Obtaurian

Jaw literally dropped when I saw the helmet. Cape is awesome, too. Dunno how I feel about the platebody. Very cool concept. :thumbup:

lmfao Kota beat you :thumbdown:

u

One of the best tasks you can get due to good slay exp and crims. Slay in CT resource dungeon or Taverly dungeon with a cannon, but I prefer CT because it's more fun with a steel titan. Use standard prayer gear. Slay away.

Penance horn. I love BA, so I wouldn't do it any other way. :cool:

He partied. He partied too hard this time. Not really looking forward to Court Cases all that much. I am looking forward to faces, though.

I would only get a bonecrusher if it costed 5k tokens max. It's not useful enough to warrant 340k experience in tokens.

[bleep] you

I was gonna ask the same thing, lol. Your name is green.

Really funny to see all of the homemade skill capes. Good video. :thumbup:

Semantics, semantics, semantics. You heal in hospitals, you explore Daemonheim in Dungeoneering. :rolleyes: Please at least ATTEMPT to provide a valid argument. He didn't lose any argument. We've already replied to every of your points and you just keep coming back with the same arguments over an over again. This is why winning a debate with stubborn people is impossible. Also I find it ironic how you blame him for discussing semantics when you jump in the train yourself. Summing up, there's no progress in the Daemonheim plot through dungeoneering, just discovery. Therefore, it's not a quest. End of. This said I'm out of the thread as well, at least of the Daemonheim discussion. Good job reading my last five or six posts. =D> Just kidding, you didn't read them. Neither you nor Demoli have met any of my arguments with valid counterarguments. You're welcome to actually READ my post further up the page where I've transcribed my entire argument into one neat little package, then respond to each of those points (which you can't, but I'll humor you). I've never used semantics in any of my arguments on this thread, so I don't know what you're talking about there. I'm glad you're leaving, too, 'cause I'd hate to have to continue debating something that I've proven ten times over. :rolleyes:

Yay for black and white arguments! "HOSPITALS DON'T HEAL PEOPLE, DOCTORS DO! LOLOLOLOL!" Anyway, I'm glad you're finally quitting. You lost the debate a long time ago.

Semantics, semantics, semantics. You heal in hospitals, you explore Daemonheim in Dungeoneering. :rolleyes: Please at least ATTEMPT to provide a valid argument.

- Dungeoneering tells you to keep going through the dungeons. Daemonnheim provides a backstory and a plot that has (possibly) already ended. Boss fights and puzzles that forces you to use your skills are not exclusive to quests, which also uses them to some degree, along with minigames and D&D's -As with most quests, Daemonheim provides it's story in segments. Daemonheim is not dungeoneering -The story in Daemonheim is directly related to (and will, most likely, affect) existing storylines in Runescape. Daemonheim is not dungeoneering - The story is told via clues found by the player as they descend into Daemonheim, which is a very common storytelling device in nearly all mediums of storytelling. Daemonheim is not Dungeoneering. See the difference now? Daemonheim will eventually be a quest area, but not thanks to Dungeoneering. Dungeoneering doesn't have a plot. Daemonheim has a backstory, Dungeoneering is not Daemonheim. Due to this, every single line written in those cronicles, diaries and letters do not belong to Dungeoneering, but to Daemonheim. The skill has no plot. The closest thing to a plot Dungeoneeing has is "We are the Fremnicks, explore the dungeons in trade of rewards". Similar to minigames. Lol, semantics. You know you've lost a debate when semantics becomes your main argument. If in my last post I replaced every instance of the word Dungeoneering with Dungeons of Daemonheim, you would have no argument. It doesn't matter what you call it, it's still there, and it's still a quest. Nice try, though.

Yes, it really does. If only you were able to counter my arguments, we could've kept going. I'll put my argument in a nice little bundle for everyone to see: Assertion: Dungeoneering is a quest with the mechanics of a skill and the rewards system of a minigame. 1. Dungeoneering is a quest. - Dungeoneering is a quest because it presents a problem to solve, a backstory, a plot, a foreseeable conclusion to the story, is full of puzzles, has (multiple) boss fights, and forces the player to utilize his/her skills and ingenuity to progress through the story. Quests often contain at least some of those aspects. - As with most quest series, the story of Dungeoneering is released in multiple parts. - The storyline in Dungeoneering is directly related to (and may directly affect) existing storylines in Runescape. - The story is told via clues found by the player as they descend into Daemonheim, which is a very common storytelling device in nearly all mediums of storytelling. 2. Dungeoneering has the mechanics of a skill. - Each floor of Daemonheim is assigned a level. To progress further, you must raise your levels (with floor 60 being at level 119). - The prestige system forces the player to repeat floors multiple times on the way to floor 60 (which is unreleased). 3. Dungeoneering has the rewards system of a minigame. - As with most minigames in Runescape, completion of "rounds" (or in Dungeoneering, floors) awards the player with some type of "currency" that can be traded for certain rewards. While not an argument, it's worth noting that Dungeoneering has far more lore, story development, and depth of storyline than most quest series. It is also one of three known plots in Runescape that, if fulfilled, will enact the Edicts of Guthix, destroying us all (the other two plots are Azzanadra's attempt to resurrect Zaros and Lucien's attempt to become a god).

But I'm not ignoring facts. Your argument is that Dungeoneering uses a storytelling device that you don't like, therefore Dungeoneering is not a quest, correct? If Reldo handed us a collection of texts and documents and said "here, read this, see if you can go stop Bilrach before he figures out how to free Zamorak," I would completely agree with you. However, that's not the case. It is the case that we are currently battling our way to the bottom of a castle to stop him while finding out what's going on as we progress, which is a pretty common scenario in many Runescape quests. The only difference is that texts tell us what happened rather than NPCs.

