sadukar123 Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 This topic is about barrow armor not weapons. It's simple: If your gonna be at a enviroment with magical and melee monsters>Use Dragonhide If your gonna be at enviroment with magical and ranged monsters>Use Karil If you wanna complain or rant about Karil armor>Go rants forum. Sorry. Didn't know Karil's coif wasn't armour. :roll: And you still haven't explain why logically Karil's should have lesser melee defence. The thing is, with sirhemen's line, that's not the case, in an area with magical and melee monsters, people will use melee armour and mage def pray the majority of the time. Karil's doesen't need melee defence, because theres an incredibly limited use for it to have it. On the topic of the x-bow, at the time of its release, it was without a doubt the strongest ranged weapon in runescape, but time progresses, the bow is much like dragon, at once it was the best, but has been beaten by modern gear. The same goes for the coif, when barrows was introduced, it was the best defence ranged helm in the game, and has always been fairly cheap, so has always been quite worth it. Even at the time of release, there was Archer helm, which has higher ranged attack, yet only missing 1 or 2 stats on defence. You two forget the Coif and crossbow. Karils armor is suited for rangers, Karil was a ranger. Combat triangle says that a ranger is weak to melee, a mage weak to range and a melee weak to magic. So shouldn't Karils armory which is a range armor have those stats? Also, does Karil need to be superior in melee defense to Dhide? No. Black d'hide is weaker to melee, yet has higher melee defence to Karil's. By your logic I can say Infinity or 3rd age mage is strong vs. melee, so shouldn't they have the stats to defend it? Yes. It has higher requirements. Drops: Misc: Abyssal Whip x28 , Dark Bow x5, Beserker Ring x3, Warrior ring x1 Dragon: Dragon Platelegs x2 , Dragon Plateskirt x2, Dragon Boots x38, Dragon Med Helm x4, Shield left half x3 Godwars: Godsword shard x13, Bandos Hilt x3, Bandos Chestplate x6, Bandos Tassets x4, Bandos Boots x5, Saradomin Sword x1, Zamorakian Spear x1,. Armadyl Helm x2, Armadyl chestplate x2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dire_Wolf Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Black d'hide is weaker to melee, yet has higher melee defence to Karil's. What? D hide has more melee defense than Karil, so why is it weaker to melee? By your logic I can say Infinity or 3rd age mage is strong vs. melee, so shouldn't they have the stats to defend it? Yes if going based on Combat triangle then 3rd age mage and Infinity should have some good melee defense. Yes. It has higher requirements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadukar123 Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Black d'hide is weaker to melee, yet has higher melee defence to Karil's. What? D hide has more melee defense than Karil, so why is it weaker to melee? By your logic I can say Infinity or 3rd age mage is strong vs. melee, so shouldn't they have the stats to defend it? Yes if going based on Combat triangle then 3rd age mage and Infinity should have some good melee defense. Yes. It has higher requirements. D'hide still follows the rule of being weaker to melee, since it's other stats are still higher than melee defence. Too bad they don't. They'd be much more useful if they did. Drops: Misc: Abyssal Whip x28 , Dark Bow x5, Beserker Ring x3, Warrior ring x1 Dragon: Dragon Platelegs x2 , Dragon Plateskirt x2, Dragon Boots x38, Dragon Med Helm x4, Shield left half x3 Godwars: Godsword shard x13, Bandos Hilt x3, Bandos Chestplate x6, Bandos Tassets x4, Bandos Boots x5, Saradomin Sword x1, Zamorakian Spear x1,. Armadyl Helm x2, Armadyl chestplate x2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dire_Wolf Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Black d'hide is weaker to melee, yet has higher melee defence to Karil's. What? D hide has more melee defense than Karil, so why is it weaker to melee? By your logic I can say Infinity or 3rd age mage is strong vs. melee, so shouldn't they have the stats to defend it? Yes if going based on Combat triangle then 3rd age mage and Infinity should have some good melee defense. Yes. It has higher requirements. D'hide still follows the rule of being weaker to melee, since it's other stats are still higher than melee defence. Too bad they don't. They'd be much more useful if they did. What rule is that, because i have never heard of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadukar123 Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Black d'hide is weaker to melee, yet has higher melee defence to Karil's. What? D hide has more melee defense than Karil, so why is it weaker to melee? By your logic I can say Infinity or 3rd age mage is strong vs. melee, so shouldn't they have the stats to defend it? Yes if going based on Combat triangle then 3rd age mage and Infinity should have some good melee defense. Yes. It has higher requirements. D'hide still follows the rule of being weaker to melee, since it's other stats are still higher than melee defence. Too bad they don't. They'd be much more useful if they did. What rule is that, because i have never heard of it. The one you said "Karil's weaker to melee because it follows the combat triangle." Read your last few post. -_- Drops: Misc: Abyssal Whip x28 , Dark Bow x5, Beserker Ring x3, Warrior ring x1 Dragon: Dragon Platelegs x2 , Dragon Plateskirt x2, Dragon Boots x38, Dragon Med Helm x4, Shield left half x3 Godwars: Godsword shard x13, Bandos Hilt x3, Bandos Chestplate x6, Bandos Tassets x4, Bandos Boots x5, Saradomin Sword x1, Zamorakian Spear x1,. Armadyl Helm x2, Armadyl chestplate x2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dire_Wolf Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Black d'hide is weaker to melee, yet has higher melee defence to Karil's. What? D hide has more melee defense than Karil, so why is it weaker to melee? By your logic I can say Infinity or 3rd age mage is strong vs. melee, so shouldn't they have the stats to defend it? Yes if going based on Combat triangle then 3rd age mage and Infinity should have some good melee defense. Yes. It has higher requirements. D'hide still follows the rule of being weaker to melee, since it's other stats are still higher than melee defence. Too bad they don't. They'd be much more useful if they did. What rule is that, because i have never heard of it. The one you said "Karil's weaker to melee because it follows the combat triangle." Read your last few post. -_- Aha yeah. Well you do have a point there. Well considering the great magical defense Karil gives, i guess the lower melee defense must be sacrificed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadukar123 Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Althought I agree Karil's is much much worth it just because of the magic defence, it still makes no sense. Karil's was released when Black d'hide was around, it still makes no sense. Drops: Misc: Abyssal Whip x28 , Dark Bow x5, Beserker Ring x3, Warrior ring x1 Dragon: Dragon Platelegs x2 , Dragon Plateskirt x2, Dragon Boots x38, Dragon Med Helm x4, Shield left half x3 Godwars: Godsword shard x13, Bandos Hilt x3, Bandos Chestplate x6, Bandos Tassets x4, Bandos Boots x5, Saradomin Sword x1, Zamorakian Spear x1,. Armadyl Helm x2, Armadyl chestplate x2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dire_Wolf Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Althought I agree Karil's is much much worth it just because of the magic defence, it still makes no sense. Karil's was released when Black d'hide was around, it still makes no sense. Jagex does not always do things well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadukar123 Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Althought I agree Karil's is much much worth it just because of the magic defence, it still makes no sense. Karil's was released when Black d'hide was around, it still makes no sense. Jagex does not always do things well. Drops: Misc: Abyssal Whip x28 , Dark Bow x5, Beserker Ring x3, Warrior ring x1 Dragon: Dragon Platelegs x2 , Dragon Plateskirt x2, Dragon Boots x38, Dragon Med Helm x4, Shield left half x3 Godwars: Godsword shard x13, Bandos Hilt x3, Bandos Chestplate x6, Bandos Tassets x4, Bandos Boots x5, Saradomin Sword x1, Zamorakian Spear x1,. Armadyl Helm x2, Armadyl chestplate x2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punitive_D Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 If Barrows armor was "nooby" I wouldn't own nearly every set (except Dharok's). You would if you were a noob! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punitive_D Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 . . . both Karil and Dragonhide has great uses. Karil for a monster that uses Magic and Ranged . . . Dragonhide body for monsters that uses magic and melee (Fight Cave) Why wouldn't you use armadyl in the fight cave? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zierro Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Yes, everything makes you a noob in online games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadukar123 Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 . . . both Karil and Dragonhide has great uses. Karil for a monster that uses Magic and Ranged . . . Dragonhide body for monsters that uses magic and melee (Fight Cave) Why wouldn't you use armadyl in the fight cave? Karil's offer no statistical advantage over Black d'hide, it degrades, it's magic defence is useless, since any magic attack that hits you in Fight caves, you are dead. It's melee defence is lower than black d'hide. Drops: Misc: Abyssal Whip x28 , Dark Bow x5, Beserker Ring x3, Warrior ring x1 Dragon: Dragon Platelegs x2 , Dragon Plateskirt x2, Dragon Boots x38, Dragon Med Helm x4, Shield left half x3 Godwars: Godsword shard x13, Bandos Hilt x3, Bandos Chestplate x6, Bandos Tassets x4, Bandos Boots x5, Saradomin Sword x1, Zamorakian Spear x1,. Armadyl Helm x2, Armadyl chestplate x2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dire_Wolf Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 . . . both Karil and Dragonhide has great uses. Karil for a monster that uses Magic and Ranged . . . Dragonhide body for monsters that uses magic and melee (Fight Cave) Why wouldn't you use armadyl in the fight cave? 1) I am a warrior, and Armadyl takes down melee attack bonus so i have not bought it. Wouldn't buy it for Fight Cave only either.. 2) Majority of players do not have Armadyl as a option, but Dhide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danqazmlp Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 . . . both Karil and Dragonhide has great uses. Karil for a monster that uses Magic and Ranged . . . Dragonhide body for monsters that uses magic and melee (Fight Cave) Why wouldn't you use armadyl in the fight cave? Karil's offer no statistical advantage over Black d'hide, it degrades, it's magic defence is useless, since any magic attack that hits you in Fight caves, you are dead. It's melee defence is lower than black d'hide. But if your any good at fight caves, nothign should get in melee range of you, so the melee defence is also useless. However, the 90's will be ranging you, and karils has higher in that, which makes karil's a better option. And on the topic of armadyl, personally, i melee in it, i find the negative effects barely noticeable with 99 attack. Want to be my friend? Look under my name to the left<<< and click the 'Add as friend' button!Big thanks to Stevepole for the signature!^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadukar123 Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 . . . both Karil and Dragonhide has great uses. Karil for a monster that uses Magic and Ranged . . . Dragonhide body for monsters that uses magic and melee (Fight Cave) Why wouldn't you use armadyl in the fight cave? Karil's offer no statistical advantage over Black d'hide, it degrades, it's magic defence is useless, since any magic attack that hits you in Fight caves, you are dead. It's melee defence is lower than black d'hide. But if your any good at fight caves, nothign should get in melee range of you, so the melee defence is also useless. However, the 90's will be ranging you, and karils has higher in that, which makes karil's a better option. And on the topic of armadyl, personally, i melee in it, i find the negative effects barely noticeable with 99 attack. You are paying 8k+ for repairs through the fight, for a grand total of +4 ranged defence more. And that's only if you use skirt as well, which you wouldn't. So it's 5k for a +2 ranged defence. Drops: Misc: Abyssal Whip x28 , Dark Bow x5, Beserker Ring x3, Warrior ring x1 Dragon: Dragon Platelegs x2 , Dragon Plateskirt x2, Dragon Boots x38, Dragon Med Helm x4, Shield left half x3 Godwars: Godsword shard x13, Bandos Hilt x3, Bandos Chestplate x6, Bandos Tassets x4, Bandos Boots x5, Saradomin Sword x1, Zamorakian Spear x1,. Armadyl Helm x2, Armadyl chestplate x2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dire_Wolf Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 . . . both Karil and Dragonhide has great uses. Karil for a monster that uses Magic and Ranged . . . Dragonhide body for monsters that uses magic and melee (Fight Cave) Why wouldn't you use armadyl in the fight cave? Karil's offer no statistical advantage over Black d'hide, it degrades, it's magic defence is useless, since any magic attack that hits you in Fight caves, you are dead. It's melee defence is lower than black d'hide. But if your any good at fight