A useless(ful) tip.

[Looce]

Since random numbers in computers are actually pseudo-random, I may understand why the above (posted by FooK-A-Ji) can be true... or completely false.

 

 

 

Java's Random class generates "random" numbers based on the previous number it generated. But the first number is given by the programmer (also known as a "seed number"). If the seed is the same all the time, and it happens that the rare drop is on that number, the rare drop WILL always occur on the first kill.

 

 

 

Now, there is a way to get a different seed every time: System.currentTimeMillis(). This returns the current time, which is obviously different every time the server restarts.

 

 

 

If the seed is always the same, what you said, FooK, is true. If not, then you are in the wrong.

 

 

 

sources: class java.util.Random, method java.lang.System.currentTimeMillis()

[gwalman]

how do you know when a server is going to be updated so you know when to try this?

[yomom1919]

This makes no sense. it's not as if monsters start by dropping the best items, then the second best, then the worst till a new server update? :/

 

 

 

server updates just refresh drops and stuff, like filling a bucket of water. im not suprised because many ohter games do this, but nice find and good thinking

[bantam222]

errr.... :?

 

 

 

 

 

so you are saying that on every system update (every few days) there is someone, on every server, getting the chain from the next KQ or DD killed? And a drag med from the next fire giant, KBD ect killed? i dont think so. :wink:

 

 

 

One think that i do know is that shops restock items to full, so if you quicky world hop places like mage guild will be full on cheap runes!!!

 

this is also true for ores, most importanty the rune rocks

[gwalman]

how do you know when the server updates anyways?

[saidada1189]

Looce, YOU ROCK!!!!

 

--Finally a person that understands that *. I thought i was the only one. I tend to go with the latter option tho. Jadex is not stupid and the programmer is not either (Yes, I know who it is :roll: ). Otherwise, it seems too easy.

 

 

 

Yeah. I think that the thread creator might have something.

 

 

 

:D :D Just my 2 cents worth!!

 

Finally, FLAME WAR, not. Seriously, we can dicredit what a person is saying but "mr.scientist" and other name calling is not good. (Just my two cents worth)

 

:D :D

[nomader]

Since random numbers in computers are actually pseudo-random, I may understand why the above (posted by FooK-A-Ji) can be true... or completely false.

 

 

 

Java's Random class generates "random" numbers based on the previous number it generated. But the first number is given by the programmer (also known as a "seed number"). If the seed is the same all the time, and it happens that the rare drop is on that number, the rare drop WILL always occur on the first kill.

 

 

 

Now, there is a way to get a different seed every time: System.currentTimeMillis(). This returns the current time, which is obviously different every time the server restarts.

 

 

 

If the seed is always the same, what you said, FooK, is true. If not, then you are in the wrong.

 

 

 

sources: class java.util.Random, method java.lang.System.currentTimeMillis()

 

 

 

only one flaw with this...runescape is no longer coded in java but a language that andrew (and as an extension jagex as a whole) created known as runescript. Towards the end of rs1 jagex was starting to push the limits of what the java language can and cannot do so they as you may recall, created an entire new game based on an entirely new design (not counting the fact that it did retain the original details of rs1). I do have to agree with you on some aspects though such as the fact that all computer based random functions are actually psuedo-random. Although I think jagex is bright enough to notice something like this that could be such a massive exploit...most likely it will generate a number at random not the same first number over and over. If this was true than it would be highly likely that the dragon chain would be no more expensive than the dragon legs, from all the people logging in to kill the kalaphite queen and the dustdevils before anybody else.

[lokisilath]

ok...i know this has been going on a while but i got a point to make.

 

i used to constantly train at lessers and so therefore i was usually online playing when server updates happened. however when i killed a lesser after a update it didnt drop a rune med which i would say is its rarest item...instead i kept getting your normal basic drops (coins, fire runes, lots of ash etc) so your idea is nice and all but i think you were just lucky.

 

same thing happens with ice giants, ice warriors, moss giants and everything else ive fought during server updates...just got normal drops.

 

this is not to say i havent got rare items off these monsters (14 rune meds to date) its just i dont get them immediatly after an update.

 

the other thing i should probably point out that i found a sly way of getting back onto servers before the log in thing jams with everyone else trying (a mixture of good timing and a third party client...although you can do it with the rs client as well if you got good timing on refreshing and logging in) so i could kill a fair few lessers before the place got crowded again. this is why im not sure your theory works as if i had just killed one then it would be understandable that the one i didnt kill was holding the rune med...but i killed em all and didnt get one so im just pointing that out.

[jimbo135]

The person who posted this topic is a [developmentally delayed], enough said.

