unclebilly1

Congratulations Jack! Sorry your welcome thread was sullied by bad attitudes and off topic posts :/

Gratz TBK and good luck on future wars :thumbup:

Kim doing work, lol :thumbsup: <3: To Pan: You get way to defensive there, amigo. Yes, my post was directed at you; however, it echoes for everything TWR related. The staff do a lot of things behind the scenes, but I can tell you honestly there is not a ton to work with in regards to the TWR. This has spiraled into an discussion of the overall activity of the Clan Discussion forum, and hey, that's fine, they do go hand in hand, but my post was about the TWR specifically, not about the entirety of Clan Discussion. I don't know exactly when you were on the Clan Staff here, but it was at least 2+ years ago, and a lot has changed since then. 2 years ago there were a lot more active clans on TWR (40+ clans warring often). Now there are not (20 clans warring infrequently). The staff is not to blame for these clans not fighting each other. Sure they could cut the inactives, and probably should, but then there would 6 clans left. Only 6 have warred this year. And I've been posting on Tip.it since 2005 and an avid reader of it even longer, so don't pull that "I've been around longer than you so I know everything" nonsense. It's condescending and pretentious and doesn't impress anyone. To Gamerr: I agree with you. My post was mainly about the TWR and not necessarily the CD forum, but you're right about that. The CL's and Mods should be more active in posting interesting topics there. When I was staff here we did a pretty poor job at it also (the CL's, the Mods did alright), but Kim and YGuy were pretty active in that department. The rule probably still exists, and should be utilized. To play devil's advocate, though, let me ask you this . . . do people post on RSC Clan Discussion boards because of the excellent moderation? I rarely see interesting topics made by moderators, and usually hear quite a bit of complaining about biased moderation there. I don't personally agree with that, just throwing it out for discussion. On Topic: One thing we haven't really considered is the mixture of PVP vs CWA-only clans in the TWR. In my opinion, the TWR was most active from early 2008 until mid-2009. Towards the end of 2009 the activity slumped, and all throughout 2010 and 2011 is just sits there on life support. When the TWR was rocking, Clan Wars was the only place for clans to fight. Yes, there was the BH crater, but is was modified in February 2008 to the 'special single' monstrosity that prevented clan combat but did allow for some pretty special pile-jumping. Nice call there, Jagex. :roll: Mid-level clans weren't really dying, or at least not any faster or slower than big clans, because everyone was in the same boat. If you wanted to fight, you had to go to clan wars. So essentially every clan was a clan wars clan. And that worked for about a year and a half, until May 2009, when the BH/PVP worlds were released. Now clans had an option, they could fight in the 'wildy' or they could continue in clan wars. Different clans went different ways, and the TWR started losing momentum, all the way until now where we have what we have. Now with PVP back in full-swing and in all worlds, the TWR needs to pick a side. Right now there are 23 clans on the TWR list. 12 actively do PVP (by PVP I mean fight in the wilderness). 5 are primarily clan wars, and the others I don't know enough about to say what they are. What that means for the TWR is while there are 23 active clans to choose from, there are in reality far less that that. A PVP clan would much rather fight in the wilderness, while CWA teams obviously want to fight in clan wars. Neither would be extremely willing to give up their preferred fighting place, and since the PVP clans would have to fight in clan wars since it's default rules, they generally go inactive on the TWR, preferring to spend their time fighting where they enjoy it the most. A quick glance over the TWR list proves this. So, in my opinion, the TWR needs to go PVP-only or Clan Wars-only. Right now there's just too much varience in the styles of clans to have any kind of meaningful rankings or fights. Crimson Raiders are never going to bother to set up a fight with KOA in Clan Wars because they prefer PVP and that fight would be a waste of their time. KOA would have no interest in that fight either. Right now the TWR is trying to be all things to all people, and that almost never works. In addition, I would allow PKRI's, both capped and uncapped, as valid wars on the TWR. TL; DR Summary: In my opinion, I think the TWR would be better of as a PVP-only list, only allowing Clan Wars if both clans agree on it. And, to have a better chance to get some bigger fish, allow capped uncapped PKRI's to be used as a valid TWR war. That would fix the major problem people had with the RAW list, is that the RAW list didn't allow PKRI's as acceptable wars. Yes, there would be some drama, but some drama is OK. It's 90% of what fuels RSC, and I think we all agree RSC is the most active Clan Board there is.

