NEW! Should skillcapes become f2p items

[vttuih2]

 

OT: Prices did not skyrocket because skillcapes were realeased, it was a string of updates. And no, achieving a 99 has not become more difficult or any less profitable than it has in the past, in fact there are many effective ways to train and combat skill effectively and still profit! (See armoured zombies, aviansies etc.)

 

But skillcapes where a big part of it. And many ways that used to be profitable are now gone. And if there is a way to trian profitable skills it goes down excluding most combat spots.

 

Do you have any evidence to show that prices even went down?

 

 

 

The reason profitable ways to train are gone are because they became;

 

-ineffiecient due to the demand of players.

 

-revealed as an effective method, and then abused.

 

-less effective/efficient than a new method.

 

 

 

Skillcapes did not have a direct effect on efficient training methods. That's absolute theory, and a ridiculous one at that.

 

 

 

^KenshinJapan, refer to this, I have to go, sorry I couldn't make a post directly to you.

[Lord_Omar_Iv]

f2pers getting skillcapes for skills that they can earn a 99 in on f2p is not necessarily a bad thing... it doesnt give any kind of advantage to f2pers but rewards them for the longer and more grueling hours to attain a lvl 99 than someone who has p2p. plus there is already so much more content in p2p so i dont see why p2pers would cry so hard against f2pers being allowed to be rewarded with skillcapes. its really just something else to dress in.

[Death123141]

 

OT: Prices did not skyrocket because skillcapes were realeased, it was a string of updates. And no, achieving a 99 has not become more difficult or any less profitable than it has in the past, in fact there are many effective ways to train and combat skill effectively and still profit! (See armoured zombies, aviansies etc.)

 

But skillcapes where a big part of it. And many ways that used to be profitable are now gone. And if there is a way to trian profitable skills it goes down excluding most combat spots.

 

Do you have any evidence to show that prices even went down?

 

 

 

 

It mainly has todo with prices going up training 'buyable' skills.

 

plus there is already so much more content in p2p so i dont see why p2pers would cry so hard against f2pers being allowed to be rewarded with skillcapes.

 

Because there our skillscapes and we love them.

[Lord_Omar_Iv]

 

OT: Prices did not skyrocket because skillcapes were realeased, it was a string of updates. And no, achieving a 99 has not become more difficult or any less profitable than it has in the past, in fact there are many effective ways to train and combat skill effectively and still profit! (See armoured zombies, aviansies etc.)

 

But skillcapes where a big part of it. And many ways that used to be profitable are now gone. And if there is a way to trian profitable skills it goes down excluding most combat spots.

 

Do you have any evidence to show that prices even went down?

 

 

 

 

It mainly has todo with prices going up training 'buyable' skills.

 

plus there is already so much more content in p2p so i dont see why p2pers would cry so hard against f2pers being allowed to be rewarded with skillcapes.

 

Because there our skillscapes and we love them.

 

 

 

 

 

technically its jagex's property, not the p2pers. plus achieving a skillcape is not anywhere near as grand and admired as they once were.

[Kenshinjapan]

 

 

 

Make up your mind.

 

 

 

"I don't see what the fuss is about talking about economical effects."

 

 

 

"I was referring to the secondary skills like fletch, fm, crafting, etc."

 

 

 

"Not to mention the effects on the runescape economy."

 

 

 

:|

 

I'm confused as to what I need to make up my mind on.

 

 

 

Do you have any evidence to show that prices even went down?

 

 

 

The reason profitable ways to train are gone are because they became;

 

-ineffiecient due to the demand of players.

 

-revealed as an effective method, and then abused.

 

-less effective/efficient than a new method.

 

 

 

Skillcapes did not have a direct effect on efficient training methods. That's absolute theory, and a ridiculous one at that.

 

 

 

^KenshinJapan, refer to this, I have to go, sorry I couldn't make a post directly to you.

 

I'm sorry, but I don't have any physical proof of the price adjustments besides that I was actively playing during that time and witnessed it.

 

 

 

Skillcapes did indeed have a direct effect on efficient training methods. Prior to skillcapes, I would see maybe 1 or 2 other people training fletching with me at the castlewars bank. However, the day that skillcapes were announced to be released sometime that month, 10+ people popped up every time that I logged on to also train.

