Underage pregnancies

[Death_By_Pod]

 

Going back on your abstinence pledge isn't incorrect use, it's no use whatsoever. Whereas using any other kind of contraception can involve incorrect use while being used, abstinence either happens or doesn't, there's no middle ground - if you're using it, you're using it correctly. It is impossible to abstain incorrectly, because as soon as something happens, it's not abstinence anymore.

 

 

 

People who take abstinence pledges treat them as a legally binding contract; otherwise there is no point in taking them unless they give you some motivation in fulfilling the pledge. In having sex you fail to fulfil the contract (a breach of contract), so unless you voided the contract previous to sex you are failing to correctly abide to your pledge.

 

 

 

Of course abstinence is a state (either you are or your not) however people take it one step further and take oaths, verbal contracts or written pledges to help swear off sex. It is these sort things that you are not correctly following, not the state of abstinence itself. You might consider abstinence as solely a state of being but many other people consider it to be a contractual obligation. Condoms are to contraception as pledges are to abstinence, when we talk about contraception we talk about the methods involved not what contraception does; likewise when we talk about abstinence we talk about ways to help abstain rather then the overarching concept of it.

[the_blob23]

Condoms do not do anything close to what the media and planned parenthood portray.

 

 

 

Uh, they do what they are supposed to? Condoms prevent pregnancy over 98% of the time if used correctly and consistently. They also stop the majority of STDs from spreading. Contrary to your claims, the media and Planned Parenthood have nothing to do with the issue of condom effectiveness. Do you have peer-reviewed clinical studies to back up your ridiculous statements? I suggest you refrain from posting such blatant falsehoods like the above without evidence.

 

 

 

 

Here's a great news article to read about the uselessness of condoms in preventing HPV, an incurable STD infecting millions of adults and the leading cause of cervical cancer, being the second highest killer of women.

 

 

 

http://www.massnews.com/past_issues/oth ... condon.htm

 

 

 

Oddly enough, it was in the Massachusetts news.

 

 

 

Here are some quotes:

 

"Condoms appear to provide little, if any, protection against HPV, one of the most common sexual diseases in America today and one that causes cervical cancer." Medical Institute for Sexual Health.

 

 

 

ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãââ "Condoms can prevent the spread of many diseases, but not HPV. HPV is found on all the genital tissues, and a condom on the * usually will not prevent transmission of HPV." Louisiana State University Medical Center.

 

 

 

ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãââ "Human Papillomavirus, thought of as the ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¹ÃâseedÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢ of cervical cancer, is a regional rather than localized disease, and its infectivity is not contained by condoms." John V. Dervin, M.D., associate specialist in radiology and assistant clinical professor, University of California, San Francisco.

 

 

 

ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãââ "everal studies have shown that condoms do not protect against this virus (HPV)."

 

 

 

Kenneth L. Noller, M.D., professor and chairman, department of obstetrics/gynecology, University of Massachusetts School of Medicine; past chairman of the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists Committee on Gynecologic Practice; and past president of the American Society for Colposcopy and Cervical Pathology.

 

 

 

ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãââ "Condom use is of little or no value in protecting patients from papilloma infection." Thomas V. Sedlacek, M.D., chairman, department of gynecology, Graduate Hospital, Philadelphia.

 

 

 

ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãââ "Condoms are useless in preventing HPV transmission, because the virus is spread by cells that are shed onto the scrotum, which then comes into contact with vulvar skin." Michael Campion, M.D., director of gynecologic endoscopy at Graduate Hospital, Philadelphia.

 

 

 

I can't help but comment on the delicious irony of an abstinence advocate commenting on HPV/cervical cancer. After all, it was abstinence promoters who aggressively fought against FDA approval of a vaccine for this terrible disease for years (the vaccine was finally approved June 8). George W. Bush was opposed, as were numerous abstinence groups around the country. Senator Tom Coburn even had the gall to say, "Pre-marital sex is dangerous, even deadly. LetÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s not encourage it by vaccinating ten-year-olds so they think theyÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢re safe.ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâÃ

[pianofrieak2]

Condoms do not do anything close to what the media and planned parenthood portray.

 

 

 

Uh, they do what they are supposed to? Condoms prevent pregnancy over 98% of the time if used correctly and consistently. They also stop the majority of STDs from spreading. Contrary to your claims, the media and Planned Parenthood have nothing to do with the issue of condom effectiveness. Do you have peer-reviewed clinical studies to back up your ridiculous statements? I suggest you refrain from posting such blatant falsehoods like the above without evidence.