caves, nothign should get in melee range of you, so the melee defence is also useless. However, the 90's will be ranging you, and karils has higher in that, which makes karil's a better option. And on the topic of armadyl, personally, i melee in it, i find the negative effects barely noticeable with 99 attack. MELEE Tz-Kih Max hit: 4 Tz-Kek Max hit: 7 Tz-Kek Max hit: 4 Yt-MejKot Max hit: 25 Yt-HurKot Max hit: 14 These ones will come after you when you distract them by attacking them to attract their attention, from there atleast 1-2 will be hitting you. RANGED Tok-Xil Max hit: 13 This monster has only 40 HP so it's killed in 2-3 shots Overall Dhide is best for Fight Cave, even if you are good at doing the waves it's still better to use Dhide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadukar123 Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 If you can afford Armadyl, I don't see why you can't use it. Drops: Misc: Abyssal Whip x28 , Dark Bow x5, Beserker Ring x3, Warrior ring x1 Dragon: Dragon Platelegs x2 , Dragon Plateskirt x2, Dragon Boots x38, Dragon Med Helm x4, Shield left half x3 Godwars: Godsword shard x13, Bandos Hilt x3, Bandos Chestplate x6, Bandos Tassets x4, Bandos Boots x5, Saradomin Sword x1, Zamorakian Spear x1,. Armadyl Helm x2, Armadyl chestplate x2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggiwhplar Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 how did this become a 5-page topic in general discussion lol armadyl > karils > dhide for fight caves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danqazmlp Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 how did this become a 5-page topic in general discussion lol Becuase were getting to a stage where barrows is finally being beaten by other armour, has taken a nice 4 years or so, but its starting to get to that time. Want to be my friend? Look under my name to the left<<< and click the 'Add as friend' button!Big thanks to Stevepole for the signature!^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dire_Wolf Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 how did this become a 5-page topic in general discussion lol armadyl > karils > dhide for fight caves. I disagree with Karil being better than Dhide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocterDuck Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 I've got full Ahrim's...I don't use it too much unless I'm maging but I rarely do that anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lets_3ekout Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 MELEE Tz-Kih Max hit: 4 Tz-Kek Max hit: 7 Tz-Kek Max hit: 4 Yt-MejKot Max hit: 25 Yt-HurKot Max hit: 14 These ones will come after you when you distract them by attacking them to attract their attention, from there atleast 1-2 will be hitting you. RANGED Tok-Xil Max hit: 13 This monster has only 40 HP so it's killed in 2-3 shots Overall Dhide is best for Fight Cave, even if you are good at doing the waves it's still better to use Dhide. Although there are better alternatives to both dhides and karil (armadyl+veracs), Karil is better for fight caves IMO. Someone skillfull at the fight caves hardly ever gets hit by melee attacks. The birds get killed in 1-2 shots almost every time, so they don't hit you, the big blob is easily blockable, the small blobs never hit anything decent, the 360's are always prayed against and the 180's should always be blocked. However, the 90's are constantly hitting you for the entire second half of the fight caves (with ranged), so range defence is a bit more valueable (IMO). Also, Jad only hits you with mage/range if you range him so the defence might give you a small extra chance of surviving a mistake. That said, Karil's is far from useless. A Draconic Guide V1.4, Fimer - Multi-Timer Farming Timer V3.Dragon Boots: 39|Abyssal Whips: 16|Dark Bows: 1| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gremmy Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 No, it's awesome. Dragon drops: 82 (2 claws)Dagannoth kings drops: 73Barrows item count: 51GWD drops: 54 (5 hilts: 1x bandos, 3x saradomin, 1x zamorak)Whips: 4Sigils: 1x spectral (FFA), 1x arcane (FFA) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brunokiller Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 Not to mention karils looks much more awesome than black d´hide. Armadyl also looks better than karils, but when I had it, it collected dust in my bank most of the time. My blog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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