 

Because of that new demand of raw materials, buyers were harder to find and people were being forced to pay significantly higher prices to buy their items. At one point, I had to switch to fletching willows instead of yews because yew longbows were no longer a profitable item to fletch.

 

 

 

Could someone with some sort of price graph showing the rise of raw materials post it please? Because I'm positive that the capes adjusted prices majorly.

[Death123141]

 

Could someone with some sort of price graph showing the rise of raw materials post it please? Because I'm positive that the capes adjusted prices majorly.

 

http://www.zybez.net/items.php

 

This seems perty accurate although don't know if it goes back far enough.

[Kenshinjapan]

 

Could someone with some sort of price graph showing the rise of raw materials post it please? Because I'm positive that the capes adjusted prices majorly.

 

http://www.zybez.net/items.php

 

This seems perty accurate although don't know if it goes back far enough.

 

 

 

No, it needs to go back about a year further than those graphs do. Thanks for trying though.

[vttuih2]

 

Do you have any evidence to show that prices even went down?

 

 

 

The reason profitable ways to train are gone are because they became;

 

-ineffiecient due to the demand of players.

 

-revealed as an effective method, and then abused.

 

-less effective/efficient than a new method.

 

 

 

Skillcapes did not have a direct effect on efficient training methods. That's absolute theory, and a ridiculous one at that.

 

 

 

^KenshinJapan, refer to this, I have to go, sorry I couldn't make a post directly to you.

 

I'm sorry, but I don't have any physical proof of the price adjustments besides that I was actively playing during that time and witnessed it.

 

 

 

Skillcapes did indeed have a direct effect on efficient training methods. Prior to skillcapes, I would see maybe 1 or 2 other people training fletching with me at the castlewars bank. However, the day that skillcapes were announced to be released sometime that month, 10+ people popped up every time that I logged on to also train.

 

Because of that new demand of raw materials, buyers were harder to find and people were being forced to pay significantly higher prices to buy their items. At one point, I had to switch to fletching willows instead of yews because yew longbows were no longer a profitable item to fletch.

 

 

 

Could someone with some sort of price graph showing the rise of raw materials post it please? Because I'm positive that the capes adjusted prices majorly.

 

 

 

Ah! I understand now, and thank you for taking the time to explain. :D

 

 

 

However, fletching is a buyable members skill.

 

 

 

At the moment, the buyable skills in F2P are Firemaking, Cooking, Smithing, Crafting, and Prayer.

 

None of these are independently profitable, meaning making skillcapes a F2P item wouldn't harm these skills drastically.

[Me_Hate_Libs]

Crafting isn't terribly buyable on F2P as all you really have it silver, and that's like 50 per bar, still takes forever. I mean, the rest of them, you can use stuff, get more exp, all that, but with f2p crafting, it's 50exp per bar all the way to 99.

[Death123141]

 

At the moment, the buyable skills in F2P are Firemaking, Cooking, Smithing, Crafting, and Prayer.

 

None of these are independently profitable, meaning making skillcapes a F2P item wouldn't harm these skills drastically.

 

RuneCrafting is as well, And if a bunch of people rush for 99 Cooking and make prices rise it would be more expensive to buy food making training melee more expensive.

[Kenshinjapan]

 

Ah! I understand now, and thank you for taking the time to explain. :D

 

 

 

However, fletching is a buyable members skill.

 

 

 

At the moment, the buyable skills in F2P are Firemaking, Cooking, Smithing, Crafting, and Prayer.

 

None of these are independently profitable, meaning making skillcapes a F2P item wouldn't harm these skills drastically.

 

 

 

I'm afraid that it would harm the prices. A large portion of raw materials come from the free worlds because there is a much higher number or players that don't have as much incentive on maxing as a member would. If free worlds were to suddenly get access to capes, they would consume much more of the raw materials that are produced and therefore raise the prices for everyone.

 

 

 

Oh, and no need to thank me for explaining. I'm happy to help people learn : .

[perfetc]

 

 

 

Make up your mind.

 

 

 

"I don't see what the fuss is about talking about economical effects."