 

 

 

 

Whoa, you're taking what I said way too far. I never said that condoms don't work at all. Neither did I say that everything Planned Parenthood is false.

 

 

 

Here's what I actually said.

 

1. The media hypes up all this use of condoms in order to make you THINK you're 100% safe from all STDs and pregnancies.

 

2. Condoms do NOT help against all STDs (HPV for instance) which they are told to.

 

3. It is a ridiculous claim to say that people use condoms effectively and when they're supposed to all of the time. In the article (if you read it), it said that in the inner city, condoms are used the right way only around 60% of the time. Don't be ridiculous in saying that condoms are the way to go since so few people use them correctly and all of the time. I realize that that isn't the condoms' fault, but don't be naive in thinking that condoms are the panacea of STDs. The best way to protect yourself is abstinence which is my, Astra's, and insane's point.

[hohto]

2. Condoms do NOT help against all STDs (HPV for instance) which they are told to.

 

 

 

Not all, but majority. That's pretty much like saying we shouldn't drive cars with your seat belts because they don't save us every time. Protection from AIDS for example is a really good reason to use one. Shame that the last pope said that it's a sin to use one and "few" africans died to aids. Oh well, hopefully your "master" will keep a good care of those who died because of that I bet their children, friends and other close people would have wanted to see them alive, tho.

 

 

 

Our race is almost the only animal (yes, we are animals IMO) that enjoys of sex. Why should we live in celibate when our body and mind tells us that it's ok? If I happen to get HPV, then I just get it. I rather take that risk, after all it's not the only risk I take. I could for example get driven over by a car while going to a store to buy some food.

 

 

 

If you wanted to help human kind, you should preach of using condoms (or invent even a better protection), free abortion laws and throw away your "holy" book. Not talk about abstinence, God's will or other stuff like that.

[Anesthesia]

If you wanted to help human kind, you should preach of using condoms (or invent even a better protection), free abortion laws and throw away your "holy" book. Not talk about abstinence, God's will or other stuff like that.

 

 

 

Again religion stands in the way of development.

 

 

 

Is objecting to things all it does? Rhetorical question.

[Fatalhit_X]

What's that supposed to mean!?

 

 

 

in reply to this guys question, here is a little history lesson.

 

Caligula was a Roman emporer who, during his reign, went insane. At one point he appointed his own horse into the Roman senate. There we go.

 

 

 

So this is not spam, I will throw my own two cents in.

 

I am saving myself for marriage, simply because i want to. Yes, my parents don't want me to, and yes they would kill me if i did, but i do it because i want it to be special with my wife. Underage pregnancy is a huge issue, because there are too many people who freak out, and just leave a baby on a doorstep. Abortions are also a huge issue, one that i do not agree with. Life begins not a birth, but after conception.

[Tigra00]

What's that supposed to mean!?

 

 

 

in reply to this guys question, here is a little history lesson.

 

Caligula was a Roman emporer who, during his reign, went insane. At one point he appointed his own horse into the Roman senate. There we go.

 

 

 

So this is not spam, I will throw my own two cents in.

 

I am saving myself for marriage, simply because i want to. Yes, my parents don't want me to, and yes they would kill me if i did, but i do it because i want it to be special with my wife. Underage pregnancy is a huge issue, because there are too many people who freak out, and just leave a baby on a doorstep. Abortions are also a huge issue, one that i do not agree with. Life begins not a birth, but after conception.

 

 

 

Good luck finding a woman willing to save herself for you these days. :P Hope you don't mind religious girls!

[Quer_Skulll]

 

 

 

 

 

Here's what I actually said.

 

1. The media hypes up all this use of condoms in order to make you THINK you're 100% safe from all STDs and pregnancies.

 

2. Condoms do NOT help against all STDs (HPV for instance) which they are told to.

 

 

 

 

this reminds of the conspiracy theory of the flat earthers...

 

 

 

and o for the love of life WHAT IF YOU DONT WANT TO DO ABSTINENCE!

 

Abstinence is so boring and personally i dont understand why anyone would even want to abstinence..

[Tigra00]

 

 

 

 

 

Here's what I actually said.

 

1. The media hypes up all this use of condoms in order to make you THINK you're 100% safe from all STDs and pregnancies.

 

2. Condoms do NOT help against all STDs (HPV for instance) which they are told to.

 

 

 

 

this reminds of the conspiracy theory of the flat earthers...