 

 

 

Its one of the stupidest theories I've ever heard.....

[Veiva]

-snip-

 

 

 

only one flaw with this...runescape is no longer coded in java but a language that andrew (and as an extension jagex as a whole) created known as runescript. Towards the end of rs1 jagex was starting to push the limits of what the java language can and cannot do so they as you may recall, created an entire new game based on an entirely new design (not counting the fact that it did retain the original details of rs1). I do have to agree with you on some aspects though such as the fact that all computer based random functions are actually psuedo-random. Although I think jagex is bright enough to notice something like this that could be such a massive exploit...most likely it will generate a number at random not the same first number over and over. If this was true than it would be highly likely that the dragon chain would be no more expensive than the dragon legs, from all the people logging in to kill the kalaphite queen and the dustdevils before anybody else.

 

 

 

RuneScript is just a scripting language. The interpreter would be written in Java.. So if Runescript calls a random number, the interpreter will use the random number function to retrieve the number.

[tmottbg]

how do you know when the server updates anyways?

 

 

 

If you are playing when the server is about to update, you get a message something like, "Server update in --insert time here--".

[FooK-A-Ji]

The person who posted this topic is a mentally challenged, enough said.

 

 

 

Its one of the stupidest theories I've ever heard.....

 

 

 

lol

[silentdeathe]

Sorry but to me this seems like a pretty flimsy theory. Jagex explained once before that the drops were based on a 'wheel' as someone mentioned. The fact about the drops being stationed 30-60 minutes apart isnt neccisarily true either. This might be the average of the drops, but i know that myself and a number of my friends have got a rare drop and then another only a couple of kills after. An example of this would be like when i got 2 half keys in a row from shadow warriors. Rare yes, but impossible no.

 

 

 

So i dont know, you might be correct, but it seems to me that you might just be very lucky :P

[kingdomzero]

This makes no sense. it's not as if monsters start by dropping the best items, then the second best, then the worst till a new server update? :/

 

 

 

it makes alot of sense.

 

 

 

if you train at GDS or other locations for some hours, you'll find that the same monster never drops the rare item twice in a row, so if u get a rune large, your gonna wait 30-60 mins for the next one, perhaps longer.

 

 

 

this rule is reset when the server refreshes, meaning the rune large the demon dropped 1 min ago is liable to be on the monster again after a server reset, meaning you can in theory gain 2 rune larges in 5 minutes from the same monster, and in theory 4 rune larges in 5 mins , as there are 2 demons ;)

 

 

 

get it ?

 

 

 

I understand what you're saying, i just think it's wrong.

 

As far as i'm concerned, the way rare drops are worked out on rs is the same as spinning a roulette wheel. The chance of getting a 0 is always 1/37, even if you're juve got a 0.

 

For what you're saying to be true, the rare system would have to remember where and when rare drops are given out, then calculate another random number basedon that to predetermin when the next drop will be. I can't believe jagex would put in such a complicated system when my version is so much more straightforward.

 

 

 

okay mr scientist, but unless you've exploited this tip, i'd suggest you.................................................................................................. go try it?

 

if your one of those ppl who can only survive with facts and numbers, well.. im sorry on your behalf :wink:

 

 

 

but to put it simpler so even you can fathom it i'll try to explain in a simple way..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1.monster have item.

 

2.monster drop item

 

3.server refresh

 

4.monster have item again instantly, just waiting to drop for you

 

now go away human, we busy

 

 

 

So you're saying that each greater demon only has 1 rune large, and has to wait until the next update to get a new one?

 

 

 

im definitely not saying that, can i hit you?

 

 

 

I TELL YOU SOMETHING. YOURE A [mod edit: do NOT evade the censor] IDIOT. YOU THINK THE MONSTERS ACTUALLY HOLD THE ITEMS ON THEM? OOOOOOOHHH, IT ACTUALLY HAS POKETS TO HOLD THE ITEMS? NNNNOOOOOO. ITS RANDOM. REMEMBER, RUNESCAPE IS NOT REAL LIFE WHERE PEOPLE HOLD STUFF IN THEIR HANDS, THESE DROPS ARE RANDOMLY GENERATED AND HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THE MONSTER "HOLDING" THE ITEM. EVEN IF YOU WERE RIGHT, YOU DONT KILL THE EXACT SAME MONSTER TWICE, DO YOU? NO. SO DO YOU THINK ALL THE DEMONS, THE DEAD AND ALIVE, ALL SHARE 1 GOOD DROP BETWEEN EACH OTHER UNTIL THE NEXT SERVER UPDATE WHEN THEY MAGICALLY AQUIRE A NEW ONE?