 

 

 

"I was referring to the secondary skills like fletch, fm, crafting, etc."

 

 

 

"Not to mention the effects on the runescape economy."

 

 

 

:|

 

I'm confused as to what I need to make up my mind on.

 

 

 

the effect of f2p getting skills capes in regards to the economy, you bring it up, shoot it down then support your point that it had an effect on the economy.

[Kenshinjapan]

 

 

 

Make up your mind.

 

 

 

"I don't see what the fuss is about talking about economical effects."

 

 

 

"I was referring to the secondary skills like fletch, fm, crafting, etc."

 

 

 

"Not to mention the effects on the runescape economy."

 

 

 

:|

 

I'm confused as to what I need to make up my mind on.

 

 

 

the effect of f2p getting skills capes in regards to the economy, you bring it up, shoot it down then support your point that it had an effect on the economy.

 

 

 

No I didn't, I'm afraid you misunderstood what I was saying.

[ForsakenMage]

I usually avoid these discussions but I may as well try to give some input.

 

 

 

I've been a non-member ever since I started playing. And as you can tell from my signature, I right now have eight level 99 skills, nine in total within the next week or so. I've been watching this debate now and again because of rumors spreading about F2P maybe getting skill capes. Just gonna outline some points/arguments as I write. It's gonna veer a little off topic, but I will get to the skill capes. :P

 

 

 

[hide=WARNING]#1. Getting level 99 in any skill, regardless of getting it on F2P or P2P, is an accomplishment. Honestly, it's a celebration. You got the highest level possible in a skill. Why isn't it an accomplishment?

 

 

 

#2. Some skills are harder to level than others on F2P than on P2P. Take for example the melee stats. F2Pers only have up to rune armor and weapons to use (unless they decide to use the corrupt dragon armor but that's really inefficient). P2Pers have a wide range of armor and weapons to use, not to mention more areas to train. Although this does not mean they have more space to train since there will always be more people training in areas that are popular, they still have a good variety compared to F2P. Another example: Smithing. With the coming of Stealing Creations, people are having an easier time leveling up this skill on members. F2Pers are still doing the same old thing since RuneScape Classic (except of course we don't need to make one item at a time). :shock:

 

 

 

#3. Members are paying for updates. I will not deny this fact. They do help make up part of the money needed to generate the updates we see time and time again. However, this does not mean some of them should get on a high horse and say "I paid for this, so you shouldn't get it." Like some have said, F2Pers do bring in potential new members, meaning more potential revenue, and even if they don't they still got more people view the ads at least. It may not make a lot but it's better than nothing at all. And we should be thankful that Jagex offers a fairly large game for the free version with no level or time restrictions.

 

 

 

Unfortunately, I've met some rather obnoxious members wandering around P2P who told me I should go members because it's more fun and that I'm wasting their money by being F2P. Excuse me? I'm not asking them to help pay for my membership. And it's probably not even "their" money; it's really their parents'. :wall: It's people like that that make me want to stay away from the P2P community. I can deal with the begging and the million-questions-a-day routine. I don't want to deal with people who think they're high and mighty because they can spend $60-72 a year on a game. I barely make enough to cover my personal expenses as it is. So to those of you who think some F2Pers are being cheap and won't get members, think: who is paying for your members and is it something you need to and can to have.

 

 

 

If you're paying for it for yourself and can hold a meaningful debate on why F2Pers shouldn't get any updates whatsoever, good for you! You are the kind of people that I think most F2Pers will be willing to talk to to hash out any differences and beliefs on the topic.

 

 

 

If you're not paying for it for yourself but can hold a meaningful debate on why F2Pers shouldn't get any updates, same as those mentioned previously.

 

 

 

If you're not and you're calling people [who are trying to hold meaningful debates] whiners and beggars for wanting updates on F2P, you might want to keep your mouth shut until you understand the value of a dollar and how you got those dollars to begin with. :?[/hide]And now to the skill capes.

 

 

 

Personally I don't care either way if F2P gets skill capes.

 

 

 

#1. It's going to take up very valuable bank space since F2P doesn't have that much already (30 spaces out of 68 if you are maxed and buy all the capes and hoods).

