Slayer Sucks

[compfreak847]

No, I'm not at all. Like I said, those die far too fast to fight with a familiar. With your vast experience, you explained to me the ease of setting it on one of the gargoyles from the far group 12 squares away. I'm waiting for the explanation of how one does that without losing a single whip hit, especially when your familiar teleports back to you in a few seconds.

[Obtaurian]

No, I'm not at all. Like I said, those die far too fast to fight with a familiar. With your vast experience, you explained to me the ease of setting it on one of the gargoyles from the far group 12 squares away. I'm waiting for the explanation of how one does that without losing a single whip hit, especially when your familiar teleports back to you in a few seconds.

 

 

 

Ah, I see, misunderstood. One of the Gargoyles will almost always be close to you, so you just go for whatever one is closer. If the monster your familiar is fighting is attacking you, it will follow you as you run, and your familiar will chase it, which is the ideal scenario. If the monster is attacking your familiar, your familiar will usually stay put and attack it, assuming you don't chase a Gargoyle all the way around the middle pillar. You could also time it so that you move to the next Gargoyle when your familiars target is targeting you. Twelve steps is an exaggeration, and keep in mind that it's easy to lure a monster so that you don't have to run far, which is what you'll have to do if both Gargoyles are far away.

[compfreak847]

12 steps isn't an exaggeration, and it's impossible to lure with the closed walls of the tunnels. I was again assuming you had actual experience with this, or are you simply making it up as you go? With piety, kills come almost as fast as spawns in a full world - it's 3-4 hits per gargoyle, sometimes less, and the other one generally spawns less then 2 whip hits before the first one dies. It would be impractical and slow to get the summon on the other one before going back to the first, and with the 3-4 hit death and cramped space, your summon rarely has time to get more then one hit in.

 

 

 

Anyway, you've finally realized that your 'get the summon on the far group' theory has been blown out of the water. I'm still wondering, have you even tried this? If so, you wouldn't have argued against it, and you certainly wouldn't have suddenly switched viewpoints :|

[Obtaurian]

12 steps isn't an exaggeration, and it's impossible to lure with the closed walls of the tunnels. I was again assuming you had actual experience with this, or are you simply making it up as you go? With piety, kills come almost as fast as spawns in a full world - it's 3-4 hits per gargoyle, sometimes less, and the other one generally spawns less then 2 whip hits before the first one dies. It would be impractical and slow to get the summon on the other one before going back to the first, and with the 3-4 hit death and cramped space, your summon rarely has time to get more then one hit in.

 

 

 

Anyway, you've finally realized that your 'get the summon on the far group' theory has been blown out of the water. I'm still wondering, have you even tried this? If so, you wouldn't have argued against it, and you certainly wouldn't have suddenly switched viewpoints :|

 

 

 

I have tried it. Many times. Have YOU tried it? Clearly not, as you were the one preaching healing familiars, BOBs, attacking the same monster that your familiar attacks. :roll:

 

 

 

How in the world is it impossible to move a Gargoyle a few spaces? Hit, move two squares, hit, move two squares... not a hard concept, and one that I learned from Zarfot's guide. You've also lowered your hit count from 4-6 to 3-4 (sometimes less)... stop changing your numbers. You have plenty of time to move yourself and a Gargoyle over to the nearest spawn.

 

 

 

"...your summon rarely has time to get more then one hit in."

 

 

 

Dear lord, please tell me you're not saying what I think you're saying. :wall:

[compfreak847]

I've already stated I've tried it many times, you can stop questioning it in ever post. Despite your not having the summon level for it, your claim to have spent a great about of time testing it, and your still not realizing a couple of impossiblities:

 

 

 

#1, the far gargoyles are 12 steps away

 

 

 

#2, your summon cannot attack the far gargoyles for more then a few seconds before walking\teleporting back to you

 

 

 

#3, the gargoyles are trapped in their respective areas by too-narrow walls

 

 

 

#4, 3-4 hits are all that is required for the average gargoyle kill.

 

 

 

#5, 1 hit every 3 kills is all that is required to prevent a summon from being worth it.

