An old-school player's thoughts on 'the update'.

[Schmo0zle]

I'm going to try to make this short, since I'm not very well informed on the update, so I can't really analyze it. :P

 

 

 

OKAY! I started playign RuneScape in 2001. I played until about 2004 hardcore until WoW came out, which I left and went to play instead. Yesterday I logged into my character for the first time in over 3 years. 1195 days or something like that. So 3 and 1/3 years, basically. :P

 

 

 

I found myself wandering around with basically no items or money (gave like 100 million away - when that was actually a ton of money) and was basically just checking out changes made to the game. New graphical updates that looked pretty cool. Quest cut-scenes...All very interesting. Then I checked the RuneScape updates on the website after I heard people screaming about no more PKing in the game.

 

 

 

"What the heck?" I asked myself. "That can't be true.", at this point I still don't know if it is true or not...Since I've been out of the loop so long, I have no idea what they're even talking about on the website! Maybe someone who's also an older player can update me. :P

 

 

 

Anyways, here's a message I wish to convey...

 

 

 

I see a lot of complaining. A lot of whining, threatening to quit, etc etc.

 

 

 

It brings back memories of a fateful day when Fatigue was introduced. The same thing was going on. People were calling it the end of RuneScape. But what was the end result? It was refined from something intolerable to something that was more tolerable for players as a whole...Yet still, people cheated, finding clever ways around it.

 

 

 

Back then - as I'm sure is the same case now - cheat-site programmers were pretty genius. They made their bots, their "sleeper" fatigue program, etc etc. It was all things Jagex didn't see around.

 

 

 

Jagex wanted this to stop forever.

 

 

 

Here comes random events! Again, people were calling it the end of RuneScape, whining about quitting, etc etc. Are you seeing a pattern yet? And once again, it was refined a bit (I don't know to what extent anymore since I haven't played in a long time, but I think they're still in-game at least!) and people got used to it.

 

 

 

Now it's the same thing. People crying, screaming and being little children. And yet, 2 years from now, RuneScape will be even bigger than it is now, and do you know why?

 

 

 

Because it's always refined, and people always get used to it. Even though I do not understand what was done in these updates completely since i've been out of the loop for so long, I CAN tell you that it isn't as bad as people are making it out to be. Why can I say that? Because it never IS as bad as people make it out to be. People just hate change, and the people who hate change the most are the people who were breaking rules that the changes stop.

 

 

 

Bottom line - Someone update me on WTF is going on (:P), and everyone quit cryin'. It is always refined into something that works, and everyone ALWAYS gets used to it and plays on. Heck, the reason I quit wasn't because of fatigue or randoms or anything else that sucked (though that puzzle box random made me sign off in anger many-a-time), it was because I got bored, plain and simple. I had a level 123 and a bunch of 60+'s. I had done it all.

 

 

 

Enjoy the game and adapt. These companies NEED to stop cheaters, because cheaters ruin games from the inside out. It isn't about breaking rules, it's about breaking a game, and Jagex needs to stop it. They always have fought these cheaters, and just when cheaters get comfy, Jagex kicks them in the nuts and the honest players usually get burned a bit too. That is Jagex's fault for being over-zealous, but they're trying to make your game experience better. Once you get used to it, this could be looked back on as the update that made RuneScape better.

[raylifes]

In response to your question:

 

You can't attack other players in the wilderness anymore, Jagex has introduced a new mini-game to substitute the wilderness, but people don't like it because you can't survive there without a team.

 

 

 

Besides the wilderness, in january unbalanced trades can't be done. No more gift giving, no more lootsharing when getting high value drops from strong monsters like the dagganoth kings. You can use lootshare, but it needs to be seriously redesigned to work for high value drops.

 

 

 

Edit: Realised you might need a bit more explaining... :P

 

 

 

Lootshare is a function you can use when fighting a monster with multiple people. The drops from that monster are then automaticly split between the players, but if it's a very strong monster that you can't kill more then 5 times maybe, the drops might be like this:

 

player1: 10 blood runes

 

player2: 1 rune scimitar

 

player3: dragon woodcutting axe (don't know the exact value, but it's in the mills)

 

 

 

Normally they would share the profit from the dragon axe, but starting from january they can't because of the trade update.

[mario_sunny]

Well, if you look at these recent updates from a player's point of view, I think the least-harshest word I could use to describe them would be 'radical.' Everyone, the economy, is being affected by this lack of pking. I wouldn't view this as 'whining,' (but there are a few that blew their heads on the RSOF) people simply want change because everything is being affected. Once great moneymaking methods are now gone, prices are plunging and won't stop, ect.