Was a lot of fun :) TT always puts up a great fight, here the numbers were just too much to overcome. They did have an impressive 105-man peak themselves, gratz on that activity. Look forward to future fights TT :thumbup:

Asc DF or VR?

Thanks for the small skirmish DF :)

It's always easy to take potshots at the staff, but in reality the staff here is active and are around every day. What makes them seem inactive is that there is literally nothing to do from a moderation standpoint on the forums. It doesn't take long to sift through 3 or 4 war declarations and 3 or 4 war topic posts. I was a CL here for about a year and a half and visited the forums daily; although I would probably be considered 'inactive' by your standards because I didn't post on every war topic and declaration topic. Fact is, no one, and that includes staff and posters alike, would post on any thread of any sort. A big response to a thread might have 15 or 20 replies, most had less than 10. You can blame the leadership, but you also need to look in the mirror as well. Without activity for us to act on, there is precious little we can do. The TWR is like a great restaurant that no one knows about. It could make the best food in the world and it wouldn't matter because no one would be there to eat it. Right now, there are just not enough small-to-medium level clans that care about a ranking ladder. I believe it is because most of the small-to-medium sized clans have fallen into a pit of inactivity brought on by the closure of the wilderness. At first, clans with 25-75 members were still active. Clan wars was new and exciting, and BH was still an unknown entity. That's when the TWR was really rocking. We had 30+ clans, and the #1 clan always had 3.000+ points. I was in a TWR clan then, and we obtained #1 by fighitng 4+ times weekly. But Runescape clanning lives and dies by fighting. It is really the only sustaining reason for combat-oriented clans. As those small and midsized clans grew tired of clan wars and ventured out into PVP and BH worlds, they quickly found out that they absolutely could not compete with the top clans that controlled the 5 or 6 available warring worlds. So, they pretty much died. The clan I was in (The Death Monkeighs) went from a 300+ person clan that could occasionally pull max opts in 2007 to today being a 44-person clan that no longer wars at all. I could probably name 30 small and midsized clans that were our immediate competition that either are on life support or no longer exist. I guess that's kind of a long way of saying that it's not the leadership's fault that there are no TWR clans that care to be active. But there still may be hope for the TWR. Of course everyone knows that with the return of ulimited wilderness will also give opportunity for the rebirth of small clans. Skillers and level 3 looters will once again roam the wildy for loot and clues. Small teams will form to take advantage of the solo players. Small clans will form to take advantage of the small teams. And so on and so forth. Will these clans also care about the TWR? It remains to be seen, but the future is a hell of a lot brighter than it has been in the past for it. Those on the Clan Staff already know that I've pushed hard for the TWR to recruit more active and more 'name' clans to the TWR, and also to make PVP default for TWR fights. I highlight it because I believe now more than ever is an opportunity for clans to enter and care about the TWR. Clan Wars would be open if both clans agreed on it, but the majority of the fights should be PVP. Since we'll basically have countless open worlds for PVP fights, crashing will no longer be an excuse. If there was ever a time to do this, it is now. It's unlikely that clans like RSD, TT, VR, DF, ROT, etc. will ever join the TWR, simply because they don't need to, nor would you really want them to. Having 100 Titans show up for a full-out against Clan X that would pull 15 level 90's would be a waste of their time and demoralizing for the small clan. But the opportuinty to gain smaller clans with high averages and larger clans with lower averages is there. Just a quick glance over the posting clans on RSC shows clans that would fit this mold (taken from ggohans77's Top 10 clan post) : Lithuanian Forces Crimson Raiders Pure Hatred Wilderland Lithunian PKing Team Hell Army The Neggas Clan Exodus Massive Metal Attack The Moon Clan Envy Downfall The Call of Legends Australian Army Dragonwood Collision Forsaken The Gladiatorz Runite Knights of Finland Poison Ascension Perception THE Clan The Knights of Order Lux Aeterna Solar Angels Resurrected Forces The Viet Clan Dark Dragon Breath Blacknights Obviously some of these clans are already in TWR, but none are particularly active. And nor could you get all of these clans, but getting 5 or 10 in addition to the clans you already have would be a decent start. Of course doing all this would mean re-vamping the TWR, and would also mean alienating some of the clans who have been around before the transition. But really it boils down to what the staff and posters of Tip.it really want. But unless people are willing to step up and say what they want, it is unlikely that anything will change.

