Defence Apparently is Useless.

[3hitm4g3u]

Since the requirments to wiled them swords are in the 70's (if I remember correctly) then they could be made to need like 90 attack and str to equip them so they truly become ultimate high level weapons (which is what players want) and increase there power to cope with the new meaning of defence.

 

 

 

The price of veracs would fly up though!

 

 

 

If they made it so Godswords (with a 90 att 90 str req) hit on armour like they do now and had implemented the armour change from the start, I agree it would have been awesome.

 

 

 

But it's too late now, nobody would accept them changes.

[Mico]

Since the requirments to wiled them swords are in the 70's (if I remember correctly) then they could be made to need like 90 attack and str to equip them so they truly become ultimate high level weapons (which is what players want) and increase there power to cope with the new meaning of defence.

 

 

 

The price of veracs would fly up though!

 

 

 

If they made it so Godswords (with a 90 att 90 str req) hit on armour like they do now and had implemented the armour change from the start, I agree it would have been awesome.

 

 

 

But it's too late now, nobody would accept them changes.

 

 

 

Ofcourse they would, people rant a bit then most of them move on, that' s how it has always been. Hell, if Jagex got away with changing the Wilderness, "free" trade and so on then this shouldn' t be a problem.

 

 

 

A solution even. The combat triange might get better with such an overhaul.

[perfetc]

Since the requirments to wiled them swords are in the 70's (if I remember correctly) then they could be made to need like 90 attack and str to equip them so they truly become ultimate high level weapons (which is what players want) and increase there power to cope with the new meaning of defence.

 

 

 

The price of veracs would fly up though!

 

 

 

If they made it so Godswords (with a 90 att 90 str req) hit on armour like they do now and had implemented the armour change from the start, I agree it would have been awesome.

 

 

 

But it's too late now, nobody would accept them changes.

 

 

 

Ofcourse they would, people rant a bit then most of them move on, that' s how it has always been. Hell, if Jagex got away with changing the Wilderness, "free" trade and so on then this shouldn' t be a problem.

 

 

 

A solution even. The combat triange might get better with such an overhaul.

 

 

 

Jagex can do what they like when they like it's there game we choose to play it, yes people with less then 90 stats will be unbelievably outraged that there fav weapon that they payed millions for will be uselss to them.

 

 

 

It says on tip.it's database that its the ultimate weapon (I assume thats the examine of them) its crazy that we can use the ultimate weapons at the 70's.

 

 

 

I bet if I made a new character today and trained 6 hours a day I could have the stats to use a godsword in less than a month, the 70's isn't that high!

[3hitm4g3u]

That isn't its examine.

 

 

 

I agree GS should have higher requirements, but the armour thing...No I don't agree with that.

[Dirkmetal]

Well you made that (good) point, so you should take the credit :thumbsup: .

 

 

 

lol a lvl 45 with 99 def and 1 att and str i mean whats the point of this, you cant kill people with your bronze dagger and 1 att and str, pointless imo

 

lol a lvl 45 with 99 def and 1 att and str i mean whats the point of this, you cant kill people with your bronze dagger and 1 att and str, pointless imo

 

 

 

 

There is no point to a lvl 45 with 99 defence. Don' t recall anyone saying there is a point to it.

 

 

 

Anyway, I envision this something like this:

 

Metal armour lowers the max hit, but since it' s quite heavy it lowers your dodging skills. Lower max hits but a bit more of them. Defence helps you avoid more of them, like it does now. Arrows break when they hit a wall of metal, but magic won' t break so warriors are still weak againts magicians.

 

 

 

Cloth, as in magic armour, is not heavy and is quite comfortable, gives you more room to dodge attacks, but since it' s cloth, it' ll just fall apart when it meets metal. Ofcourse, dodging arrows is harder than swords or axes, so mages will still be weak againts archers.