 

 

 

The random events were, indeed, something that everyone got used to, but now I think you can agree with this generation of runscapers that they have really gotten pretty annoying if you stay in the game long enough. :P

[Schmo0zle]

In response to your question:

 

You can't attack other players in the wilderness anymore, Jagex has introduced a new mini-game to substitute the wilderness, but people don't like it because you can't survive there without a team.

 

 

 

Besides the wilderness, in january unbalanced trades can't be done. No more gift giving, no more lootsharing when getting high value drops from strong monsters like the dagganoth kings. You can use lootshare, but it needs to be seriously redesigned to work for high value drops.

 

 

 

Indeed it sounds horrible, but like I said, it'll surely be refined to some point, though I doubt you'll get free-attacking wilderness back, which is kinda' lame.

 

 

 

My entire point is basically this - people always whine and kick and scream, but a year from now, no one will care, and RuneScape will be bigger. It's happened with every single "bad" update they've made.

 

 

 

I'm not going to give Jagex any credit, though. They've dealt with cheaters in the worsts way possible. They're very uninventive. They could've just tracked unbalanced trades via an in-game mailing system like WoW does, and banned people who did that. That would've only been a first line of defense, however, and they've have to go back and do more later.

 

 

 

Jagex seems to just be fed up with it all. Since day one they've been dealing with cheaters, and multiple times, these cheaters have messed up the games economy with party hat dupes, money duping, bots in general, etc etc.

 

 

 

Makes me wish they'd sell RSC's source. I'd buy it up in a second. :P

[Schmo0zle]

Well, if you look at these recent updates from a player's point of view, I think the least-harshest word I could use to describe them would be 'radical.' Everyone, the economy, is being affected by this lack of pking. I wouldn't view this as 'whining,' (but there are a few that blew their heads on the RSOF) people simply want change because everything is being affected. Once great moneymaking methods are now gone, prices are plunging and won't stop, ect.

 

 

 

The random events were, indeed, something that everyone got used to, but now I think you can agree with this generation of runscapers that they have really gotten pretty annoying if you stay in the game long enough. :P

 

 

 

Of this I have no doubt. If I still played, I'd probably be very upset. Before fatigue, everything was fine and dandy. People were cheating, but I didn't view it as a huge issue, really. Now with each "stopping cheaters" update, it's seemed to have gotten worse. I've looked into RS's community about once per year since I quit, and to me, it had always seemed to go downwards. I don't know if you played back in the day, but RuneScape was a pretty glorious game. It was ugly, but it was FUN. It kept me out of trouble as a kid, too, so that's a plus. :P

 

 

 

Like I said, if RSC's source was for sale, I would buy it in a second. RSC was the first MMO I had ever played, and probably the game that, to this day, I've spent the most time on. being able to play RSC in it's 2003-ish glory would make me happy. :P

[Schmo0zle]

Just a thought I had..

 

 

 

Can someone tell me why they didn't just make it so you cannot go into the wilderness with money in your inventory? That way, PKing is still viable, but cheaters wouldn't be able to go in and kill each other to drop said money.

[DarkDude]

And remember with Fatigue people were complaining about having to walk to a bed and then Jagex "fixed" this by adding Sleeping bags, which made pretty much everyone happy, having to carry an extra item with you didn't hurt too badly.

 

 

 

The same will happen here, I doubt any of the changes are going to remain as they are. I believe Jagex have already said they're doing something about loot sharing, they've been listening to comments on Clan Wars and I assume the new "wild" will be changed.

 

 

 

People just don't have patience, they ARE listening to players and of course won't leave things how they are.

[raylifes]

Just a thought I had..

 

 

 

Can someone tell me why they didn't just make it so you cannot go into the wilderness with money in your inventory? That way, PKing is still viable, but cheaters wouldn't be able to go in and kill each other to drop said money.

 

 

 

The cheaters would just go into the wild with very expensive armor, so that the buyer could sell that for money.

[pieter012345]

nice speech

 

 

 

 

 

respect !!

[Rock Hard]

People will change and adapt to the new game. RuneScape is not over.

 

 

 

But it will be changed, changed too much for the liking of a lot of players.

 

 

 

I don't mind change, I remember coming back to play a while after RS2 came out and being amazed at all the changes that had been made. It wasn't the same game, but it was still fun.

 

 

 

However, i've given bounty hunter a try, and it isn't fun for the solo player. It's not fun for the player who likes to risk wealth in PvP, and it's not fun for the player who enjoys evenly matched fights.

 

 

 

This time, the changes aren't worth putting up with. I play games for fun, and if RS isn't fun for me - There's plenty of other games that are.

 

 

 

If Jadex can make RS fun again for me, i'll play. Til then ...

[Schmo0zle]

Just a thought I had..

 

 

 

Can someone tell me why they didn't just make it so you cannot go into the wilderness with money in your inventory? That way, PKing is still viable, but cheaters wouldn't be able to go in and kill each other to drop said money.

