i_love_burritos Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Look, I don't want to be labelled a crazy nutjob, but I believe that terrorists, it is their mission to cause harm to others and when one's life is in danger, even one person shouldn't have to die for these terrorists. As long as lives are saved all types of torture should be allowed. Senseless violence is another thing. However these people, made their choice of how to lead their lives, and if they are threatening the lives of others, I have no hesitation in allowing them to be tortured. The effectiveness of this torture is something else. If one is being tortured to such an extent he or she will say anything to make it stop. So I don't know about how effective it is. But it should be implemented. But also, ONLY when other lives are at immeadiate danger/risk. So yeah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magekillr Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 I'd rather torture a few terrorists in hopes of getting information needed to prevent a future attack then not and have no hopes of preventing a future attack. If only life was an episode of 24, then torture might actually be justified... :lol: Justifiable*. I don't care if it worked (it clearly doesn't), it's wrong. It's never justified, but they would have a "justifiable" argument for it. I think most Americans really think 24 is how the real world operates lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstain Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Look, I don't want to be labelled a crazy nutjob, but I believe that terrorists, it is their mission to cause harm to others and when one's life is in danger, even one person shouldn't have to die for these terrorists. As long as lives are saved all types of torture should be allowed. Senseless violence is another thing. However these people, made their choice of how to lead their lives, and if they are threatening the lives of others, I have no hesitation in allowing them to be tortured. The effectiveness of this torture is something else. If one is being tortured to such an extent he or she will say anything to make it stop. So I don't know about how effective it is. But it should be implemented. But also, ONLY when other lives are at immeadiate danger/risk. So yeah. Not crazy nut job, just uneducated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollyboy Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 But it should be implemented. But also, ONLY when other lives are at immeadiate danger/risk. You mean when a terrorist is caught with an actual bomb around their chest, and that intelligence indicates there is a high potential that he has other accomplices ready to attack? Then I would have to agree on torture being used as a last resort to gain information. If I remember correctly some of the 'terrorist' that were caught, were actually dobbed in by disgruntled neighbours or by feuding clans. These same 'terrorist' were not tried till years later, and were tortured. That just seems wrong. Atleast find them guilty before conducting any sort of torture. Even then I would find it hard to accept the use of torture, unless there was that immediate danger. "I'd rather bear the comments people say to insult ya, then to poison my skin and erase my culture " - Deep Foundation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstain Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 But it should be implemented. But also, ONLY when other lives are at immeadiate danger/risk. You mean when a terrorist is caught with an actual bomb around their chest, and that intelligence indicates there is a high potential that he has other accomplices ready to attack? Then I would have to agree on torture being used as a last resort to gain information. If I remember correctly some of the 'terrorist' that were caught, were actually dobbed in by disgruntled neighbours or by feuding clans. These same 'terrorist' were not tried till years later, and were tortured. That just seems wrong. Atleast find them guilty before conducting any sort of torture. Even then I would find it hard to accept the use of torture, unless there was that immediate danger. Why the hell do I even bother posting links if no one reads them? anyway, You can receive millions of dollars for helping the Anti-Taliban Forces catch Al-Qaida and Taliban murderers. This is enough money to take care of your family, your village, your tribe for the rest of your life. Pay for livestock and doctors and schoolbooks and housing for all your people Sample text from leaflet handed out in Afghanistan by US Forces. I'm not going to bother referencing it because people here don't even click Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roseiah Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 There are always other ways to get information out of people, torturing people who may or may not of done something is not something is not something I think is right, but I believe in innocent until proven guilty. Unless someone is of proven guilt you can not torture them for information they may not even have. What if they actually got it wrong, and they had arrested an innocent man, and then they tortured that man for hours on end asking for information that he wanted to give but simply did not have. It could happen. On the other hand, if there is a threat to someone else's live, or someone else is in danger, for example, a kidnapper is found and they have admitted to the kidnap but the victim is still yet to be found and in grave danger, then if time was running out and all other methods had been tried, then torturing them to save the victims life seems like a reasonable solution. However, torture does not always work, when someone is being tortured they may confess to a crime they did not commit just to stop being tortured. I know if I was being tortured all day and all night I would do anything for it to stop, even if it lead to my death, because death is better than endless pain. I would rather be branded a criminal and lying 6 feet underground where no-one could hurt me rather than being tortured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faux Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 US could pay me to sing to these poor sobs :: Guess the Movie Contest Champion: pfilc23 :: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiriyama Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 US could pay me to sing to these poor sobs I think that goes beyond cruel and