Extreme pots in Pvp

[De_Lille_D]

This basically explains the issue: http://www.tip.it/runescape/?times=346

 

So: should you be able to use these extremely effective pots in Pvp and minigames or not?

And most importantly, why?

 

Are they really overpowered for PvP, or did the whiny pkers get what they wanted again?

[Sir_Kurity]

I still think non combat skills should not have to much of an effect on combat, especially PVP.

[purewcnub]

Think about it this way: Rich people already have an advantage with very expensive weaponry like AGS that common players can't afford. Those Herblore pots are another advantage, and huge at that. As said, non-combat and combat skills shouldn't be too intertwined, except runecraft, smithing, and fletching of course(Maybe fishing in a way too)

[teampots]

Think about it this way: Rich people already have an advantage with very expensive weaponry like AGS that common players can't afford. Those Herblore pots are another advantage, and huge at that. As said, non-combat and combat skills shouldn't be too intertwined, except runecraft, smithing, and fletching of course(Maybe fishing in a way too)

 

Whilst I agree with this to some extent, It is not like herblore has only just become part of combat, there are other combat related Pots are there not? there are many ways of getting an advantage, this was just one way, a way that only a minority had access to and one that another minority decided was too great.

[purewcnub]

Think about it this way: Rich people already have an advantage with very expensive weaponry like AGS that common players can't afford. Those Herblore pots are another advantage, and huge at that. As said, non-combat and combat skills shouldn't be too intertwined, except runecraft, smithing, and fletching of course(Maybe fishing in a way too)

 

Whilst I agree with this to some extent, It is not like herblore has only just become part of combat, there are other combat related Pots are there not? there are many ways of getting an advantage, this was just one way, a way that only a minority had access to and one that another minority decided was too great.

 

Yes, I agree, there are other combat potions.. but the extreme pots are too extreme. Hitting 46 with ice barrage?!!?

[RangingRoy]

Think about it this way: Rich people already have an advantage with very expensive weaponry like AGS that common players can't afford. Those Herblore pots are another advantage, and huge at that. As said, non-combat and combat skills shouldn't be too intertwined, except runecraft, smithing, and fletching of course(Maybe fishing in a way too)

 

Whilst I agree with this to some extent, It is not like herblore has only just become part of combat, there are other combat related Pots are there not? there are many ways of getting an advantage, this was just one way, a way that only a minority had access to and one that another minority decided was too great.

 

 

The issue is not herblore pots being used in PvP, but whether herblore should affect combat level.

 

A level 30, with 96 herblore. They can instantly increase their levels much higher than another level 30. You can buy and sell normal pots, you cant buy and sell the new pots.

[AlexRose]

We've already had a constructive thirteen page debate on this back in the orginal thread. >_>

[Sir_Kurity]

Yea, it just shouldn't.

 

Its really just forcing people to grind more and be extremely rich to get to full power in PVP.

 

I'm glad its nerfed.

[AlexRose]

Yea,Godswords just shouldn't.

 

Its really just forcing people to earn money to get to full power in PVP.

 

I'm glad it will be nerfed.

 

You seemed to have had several grammatical errors in your post; it should be more legible now.

[Sir_Kurity]

Um sorry, what?

 

I assumed it didn't work in PVP or minigames.

[Alg]

They are, or so I heard...

I still think non combat skills should not have to much of an effect on combat, especially PVP.

I would agree, to a certain extent. High cooking, herblore, etc. should save you money in PvP, but it should not limit the game to only players who max the skill. A player with low cooking can function just as well as one with high cooking, a player with high herblore is going to dominate those that don't have it.

Combat is combat. There should be a benefit for training other skills, but not a game breaking one.

There aren't enough hitpoints as it is.

[3hitm4g3u]

No they shouldn't be in PVP worlds or BH worlds.

 

Should they be taken away from minigames? No.

[Guest TrixStar]

Minigames no PVP I say yes unless they were tradable.

[Sir_Kurity]

Some minigames i would say...

 

FOG, fight caves? or similar i don't think so. But castle wars/soul wars or similar is fine by me.

[De_Lille_D]

Wow that's a lot of replies.

I still think non combat skills should not have to much of an effect on combat, especially PVP.