 

 

 

#2. Some of the cape sellers are in P2P areas. Unless they want to have secondary sellers for those skills that are F2P or make the skill capes tradable, they're going to have to move the NPCs around, which could cause some problems for members that need to talk to the NPCs for several P2P quests.

 

 

 

#3. We have the issue of the stats bonus (which every little bit counts on F2P heh). What can be done is that we can have the stats of the capes remain negated so it doesn't give any bonuses; they're already negated on F2P worlds to begin with. In terms of emotes, some have suggested to make a different set of emotes for the capes. Erm, no thanks... Besides, it'll just make the capes seem better on F2P than P2P then if the emotes are comparatively better for some skills. :lol: And then what?

 

 

 

#4. Some have suggested making another set of capes for the F2Pers, but that would mean more items that could end up being useless since they are more or less the same item as the original cape. And again, what if we have people going, "Why do their capes look better?" :wall:

 

 

 

I think the main root of the problem right now is that we currently don't have any items on F2P that we can wear/obtain but don't get any bonuses unless we're on members that we can use to compare to to make a strong argument to bring skill capes to F2P. We simply don't have an example of this happening which makes it sound unlikely to happen...

[perfetc]

 

 

 

Make up your mind.

 

 

 

"I don't see what the fuss is about talking about economical effects."

 

 

 

"I was referring to the secondary skills like fletch, fm, crafting, etc."

 

 

 

"Not to mention the effects on the runescape economy."

 

 

 

:|

 

I'm confused as to what I need to make up my mind on.

 

 

 

the effect of f2p getting skills capes in regards to the economy, you bring it up, shoot it down then support your point that it had an effect on the economy.

 

 

 

No I didn't, I'm afraid you misunderstood what I was saying.

 

 

 

So what were you saying cos from them quotes I took from your posts it sounds like your a bit confused.

 

 

 

ForsakenMage,

 

 

 

you could always not buy the cape to save bank space or give f2p an extra 15 spots.

 

 

 

What about my idea of giving things like the melee capes to Scavvo in the champs guild, the magic cape could be in the tower south of draynor, in other words give npc's new items or chat "sequences" (for lack of a better word).

 

 

 

It seems f2p are in need of a good cape and what better stats and reward than the second best cape in p2p?

 

 

 

Emotes and looks I agree with.

[Me_Hate_Libs]

I usually avoid these discussions but I may as well try to give some input.

 

 

 

I've been a non-member ever since I started playing. And as you can tell from my signature, I right now have eight level 99 skills, nine in total within the next week or so. I've been watching this debate now and again because of rumors spreading about F2P maybe getting skill capes. Just gonna outline some points/arguments as I write. It's gonna veer a little off topic, but I will get to the skill capes. :P

 

 

 

[hide=WARNING]#1. Getting level 99 in any skill, regardless of getting it on F2P or P2P, is an accomplishment. Honestly, it's a celebration. You got the highest level possible in a skill. Why isn't it an accomplishment?

 

 

 

#2. Some skills are harder to level than others on F2P than on P2P. Take for example the melee stats. F2Pers only have up to rune armor and weapons to use (unless they decide to use the corrupt dragon armor but that's really inefficient). P2Pers have a wide range of armor and weapons to use, not to mention more areas to train. Although this does not mean they have more space to train since there will always be more people training in areas that are popular, they still have a good variety compared to F2P. Another example: Smithing. With the coming of Stealing Creations, people are having an easier time leveling up this skill on members. F2Pers are still doing the same old thing since RuneScape Classic (except of course we don't need to make one item at a time). :shock:

 

 

 

#3. Members are paying for updates. I will not deny this fact. They do help make up part of the money needed to generate the updates we see time and time again. However, this does not mean some of them should get on a high horse and say "I paid for this, so you shouldn't get it." Like some have said, F2Pers do bring in potential new members, meaning more potential revenue, and even if they don't they still got more people view the ads at least. It may not make a lot but it's better than nothing at all. And we should be thankful that Jagex offers a fairly large game for the free version with no level or time restrictions.