unusual. Anyway, I doubt torture actually works. Put enough pressure on someone and they'll say anything. If you suspect them, you won't stop until they admit it. Its a losing situation for both sides. Denizen of Darkness| PSN= sworddude198 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_love_burritos Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Look, I don't want to be labelled a crazy nutjob, but I believe that terrorists, it is their mission to cause harm to others and when one's life is in danger, even one person shouldn't have to die for these terrorists. As long as lives are saved all types of torture should be allowed. Senseless violence is another thing. However these people, made their choice of how to lead their lives, and if they are threatening the lives of others, I have no hesitation in allowing them to be tortured. The effectiveness of this torture is something else. If one is being tortured to such an extent he or she will say anything to make it stop. So I don't know about how effective it is. But it should be implemented. But also, ONLY when other lives are at immeadiate danger/risk. So yeah. Not crazy nut job, just uneducated Would you care to explain, instead of putting simple minded one-sentence responses, like the moron you are ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstain Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Look, I don't want to be labelled a crazy nutjob, but I believe that terrorists, it is their mission to cause harm to others and when one's life is in danger, even one person shouldn't have to die for these terrorists. As long as lives are saved all types of torture should be allowed. Senseless violence is another thing. However these people, made their choice of how to lead their lives, and if they are threatening the lives of others, I have no hesitation in allowing them to be tortured. The effectiveness of this torture is something else. If one is being tortured to such an extent he or she will say anything to make it stop. So I don't know about how effective it is. But it should be implemented. But also, ONLY when other lives are at immeadiate danger/risk. So yeah. Not crazy nut job, just uneducated Would you care to explain, instead of putting simple minded one-sentence responses, like the moron you are ? Read the links I've posted earlier in the thread. Rapport building > torture. There isn't even evidence that torture is effective Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_love_burritos Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Ok, I concede. However if you bothered to read past the first two sentences of my responses you would see that The effectiveness of this torture is something else. If one is being tortured to such an extent he or she will say anything to make it stop. So I don't know about how effective it is. You would infer that I didn't know about its use, prescribed methods of effectiveness. Base your intelligent response from the entirity of another's argument not from fragments that you assume and then take out of context. Also, I don't think there is a real need for a context as my statement was quite clear cut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstain Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Ok, I concede. However if you bothered to read past the first two sentences of my responses you would see that The effectiveness of this torture is something else. If one is being tortured to such an extent he or she will say anything to make it stop. So I don't know about how effective it is. You would infer that I didn't know about its use, prescribed methods of effectiveness. Base your intelligent response from the entirity of another's argument not from fragments that you assume and then take out of context. Also, I don't think there is a real need for a context as my statement was quite clear cut. As long as lives are saved all types of torture should be allowed... But it should be implemented. Kind of contradictory there bud. And using big words doesn't make you seem smart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_love_burritos Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Ok, I concede. However if you bothered to read past the first two sentences of my responses you would see that The effectiveness of this torture is something else. If one is being tortured to such an extent he or she will say anything to make it stop. So I don't know about how effective it is. You would infer that I didn't know about its use, prescribed methods of effectiveness. Base your intelligent response from the entirity of another's argument not from fragments that you assume and then take out of context. Also, I don't think there is a real need for a context as my statement was quite clear cut. As long as lives are saved all types of torture should be allowed... But it should be implemented. Kind of contradictory there bud. And using big words doesn't make you seem smart. I don't want to get into a flame war or anything but, lets see. Ok, first part of my statement. "As long as lives are saved all types of torture should be allowed" Note: I'm arguing FOR use of torture in the case which it saves lives. Then the ellipses, just as a final note on the end to sum up my point. "But it should be implemented." Implement:/ n.im-pluh-muhnt; v. im-pluh-ment, -muhnt -noun 3. a means; agent: human beings as an implement of divine plan. verb (used with object) 4. to fulfill; perform; carry out: Once in office, he failed to implement his campaign promises. So in both parts I'm saying it should be allowed on the basis it saves other's lives. Simple enough for you ? I fail to see the contradiction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millard Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 I really don't think there is any point in arguing with someone who uses the term "Big Words". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ren0gade Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Torture all the sick, crazy, nutty serial killers who do the same thing to their victims, except never kill them just drag on the torture for years and years. That would be pretty righteous and honestly, i think pretty hilarious to hear them cry about it. Masta Chef Drops-- Dragon: Medium(2),Spear(1),Legs(2),Skirt(1) Pharaoh's Scepter(1) Barrows items(10 total) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
