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personalized shops is the very LAST straw jagex


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#1
canadiansmurf
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I think personalized shops have just changed the game as much as restricting free trade and eliminating the wildy did.



I think the personalized shops update would have been a good idea IF the amount people could buy was realistic, or even generous. I don't see the point of rationing items to such an extreme level.



I wonder what jagex are thinking when they change the gameplay so much. I don't think the game needs this upheavel or chaos.



Also it seems with each update the player interaction is just being taken away. I liked seeing what others sold to shops.



I predict that buying items in large quantities will be a pain. In one move jagex has effectively made GP worthless. Items will be bartered for other scarce items. Welcome to the frustrating age of bartering.



I think that the worst part is all of these RS changes are related to mechscape, we are just being the guinea pigs for it. Things like runetek 5 is probably what mechscape will run on.



Also it seems that they've lost another round of players recently. Less people are logging in that normal.



^This will probably cause another knee-jerk reaction from jagex as they will scramble to get more players. I know nothing about business but even I can see that going from 200k+ players in 2007 to hovering around 140k at peak times in 2009 is not moving in the right direction. Most companies try to grow their business, jagex does the opposite.





My two cents is that I am tired of the gameplay changing drastically. I am tired of HD being shoved down our throats when so many players requested SD. Shiny new graphics are great but I just don't play rs for graphics and I don't even notice the graphics after looking at them once. Yes I can choose to turn everything off, however why should I waste my time doing this. All of the extra's should be optional, instead of the default setting.



I wish jagex would stop copying other mmorpg's the new cursor buttons remind me of Free Realms.





I am tired of broken promises and a laggy, buggy unplayable game.



So at summer's end I find that I can't play RS anymore thanks to the changes Jagex made.



Oh and if Jagex is even ever looking at fan sites, I was going to make my pure member's as I was tired of my main. Glad I didn't and I cancelled members on my main.



I'm dusting off my skillcapes and hanging them in my poh closet. It was fun while it lasted but I'm done. Thanks jagex for breaking my addiction.

Oh and no one could pay me to play mechscape after what i've put up with for runescape, that would just be torturing myself more.

#2
Bladewing
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FYI: Wait 'til tomorrow, or whenever this week's update comes out. Some JMod forum posts indicate that it will "make it all worthwhile". We'll see though.

#3
canadiansmurf
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I saw that.



However I don't believe in jagex's smoke and mirror illusions any longer.





The bottom line for me is that I play a game for fun.

#4
langer
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I don't have the same opinion on the matter and like you said, you should stop playing a game when it's not fun anymore, but there are 2 points of your post that require adjustments.



In 2007 when the peak players was at 200K, there were countless bots and goldfarmers. That number was inflated because of that fact.



The simple mention that GP is made worthless is very thin and short-sighted. Some items have been given a weird fix with the latest update, but nothing ground breaking worth saying GP are now worthless.


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#5
quelmotz
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Really, what you've said was YET another post full of nitpicks, ridiculous facts and some random crap.



I think personalized shops have just changed the game as much as restricting free trade and eliminating the wildy did.




That's a flat-out exaggeration. Enough said.



I think the personalized shops update would have been a good idea IF the amount people could buy was realistic, or even generous. I don't see the point of rationing items to such an extreme level.




This I agree with. I don't see how rationing items to such a level would help to ease the GE price restrictions. I think Jagex should have explained how it would ease up GE restrictions. It's better to give a technical description and mystify 95% of the population rather than say "oh some strange reasons that are too technical for us to describe", which would lead to players thinking they're just trying to trick them.



Also it seems with each update the player interaction is just being taken away. I liked seeing what others sold to shops.




This is just a flat-out nitpick. Nitpicks just show you have no content to write about. Every single major update you have to nitpick on it and talk a lot about minor points and personal stuff that most people don't do.



I predict that buying items in large quantities will be a pain. In one move jagex has effectively made GP worthless. Items will be bartered for other scarce items. Welcome to the frustrating age of bartering.




This is utter and total rubbish. Players WILL find a way around this. Just wait and see. They'll start MAKING their own items instead of buying them, which COULD BE the motivation behind the update. I don't know. During your so-called "golden age of RS", there was a lot of bartering too. Why don't you complain about it? Oh, I see, it's because you have nothing much to say, and to fill up space, you just nitpick.



Also it seems that they've lost another round of players recently. Less people are logging in that normal.



^This will probably cause another knee-jerk reaction from jagex as they will scramble to get more players. I know nothing about business but even I can see that going from 200k+ players in 2007 to hovering around 140k at peak times in 2009 is not moving in the right direction. Most companies try to grow their business, jagex does the opposite.