Is that a personal opinion or do you have any objective reasons to think so?

 

Whilst I agree with this to some extent, It is not like herblore has only just become part of combat, there are other combat related Pots are there not? there are many ways of getting an advantage, this was just one way, a way that only a minority had access to and one that another minority decided was too great.

So, you are saying its because the whiny pkers have low Herblore? Would Jagex have acted diferently if a lot of pkers had high Herblore?

 

Yes, I agree, there are other combat potions.. but the extreme pots are too extreme. Hitting 46 with ice barrage?!!?

I think you can keep going higher until you start one-hitting people ... This would have made wilderness so much more dangerous. One day pkers are complaining about wild being too safe and EPers not really risking anything. The next day, Jagex does what they ask for and they start complaining again!

 

The issue is not herblore pots being used in PvP, but whether herblore should affect combat level.

A level 30, with 96 herblore. They can instantly increase their levels much higher than another level 30. You can buy and sell normal pots, you cant buy and sell the new pots.

As mentoined before, should you add combat levels for how rich you are too then? AGS gives you a clear advantage, yet does not change your combat. I think there would be few people who would get high herblore just for those pts (don't forget they won't boost your stats as much if they are low). You can still look them up on the highscores, just like people with 99 str.

High herblore does give you a little advantage, but not big enough to add it to the combat level.

 

We've already had a constructive thirteen page debate on this back in the orginal thread. >_>

That thread can't be controlled. Too many people post to get a decent debate.

 

Yea, it just shouldn't.

Its really just forcing people to grind more and be extremely rich to get to full power in PVP.

I'm glad its nerfed.

Are you for nerfing the AGS and D Claws too? They are equally expensive and provide a obvious advantage...

 

Um sorry, what?

 

1) High cooking, herblore, etc. should save you money in PvP, but it should not limit the game to only players who max the skill. ... Combat is combat. There should be a benefit for training other skills, but not a game breaking one.

2) There aren't enough hitpoints as it is.

1) So you're saying it would be ok, if the pots were less powerfull?

2) That's another debate :wink:.

 

No they shouldn't be in PVP worlds or BH worlds.

Should they be taken away from minigames? No.

Personal oppinion?

 

Minigames no PVP I say yes unless they were tradable.

Personal oppinion?

 

Some minigames i would say...

 

FOG, fight caves? or similar i don't think so. But castle wars/soul wars or similar is fine by me.

How do you decide which minigames should allow extreme pots and why? Is it because you respawn when you die?

[depresins]

If they were tradeable they would've been adored in PvP activities.

 

It's the whiny pkers getting their way again. Again, out the door goes Jagex original policy on balanced characters. Truly pathetic.

[JoeDaStudd]

I still think non combat skills should not have to much of an effect on combat, especially PVP.

.....

Look at the following PvP items.

DDS, D scimmy, D long, anchor, RfD gloves, crystal bow, crystal shield, d hally (next to never used, but possible), rune plate, and spirit shields.

Lunars and ancients too.

 

They all require skills to complete the quests to unlock and wield them.

 

I'd hate to imagine PvP without all the skill/quest related items. You'd be limited to very few dragon items and it would pretty much jump from rune to whips/godswords with no middle ground.

 

People need to look and see skills have always affected PvP. Back in the days per GE it was either buy 100's/1000's of potions or make them yourself. The average scaper would either spend hours trying to afford or bid down the price of potions or skill to make the potions themselves.

[De_Lille_D]

Does anyone here agree with Jagex releasing something and then removing it again because of "Player Feedback"? If so, what are your arguments?

[Lord_Rand]

The issue is not herblore pots being used in PvP, but whether herblore should affect combat level.

 

A level 30, with 96 herblore. They can instantly increase their levels much higher than another level 30. You can buy and sell normal pots, you cant buy and sell the new pots.

 

-This isn't directed at you per se but merely at the argument you presented-

 

*cough* Pures? *cough*

 

Admitedly this doesn't effect the top tier of pkers all that much but if you base your argument on herblore making players deceptively powerful then the entire combat formula should be overhauled so pures aren't deceptively strong/accurate.