 

 

 

Unfortunately, I've met some rather obnoxious members wandering around P2P who told me I should go members because it's more fun and that I'm wasting their money by being F2P. Excuse me? I'm not asking them to help pay for my membership. And it's probably not even "their" money; it's really their parents'. :wall: It's people like that that make me want to stay away from the P2P community. I can deal with the begging and the million-questions-a-day routine. I don't want to deal with people who think they're high and mighty because they can spend $60-72 a year on a game. I barely make enough to cover my personal expenses as it is. So to those of you who think some F2Pers are being cheap and won't get members, think: who is paying for your members and is it something you need to and can to have.

 

 

 

If you're paying for it for yourself and can hold a meaningful debate on why F2Pers shouldn't get any updates whatsoever, good for you! You are the kind of people that I think most F2Pers will be willing to talk to to hash out any differences and beliefs on the topic.

 

 

 

If you're not paying for it for yourself but can hold a meaningful debate on why F2Pers shouldn't get any updates, same as those mentioned previously.

 

 

 

If you're not and you're calling people [who are trying to hold meaningful debates] whiners and beggars for wanting updates on F2P, you might want to keep your mouth shut until you understand the value of a dollar and how you got those dollars to begin with. :?[/hide]And now to the skill capes.

 

 

 

Personally I don't care either way if F2P gets skill capes.

 

 

 

#1. It's going to take up very valuable bank space since F2P doesn't have that much already (30 spaces out of 68 if you are maxed and buy all the capes and hoods).

 

 

 

#2. Some of the cape sellers are in P2P areas. Unless they want to have secondary sellers for those skills that are F2P or make the skill capes tradable, they're going to have to move the NPCs around, which could cause some problems for members that need to talk to the NPCs for several P2P quests.

 

 

 

#3. We have the issue of the stats bonus (which every little bit counts on F2P heh). What can be done is that we can have the stats of the capes remain negated so it doesn't give any bonuses; they're already negated on F2P worlds to begin with. In terms of emotes, some have suggested to make a different set of emotes for the capes. Erm, no thanks... Besides, it'll just make the capes seem better on F2P than P2P then if the emotes are comparatively better for some skills. :lol: And then what?

 

 

 

#4. Some have suggested making another set of capes for the F2Pers, but that would mean more items that could end up being useless since they are more or less the same item as the original cape. And again, what if we have people going, "Why do their capes look better?" :wall:

 

 

 

I think the main root of the problem right now is that we currently don't have any items on F2P that we can wear/obtain but don't get any bonuses unless we're on members that we can use to compare to to make a strong argument to bring skill capes to F2P. We simply don't have an example of this happening which makes it sound unlikely to happen...

 

 

 

1) They want the capes so badly, let them use their bank space for them.

 

 

 

2) Make it so that the WOM in Draynor can sell all the capes for 99k. And the option can be the same on Members. You could also just make that so and get rid of the other cape sellers, though most have other uses as well.

 

 

 

3) Let them have the bonuses. You get a 99 in a skill, you deserve it.

 

 

 

4) Do above 3 and skip number 4.

[ForsakenMage]

1) They want the capes so badly, let them use their bank space for them.

 

 

 

2) Make it so that the WOM in Draynor can sell all the capes for 99k. And the option can be the same on Members. You could also just make that so and get rid of the other cape sellers, though most have other uses as well.

 

 

 

3) Let them have the bonuses. You get a 99 in a skill, you deserve it.

 

 

 

4) Do above 3 and skip number 4.

#1. The reason why I even stated the bank space is because that's one of the issues I have personally. I'm pretty sure others don't mind using up the space for the capes. :P It's not a big deal really, but that was something that was pointed out.

 

 

 

#2. While we do have NPCs that sell multiple items of the same category, I feel quests and skill capes don't mix together. Plus it's going to make Draynor into a breeding ground for "OMG EMOTE PLZ." :? Jimmyw3000 told me about an idea where people could teleport from Lumbridge to a room that has all the cape sellers (can't find the link for it at the moment) and that seems to be a good idea. I think there needs to be kept the consistency there is now with how the capes are distributed. Plus I don't know about you, but I like the feeling of receiving one honor from one person at a time. Makes me feel a little special being able to talk to so many people instead of just one going, "Okay here you go!" and throwing all the capes in your face. :|

 

 

 

#3. One of the main arguments that was pointed out when I was talking about this on my chat was the fact that some members didn't like the idea of the bonus being given if skill capes went F2P. That's why I suggested keeping the bonus out, although it would be cool to have. I'm not saying whether or not F2P deserves the bonus. I would LIKE to have the bonus sure, but I can do without it too.