 

 

 

If your trying to lure a monster that dies in a few hits over 12 squares so your summon can attack it, you will never get ANYWHERE close to the original spot before it dies. I suggest you try this before you preach about it =D>

[Obtaurian]

I've already stated I've tried it many times, you can stop questioning it in ever post. Despite your not having the summon level for it,

 

 

 

Really? I don't have the summoning level to hit the call button? There goes my entire argument!

 

 

 

your claim to have spent a great about of time testing it, and your still not realizing a couple of impossiblities:

 

 

 

#1, the far gargoyles are 12 steps away

 

 

 

Wow, defeated again! I totally forgot that the Gargoyles never move!

 

 

 

#2, your summon cannot attack the far gargoyles for more then a few seconds before walking\teleporting back to you

 

 

 

I've already told you that they do not teleport back to you or stop attacking unless you run allllll the way around the pillar, which you shouldn't do at all if you know how to lure.

 

 

 

#3, the gargoyles are trapped in their respective areas by too-narrow walls

 

 

 

Not true at all. The two Gargoyles closest to the rope can wander into each others' areas.

 

 

 

#4, 3-4 hits are all that is required for the average gargoyle kill.

 

 

 

Which is it, 4-6 or 3-4? I'd say you're right with both. About 3-6. Plenty of time to position yourself.

 

 

 

#5, 1 hit every 3 kills is all that is required to prevent a summon from being worth it.

 

 

 

Better not screw up then, eh?

 

 

 

If your trying to lure a monster that dies in a few hits over 12 squares so your summon can attack it, you will never get ANYWHERE close to the original spot before it dies. I suggest you try this before you preach about it =D>

 

 

 

Tried, tested, and I will continue to "preach." The last thing I want is respected yet uninformed players like yourself giving bad advice to budding Slayers.

[bedman]

Why dont you guys just meet up at gargs, and you, morningrise, show compfreak what you mean, cause I think there is a misunderstanding.

 

 

 

Just show it in game, really is the easiest.

[Obtaurian]

Just did a little testing without a Slayer Helm. I tried utilizing all four Gargoyles by running around the pillar clockwise. So far I'm getting good results. It might even work a little better than just taking three of them. :) Of course, it'd be much better with the helm. I did get a mystic top and a granite maul, so that's cool. I killed 40.

[pureprayer]

Test your xp/h and see how long you last. Then try it with a bunyip. A yip can attack also but it just sucks.

[Obtaurian]

Test your xp/h and see how long you last. Then try it with a bunyip. A yip can attack also but it just sucks.

 

 

 

Yips don't attack unless attacked, which monsters don't do. I have yet to test my xp rates, but my tasks go by much faster with a combat familiar than a Bunyip.

[compfreak847]

 

Tried, tested, and I will continue to "preach." The last thing I want is respected yet uninformed players like yourself giving bad advice to budding Slayers.

 

As if. Preach was used as a sarcastic term, implying that you were talking about XP rates that you didn't know and couldn't test.

 

I have tested it many times, and know what I'm talking about. You don't need to worry bout me giving bad advice.

 

 

 

Just did a little testing without a Slayer Helm. I tried utilizing all four Gargoyles by running around the pillar clockwise. So far I'm getting good results. It might even work a little better than just taking three of them. :) Of course, it'd be much better with the helm. I did get a mystic top and a granite maul, so that's cool. I killed 40.

 

Bad idea. Due to the distance between groups, your missing out on .75-1 whip hit every time you rotate groups, resulting ini the loss of the 1 in 3 monster whip hit to make a summon break even.

[Obtaurian]

 

Tried, tested, and I will continue to "preach." The last thing I want is respected yet uninformed players like yourself giving bad advice to budding Slayers.

 

As if. Preach was used as a sarcastic term, implying that you were talking about XP rates that you didn't know and couldn't test.

 

I have tested it many times, and know what I'm talking about. You don't need to worry bout me giving bad advice.

 

 

 

You've stated many times that you attack the same monster that your familiar is attacking. You have obviously not tested it. I have never given you exact experience rates.

 

 

 

Just did a little testing without a Slayer Helm. I tried utilizing all four Gargoyles by running around the pillar clockwise. So far I'm getting good results. It might even work a little better than just taking three of them. :) Of course, it'd be much better with the helm. I did get a mystic top and a granite maul, so that's cool. I killed 40.

 

Bad idea. Due to the distance between groups, your missing out on .75-1 whip hit every time you rotate groups, resulting ini the loss of the 1 in 3 monster whip hit to make a summon break even.