This is absolute [cabbage].



How many times do people have to repeat - those player numbers were largely made out of bots.



RuneScape is prospering - how would they get the title of the best free MMO then? Don't spout nonsense without thinking.



My two cents is that I am tired of the gameplay changing drastically. I am tired of HD being shoved down our throats when so many players requested SD. Shiny new graphics are great but I just don't play rs for graphics and I don't even notice the graphics after looking at them once. Yes I can choose to turn everything off, however why should I waste my time doing this. All of the extra's should be optional, instead of the default setting.




This is another nitpick. Does it kill you that there are some new graphics? The extras can be turned off. You're really too petty about all these things. It takes what, 2 seconds to select SD instead of HD.



I wish jagex would stop copying other mmorpg's the new cursor buttons remind me of Free Realms.




So? This isn't a copyrighted idea. Anyone can make some new cursor buttons, and just because it reminds you of another game's cursor, doesn't mean it is copied.



I am tired of broken promises and a laggy, buggy unplayable game.




Lag is caused by your own computer, so shut the hell up. Stop pushing the blame to Jagex when it's your own fault/your ISP's fault.



I think that the worst part is all of these RS changes are related to mechscape, we are just being the guinea pigs for it. Things like runetek 5 is probably what mechscape will run on.




Absurd. You ASSUMED every single thing without a tiny bit of proof. Why is it called "runetek 5" then? "All of these changes are related to mechscape"? How the hell are personalised shops and stuff related to mechscape directly? Stop nitpicking and assuming things and trying to find fault with every tiny bit of updates.

#6
canadiansmurf
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The simple mention that GP is made worthless is very thin and short-sighted. Some items have been given a weird fix with the latest update, but nothing ground breaking worth saying GP are now worthless




In my eyes if you have the GP but can't BUY the items you need to play, it makes GP worthless. Give it a week or a month for supplies to dry up, then come talk to me when you can't buy basics.



It's tedious to DIY or have items trickle in slowly in miniscule quantities through the GE.



Loosening price floors means that now junk is not stable, so junk trading to overpay for items you need is out the door.



The only thing left is to barter and hope and pray that you have items other players want in exchange for what you need. This is much worse than what existed pre-trade restrictions. Pre-trade restrictions it was one step to buying what you needed, post on forums and overpay with GP.

#7
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In my eyes if you have the GP but can't BUY the items you need to play, it makes GP worthless. Give it a week or a month for supplies to dry up, then come talk to me when you can't buy basics.



It's tedious to DIY or have items trickle in slowly in miniscule quantities through the GE.



Loosening price floors means that now junk is not stable, so junk trading to overpay for items you need is out the door.



The only thing left is to barter and hope and pray that you have items other players want in exchange for what you need. This is much worse than what existed pre-trade restrictions. Pre-trade restrictions it was one step to buying what you needed, post on forums and overpay with GP.




I guess I'll have to adapt to the situation, which is not that bad from my perspective.

It's tedious to DIY if you don't like it and getting items slowly through the G.E. just means you have to plan in advance what you wanna skill. I don't mind planning in advance.

It's a great thing that junk is not stable, it was never meant to be used this way.

Pre-trade restrictions was much harder to buy. You needed to have the right seller online, the right price and the quantity.

I usually have the right item the other player wants, it's called GP.


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#8
canadiansmurf
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It's a great thing that junk is not stable, it was never meant to be used this way.




Andrew himself did state that he wasn't anti-junk.



The way you played the game, junk wasn't a factor and you can care less that it's not stable.



Junk did create stablility though, and now that is gone. When new items come into the game and are underpriced by Jagex, junk trades is the main way to accquire these items. Pre-trade restrictions these items were easy to purchase as players set the price.





I usually have the right item the other player wants, it's called GP




You are missing something crucial here, if players set the price than they can accept pure GP. Currently the way trade is set up even player to player the price cannot be set, its fixed GE prices. Also even if prices [bleep]e the demand will still be higher than the supply, and it's frustrating trying to purchase items on the GE that never sell or trickle in slowly. Why would someone go out of their way to sell an item to you if it sells instantly for them at max price on the GE?



I just don't think it was neccessary to add another layer of pure frustration to the game.



What is the point of me running around all of these stores just to get a fairly small stock of runes that won't even last one hour and this is assuming that you have done the quests to access some of these shops. :wall:



It's like a twisted joke.