 

 

 

The cheaters would just go into the wild with very expensive armor, so that the buyer could sell that for money.

 

 

 

That MAY be more trouble than it is worth. If you're trying to sell 10 million gp flat, it'd be hard to get together a set of armor that is 10 million gp flat without ripping off yourself, or the buyer getting ripped off.

 

 

 

Likewise, if you're trying to sell 1 billion gp...Good luck! Basically, make potions, armor, food, runes, etc the only things that can go in the wild. No rares, no money...Nothing useless. No one would have complained about this except cheaters, and the cheaters wouldn't be able to fill in larger orders and smaller orders would be hard to fill without one side or the other getting ripped off. It may not be a solid 100% fix, but it'd be a severe deterrent.

[deep_pain]

And remember with Fatigue people were complaining about having to walk to a bed and then Jagex "fixed" this by adding Sleeping bags, which made pretty much everyone happy, having to carry an extra item with you didn't hurt too badly.

 

 

 

The same will happen here, I doubt any of the changes are going to remain as they are. I believe Jagex have already said they're doing something about loot sharing, they've been listening to comments on Clan Wars and I assume the new "wild" will be changed.

 

 

 

People just don't have patience, they ARE listening to players and of course won't leave things how they are.

 

 

 

It would be nice if they are listening to players if they would let the players know that.

 

 

 

The RSOF had at least 100k posts about this update, the only thing they did was to make a post to get people to stop posting everywhere, that post alone has 40k+. They say at the begining of that post that they are listening, but 2 days have passed. I dont expect them to make changes straight away, but surely one of their 300 staff could mention somewhere on the site that they understand people have grievences and they will try and do something about it? not much to ask.

 

 

 

Back when fatigue was introduced Jagex was tiny compared to it's current form, it's understandable that they could have overlooked something as simple as people being annoyed having to walk so far for sleep.

 

 

 

As a PKer I used to love fatigue, if you logged out at 100% fatigue, you wouldn't have to worry about getting def exp if anything attacked you when you logged in, or if you forgot to change styles.

 

 

 

But so many staff didnt realise that people wouldnt be unhappy that there was no way of 1v1 PKing anymore. I very much doubt this will be fixed, because it is too silly to be an oversight, if it is an oversight, they need new heads of department. Of course they realised. But they made the change anway calculating losses against future new player gains.

[Schmo0zle]

And remember with Fatigue people were complaining about having to walk to a bed and then Jagex "fixed" this by adding Sleeping bags, which made pretty much everyone happy, having to carry an extra item with you didn't hurt too badly.

 

 

 

The same will happen here, I doubt any of the changes are going to remain as they are. I believe Jagex have already said they're doing something about loot sharing, they've been listening to comments on Clan Wars and I assume the new "wild" will be changed.

 

 

 

People just don't have patience, they ARE listening to players and of course won't leave things how they are.

 

 

 

It would be nice if they are listening to players if they would let the players know that.

 

 

 

the RSOF had at least 100k posts about this update, the only thing they did was to make a post to get people to stop posting everywhere, that post alone has 40k+. They say at the begining of that post that they will take suggestions, but 2 days have passed. I dont expect them to make changes straight away, but surely one of their 300 staff could mention somewhere on the site that they understand people have grievences and they will try and do something about it? not much to ask.

 

 

 

Jagex has never been very good at listening. Ever since I first started playing, people were begging for stuff they wanted, and Jagex would essentially do the opposite most times. People begged for whole-world Pking if even on just select servers, and this was never even discussed openly.

 

 

 

Jagex used to post on tip.it, for example, but even then, I can't recall anything useful ever being said.

 

 

 

If I ran a game, my I'd probably have open forum asking the players what to do next. Jagex owns the game, but the players run it because they're the ones playing. Jagex is kind of like a dictatorship while all of it's citizens are screaming "democracy!" and they just don't give a crap. I said it back then and I'll say it now - I'll never give credit to Jagex for listening. I have always said they never listen and never give players anything they want.

 

 

 

The only exception I can think of is the sleeping bag, and that's only because it was a player-idea that actually made sense. You have no idea how much fatigue sucked [wagon] without sleeping bags. I can remember going from the Miners Guild into the Fally bank, and then instead of going back to the mine...Running down to the bed by the south gate in that little house next to the chain mail shop...Then running all the way back around and doing it all over again. It was horrible.

[Rock Hard]

 

 

 

Likewise, if you're trying to sell 1 billion gp...Good luck! Basically, make potions, armor, food, runes, etc the only things that can go in the wild. No rares, no money...Nothing useless. No one would have complained about this except cheaters, and the cheaters wouldn't be able to fill in larger orders and smaller orders would be hard to fill without one side or the other getting ripped off. It may not be a solid 100% fix, but it'd be a severe deterrent.