[Unitedite]

Guys, you can disagree without biting his head off...

[FooK-A-Ji]

This makes no sense. it's not as if monsters start by dropping the best items, then the second best, then the worst till a new server update? :/

 

 

 

it makes alot of sense.

 

 

 

if you train at GDS or other locations for some hours, you'll find that the same monster never drops the rare item twice in a row, so if u get a rune large, your gonna wait 30-60 mins for the next one, perhaps longer.

 

 

 

this rule is reset when the server refreshes, meaning the rune large the demon dropped 1 min ago is liable to be on the monster again after a server reset, meaning you can in theory gain 2 rune larges in 5 minutes from the same monster, and in theory 4 rune larges in 5 mins , as there are 2 demons ;)

 

 

 

get it ?

 

 

 

I understand what you're saying, i just think it's wrong.

 

As far as i'm concerned, the way rare drops are worked out on rs is the same as spinning a roulette wheel. The chance of getting a 0 is always 1/37, even if you're juve got a 0.

 

For what you're saying to be true, the rare system would have to remember where and when rare drops are given out, then calculate another random number basedon that to predetermin when the next drop will be. I can't believe jagex would put in such a complicated system when my version is so much more straightforward.

 

 

 

okay mr scientist, but unless you've exploited this tip, i'd suggest you.................................................................................................. go try it?

 

if your one of those ppl who can only survive with facts and numbers, well.. im sorry on your behalf :wink:

 

 

 

but to put it simpler so even you can fathom it i'll try to explain in a simple way..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1.monster have item.

 

2.monster drop item

 

3.server refresh

 

4.monster have item again instantly, just waiting to drop for you

 

now go away human, we busy

 

 

 

So you're saying that each greater demon only has 1 rune large, and has to wait until the next update to get a new one?

 

 

 

im definitely not saying that, can i hit you?

 

 

 

I TELL YOU SOMETHING. YOURE A edited IDIOT. YOU THINK THE MONSTERS ACTUALLY HOLD THE ITEMS ON THEM? OOOOOOOHHH, IT ACTUALLY HAS POKETS TO HOLD THE ITEMS? NNNNOOOOOO. ITS RANDOM. REMEMBER, RUNESCAPE IS NOT REAL LIFE WHERE PEOPLE HOLD STUFF IN THEIR HANDS, THESE DROPS ARE RANDOMLY GENERATED AND HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THE MONSTER "HOLDING" THE ITEM. EVEN IF YOU WERE RIGHT, YOU DONT KILL THE EXACT SAME MONSTER TWICE, DO YOU? NO. SO DO YOU THINK ALL THE DEMONS, THE DEAD AND ALIVE, ALL SHARE 1 GOOD DROP BETWEEN EACH OTHER UNTIL THE NEXT SERVER UPDATE WHEN THEY MAGICALLY AQUIRE A NEW ONE?

 

 

 

u suck at flaming dude

[Gaelforcwynd]

I think it's totally random.

[slicer92]

Fook is 100% right.Thats how I managed to get Dlegs after logging after update at Metal drags :D

[sessie]

The funny thing about random is that can be different every time BUT it can also be the same.

[zerger0]

I spent 8 weeks at dust devils, i didnt get anything good after updates.... jsut average drops.....

 

i spent 2 updates ( not the whiole 2 weeks ) at metal drags... average drops...

 

Jagex said its based on 2 wheels, 1 with rares ( gems, half keys and anything else the monster may drop.) and a common wheel ( coins, runes, common objects etc.) When a monster dies one is spun ( with a higher chance of the common wheel being spun) each item has a certain ammount of slots, for example - for dust devils if you get the rare wheel, chain will have lets say 1 slot, but a sapphire would have about 50.

 

A ring of wealth just increases the chances of spinning the rare wheel.

 

 

 

This is what Jagex themselves replied to a message sent to them asking how the ring of wealth works, if i can find the screeny again i will post, but it was a month or two back.

[hawkmeathead]

I think what fooks theory can be likened to is the random player on windows media player (hes not saying the monsters hold items in their pockets or they only drop theyre rarest item once per update) hes saying that if you have 10 tracks on a playlist, it will play them all through and not repeat the same one...

 

 

 

so in rs:

 

 

 

lesser demon would drop:

 

 

 

10 coins (100 times)

 

20 coins (50 times)

 

mith shield(4 times)

 

mith chain(2 times)

 

20 fire runes(30 times)

 

150 fire runes(15 times)

 

rune med(1 time)

 

 

 

*(this is just an example...)*

 

 

 

so once its dropped its rune med, it will have to drop everything else before returning to drop its rune med...