From RSOF:



For deaths you can get 1220 runes:

300 from Mage Arena Lundail's Arena-side Rune Shop

300 from Wizards' Guild, 2nd Floor Magic Guild Store - Runes and Staves

300 from Lunar Isle Baba Yaga's Magic Shop

100 from Al Kharid Ali's Discount Rune Shop

100 from Wilderness, North of Edgeville Battle Runes

100 from Void Knights' Outpost Void Knight Magic Store

10 from Port Sarim Betty's Magic Emporium

10 from Varrock Aubury's Rune Shop



For bloods you can get 400 runes:

100 from Al Kharid Ali's Discount Rune Shop

100 from Wizards' Guild, 2nd Floor Magic Guild Store - Runes and Staves

100 from Wilderness, North of Edgeville Battle Runes

100 from Lunar Isle Baba Yaga's Magic Shop



For water, air, fire & earth you can get 6900 of each if you go around all the shops




No wonder they did the agility and sitting update now that you do have to run all over RUNescape to get necessary items.

#9
canadiansmurf
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Oh and before certain F2P players gasp at how generous Jagex is with runes, these runes won't last long if someone is ancienting.



Oh and Langer, I must not be adapting, silly me not wanting to do lvl 1-13 strike spells.

#10
Omali
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I think personalized shops have just changed the game as much as restricting free trade and eliminating the wildy did.




While you're at it, why not throw in a good Nazi analogy? Irrelevant and whiny.



I think the personalized shops update would have been a good idea IF the amount people could buy was realistic, or even generous. I don't see the point of rationing items to such an extreme level.




Yea, realistic. I prefer to buy as many fire runes in Runescape as I can at my local pawn shop. I mean srsly, Jafix, you guys should know this stuff. I'm going to completely disregard the post about certain items being tweaked, and the fact that shops were always finite, up until they updated to stop bots buying out runes, as a TEMPORARY SOLUTION.



I wonder what jagex are thinking when they change the gameplay so much. I don't think the game needs this upheavel or chaos.




Then stop crying like a toddler every time they change something.



Also it seems with each update the player interaction is just being taken away. I liked seeing what others sold to shops.




Exactly. MMOs aren't MMOs because you can talk, trade, fight, cooperate, or compete against other players. It's all about how you can see what they sold. Why doesn't Jagex just add a loneliness skill, because this game is totally devoid of interaction now that you can't see what people sold to the General Store.



I predict that buying items in large quantities will be a pain. In one move jagex has effectively made GP worthless. Items will be bartered for other scarce items. Welcome to the frustrating age of bartering.




Yea, Jagex has made GP worthless. Let's forget that Runescape survived for about 7 years on this system, minus the shops being personalized, and actually is an improvement over the old system. Not only will Jagex make items worthless, they'll start a death panel to decide whether kittens are to be roasted or beer battered. Oh and they're going to set up the Commission for Punching Your Mother. Welcome to the age of death; Population: Nobody.



I think that the worst part is all of these RS changes are related to mechscape, we are just being the guinea pigs for it. Things like runetek 5 is probably what mechscape will run on.




Exactly. Runescape is updating to be in line with Mechscape, which can only mean that the skills are being removed (Mechscape is a level-less game) as will experience and grinding.



Also it seems that they've lost another round of players recently. Less people are logging in that normal.




That's oddly coincidental. I've seen a slew of inflammatory rhetorical questions, lame exaggerations, and falsified facts recently. We should compare notes.



^This will probably cause another knee-jerk reaction from jagex as they will scramble to get more players. I know nothing about business but even I can see that going from 200k+ players in 2007 to hovering around 140k at peak times in 2009 is not moving in the right direction. Most companies try to grow their business, jagex does the opposite.




You know nothing about business. Let's just leave it there before you embarrass yourself any further.



My two cents is that I am tired of the gameplay changing drastically. I am tired of HD being shoved down our throats when so many players requested SD. Shiny new graphics are great but I just don't play rs for graphics and I don't even notice the graphics after looking at them once. Yes I can choose to turn everything off, however why should I waste my time doing this. All of the extra's should be optional, instead of the default setting.




If you're afraid of massive change, then get out of MMOs. No MMO is ever complete, it is an ongoing changing atmosphere that updates with time and trend. Runescape will continue updating, and one day HD will be the new SD, while SD will be left in the dust. The options are default because the number of us with decent computers that can run it far outweigh those on Compaq Pentium II's.



I wish jagex would stop copying other mmorpg's the new cursor buttons remind me of Free Realms.




You're really grasping for stuff to cry about, aren't you?