 

 

 

So far it's working out better than my previous method, and I'm still not losing any time. It's a little less chaotic, and I daresay a little more fun. I'll continue to test it when I get a Gargoyle task.

[compfreak847]

 

So far it's working out better than my previous method, and I'm still not losing any time. It's a little less chaotic, and I daresay a little more fun. I'll continue to test it when I get a Gargoyle task.

 

Your forgetting that you only need to miss one hit a minute to ruin the familiar. You should never lose a hit on either of the two groups, so if you spend anything over the 2.1 whip hit delay running between monsters, picking up drops, and shattering gargoyles your actually getting slower XP with a summon. I'll try to video something later to prove it's impossible to lure your familiar onto a separate monster without ever missing a single hit or waiting for a respawn, but it would probably be easier for you to make one showing you can.

[Obtaurian]

 

So far it's working out better than my previous method, and I'm still not losing any time. It's a little less chaotic, and I daresay a little more fun. I'll continue to test it when I get a Gargoyle task.

 

Your forgetting that you only need to miss one hit a minute to ruin the familiar. You should never lose a hit on either of the two groups, so if you spend anything over the 2.1 whip hit delay running between monsters, picking up drops, and shattering gargoyles your actually getting slower XP with a summon. I'll try to video something later to prove it's impossible to lure your familiar onto a separate monster without ever missing a single hit or waiting for a respawn, but it would probably be easier for you to make one showing you can.

 

 

 

Shattering gargoyles is pretty simple. You don't lose an attack turn when you use the hammer, so I usually hover my mouse over the hammer when one or both of the gargoyles gets low on health. That way I can click call and put my familiar back in line, attack the other gargoyle if my familiar goes for mine, etc. I'll look into recording, though I've never done it before.

[compfreak847]

 

 

 

Shattering gargoyles is pretty simple. You don't lose an attack turn when you use the hammer, so I usually hover my mouse over the hammer when one or both of the gargoyles gets low on health. That way I can click call and put my familiar back in line, attack the other gargoyle if my familiar goes for mine, etc. I'll look into recording, though I've never done it before.

 

Exactly, but the shattering takes an extra click. Do you honestly believe you can shatter a gargoyle then run to the far group and hit another gargoyle in under 2.1 seconds and call your familiar before the gargoyle retaliates, EVERY time, for an hour straight? I'd like to see a video of this, I find it hard to believe.

[Rimy_Penguin]

Lol. If u think slayer sucks then its ur loss. :shame:

 

Its probly one of the best skills on the game. But thats just my opinion

[compfreak847]

Lol. If u think slayer sucks then its ur loss. :shame:

 

Its probly one of the best skills on the game. But thats just my opinion

 

Glad to see we agree. I think it's a great skill too :thumbsup:

[Obtaurian]

 

 

 

Shattering gargoyles is pretty simple. You don't lose an attack turn when you use the hammer, so I usually hover my mouse over the hammer when one or both of the gargoyles gets low on health. That way I can click call and put my familiar back in line, attack the other gargoyle if my familiar goes for mine, etc. I'll look into recording, though I've never done it before.

 

Exactly, but the shattering takes an extra click. Do you honestly believe you can shatter a gargoyle then run to the far group and hit another gargoyle in under 2.1 seconds and call your familiar before the gargoyle retaliates, EVERY time, for an hour straight? I'd like to see a video of this, I find it hard to believe.

 

 

 

You call the familiar after the monster retaliates, or the familiar wont attack the monster. Remember to lure as well. My tasks usually last less than an hour, unless it's a particularly large task. Again, I'll look into recording a few minutes of it for you.

[warren211]

It's true, slayer is NOT the best way to train combat or earn money. But I still love the skill. I'm at 78 right now, working my way to 85 slowly.

 

 

 

Perhaps the best reason for slayer's existence is to add a requirement to certain monsters. Just think, what would happen if abyssal demons didn't have a slayer requirement? Pures, noobs, high levels, mid levels, and everything in between would camp there. Abyssal whips would drop sharply. The same goes for dark beasts, anyone over 80 combat would be able to kill them with enough prayer pots. Adding a combat requirement just wouldn't help, there are way more players over 90 combat than there are players 80 combat and 50 slayer. The slayer requirement for monsters helps tightly control massive populations of monster hunters. The game basically is saying "You wanna kill abby demons for their whips? Kill several thousand monsters first to get the slayer level and then we'll see". A great system if you ask me. I just don't like the idea of weak people noobing up drops like g mauls, dark bows, and abby whips that are slayer-specific drops.