 

 

 

Leather is in between. It' s lighter than metal, but still not as comfortable as cloth. They will be able to dodge magic attacks to some level, and since leather magically repels magic (heh), spellcasters are still weak againts them.

 

 

 

A crude idea I came up while taking a shower just now, so there can be alot of holes in it.

 

 

 

Sounds like Elder Scrolls III; Morowind's combat system.

[Mico]

Never heard of that game, but I guess it works for them.

 

 

 

Oh and perfetc, I know it' s their game and they can do what they wan' t, I' m just saying that everyone won' t quit if they completely overhaul armour and defence, people will just move on. Some will quit, maybe even in the hundrets of thousands, but the majority will stay and the show will go on.

[perfetc]

Never heard of that game, but I guess it works for them.

 

 

 

Oh and perfetc, I know it' s their game and they can do what they wan' t, I' m just saying that everyone won' t quit if they completely overhaul armour and defence, people will just move on. Some will quit, maybe even in the hundrets of thousands, but the majority will stay and the show will go on.

 

 

 

The elder scolls is an awesome game!

 

 

 

I totaly agree, people will quit but the game will still survive and move on.

[1dhunter]

had a good time reading all this bs. Come on guys, someone wearing RUNE gets killed 1 FREAKING time... Better luck next time. :wall:

 

 

 

btw, What does armour do? Reduce damage. What does RS armour do to you? Yeah right, you'll get hit less when wearing good armour (not rune ffs). Who gives a [bleep] about how the system really works as long as armour does what it should do?

 

 

 

[/thread]

[Mico]

had a good time reading all this bs. Come on guys, someone wearing RUNE gets killed 1 FREAKING time... Better luck next time. :wall:

 

 

 

btw, What does armour do? Reduce damage. What does RS armour do to you? Yeah right, you'll get hit less when wearing good armour (not rune ffs). Who gives a [bleep] about how the system really works as long as armour does what it should do?

 

 

 

[/thread]

 

 

 

Listen to this story, a story about defence:

 

 

 

Me and my friend decided to do some dueling. First time we went without armour and only weapons. No food ofcourse. I am combat level 84, he is 77. I have 70 attack, 70 strenght and 64 defence. He has 70 attack, 79 strenght and 45 defence. We both have 70 hp so it' s fair there. We both used rune scimitars as the main attack and 2h for the finishing moves.

 

 

 

So the first fight he wins hands down with half his hp left. So goes number 2. And 3. And 4. All the way to fight number 8 where I win with 5 hp remaining. Oh I am so awesome.

 

 

 

Ok so we' re both a bit confused but ok. Now comes with armour. We both slap on full rune but no kiteshields and a green d'hide body since he doesn' t have a rune plate. Food, prayer and strenght potions allowed. The fight starts, tilting in my favor after hitting high several times, forcing him to eat above 10 hp. I win with 3 lobsters in my backpack and 4 hp left. Woohoo.

 

 

 

Now we go back to no armour and strenght pots. Again, he opens a can of whoopass and I get smacked down brutally. After 5 losses we try the armour thing again. This time I loose.

 

 

 

After that, we just agreed that defence is useless and even though I have 20 more levels at it, fought the same way as he did (I know how and when to use the 2h, that' s how I won twice) and prayed every possible way I could, I still lost to a superior fighter.

 

 

 

With the same attack, 9 more strenght levels and 20 less defence levels. Ah yes, armour does what it should, but does it work like it should depending on your stats? We train stats equally to be better, right? Train attack to hit more often, train strenght to hit more and train defence to block more attacks. Just that defence is a glass house while the other two are reinforced concrete skyscrapers.

 

 

 

Atleast what I managed to figure out while killing and getting killed in the Wilderness. So I just let it go since my "superior" defence is useless.

 

 

 

EDIT: Oh yea, forgot to type in. He hit max hits about double the time I did.

[RayOxide]

So Defence and armour fail and Jagex needs to fix it end?

[Mico]

So Defence and armour fail and Jagex needs to fix it end?