I am tired of broken promises and a laggy, buggy unplayable game.




There's the door.



So at summer's end I find that I can't play RS anymore thanks to the changes Jagex made.




There's 47k people playing right now. That's the norm for this early in the morning when school is in session.



Oh and if Jagex is even ever looking at fan sites, I was going to make my pure member's as I was tired of my main. Glad I didn't and I cancelled members on my main.




I'm glad you didn't too. People like you pollute MMOs.



I'm dusting off my skillcapes and hanging them in my poh closet. It was fun while it lasted but I'm done. Thanks jagex for breaking my addiction.

Oh and no one could pay me to play mechscape after what i've put up with for runescape, that would just be torturing myself more.




You'll play it, and you'll continue to play Runescape. That's because, despite your constant whingeing, you actually like the game. You just want something to angst about. You'll be back, and you're going to continue whining at every opportunity, or you're going to turn into the guy who quit, yet still comes back to give us a constant feed of his ill-informed opinions on how Runescape sucks.



In my eyes if you have the GP but can't BUY the items you need to play, it makes GP worthless. Give it a week or a month for supplies to dry up, then come talk to me when you can't buy basics.




The key part of that was "in my eyes." Your eyes are wrong, plain and simple.



It's tedious to DIY or have items trickle in slowly in miniscule quantities through the GE.




Odd, considering you're always whining that Runescape should go back to how it used to be.



Loosening price floors means that now junk is not stable, so junk trading to overpay for items you need is out the door.




That's because junk trading isn't a valid form of trade.



Andrew himself did state that he wasn't anti-junk.




No, he said they weren't going to make it against the rules because it wasn't malicious. He also said close by that statement that they were planning on nuking junk trading. The community has known about this for about six months now.



Junk did create stablility though, and now that is gone. When new items come into the game and are underpriced by Jagex, junk trades is the main way to accquire these items. Pre-trade restrictions these items were easy to purchase as players set the price.




You don't care about players setting the price, otherwise you'd welcome the fact that players can't flood the market anymore for these items, and the fact that floors/ceilings have been removed only gives players that much more of an ability to set prices. Junk created the illusion of stability, like putting a piece of paper underneath a wobbly table and calling it fixed. Eventually, that table is going to crash anyway.



Currently the way trade is set up even player to player the price cannot be set, its fixed GE prices. Also even if prices [bleep]e the demand will still be higher than the supply, and it's frustrating trying to purchase items on the GE that never sell or trickle in slowly.




I'm going to go on a limb and say you're not acquainted with how the GE works.



What is the point of me running around all of these stores just to get a fairly small stock of runes that won't even last one hour and this is assuming that you have done the quests to access some of these shops. :wall:



It's like a twisted joke.




Again, I'm going to point out to your 5-second long attention span, that this is how Runescape used to be prior to the bot updates. You're against change of all kind, why aren't you lapping this up?



Oh and Langer, I must not be adapting, silly me not wanting to do lvl 1-13 strike spells.




Silly you not being able to adapt to, again, a system that was in place for 7 years minus the personalization. There's actually more stock than before the shops went infinite, because everyone gets their own.
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#11
Bauke
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Now I'm wondering... did you make text purple to clarify that it doesn't make sense at all? Because you make it look like it.

#12
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The only thing that annoys me (with the exception of a few small RT5 issues) is that they are slowing killing player/player interaction for trades.

Before the GE I would always stop by the general store to see if there was any bargains to be had (a few times I made a killing or got the item I was looking for). Now with the exception of junk theres no reason to use a general store and the lower the pre GE rune amounts (I'm 99% sure the zammy mage had more then 100 bloods in stock) gives no reason to use them.
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#13
langer
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Oh and Langer, I must not be adapting, silly me not wanting to do lvl 1-13 strike spells.




I don't get how it relates to adapting... You mean doing these spells because mind runes are more available? You must not be trying hard enough... I just bought 10 law runes 4 GP under mid price. Sure it took me half a day to get all I needed, but it that so bad?



If you can't buy something at max price, then there is not enough supply. Suppliers in many cases are players: skillers and monster hunters. When demand is higher, prices wil raise, the suppliers will have an incentive to gather these items.



Buying from stores to sell to the G.E. is a way to make money, but probably not something the game creators wanted their players to focus on.



When an item is released, there a re two ways to get it, buy it through inflated price via junk-trade or... not be lazy and get it yourself.



I get the feeling that you want to have what you want the moment the need emerges in your mind. You seem to think that pre-G.E., the moment you wanted something, a trader would magically appear to trade you in a matter of minutes. There were lots of things that could be obtained quickly, but there were also lots of items that would require hours to gather via forums and world 2.



