Dragon scimitar is soo widely accepted now, that when you say sometting about zerker combo, u get blasted(from my experience)

 

 

 

even tho they have dumb reasons people just don't like change and know they are wrong. so what happened to 4mil zerker maulers and macers and sworders now, kicked out for those randoms noobs? why can't peoplke try it and see that it still is a bit better part from accuracy, so what will happen in a couple more months time, ever new/better weapons come out, what will happen then?

I think we've discovered a serious flaw in runescape. If your attack level is high enough, you don't need the added attack bonus to hit low level monsters.

I think we've discovered a serious flaw in runescape. If your attack level is high enough, you don't need the added attack bonus to hit low level monsters.

 

 

 

omfg lulz zomg m0nst3r fl4w y0u f0nd. d3l3t3 run3sc4p3 n0w! :lol:

 

 

 

i agree with him though when training normaly you dont need the ekstre what 20+ or 10+ att bonus ;)

I think we've discovered a serious flaw in runescape. If your attack level is high enough, you don't need the added attack bonus to hit low level monsters.

 

 

 

omfg lulz zomg m0nst3r fl4w y0u f0nd. d3l3t3 run3sc4p3 n0w! :lol:

 

 

 

i agree with him though when training normaly you dont need the ekstre what 20+ or 10+ att bonus ;)

 

 

 

 

 

its not an extra +10 or +20 attack bonus though, it's more like a +50/60 bonus using a whip in attack and strength AND an increase in speed

 

 

 

EDIT: there's a 54 difference in attack, and 34 difference in strength, not to mention the -35 to all defence just from your amulet slot before you start, all it comes down to is opinion - and in my opinion even if the +20% increases your max hit... hitting an extra 1 damage isn't worth -54 attack and -35 defence,

 

 

 

good day.

So far the main argument has been that this combo decreases accuracy. What everyone has to remember is that the zerker necklace adds 20% damage to each hit, making you hit harder every time. So if you normally would have hit a 20, the zerker special makes you hit a 24. I guess before the 20% bonus is added, you could say that you are less accurate, but 20% is added to your hit every time. I think this could make up for any loss of accuracy.

I think we've discovered a serious flaw in runescape. If your attack level is high enough, you don't need the added attack bonus to hit low level monsters.

 

 

 

omfg lulz zomg m0nst3r fl4w y0u f0nd. d3l3t3 run3sc4p3 n0w! :lol:

 

 

 

i agree with him though when training normaly you dont need the ekstre what 20+ or 10+ att bonus ;)

 

 

 

 

 

its not an extra +10 or +20 attack bonus though, it's more like a +50/60 bonus using a whip in attack and strength AND an increase in speed

 

 

 

EDIT: there's a 54 difference in attack, and 34 difference in strength, not to mention the -35 to all defence just from your amulet slot before you start, all it comes down to is opinion - and in my opinion even if the +20% increases your max hit... hitting an extra 1 damage isn't worth -54 attack and -35 defence,

 

 

 

good day.

 

Yes, we realize that that is true, but have you tried it out...as some other people have, and discovered that it is comparable to the whip for training, despite its lowered stats, and it even hits higher than the dragon scimitar, while having the same speed.

 

 

 

If you really needed an attack bonus while killing creatures, why don't more people use items such as Longswords or Battleaxes, which have a superior attack bonus over the Scimitar.

 

 

 

The loss in attack bonus is easily compensated for and often gives extra xp because of the extra damage it can do over the scimitar.

 

~Dan

I think we've discovered a serious flaw in runescape. If your attack level is high enough, you don't need the added attack bonus to hit low level monsters.

 

 

 

omfg lulz zomg m0nst3r fl4w y0u f0nd. d3l3t3 run3sc4p3 n0w! :lol:

 

 

 

i agree with him though when training normaly you dont need the ekstre what 20+ or 10+ att bonus ;)

 

 

 

 

 

its not an extra +10 or +20 attack bonus though, it's more like a +50/60 bonus using a whip in attack and strength AND an increase in speed

 

 

 

EDIT: there's a 54 difference in attack, and 34 difference in strength, not to mention the -35 to all defence just from your amulet slot before you start, all it comes down to is opinion - and in my opinion even if the +20% increases your max hit... hitting an extra 1 damage isn't worth -54 attack and -35 defence,

 

 

 

good day.