 

This won't happen though as it's simple to quickly whack a name into the highscores or w/e game client you happen to play through. This, magically also happens to show a players herblore level, if they're over *insert w/e pot level* then you can safely assume they'll be packing a bit more of a punch. This is far less deceptive than whether or not a player is hybriding/has claws, ags, Vesta's etc hidden away in their invent.

 

I'm surprised people complain about hidden bonuses but yet don't go round demanding an 'invent spy' spell or something of that ilk.

[AlexRose]

Um sorry, what?

 

I assumed it didn't work in PVP or minigames.

 

My point was that your reason of your dissent, which was that it forced players to raise large ammounts of money to unlock the full potential of their stats, could also be applied to other expensive, powerful weapons. Like the Godswords.

 

Does anyone here agree with Jagex releasing something and then removing it again because of "Player Feedback"? If so, what are your arguments?

 

Short Answer: No.

 

Long Answer: Jagex should not base a decision based purely off the initial reactions of forum goers, who do not accurately reflect the opinion of the majority of Runescape and (may) possess very little intellectual forthought to their posts. However, after sufficent time has passed for players to accurately assess the impact of a new release, then Jagex should browse the forums to find well thought out arguments, and then assess the situtation for themsleves. In other words, player feedback should only be a guide for Jagex to be aware of problems, not as an absolute representation of what the players want.

 

Shorter Answer: Jagex should not read the rants of the first week an update has come out. Once time has passed and good, accurate assements can be made, the Jagex should use player feedback, but not as a reason for changing something.

[Troacctid]

People don't even use regular potions in PVP. I don't see the big deal about extreme pots. Even if they were too strong in BH, why do they need to be banned from Castle Wars? That's dumb.

[De_Lille_D]

Does anyone here agree with Jagex releasing something and then removing it again because of "Player Feedback"? If so, what are your arguments?

...

Shorter Answer: Jagex should not read the rants of the first week an update has come out. Once time has passed and good, accurate assements can be made, the Jagex should use player feedback, but not as a reason for changing something.

I think the main problem is that Jagex doesn't test their updates enough. Instead of anticipating the possible abuses and testing to see if anything is outrageously strong in a certain situation, they release it and wait for responses from the players. They are basically treating us like unpayed beta-testers.

Nerfing is something to be done for things you couldn't have forseen. However, here, anyone could have predicted that rushers would become even stronger. So, either they didn't think of it (and they should get smarter staff) or they didn't care and waited to see the players reaction. Either way, this never should have happened.

 

People don't even use regular potions in PVP. I don't see the big deal about extreme pots. Even if they were too strong in BH, why do they need to be banned from Castle Wars? That's dumb.

I don't know how or if you pk, but when I do, I always bring pots...

I agree that there was no reason to ban it from Castle Wars.

 

 

Now, if no one has any arguments to support what Jagex did, theres no point in continuing this debate. If you still want to express your discontent, go to the Rants forum.

[JoeDaStudd]

The removal in cwars would be understandable as the castle wars bracelet gives 20% added to the increase in power from the potions it would stalemate a lot of games if you had a few maxed attackers or defenders with the potions.

[De_Lille_D]

The removal in cwars would be understandable as the castle wars bracelet gives 20% added to the increase in power from the potions it would stalemate a lot of games if you had a few maxed attackers or defenders with the potions.

Ok, but super pots are allowed? I would have lowered all pot bonuses and stats by 80% in the games, unless you bring castle wars brace. if you bring brace, you get 100% of your pot bonuses/stats.

 

And even so, why aren't they allowed in Soul Wars?

[JoeDaStudd]

The removal in cwars would be understandable as the castle wars bracelet gives 20% added to the increase in power from the potions it would stalemate a lot of games if you had a few maxed attackers or defenders with the potions.

Ok, but super pots are allowed? I would have lowered all pot bonuses and stats by 80% in the games, unless you bring castle wars brace. if you bring brace, you get 100% of your pot bonuses/stats.

 

And even so, why aren't they allowed in Soul Wars?

I think it was more a strike first and fix it later on a case by case thing, similar to the RuneTech issues.

 

I was just explaining why the cwars removal could be understandable, I still believe that they should be allowed.

You learn the reward you want to use it.