 

 

 

As Captain Falchon would say: H-YES!

[Monkeyanniee]

Ouch man.

 

 

 

But seriously, defence rocks.

 

 

 

Half of this game is luck anyway..

[perfetc]

Your telling me I killed a green drag with a mith mace, steel plate legs and iron plate body ... most will say impossable but I did.

 

 

 

(I randomly picked it up in a pvp world and decided to run around wild wearing it then I saw green drags and thought I wonder :lol: )

 

 

 

I shouldn't be able to do that luck should be a factor but not to that degree.

[Tim]

Before it turns into flame bait, I was ranting about the uselessness of my defence level on that day. I had every right to rant/vent, If I need to I'll throw quotes from the TIF Rules so drop the "boohoo etc" type of lines. Last I want is for mature TIF users to sink to the levels of RSOF Rants Thread Lurkers. :|

 

 

 

And while were at it, lock it up anyway. I had my rant and im over it.

[RayOxide]

No Matthew, this is still a very valid rant.

[perfetc]

Why don't you create a thread in the debate forum if you want to discuss it more?

[Moad14]

No Matthew, this is still a very valid rant.

 

How is it valid? I personally believe it falls in the How I Lost My Items sticky.

[1dhunter]

had a good time reading all this bs. Come on guys, someone wearing RUNE gets killed 1 FREAKING time... Better luck next time. :wall:

 

 

 

btw, What does armour do? Reduce damage. What does RS armour do to you? Yeah right, you'll get hit less when wearing good armour (not rune ffs). Who gives a [bleep] about how the system really works as long as armour does what it should do?

 

 

 

[/thread]

 

 

 

Listen to this story, a story about defence:

 

 

 

Me and my friend decided to do some dueling. First time we went without armour and only weapons. No food ofcourse. I am combat level 84, he is 77. I have 70 attack, 70 strenght and 64 defence. He has 70 attack, 79 strenght and 45 defence. We both have 70 hp so it' s fair there. We both used rune scimitars as the main attack and 2h for the finishing moves.

 

 

 

So the first fight he wins hands down with half his hp left. So goes number 2. And 3. And 4. All the way to fight number 8 where I win with 5 hp remaining. Oh I am so awesome.

 

 

 

Ok so we' re both a bit confused but ok. Now comes with armour. We both slap on full rune but no kiteshields and a green d'hide body since he doesn' t have a rune plate. Food, prayer and strenght potions allowed. The fight starts, tilting in my favor after hitting high several times, forcing him to eat above 10 hp. I win with 3 lobsters in my backpack and 4 hp left. Woohoo.

 

 

 

Now we go back to no armour and strenght pots. Again, he opens a can of whoopass and I get smacked down brutally. After 5 losses we try the armour thing again. This time I loose.

 

 

 

After that, we just agreed that defence is useless and even though I have 20 more levels at it, fought the same way as he did (I know how and when to use the 2h, that' s how I won twice) and prayed every possible way I could, I still lost to a superior fighter.

 

 

 

With the same attack, 9 more strenght levels and 20 less defence levels. Ah yes, armour does what it should, but does it work like it should depending on your stats? We train stats equally to be better, right? Train attack to hit more often, train strenght to hit more and train defence to block more attacks. Just that defence is a glass house while the other two are reinforced concrete skyscrapers.

 

 

 

Atleast what I managed to figure out while killing and getting killed in the Wilderness. So I just let it go since my "superior" defence is useless.

 

 

 

EDIT: Oh yea, forgot to type in. He hit max hits about double the time I did.

 

 

 

good example, 5 kills? why don't you fight someone with same attack and strength? I can promise that the higher def WILL make a difference. I'm only 82 def(around 200 melee def stats) but I win 9 out of 10 fights with a melee guy. Mostly they have around 75 def and 90 att/str. I always use sup defence pot for a fight and most of their *uber* dds specs fail. Even whips and godswords have a hard time hitting on me :thumbsup:

[RayOxide]

No Matthew, this is still a very valid rant.