 

 

 

#4. Only stated this as one of the arguments given that I can argue against. :P

[perfetc]

I don't think f2p should get the quest cape though cos they havn't done all the quests.

[Death123141]

I don't think f2p should get the quest cape though cos they havn't done all the quests.

 

F2p quest cape lol i think everyone would have that.

[perfetc]

I don't think f2p should get the quest cape though cos they havn't done all the quests.

 

F2p quest cape lol i think everyone would have that.

 

 

 

:lol: I am the other side of the argument now.

 

 

 

Let me get my "worn out arguments" book out .... Ah, here we go.

 

 

 

They don't pay for it!

 

 

 

They don't deserve it!

 

 

 

No. End of story.

 

 

 

Seriously. If Jagex hid all the p2p quests from f2p then I would say ok but it is odd that you can see you havn't done all the quests but you have a cape for doing all the quests :?

 

 

 

Would that mean members who have done all the f2p quests could get the cape? :lol:

[Death123141]

I don't think f2p should get the quest cape though cos they havn't done all the quests.

 

F2p quest cape lol i think everyone would have that.

 

 

 

:lol: I am the other side of the argument now.

 

 

 

Let me get my "worn out arguments" book out .... Ah, here we go.

 

 

 

They don't pay for it!

 

 

 

They don't deserve it!

 

 

 

No. End of story.

 

 

 

Seriously. If Jagex hid all the p2p quests from f2p then I would say ok but it is odd that you can see you havn't done all the quests but you have a cape for doing all the quests :?

 

 

 

Would that mean members who have done all the f2p quests could get the cape? :lol:

 

If they made it.

[perfetc]

I don't think f2p should get the quest cape though cos they havn't done all the quests.

 

F2p quest cape lol i think everyone would have that.

 

 

 

:lol: I am the other side of the argument now.

 

 

 

Let me get my "worn out arguments" book out .... Ah, here we go.

 

 

 

They don't pay for it!

 

 

 

They don't deserve it!

 

 

 

No. End of story.

 

 

 

Seriously. If Jagex hid all the p2p quests from f2p then I would say ok but it is odd that you can see you havn't done all the quests but you have a cape for doing all the quests :?

 

 

 

Would that mean members who have done all the f2p quests could get the cape? :lol:

 

If they made it.

 

 

 

That would hack alot of people off! :|

[Death123141]

[hide=]

I don't think f2p should get the quest cape though cos they havn't done all the quests.

 

F2p quest cape lol i think everyone would have that.

 

 

 

:lol: I am the other side of the argument now.

 

 

 

Let me get my "worn out arguments" book out .... Ah, here we go.

 

 

 

They don't pay for it!

 

 

 

They don't deserve it!

 

 

 

No. End of story.

 

 

 

Seriously. If Jagex hid all the p2p quests from f2p then I would say ok but it is odd that you can see you havn't done all the quests but you have a cape for doing all the quests :?

 

 

 

Would that mean members who have done all the f2p quests could get the cape? :lol:

 

If they made it.

[/hide]

 

 

 

That would hack alot of people off! :|

 

Ya, and if they do make f2p capes i think they should be a design like wilderness capes so they don't get the cool design like i have.

[perfetc]

Bit selfish.

 

 

 

No quest cape and identical skill capes for f2p skills in f2p worlds sold by a mix of old and new npc's in various places around the f2p area in both members and f2p worlds.

 

 

 

Simples! :thumbsup:

[Death123141]

Bit selfish.

 

 

 

No quest cape and identical skill capes for f2p skills in f2p worlds sold by a mix of old and new npc's in various places around the f2p area in both members and f2p worlds.

 

 

 

Simples! :thumbsup:

 

I still don't like the idea of sharing my capies with them.