 

 

 

Just noting, it isn't giving an extra 1. It's giving an extra 20%. It's like having another super strength potion. Say I hit a 20, I'd now hit 20% higher (+4), so I'll hit a 24. And, as said before, this is for each hit. Not just your max. So each hit is 20% higher.

Zaps can you please post video of it in action???

I have been testing this combo ever since i saw this thread...

 

I've been mostly at cwars, dueling arena, and pest control.

 

in all cases i've gotten both "You'll never kill me and my godsword with that tiny thing!" AND "omfg did you just hit a 35 O.o"

 

 

 

I actually am hitting slightly higher than i would with my whip (1-2 points) and I beleive this combo is worth getting for and kind of combat.

 

 

 

My stats are:

 

Attack: 90

 

strength: 83 (training it, use stab it has a higher to hit bonus and most armor is weaker to stab)

 

defense:75

 

Hp:85

 

prayer: 70 (i try to keep piety on most of the time)

 

 

 

while i have no solid recorded data I have noticed a major increase in the amount of xp i get per hour and this is now my favorite weapon.

 

 

 

When I picked up the mace and tested it i found that it hit for more damge than the sword but the speed decrease and apparent loss of accuracy (if not 0 it never hit its max while the sword hit my max a lot) made the mace not worth using.

So far the main argument has been that this combo decreases accuracy. What everyone has to remember is that the zerker necklace adds 20% damage to each hit, making you hit harder every time. So if you normally would have hit a 20, the zerker special makes you hit a 24. I guess before the 20% bonus is added, you could say that you are less accurate, but 20% is added to your hit every time. I think this could make up for any loss of accuracy.

 

 

 

The 20% increase in damage doesn't affect accuracy. Accuracy is how often you actually not, not the damage dealt. With this combination you will hit more 0's is all that means with reduction in accuracy. To prove my point with what I have been saying already, using Tip.It's max hit calculator (no prayer or potions, on accurate):

 

 

 

Abyssal Whip + Fury

 

Strength Level/Max Hit

 

50 - 14

 

60 - 17

 

70 - 20

 

80 - 22

 

90 - 25

 

99 - 27

 

 

 

Obsidian Sword + Berserker Necklace (On calc the Sword is actually the Dagger)

 

Strength Level/Max Hit

 

50 - 14

 

60 - 16

 

70 - 18

 

80 - 21

 

90 - 23

 

99 - 25

 

 

 

From this you see, the Whip after level 50 strength, always hits higher, has better accuracy and better defence stats. I know you are know thinking, What about armour? As it is 20% damage, the higher strength bonus will help the Sword more right? This is with piety and super strength potion. Every slot other then the weapon+neck has the highest strength bonus equipment on.

 

 

 

Abyssal Whip

 

50 - 25

 

60 - 29

 

70 - 34

 

80 - 39

 

90 - 43

 

99 - 47

 

 

 

Obsidian Sword

 

50 - 25

 

60 - 29

 

70 - 34

 

80 - 38

 

90 - 43

 

99 - 47

 

 

 

As you can see, they hit the exact same (except at level 80 for some reason). However, this calculator rounds off, but in runescape, everything rounds off down. Using the same strength bonus for the Sword when the necklace is equipped (+96), but having removed everything so the 20% damage isn't put in. This gives a max hit of 39. 39 + 20% = 46.8 which in runescape would be 46. However in combat it may round up, but it is unsure. Even if it does, the chances of hitting max is less then the Whip as the Whip has a max of about 47.75 (this is shown due to when controlled mode is put on, it hits 48 [controlled mode is effectively +1 to Strength Level]).

