidence to make such claims about existence/the Universe?

 

 

 

Jesus existed (almost certainly), but saying that he is the Son of God is a different matter. In my opinion, the Bible isn't enough evidence for that.