l0l0lpur34 Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Torture all the sick, crazy, nutty serial killers who do the same thing to their victims, except never kill them just drag on the torture for years and years. That would be pretty righteous and honestly, i think pretty hilarious to hear them cry about it. Just another example of how certain topics (torture being one of them) brings out the worst of OT - I can't believe people can write such sadistic stuff then round it off with "them cry about it". Yes serial killers are scum but torturing another human being is never "hilarious". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmesh Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Kind of contradictory there bud. And using big words doesn't make you seem smart. Don't hurt their cyber ego now. Shout to LowFatMilk for the sig! Doin your body and sig good :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstain Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 I really don't think there is any point in arguing with someone who brings evidence to the table when the other side can't Agreed Hate to be the one to break this to you, but real life isn't an episode of 24 So in both parts I'm saying it should be allowed on the basis it saves other's lives. Simple enough for you ? I fail to see the contradiction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmmcannibalism Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Torture all the sick, crazy, nutty serial killers who do the same thing to their victims, except never kill them just drag on the torture for years and years. That would be pretty righteous and honestly, i think pretty hilarious to hear them cry about it. I wish you were president, we would be so much better off /bull Orthodoxy is unconciousnessthe only ones who should kill are those who are prepared to be killed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_love_burritos Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 I really don't think there is any point in arguing with someone who brings evidence to the table when the other side can't Agreed Hate to be the one to break this to you, but real life isn't an episode of 24 So in both parts I'm saying it should be allowed on the basis it saves other's lives. Simple enough for you ? I fail to see the contradiction. If only life was an episode of 24, then torture might actually be justified I never said it was an episode of 24. And there is no need for you to "break" anything to me, I know what I'm saying. I really don't think there is any point in arguing with someone who brings evidence to the table when the other side can't T_Millard said that a few pages back, you took it out of context on my behalf and it's now made you look stupid. [hide=Flame]Stop trying to argue anything, you'll just end up failing like you did in your last two posts.[/hide] I really don't think there is any point in arguing with someone who uses the term "Big Words". He's referring to you "bloodstain". ;) So, I'm done. If you want to continue this argument, feel free to PM me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstain Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 I'm aware he was referring to me, and I don't really care. He contributed nothing to the topic so whatever. Still waiting on any evidence that torture > rapport building. Rapport building will save lives, not torture Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_love_burritos Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Oh my god how thick can you get ? I wrote "Look, I don't want to be labelled a crazy nutjob, but I believe that terrorists, it is their mission to cause harm to others and when one's life is in danger, even one person shouldn't have to die for these terrorists. As long as lives are saved all types of torture should be allowed. Senseless violence is another thing. However these people, made their choice of how to lead their lives, and if they are threatening the lives of others, I have no hesitation in allowing them to be tortured. The effectiveness of this torture is something else. If one is being tortured to such an extent he or she will say anything to make it stop. So I don't know about how effective it is. But it should be implemented. But also, ONLY when other lives are at immeadiate danger/risk. So yeah." I never said that torture is ">" rapport building. My statement in 25 words or less is : "You should use torture in the worst case scenarios, but also, I don't know about how "good" it is." Must I explain further ? I'm aware he was referring to me, and I don't really care. So you purposely quote others, to purposely make youself look stupid ? Riiiight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstain Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 You suggested using torture under the assumption that it actually works, it does not. If you had read any of my previous posts in the thread you would have known that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieMcD Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Torture all the sick, crazy, nutty serial killers who do the same thing to their victims, except never kill them just drag on the torture for years and years. That would be pretty righteous and honestly, i think pretty hilarious to hear them cry about it. Torture I view only ever as a last resort, and I don't even know how effective it would be considering you can't know what's true or not as people would say yes to anything to make it stop. If you get pleasure out of watching them suffer in pain though, you are just as low and scummy as them. There's nothing hilarious about extreme physical or mental pain and physical or mental stress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nenga Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Torture all the sick, crazy, nutty serial killers who do the same thing to their victims, except never kill them just drag on the torture for years and years. That would be pretty righteous and honestly, i think pretty hilarious to hear them cry about it. Torture I view only ever as a last resort, and I don't even know how effective it would be considering you can't know what's true or not as people would say yes to anything to make it stop. If you get pleasure out of watching them suffer in pain though, you are just as low and scummy as them. There's nothing hilarious about extreme physical or mental pain and physical or mental stress. Funny: maybe not. Just punishment: hell yes Ponies! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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