 

 

 

Stackable runes and arrows.

 

 

 

Not too hard. ;)

[fearspudgod]

If you ask me, this whole thing is stupid. Jagex just has sand in their butts because the money sellers make more $$ anually then they do.

[Schmo0zle]

If you ask me, this whole thing is stupid. Jagex just has sand in their butts because the money sellers make more $$ anually then they do.

 

 

 

Highly doubt that, but the reason they're doing it is because cheaters are not only now-lives online, they're also low-lives in RL, using stolen CC#'s to pay for membership, which Jagex then loses and their provider of services for CC's is pissed off.

 

 

 

...By the way, if I had a credit card and I could buy anything and not get busted, the LAST thing I'd do is buy RuneScape membership. Wtf. :lol:

[Schmo0zle]

 

 

 

Likewise, if you're trying to sell 1 billion gp...Good luck! Basically, make potions, armor, food, runes, etc the only things that can go in the wild. No rares, no money...Nothing useless. No one would have complained about this except cheaters, and the cheaters wouldn't be able to fill in larger orders and smaller orders would be hard to fill without one side or the other getting ripped off. It may not be a solid 100% fix, but it'd be a severe deterrent.

 

 

 

Stackable runes and arrows.

 

 

 

Not too hard. ;)

 

 

 

Again - more trouble than it is worth. But if you want to assume someone would take the time to get 1 billion gp in runes/arrows, then Jagex should implement something they should've a long [wagon] time ago...Mana pools. In short, you wouldn't be able to take runes/arrows (probably "energy" for arrows instead of "mana") into the wilderness because you wouldn't need them. You'd be able to cast without them, only you'd get no experience for doing so. Also, telegrab would be ommitted from this due to the things you can telegrab in the wilderness...And...Umm...Lets just say that mobs give no drops as well so people can sit there maging/ranging for fre and getting money.

 

 

 

There. Solved. And it's much better than ditching the wilderness. :P

[epeeflecher]

The only thing that is affecting me is the Trade update. I'm not going to cry over it though like the millions of pk'ers in fally crying over the wildy.

[JFonseka]

Bah, logging in for 2 minutes a week wouldn't hurt to see what's up. Even when I don't play, I login just once a week and check out the scenery.

 

 

 

Update yourself on the matter, don't be lazy.

[Schmo0zle]

Bah, logging in for 2 minutes a week wouldn't hurt to see what's up. Even when I don't play, I login just once a week and check out the scenery.

 

 

 

Update yourself on the matter, don't be lazy.

 

 

 

I really have no desire to. :P

 

 

 

RuneScape is annoying for me to play. Walking itself seems sluggish and slow...So if walking annoys me itself, I can't imagine what else would now. :P

[dustin]

lol, i remember the day Fatigue came into effect. They didn't even have sleeping bags at the time so you'd have to find a bed before you could continue.

[deep_pain]

The only thing that is affecting me is the Trade update. I'm not going to cry over it though like the millions of pk'ers in fally crying over the wildy.

 

 

 

quite different really, trade update obviously wont stop you playing the part of the game that is the reason you have a runescape account (although I sense for some it will).

 

 

 

A lot of PK'ers have been members for months or years. It is the only part of the game they enjoy, why that is the case shouldn't be in question, I will not question the part of the game you enjoy. The fact is they play RS to PK, like you play RS to do whatever you do. It's not a case of it's only a small change to what they do on Runescape, it is their entire reason for playing runescape. They are not cheaters, RWT's, bots or scammers more than any other type of player on RS.

 

 

 

The fact is they are paying for a service, Jagex have quite happily been accepting their money for months or years, and in one swoop have removed the reason they play the game.

 

 

 

There's been updates in the past that have affected me that I didn't like, but updates are updates if I don't like them, I wont use them. This isn't just about not liking an update.

 

 

 

The fact that Solo PKing no longer exists, isn't just that a part of the game has changed for me, it is that the whole part of the game I liked has been removed. No I wont do a: omg i quit you ruined my life post, because if i quit that's nobodys business but mine and friends, but for people like you to act like we dont have a right to complain after years of subscription, well whatever makes u happy I guess.

[Nenga]

This is what i've been saying this update is not as bad as they think.

 

 

 

This update seems a little overwhelming though because jagex sprung it on us all at once.

[Schmo0zle]

They could've done this without getting rid of the Wilderness. I suspect that they've wanted to get rid of the wilderness for quite some time now.

[alphakoldes]

Schmoozle, your initial post and everything you said was very intelligent and thought out.

 

 

 

A big problem I'm having with people is that they aren't being patient, aren't giving them a chance to at least try to fix things... I'm glad someone other than a player who's only been playing for a year can say this to everyone.

 

 

 

Good luck in WoW or whatever you do