 

 

 

and o for the love of life WHAT IF YOU DONT WANT TO DO ABSTINENCE!

 

Abstinence is so boring and personally i dont understand why anyone would even want to abstinence..

 

 

 

Because having sex with as many easy women as possible isn't appealing to a select few. Apparently you're not one of them.

 

 

 

Dude, I could tell you of many people I know who had sex ONE TIME and now they're locked down for 18 years with a baby with someone they don't even know or don't even care about at all. One of my buddies I went to school with has had sex once in his 19 years, and he has a 2 year old now. That is why abstinence is appealing. You could argue that he should have wore a condom, but the thing is: he did. They're 98% effective, not 100%.

 

 

 

Still, I cannot fathom where people get the nerve to say condoms are a bad thing. More Bible mis-interperatations (or just stupidity) I'm sure. Listen, if every sperm was a potential child, which it isn't, then I could see the moral dilema. However, they're not...Female eggs are a potential child, and they die naturally every month when not fertilized. Are you picketing female menstrual cycles because they kill potential children? No, you'd rather picket condoms, which kill micro-organisms that are in no way shape or form a human life, and never will be. You could argue that sex is sacred and is meant to produce a child, thus stopping that makes it somehow non-sacred, but all I can say to that is - Have fun taking care of 5,000 children. Seriously. If everyone had a child each time they had sex, every town in the world would have the entire population of China held within, lol.

 

 

 

So, better get to picketing Tampax and stuff. Those damned women and their baby-killing ways.

[Anesthesia]

Clarification according to a pamphlet I'm holding right here:

 

 

 

The "98% effective" statistic doesn't mean that 2 out of every 100 times you have sex it will fail. It means it will, on average, fail once for 2 out of every 100 people in a year.

[Faux]

There's another bullet proof option other than abstinence. It's menopause. It's full proof. Just wait for a woman to mature, then boom, do it like rabbits with no worries.

[Pete_the_Viscous]

That probably entails a certain amount of abstinence anyway...

[Fatalhit_X]

What's that supposed to mean!?

 

 

 

in reply to this guys question, here is a little history lesson.

 

Caligula was a Roman emporer who, during his reign, went insane. At one point he appointed his own horse into the Roman senate. There we go.

 

 

 

So this is not spam, I will throw my own two cents in.

 

I am saving myself for marriage, simply because i want to. Yes, my parents don't want me to, and yes they would kill me if i did, but i do it because i want it to be special with my wife. Underage pregnancy is a huge issue, because there are too many people who freak out, and just leave a baby on a doorstep. Abortions are also a huge issue, one that i do not agree with. Life begins not a birth, but after conception.

 

 

 

Good luck finding a woman willing to save herself for you these days. :P Hope you don't mind religious girls!

 

 

 

oddly enough, i myself am a christian. Blows the mind, eh?

[Tigra00]

What's that supposed to mean!?

 

 

 

in reply to this guys question, here is a little history lesson.

 

Caligula was a Roman emporer who, during his reign, went insane. At one point he appointed his own horse into the Roman senate. There we go.

 

 

 

So this is not spam, I will throw my own two cents in.

 

I am saving myself for marriage, simply because i want to. Yes, my parents don't want me to, and yes they would kill me if i did, but i do it because i want it to be special with my wife. Underage pregnancy is a huge issue, because there are too many people who freak out, and just leave a baby on a doorstep. Abortions are also a huge issue, one that i do not agree with. Life begins not a birth, but after conception.

 

 

 

Good luck finding a woman willing to save herself for you these days. :P Hope you don't mind religious girls!

 

 

 

oddly enough, i myself am a christian. Blows the mind, eh?

 

 

 

Nay. Just saying, I can't think of any girls I know off-hand that are waiting until marriage, save for one. And she's a Christian too. :P

[the_blob23]

 

1. The media hypes up all this use of condoms in order to make you THINK you're 100% safe from all STDs and pregnancies.

 

 

 

Show me one instance where the media has "hyped up" the use of condoms. Obviously, condoms don't protect you from every single disease and pregnancy, just as airbags don't protect you from every crash. That doesn't mean that these devices are inherently ineffective.