 

How is it valid? I personally believe it falls in the How I Lost My Items sticky.

 

 

 

There's no "Jagex needs to fix.."

 

Sticky or one about how useless defence is now-a-days.

[perfetc]

No Matthew, this is still a very valid rant.

 

How is it valid? I personally believe it falls in the How I Lost My Items sticky.

 

 

 

There's no "Jagex needs to fix.."

 

Sticky or one about how useless defence is now-a-days.

 

 

 

Why not make one?

[joey11223]

hmm so is what you hit just based on your strength level and chance?

 

 

 

I mean obviously your defence level along with your bonus makes the enemy more likely to miss, but once they hit and their str 99, is just the roll of a dice numbered 1 to (their max)? so they could hit 30,35 or 2,4, it's just luck?

[quelmotz]

hmm so is what you hit just based on your strength level and chance?

 

 

 

I mean obviously your defence level along with your bonus makes the enemy more likely to miss, but once they hit and their str 99, is just the roll of a dice numbered 1 to (their max)? so they could hit 30,35 or 2,4, it's just luck?

 

 

 

Yes, and that's the problem we have here.

 

 

 

Nothing really counters strength, except how long can you last with your health and the protect from melee prayer.

[Mico]

[hide=Wall of quotes]

had a good time reading all this bs. Come on guys, someone wearing RUNE gets killed 1 FREAKING time... Better luck next time. :wall:

 

 

 

btw, What does armour do? Reduce damage. What does RS armour do to you? Yeah right, you'll get hit less when wearing good armour (not rune ffs). Who gives a [bleep] about how the system really works as long as armour does what it should do?

 

 

 

[/thread]

 

 

 

Listen to this story, a story about defence:

 

 

 

Me and my friend decided to do some dueling. First time we went without armour and only weapons. No food ofcourse. I am combat level 84, he is 77. I have 70 attack, 70 strenght and 64 defence. He has 70 attack, 79 strenght and 45 defence. We both have 70 hp so it' s fair there. We both used rune scimitars as the main attack and 2h for the finishing moves.

 

 

 

So the first fight he wins hands down with half his hp left. So goes number 2. And 3. And 4. All the way to fight number 8 where I win with 5 hp remaining. Oh I am so awesome.

 

 

 

Ok so we' re both a bit confused but ok. Now comes with armour. We both slap on full rune but no kiteshields and a green d'hide body since he doesn' t have a rune plate. Food, prayer and strenght potions allowed. The fight starts, tilting in my favor after hitting high several times, forcing him to eat above 10 hp. I win with 3 lobsters in my backpack and 4 hp left. Woohoo.

 

 

 

Now we go back to no armour and strenght pots. Again, he opens a can of whoopass and I get smacked down brutally. After 5 losses we try the armour thing again. This time I loose.

 

 

 

After that, we just agreed that defence is useless and even though I have 20 more levels at it, fought the same way as he did (I know how and when to use the 2h, that' s how I won twice) and prayed every possible way I could, I still lost to a superior fighter.

 

 

 

With the same attack, 9 more strenght levels and 20 less defence levels. Ah yes, armour does what it should, but does it work like it should depending on your stats? We train stats equally to be better, right? Train attack to hit more often, train strenght to hit more and train defence to block more attacks. Just that defence is a glass house while the other two are reinforced concrete skyscrapers.

 

 

 

Atleast what I managed to figure out while killing and getting killed in the Wilderness. So I just let it go since my "superior" defence is useless.

 

 

 

EDIT: Oh yea, forgot to type in. He hit max hits about double the time I did.

 

 

 

good example, 5 kills? why don't you fight someone with same attack and strength? I can promise that the higher def WILL make a difference. I'm only 82 def(around 200 melee def stats) but I win 9 out of 10 fights with a melee guy. Mostly they have around 75 def and 90 att/str. I always use sup defence pot for a fight and most of their *uber* dds specs fail. Even whips and godswords have a hard time hitting on me :thumbsup:

[/hide]

 

 

 

I' m F2P, how does that help me in any way?