 

 

 

All this information shows that the Whip in nearly all cases, hits higher or equal to the Sword (or higher in every case if it rounds down). It has increased accuracy, increased prayer bonus, increased defence bonuses. So for everyone saying the 20% damage makes up for accuracy.... I think this shows it doesn't ;)

i'm pretty sure the tip.it calc doesn't add the 20% for zerker necklace. #-o

 

As you can see, they hit the exact same (except at level 80 for some reason). However, this calculator rounds off, but in runescape, everything rounds off down. Using the same strength bonus for the Sword when the necklace is equipped (+96), but having removed everything so the 20% damage isn't put in. This gives a max hit of 39. 39 + 20% = 46.8 which in runescape would be 46. However in combat it may round up, but it is unsure. Even if it does, the chances of hitting max is less then the Whip as the Whip has a max of about 47.75 (this is shown due to when controlled mode is put on, it hits 48 [controlled mode is effectively +1 to Strength Level]).

 

 

 

All this information shows that the Whip in nearly all cases, hits higher or equal to the Sword (or higher in every case if it rounds down). It has increased accuracy, increased prayer bonus, increased defence bonuses. So for everyone saying the 20% damage makes up for accuracy.... I think this shows it doesn't ;)

 

 

 

However, the problem is that...we were never comparing to the Whip, we realize that the whip is better for training attack or defense, but is better than other weapons for training strength.

 

 

 

The accuracy difference rarely matters, if you really the attack bonus, then people wouldn't use items such as the scimitar and rather would use the longsword or battleaxe.

 

 

 

Please use the weapon combination before you judge it or make these calculations, because the calculator isn't 100% accurate either.

 

~Dan

Note when you select the Salve ammy on the tip.it calc, there's an option, Undead or Not?

 

 

 

When you select barrows there's: Full set or not?

 

 

 

For Dharoks: What's your hp?

 

 

 

Yet when you select the zerker necklace, nothing as such comes up. That leads me to believe that max hit is based ON STRENGTH BONUS ONLY.

However, the problem is that...we were never comparing to the Whip, we realize that the whip is better for training attack or defense, but is better than other weapons for training strength.

 

 

 

The accuracy difference rarely matters, if you really the attack bonus, then people wouldn't use items such as the scimitar and rather would use the longsword or battleaxe.

 

 

 

Please use the weapon combination before you judge it or make these calculations, because the calculator isn't 100% accurate either.

 

~Dan

 

 

 

Even still, the Whip is more efficient for training Strength. Sure it may be 1/3 the experience per damage, but in 3x the time you will have gotten more Strength experience then simply only training Strength with this Sword. Although you could argue that people want to keep their Attack and Defence levels down, but I don't see the point in that. Eventually you will more then likely want to raise them to 99 anyway. Accuracy does matter. The reason you see people using the Scimitar rather then a Longsword or Battleaxe, is the speed. While accuracy is important, speed is also. So there can't be a comparison in accuracy if there are different speeds.

 

 

 

Even if the calculator isn't 100% accurate, would it not be right to state that it would affect them both the same. So meaning even if the numbers aren't right, it still shows how the Whip would still hit higher (or equal to) then the Sword. Even comparing this Sword to the Dragon Scimitar, the Sword will hit on average 3-4 higher. But it is less accurate, and reduction in other bonuses.

 

 

 

Note when you select the Salve ammy on the tip.it calc, there's an option, Undead or Not?

 

 

 

When you select barrows there's: Full set or not?

 

 

 

For Dharoks: What's your hp?

 

 

 

Yet when you select the zerker necklace, nothing as such comes up. That leads me to believe that max hit is based ON STRENGTH BONUS ONLY.

 

 

 

Sorry but that is wrong. Type in your strength bonus as 96, and have it show you the max hit (make the Strength level 80 or so maybe, not 1 : ). Next select the equipment "Obsidian Dagger" (actually the sword), Berserker Necklace, and the max strength equipment for the rest. That comes to 96 strength bonus, but now you hit higher as the 20% is calculated in it. Also note that if you select 129 strength bonus (equivalent of Whip with max strength bonus but Berserker Necklace instead Fury) and also select the equipment, it hits the same. The 20% damage bonus for the Necklace on the calculator is only added when using the Obsidian weapons.