[compfreak847]

 

You call the familiar after the monster retaliates, or the familiar wont attack the monster. Remember to lure as well. My tasks usually last less than an hour, unless it's a particularly large task. Again, I'll look into recording a few minutes of it for you.

 

 

 

That's what I mean. But you've got to hit the final blow on one gargoyle, then:

 

 

 

Smash it with the hammer

 

Run 12 steps over to the far group

 

Pick up the drops that the gargoyle left from the last time it died

 

Run to a spot where you can hit the gargoyle, but still have a large enough space for your familiar to spread out and attack

 

Hit the gargoyle and call your familiar immediately

 

 

 

All in under 2.1 seconds, without ever messing up - virtually impossible.

[Obtaurian]

 

You call the familiar after the monster retaliates, or the familiar wont attack the monster. Remember to lure as well. My tasks usually last less than an hour, unless it's a particularly large task. Again, I'll look into recording a few minutes of it for you.

 

 

 

That's what I mean. But you've got to hit the final blow on one gargoyle, then:

 

 

 

Smash it with the hammer

 

Run 12 steps over to the far group

 

Pick up the drops that the gargoyle left from the last time it died

 

Run to a spot where you can hit the gargoyle, but still have a large enough space for your familiar to spread out and attack

 

Hit the gargoyle and call your familiar immediately

 

 

 

All in under 2.1 seconds, without ever messing up - virtually impossible.

 

 

 

As I've already stated, you do not perform all of these actions between two whips hits. It takes place over the course of killing one or two gargoyles. It's more like 10-15 seconds. Practice makes perfect.

 

 

 

Click gargoyle to hit with hammer

 

Click next gargoyle (hit)

 

Click call when gargoyle hits

 

Move to next gargoyle (hit)

 

 

 

Your familiar will almost always teleport right next to the gargoyle, especially on the western side of the room. It was easier to deal with drops when moving around the pillar clockwise. Drops are mostly coins and steel items, which I do not pick up.

 

 

 

I should also mention that if your familiar leaves to attack the monster that you're attacking, just switch places with it.

[compfreak847]

Gargoyles have a high charm rate, so over 50% of the time you'll end up doing EXACTLY what I described. My post stands.

[Sir_Kurity]

As I've already stated, you do not perform all of these actions between two whips hits. It takes place over the course of killing one or two gargoyles. It's more like 10-15 seconds. Practice makes perfect.

 

 

 

Click gargoyle to hit with hammer

 

Click next gargoyle (hit)

 

Click call when gargoyle hits

 

Move to next gargoyle (hit)

 

 

 

Your familiar will almost always teleport right next to the gargoyle, especially on the western side of the room. It was easier to deal with drops when moving around the pillar clockwise. Drops are mostly coins and steel items, which I do not pick up.

 

 

 

I should also mention that if your familiar leaves to attack the monster that you're attacking, just switch places with it.

 

 

 

Yep, summoning is so inadequate it needs to be micro managed.

[Obtaurian]

Gargoyles have a high charm rate, so over 50% of the time you'll end up doing EXACTLY what I described. My post stands.

 

 

 

Drops stay put long enough and gargoyles die fast enough to allow you to make it back to your drop before it disappears. Moving clockwise around the pillar, I was easily able to collect my drops within a minute of them appearing on the floor. That was without a Slayer Helm, mind you.

 

 

 

EDIT:

 

Yep, summoning is so inadequate it needs to be micro managed.

 

 

 

You say that like Summoning is the only aspect of this game that utilizes micromanagement. A good number of skills require micromanagement to train at maximum speed.

[compfreak847]

Slayer helm shouldn't make a huge difference, although your lower combat stats certainly will. It's not the making it back part that's the problem, it's the crushing the gargoyle, running 12 steps, picking up drops, attacking another gargoyle, and calling your familiar in under 2.1 seconds that's the problem. Try recording the time and you'll see what I mean.