 

 

 

And yes, I have PKed in my day and yes, I know what I' m talking about. And explain how I could hit fewer times on him? I freakin lost all but 2 fights to someone 7 combat levels below me, with 20 defence levels less? Only 9 more strenght levels, he had a max hit of 17 with rune scimitar, I had 15 and yet I kept hitting zeors while he kept hitting max hits. And every fight was the same, me 0 HP and him half HP. Every fight. But 2 that is.

 

 

 

And this is not the only case. All I can PK are solo pures who use monk robes or in a team where nobody attacks me. Other than that, I' m screwed.

 

 

 

EDIT: now that I read it myself, the whole post is a bit agressive. Don' t take it the wrong way, I' m just a bit pissed at the moment.

[3hitm4g3u]

had a good time reading all this bs. Come on guys, someone wearing RUNE gets killed 1 FREAKING time... Better luck next time. :wall:

 

 

 

btw, What does armour do? Reduce damage. What does RS armour do to you? Yeah right, you'll get hit less when wearing good armour (not rune ffs). Who gives a [bleep] about how the system really works as long as armour does what it should do?

 

 

 

[/thread]

 

 

 

Listen to this story, a story about defence:

 

 

 

Me and my friend decided to do some dueling. First time we went without armour and only weapons. No food ofcourse. I am combat level 84, he is 77. I have 70 attack, 70 strenght and 64 defence. He has 70 attack, 79 strenght and 45 defence. We both have 70 hp so it' s fair there. We both used rune scimitars as the main attack and 2h for the finishing moves.

 

 

 

So the first fight he wins hands down with half his hp left. So goes number 2. And 3. And 4. All the way to fight number 8 where I win with 5 hp remaining. Oh I am so awesome.

 

 

 

Ok so we' re both a bit confused but ok. Now comes with armour. We both slap on full rune but no kiteshields and a green d'hide body since he doesn' t have a rune plate. Food, prayer and strenght potions allowed. The fight starts, tilting in my favor after hitting high several times, forcing him to eat above 10 hp. I win with 3 lobsters in my backpack and 4 hp left. Woohoo.

 

 

 

Now we go back to no armour and strenght pots. Again, he opens a can of whoopass and I get smacked down brutally. After 5 losses we try the armour thing again. This time I loose.

 

 

 

After that, we just agreed that defence is useless and even though I have 20 more levels at it, fought the same way as he did (I know how and when to use the 2h, that' s how I won twice) and prayed every possible way I could, I still lost to a superior fighter.

 

 

 

With the same attack, 9 more strenght levels and 20 less defence levels. Ah yes, armour does what it should, but does it work like it should depending on your stats? We train stats equally to be better, right? Train attack to hit more often, train strenght to hit more and train defence to block more attacks. Just that defence is a glass house while the other two are reinforced concrete skyscrapers.

 

 

 

Atleast what I managed to figure out while killing and getting killed in the Wilderness. So I just let it go since my "superior" defence is useless.

 

 

 

EDIT: Oh yea, forgot to type in. He hit max hits about double the time I did.

 

 

 

good example, 5 kills? why don't you fight someone with same attack and strength? I can promise that the higher def WILL make a difference. I'm only 82 def(around 200 melee def stats) but I win 9 out of 10 fights with a melee guy. Mostly they have around 75 def and 90 att/str. I always use sup defence pot for a fight and most of their *uber* dds specs fail. Even whips and godswords have a hard time hitting on me :thumbsup:

 

 

 

You probably super def pot in clan wars whilst they're not potted up at all.

 

 

 

That's why whips and godswords have a 'hard time' hitting on you.

[RayOxide]

If theyre going to pot super str and atk, why not pot super def which doesnt help much since def is useless anyway?