 

Even still, the Whip is more efficient for training Strength. Sure it may be 1/3 the experience per damage, but in 3x the time you will have gotten more Strength experience then simply only training Strength with this Sword. Although you could argue that people want to keep their Attack and Defence levels down, but I don't see the point in that. Eventually you will more then likely want to raise them to 99 anyway. Accuracy does matter. The reason you see people using the Scimitar rather then a Longsword or Battleaxe, is the speed. While accuracy is important, speed is also. So there can't be a comparison in accuracy if there are different speeds.

 

 

 

Even if the calculator isn't 100% accurate, would it not be right to state that it would affect them both the same. So meaning even if the numbers aren't right, it still shows how the Whip would still hit higher (or equal to) then the Sword. Even comparing this Sword to the Dragon Scimitar, the Sword will hit on average 3-4 higher. But it is less accurate, and reduction in other bonuses.

 

 

Unfortunately most people do not enjoy training on controlled because "it seems like" slower xp, even though its not. I do agree that it's overall faster xp, but some people do want to restrain their levels to a certain amount (Especially bHers, who want to stay within the Middle Level cave).

 

 

 

I have been using both the scimmy and the sword, along with the Whip, and my xp is only a little bit higher in compared to the sword, while using the whip, and is actually a good amount of higher than the Scimitar.

 

~Dan

 

 

 

[Edit]:I'll post the exact numbers later, when I have more time to post

but the thing is

 

1. some people are comparing it to whip, there's no problem in that but its than u put in fury, since everyone has 4.5mil to blow, actually no they don't.

 

2.if u have 4.5mil to spend, then what bout sara sword, it would obviously better than zerker combo

 

 

 

so obviously this thread is about 60 atack ,medium level cash account, quick ways to train str, so stop comparing it to a whip, i tried zerker combo with dds and glory(havent done monkey madness =P) and it worked awesomely,lol, on cyclopes, so i would suggest spend 778k on it, if u want, ull be suprised!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

SS is over 9m now, just a small note to above.

 

Even still, the Whip is more efficient for training Strength. Sure it may be 1/3 the experience per damage, but in 3x the time you will have gotten more Strength experience then simply only training Strength with this Sword. Although you could argue that people want to keep their Attack and Defence levels down, but I don't see the point in that. Eventually you will more then likely want to raise them to 99 anyway. Accuracy does matter. The reason you see people using the Scimitar rather then a Longsword or Battleaxe, is the speed. While accuracy is important, speed is also. So there can't be a comparison in accuracy if there are different speeds.

 

 

 

Even if the calculator isn't 100% accurate, would it not be right to state that it would affect them both the same. So meaning even if the numbers aren't right, it still shows how the Whip would still hit higher (or equal to) then the Sword. Even comparing this Sword to the Dragon Scimitar, the Sword will hit on average 3-4 higher. But it is less accurate, and reduction in other bonuses.

 

 

 

 

Actually according to the max hit formula I found (find the answers to be 99.9% corect to me), I would actually hit MORE than my whip using a toktz-xil-ak and berserker necklace. Also, the whole point of buying and using this set is against monsters with low defense ei you'll hit 5/6s of the time regardless of your attack bonus (which is what happens to some of my slayer assignments and a lot of the times in pest control.) I find that the set not only looks cool, but is a very good investment in training strength. Of course this is coming from someone whose attack and defense levels recently were at least 3 levels higher than her strength ;) .

fenrir as far as I can tell he isnt suggesting that this is a better setup than the whip/fury/defender combo - rather that it's a viable alternative to using a d scim to train strength

Actually according to the max hit formula I found (find the answers to be 99.9% corect to me), I would actually hit MORE than my whip using a toktz-xil-ak and berserker necklace. Also, the whole point of buying and using this set is against monsters with low defense ei you'll hit 5/6s of the time regardless of your attack bonus (which is what happens to some of my slayer assignments and a lot of the times in pest control.) I find that the set not only looks cool, but is a very good investment in training strength. Of course this is coming from someone whose attack and defense levels recently were at least 3 levels higher than her strength ;) .