We fought them before the rot+df fight. They left and fought rot+df after our fight. So, no, there was no 3v2 as no rot nor any df were at our fight.

Good luck to everyone who applies!

Nice win Solace!

^ Pretty much this.

Looked like a lot of fun, I really like close fights like that :thumbup:

Close fight! Gratz CR, and good effort SE :thumbup:

Gratz on your fights! Looked like fun :)

Would been a lot more fun and competitive had EoS not crashed like 10 times. Maybe next time they can find something else to occupy their time with :P GF TT

Good job TO, sad to see KO with such small pulls, they used to be really active.

I've never seen a tracker that was spot on, no one would believe it anyhow, lol. Good Job CR :thumbup: Hope you guys get back to pulling big opts.

The topic will remain open unless proof is supplied that DW did indeed crash a fight between Poison and Exodus. Until then, there is more than sufficient evidence that a fight occured between Dragonwood and Poison to leave the topic open. Any pics of proof of crashing can be sent to any Clan Staff member for review. Thanks!

There is a plaque in Lumbridge and at Clan Wars with the winning team's names on it. Nothing special but still beats a kick in the rear :P

Pretty sure this topic is for Poison's win against AK Latin. It is not a topic of who's slumping, who has slumped, and who does or does not do PvP. So, let's get back on topic. GJ Poison, BLNT AK Latin :thumbup:

TDM vs Adelais (2007) - After months of smack talk from Adelais, TDM pulled 140 people (420 opts) in the old wildy and absolutely steamrolled Aids, who were Top 10 at the time. TDM War List vs Darkness Awaits (2008) - My first 12-hour returning PKRI. Small opts (only about 50-60 for each team remaining at 3 AM), but was still intense, both sides really wanted the win. TDM War List vs Blacknights (2009) - Clan Wars matched 22-22, came down to a 1v1 to decide the winner. TS was going crazy, lol. Eternal Honour vs Shadow Elves (?) (2009) - Only significant because it was my first fight after joining a Top 10 clan, fighting another Top 10 clan. Fighting with huge opts is waaaaaaaaay different than matched 20 v. 20's in CWA. RSD vs RoT (2010) - 8-hour P2P PKRI, lost like 25-30M in sets but kept returning. Others lost a lot more, but kept returning. Amazing dedication, we won the fight but admittedly there was a lot of crashing, most of it directed at RoT. Had over 50 kills that fight, have never come close to that since :P Only downside was the huge lag, both clans had over 100 people (+ familiars) and there were about 30-40 people constantly crashing. RSD vs VR (2010) - We pulled 120 (360 opts) and VR pulled 170 (510 opts :shock:). After 6 hours of figting, though, we had grown to 135+ while VR had dropped to 90 or so, and they ended quickly from there. Probably the most lopsided starting I've been a part of, and still came out victorious. Jagex Cup 2010 - Winning it was nice, not gonna lie :P

When is it ok to crash? It's never really worth it. Sure, it might feel good and you will get some good TS laughs when you hit someone you hate, but you will also be pissed when that same clan crashes your fights and ruins your good time. RSD doesn't crash, and I think we have more fun, clean fights as a result of that. Crashing takes its toll on members, also. Some really enjoy it, but most grow tired of it quickly. Most clans that get involved in crash wars lose a lot of members quickly, that makes me believe it is not as fun as people make it out to be. Very few clans end a crash war with more members than they started with. Does your clan crash planned fights? No, never. Do you Consider it 'NH'? Not really, it's the wilderness and everyone's fair game. If you want a crash-proof fight, CWA is there, so if your clan doesn't utilize it then your complaints about being crashed are null because you ignored the alternative. It's really more of a 'golden rule' thing, treat others like you want to be treated. If you don't want to be crashed, don't crash. If someone in YOUR clan snipes other wars, do your clan officials take action? Yes, they are kicked from the clan.

I see me in the chat box :shades: Was fun, was only able to attend the F2P part of the trip.

Was fun AF, thanks for the fight.

Was fun, thanks for the fight VR. 3 kills, 0 deaths