 

 

 

2. Condoms do NOT help against all STDs (HPV for instance) which they are told to.

 

 

 

What are you talking about? No one has even made the claim that condoms protect against human papillomavirus. Physicians have known that oral contraceptives and condoms aren't particularly effective against HPV for years. There have been multiple studies about oral contraceptives and condoms, and all have found no evidence that they are effective against HPV. Effect of oral contraceptives on risk of cervical cancer in women with human papillomavirus infection: the IARC multicentric case-control study. The Lancet 2002; 359:1085-1092

 

 

 

That condoms don't protect against every single STD in no way implies that they shouldn't be used.

 

 

 

3. It is a ridiculous claim to say that people use condoms effectively and when they're supposed to all of the time.

 

 

 

Too bad I never made that claim. From one of my previous posts in this thread:

 

 

 

 

Only two percent of couples who use latex condoms correctly and consistently as their main form of contraception will have unintended pregnancies (Hatcher, et al., 2004).

 

 

 

And later on, I said:

 

 

 

 

Most contraceptives are evaluated by their "perfect use" (used correctly every time) and "typical use" (accounts for human error and inconsistency) effectiveness.

 

 

 

It is painfully obvious that the data I originally presented deals with the perfect use of condoms. Even when typically used, condoms still have a success rate ranging from 80% to 85%, depending on the study one consults.

 

 

 

Don't be ridiculous in saying that condoms are the way to go since so few people use them correctly and all of the time.

 

 

 

Once again: The fact that condoms do not work 100% of the time in no way implies that they shouldn't be used.

 

 

 

I realize that that isn't the condoms' fault, but don't be naive in thinking that condoms are the panacea of STDs.

 

 

 

Condoms are the bane of most STDs. That's why people use them. There are very few STDs that condoms do not protect you from, and in those cases, it is wise to be tested anyway.

 

 

 

 

 

The best way to protect yourself is abstinence which is my, Astra's, and insane's point.

 

 

 

Is is really, though? What about oral sex? If someone has unprotected oral sex, then there is a high risk of catching an STD. Abstinence isn't a practical solution for the vast majority of the world's people. Are most people going to listen to the advice, "Don't have sex"? I highly doubt it. It is better to teach them about anatomy and human sexuality so they aren't ignorant when they decide to have intercourse for the first time.

[mad4u689]

Clarification according to a pamphlet I'm holding right here:

 

 

 

The "98% effective" statistic doesn't mean that 2 out of every 100 times you have sex it will fail. It means it will, on average, fail once for 2 out of every 100 people in a year.

 

 

 

2 out of every 100 couples who use condoms as their means of contraception and have regular sex for a year, will get pregnant anyway. Just to clarify very slightly :D

[Viv]

well most teens are horny and are going to be horny till they are like 40.

 

 

 

abstinence programs do not teach anything but do not have sex and really we WILL listen to our friends rather then some sex ed teacher saying do not have sex. anyway the teens who got pregnant either did not use a condom, used it incorrectly or where totally unlucky.

 

 

 

i am 15 i am not pledging abstinence till marrage as that is very unreasonable. though i am saving myself for a commited relationship where if we get pregnant we at least have money and i know that i am not going to get left as a single mother.

[insane]

Our race is almost the only animal (yes, we are animals IMO) that enjoys of sex.

 

 

 

I hear dolphins do as well.

 

 

 

Why should we live in celibate when our body and mind tells us that it's ok?

 

 

 

Just because your body and mind tell you its okay, doesn't mean it is okay. Alot of 3-year old's minds and bodies tell them it's okay to eat dog crap out of a garbage pail, but it's not exactly the best thing for them to be doing.

 

Or murder's think it's okay to be killing people. Not okay.

 

 

 

 

 

If I happen to get HPV, then I just get it. I rather take that risk, after all it's not the only risk I take. I could for example get driven over by a car while going to a store to buy some food.

 

 

 

True but what he's saying is that if you both (you and your spouse) have kept abstinent until your time of marriage, you can have unprotected sex every day for 25 years and you're not going to get HIV - unless it came genetically.

 

 

 

If you wanted to help human kind, you should preach of using condoms (or invent even a better protection), free abortion laws and throw away your "holy" book. Not talk about abstinence, God's will or other stuff like that.

 

 

 

Nobody was talking about the Bible, or God's will, or "other stuff like that". You brought that up purely for the sake of telling us that Christianity is garbage, and you know it. Nobody was shouting Bible passages or "God's will" at each other - stop making us out to be intolerant when you're the only one showing any intolerance on this thread.