 

 

 

Comparing what you did, the Sword would hit higher yes. You seem to have forgotten that it required a Necklace to hit that high, and to be able to compare, the Whip also needs one (i.e Fury). By saying you use this specifically only on low Defence monsters is irrelevant. You can't say you hit 5/6 of the time regardless of attack bonus. If that was the case, then that would mean attack bonus has no effect on how often you hit regardless of their defence level. The Whip/Dragon Scimitar+Fury will hit more often then the Sword/Necklace regardless of Defence. On Goblin's, with a Whip+Fury, it is possible to still hit 0's, the Sword will hit more 0's then the Whip though.

 

 

 

but the thing is

 

1. some people are comparing it to whip, there's no problem in that but its than u put in fury, since everyone has 4.5mil to blow, actually no they don't.

 

While that is true, it is unfair to compare another weapon without it. Berserker Necklace is the best one when using Obsidian weapons, so it is only fair that you use the best when comparing the others. It can also be said that they started as being the same gem ;)

 

 

 

Finally, people need to look beyond the ability to hit higher. The Dragon Scimitar, while does not hit as high, when combined with Fury has many additional bonuses. Overall it is far more useful on a far greater variety of NPC's.

I just completed a test for the difference between Dragon Scimitar+Fury and the Toktz-Xil-Ak+Berserker Necklace. The test was on the Agressive style, as this is what everyone wants to compare, the ability to train Strength. The test went for 1 hour exactly (From first attack till last attack before the time ended) with each and was conducted on Moss Giants on Pirate's Cove. The rest of what I wore was; Helm of Neitiznot, Fire Cape, Bandos Chestplate, Bandos Tassets, Dragon Boots, Berserker Ring, and "Barrows" Gloves. I also used Super Sets. Both set-ups started off with 10 Monkfish, in both cases I dropped 2 to pick up the drops, so really out of 8.

 

 

 

[hide=Dragon Scimitar]Strength Bonus: +112

 

Slash Attack Bonus: +109

 

Crush Defence Bonus: +283

 

(Only Crush Defence, as that is the style Moss Giants use : )

 

 

 

Max Hit seen: 34

 

Max Hit on Tip.It's Calc: 35

 

 

 

Experience Gained: 75,324

 

 

 

Aproximately how many were killed: 313.85

 

 

 

Ending Inventory

 

 

Herbs are both Kwuarm, seeds are Irit, Kwuarm, 2x Ranarr, Avantoe and Spirit Weed.

 

Money Made at Average Price on GE: 68k

 

Profit:61k[/hide]

 

 

 

[hide=Toktz-Xil-Ak]Strength Bonus: +94

 

Stab Attack Bonus: +70

 

Crush Defence Bonus: +248

 

 

 

Max Hit seen: 36

 

Max Hit on Tip.It's Calc: 38

 

 

 

Experience Gained: 74,160

 

 

 

Aproximately how many were killed: 309

 

 

 

Ending Inventory

 

 

Herbs are both Ranarr, seeds are 2x Ranarr, Avantoe and Spirit Weed.

 

Money Made at Average Price on GE: 87k

 

Profit:79k[/hide]

 

 

 

[hide=Overall Profit and Charm Drop Rate]Profit: 140k

 

 

 

Gold Charm: 187

 

Green Charm: 16

 

Crimson Charm: 11

 

Blue Charm : 6

 

 

 

Gold Charm: 30%

 

Green Charm: 2.6%

 

Crimson Charm: 1.8%

 

Blue Charm : 1%[/hide]

 

 

 

This shows that the Dragon Scimitar still goes better on something with low Defence. Although not much better, also remember that it is cheaper by about 650k. However, there are possible errors in my testing. I also want to note that while the Toktz-Xil-Ak did have a higher max hit - 36 compared to 34, it only ever hit 36 twice and never hit a 35. So they essentially had the same max hit.