Wow, you keep bringing up progression of the plot despite my countering that argument multiple times. Stop. Once again, your argument seems to be more emotive in that you just don't want Dungeoneering in your life at all, so your arguing against it however you can, despite the fact that you can't counter any of my arguments.

So you don't believe that uncovering clues to find answers is a valid way to progress a plot? In Runescape, we often have to rely on texts and ancient artifacts and the like to solve a problem or progress a storyline. It's not new with Dungeoneering. In fact, it's much more common than you say it is -- Dungeoneering just relies on it more heavily than others, which makes sense as we're dealing with an antagonist who has a few thousand year lead on us.

Demoli, please stop bringing up the skill mechanics of Dungeoneering when we're talking about the questing side of it. For the umpteenth time, I know that the bosses keep appearing and you play through the floors a bunch of times. Believe me, I know. That's why it's a skill. Can we drop that now? In regards to reaching Bilrach, we know that he hasn't completed his task yet because the world hasn't ended. Thus, we still have a chance to stop him, which is what we're trying to do. This argument was always fun, as I always enjoy arguing. It's unfortunate that it's ended now, as you've admitted that other quests use the same storytelling device as Dungeoneering, meaning that Dungeoneering is no less of a quest in regards to the way the plot progresses and how the story is told.

Every time you descend to another floor, you're progressing the plot because each consecutive floor puts you closer and closer to Bilrach. We've defeated four of his Kal'Gerion generals, which is a pretty big deal. Furthermore, I don't see how uncovering lore makes it any less of a quest. It's not uncommon for questers in any game, movie, or book to have to piece together clues to find out what's going on, which is exactly what we're doing here. You can think of the various Dungeoneering batches as quests in a series. The initial release was quest one, batch 1.75 was quest two, and batch 2 will presumably be the final installment. In that sense, you can compare Dungeoneering to any quest series, such as the Void quests or the Summer quests. Using your logic and reasoning, the Void quest series (and any quest series that has yet to conclude) is stagnant and stale because the plot does not progress.

In regards to the first sentence, We don't know, and neither do you. So lets not assume what Dungeoneering could be and judge what dungeoneering is. This means Daemonheim has a stale plot. Like silvertale and i have said, it doesn't move on. It's there set in stone. No matter what you do so far, it won't progress. This denial of progression is the main reason Dungeoneering isn't a quest. I do agree Daemonheim will eventually be home to a quest, and i look forward to it, since Bilrach is one of the few remaining mahjarrat that still weren't seen in physical form , only him and Sliske remain i think. Him being introduced would mean the ritual could be happening sooner than i though. Wow, are we really going to go through all of this again? We KNOW what Bilrach is planning to do. WE KNOW. We have to stop him for obvious reasons. How in the world is that stale at all? Do you really want me to explain the story again? The plot DOES progress whether you like it or not. It's a "multi-part" quest in a sense. I don't know if you're aware, but batch 2 isn't out yet, so the story isn't complete yet. However, there IS an end to the story. You're arguing technicalities, which is pretty unimaginative of you. You and I both know that this story has an ending and that we'll almost certainly have to confront Bilrach and stop him. For whatever reason, you're trying to very hard to forget that and argue that "nothing" has happened, therefore the plot is stagnant and stale, which is faulty reasoning. You can't just ignore an important aspect of the issue to support your argument.

Well then we're 4 to believe the skill alone will still need a quest sooner or later. And why do you think they'll add a new quest? Because if they leave the skill as it is right now, even adding new levels, it will never move on from that. That's what quests are there for - to make progress in the history of the game, to solve the plots. I think you're just confusing the words "quest" and "adventure". Both Dungeoneering and questing are adventures. But they're two different types of adventures. You think it's a quest because of how you explore and learn more about the area while you do the skill, right? Well, that's what adventuring is about, but questing takes a few more ingredients than that. I think the misunderstanding is solved here much. But the events in Daemonheim DO have a progressing plot, like I've already mentioned many times. The plot will eventually stop when the "quest" is complete, just like in real quests. The only thing that quests have that Dungeoneering does not have is quest points. The books/notes you find in Dungeoneering were already there before you even entered the dungeon. Your knowledge makes progress but the game doesn't. And what happens when we get to the bottom of Daemonheim . . . ? You're not looking at the big picture. We're not just uncovering clues right now, we're also fighting through hordes of monsters to reach Bilrach before he can unleash Zamorak. There is undeniably a progressing plot.

Well then we're 4 to believe the skill alone will still need a quest sooner or later. And why do you think they'll add a new quest? Because if they leave the skill as it is right now, even adding new levels, it will never move on from that. That's what quests are there for - to make progress in the history of the game, to solve the plots. I think you're just confusing the words "quest" and "adventure". Both Dungeoneering and questing are adventures. But they're two different types of adventures. You think it's a quest because of how you explore and learn more about the area while you do the skill, right? Well, that's what adventuring is about, but questing takes a few more ingredients than that. I think the misunderstanding is solved here much. But the events in Daemonheim DO have a progressing plot, like I've already mentioned many times. The plot will eventually stop when the "quest" is complete, just like in real quests. The only thing that quests have that Dungeoneering does not have is quest points.

40.9M in herb supplies. B)

Getting at least 92 herblore on the exp weekend for sure so far. Did a little dungeoneering. Definitely gonna solo all the way to 85. Can't stand teams still.