At the moment, unless the item is being bought out or supply is ridiculously low, you can get many items instantly at max price.



Currently the way trade is set up even player to player the price cannot be set, its fixed GE prices. Also even if prices [bleep]e the demand will still be higher than the supply, and it's frustrating trying to purchase items on the GE that never sell or trickle in slowly. Why would someone go out of their way to sell an item to you if it sells instantly for them at max price on the GE?




Prior G.E., have you ever witness an item being rightly prced upon its release? Jagex might not be the best at pricing items, but players are definitely not better at this. When you can't get an item via trade, you simply get it through another avenue (just like the people that kill the corporeal beast to get sigils). Sure it's frustrating, you have to adapt and not be lazy, change is often hard to accept. I have no idea why would someone go out their way to sell an itam for less...



Going through all the rune store is really a last resort option... that means no one is selling, no one is RCing, you don't want to RC and you absolutely need these runes in a matter of seconds...

Plan ahead and you won't lack what you need.

And the run update is pretty good for Runecrafting, try it someday, I hear it gives you RUNES.


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#14
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I've read through the whole post, as grammatically challenging as it was.



Omali, your post made my eyes water :?

Langer, your posts make some sense and strike a chord for me.



However Canadasmurfperson, in the words of Smellysocks, don't catch your [wagon] in the door on the way out!



Do I sense a return to skilling? :shock:
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#15
langer
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Do I sense a return to skilling?




Not for all players, but it will surely be an incentive for those incline to make a batter profit while skilling.


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#16
Me_Hate_Libs
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I don't think they've ruined the game or anything, but I will say that when it comes to changes like these that they make, they tend to do it with a very heavy hand and then scramble to fix it.
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#17
langer
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I don't think they've ruined the game or anything, but I will say that when it comes to changes like these that they make, they tend to do it with a very heavy hand and then scramble to fix it.




Well they use their player base as testers in every update and so far, the game is still beeing played and profitable, so no reason to change it really. There's slight chaos after every update when the players adjust, if the game can't adjust to the new behavior, Jagex tweaks what is not done through natural gameplay.


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#18
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Agreed Langer, but you must admit that when changes such as these are made, they go from one extreme to the other, then tweak it and find the middle ground as they go, instead of attempting to find a middle ground from the outset, then tweaking it slightly.
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#19
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Yeah we are on agreement on that. Debating if it's good or bad is mostly a matter of opinion though. From a business point of view, having "willing" testers as customers is a good strategy as long as the customers keep playing (and paying obviously).



They sometimes go overboard with some updates and major tweakings are necessary (meaning they messed up prior to release).

As for this update, I see a couple fix there and there, but not a major one like going back to infinite stock.



An example of a major and quick fix would be the bounty +1 worlds they released 2 days after the PVP revamp. That was a quick response to a gross misjudgment of their player base needs. I expect internal testers have infinite weapons and don't mind losing a pair of d claws if you get my drift...


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#20
canadiansmurf
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canadiansmurf

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Omali wrote:



Let's forget that Runescape survived for about 7 years on this system, minus the shops being personalized, and actually is an improvement over the old system.



There's actually more stock than before the shops went infinite, because everyone gets their own.




Have you tried this update before saying things like there is actually more stock prior to infinite stores :<img src=:' /> because there actually isn't more stock. Also now you can't world hop in the hopes of getting an item.



The stock levels are not generous, and the amounts for sale are bizarre. 10 bone bolts :thumbdown: I don't see one player who would do the quest, make the trek to purchase 10 bone bolts and then make their way back to sell it at GE.



Also with the way the GE works and price updates soon everything will rise in price on the GE harming the everyday player. Under the old system some higher levels overpaying didn't mean that all prices were set at that level there were always deals to be had if you were patient. This isn't seven years ago the game and context is different, with the GE we will see hyper-inflation.









Do I sense a return to skilling?




I don't see how this helps skilling by forcing us to run around to gather resources from various stores. Maybe it does help runecraft, but runecraft was already a lucrative skill before once it hit 91. It harms other skills though. Also without buy-x there is more wasted time doing chores before you can even skill to gain experience.



When an item is released, there a re two ways to get it, buy it through inflated price via junk-trade or... not be lazy and get it yourself.




So I have your assurance that new items introduced from the game from now on will not be based on luck? It's easier to say oh just go there and get a drop yourself. How long should I wait years? Because there are plenty of "unlucky" players.




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