 

 

 

1) I re-potted with the Super Set every 10 minutes (10 levels below potted max). On a couple of cases with the Toktz-Xil-Ak, I missed this and repotted after 11 minutes. Not really a substantial difference though.

 

 

 

2) I lost connection during the test with the Dragon Scimitar. I stopped the stopwatch 10 seconds after it lost connection (as I had just started attacking a Moss Giant). Then restarted it after I had logged in just before my first attack. Again, nothing substantial.

 

 

 

3) With the Scimitar I received 2 randoms, Wise Old Man with the Box and the Evil Chicken. With the Chicken, I put on mage prayer and piety and swapped to Accurate mode. It took maybe 20-30 seconds to kill. Might have resulted in the loss of around 700 experience. With the Toktz-Xil-Ak, only had 1 random - Security guard, no time lost.

 

 

 

4) Although not an error on my behalf necessarily, but I used the Agressive Stab mode with the Toktz-Xil-ak, as it had a higher attack bonus. Moss giants may be either weaker or more resistant to stab compared to slash, unsure.

 

 

 

I was thinking of doing a test on Monkey Guards at Ape Atoll as they have higher Defence. I would also be able to use Piety to increase accuracy and damage. I might do this anothing time, unless someone else is willing to test : . In my opinion, even if the Toktz-Xil-Ak had beaten the Dragon Scimitar by anything up to maybe 5k per hour. Dragon Scimitar would still be better. Cost of buying it is one factor, additional cost of food and Prayer potions. The reason why I have kept mentioning the extra prayer bonus, is during all slayer tasks, sometimes not even on slayer, I use damage increasing prayer all the time. Usually Superhuman Strength and sometimes Piety/Ultimate Strength. Extra prayer bonus will reduce the cost here again.

The Problem with this is i can't afford a fury so would d scim +glory be any different? or better than zerker combo?

 

It is hard to say whether Toktz-Xil-Ak/Berserker Necklace is better then Scimitar/Glory. Around 1k experience per hour worse approximately if anything. Keep in mind, the Scimitar/Glory combination is about 650k cheaper. Although, seeing as the Fury and Glory have the same attack bonuses, your hitting rate stays the same. Prayer bonus is same as Berserker Necklace, 2 less strength bonus compared to fury, 1 less compared to Necklace. And also +3 to all defence. So if anything, Scimitar/Glory is more then likely better still.

Nice to see those numbers, I'm trying them out on several different creatures right now, and as you may know, some creatures are weaker to different Attack Styles (Such as Dust Devils being weaker to Stab based attacks, and Giants being weaker to Slash attacks). Just making a reminder of that when testing out for values, because I'm getting higher xp on Dust Devils using the Sword than the Scimitar, while on other creatures, it may be more balanced.

 

 

 

I'm rather poor at keeping track of my own xp gains...but I'm working with Sara Sword + Fury, Scimmy + Fury + Defender, Obby Sword + Berserker Necklace + Defender, and perhaps Dharoks with either Fury or Salve.

 

 

 

I messed up on my first test already >.<....Didn't watch the time I started with Sara Sword...gonna start again tomorrow morning.

 

~Dan

Once you get the necklace, aren't you pretty much stuck with it? Who buys it, other than the people who have read this thread?

 

I have seen 7 people with this combo already lol.

 

 

 

Idk if someone said this but:

 

The necklace died with pking, maulers used it to hit 44s, then pking died and along with it, killed the part of the game which required thee most skill.

 

 

 

Does it beat a bgs in str training? I seem to get good amounts of exp. at castle wars with mine, it is also very entertaining.

 

 

 

Cocky level 100s run around with the flag in their karils, but they don't hear the roar of the godsword until they are dead :].