 

 

 

he is merely saying that if u get a rune med drop before the update, you will not have to wait for it to drop everything else before another rune med drop.

 

however, you will still have a 202/1 chance(if u use my example) of getting a rune med once the server is refreshed.

 

 

 

 

 

instead of flaming like idiots, why dont you understand his idea, which is quite possible, then give you views.

 

 

 

i dont know if it works like that or not, as someone pointed out by explaining java programming, it could work either way.

 

 

 

 

 

*NOTE*: FOR THOSE OF YOU TOO LAZY TO READ EVERYTHING, HE IS NOT SAYING EVERY MONSTER DROPS THEIR RAREST DROP THE FIRST TIME THEYRE KILLED AFTER SERVER UPDATE!

[RcS89]

I think what fooks theory can be likened to is the random player on windows media player (hes not saying the monsters hold items in their pockets or they only drop theyre rarest item once per update) hes saying that if you have 10 tracks on a playlist, it will play them all through and not repeat the same one...

 

 

 

so in rs:

 

 

 

lesser demon would drop:

 

 

 

10 coins (100 times)

 

20 coins (50 times)

 

mith shield(4 times)

 

mith chain(2 times)

 

20 fire runes(30 times)

 

150 fire runes(15 times)

 

rune med(1 time)

 

 

 

*(this is just an example...)*

 

 

 

so once its dropped its rune med, it will have to drop everything else before returning to drop its rune med...

 

 

 

he is merely saying that if u get a rune med drop before the update, you will not have to wait for it to drop everything else before another rune med drop.

 

however, you will still have a 202/1 chance(if u use my example) of getting a rune med once the server is refreshed.

 

 

 

 

 

instead of flaming like idiots, why dont you understand his idea, which is quite possible, then give you views.

 

 

 

i dont know if it works like that or not, as someone pointed out by explaining java programming, it could work either way.

 

 

 

 

 

*NOTE*: FOR THOSE OF YOU TOO LAZY TO READ EVERYTHING, HE IS NOT SAYING EVERY MONSTER DROPS THEIR RAREST DROP THE FIRST TIME THEYRE KILLED AFTER SERVER UPDATE!

 

 

 

I didn't see alot of flaming, merely arguments against his idea.

 

 

 

I personally think it's a load of nonsense. I've looted 2 rune meds before from lessers, within the space of 5 minutes, meaning that the theory Fook put forward is pretty much impossible.

 

 

 

I believe that there is a calculated chance of finding an item.

 

 

 

Lets say 1/1000 Drag Chain, 24/1000 Drag Legs, 100/1000 Rune Baxe, 875/1000 GP.

 

 

 

So there is Always a chance of finding a Drag Chain, but a greater chance of finding Drag Legs. The Drag Legs will therefore be 24x more common a drop than the Chain. Although more likely to be found more often, there is still a chance that you'll find 10 chains to every 1 legs you loot, even if it is highly unlikely...

[chielekop]

i dont know wether this is true or not, but ill test it when i can and tell u the real truth

[hawkmeathead]

I think what fooks theory can be likened to is the random player on windows media player (hes not saying the monsters hold items in their pockets or they only drop theyre rarest item once per update) hes saying that if you have 10 tracks on a playlist, it will play them all through and not repeat the same one...

 

 

 

so in rs:

 

 

 

lesser demon would drop:

 

 

 

10 coins (100 times)

 

20 coins (50 times)

 

mith shield(4 times)

 

mith chain(2 times)

 

20 fire runes(30 times)

 

150 fire runes(15 times)

 

rune med(1 time)

 

 

 

*(this is just an example...)*

 

 

 

so once its dropped its rune med, it will have to drop everything else before returning to drop its rune med...

 

 

 

he is merely saying that if u get a rune med drop before the update, you will not have to wait for it to drop everything else before another rune med drop.

 

however, you will still have a 202/1 chance(if u use my example) of getting a rune med once the server is refreshed.

 

 

 

 

 

instead of flaming like idiots, why dont you understand his idea, which is quite possible, then give you views.

 

 

 

i dont know if it works like that or not, as someone pointed out by explaining java programming, it could work either way.

 

 

 

 

 

*NOTE*: FOR THOSE OF YOU TOO LAZY TO READ EVERYTHING, HE IS NOT SAYING EVERY MONSTER DROPS THEIR RAREST DROP THE FIRST TIME THEYRE KILLED AFTER SERVER UPDATE!

 

 

 

I didn't see alot of flaming, merely arguments against his idea.

 

 

 

I personally think it's a load of nonsense. I've looted 2 rune meds before from lessers, within the space of 5 minutes, meaning that the theory Fook put forward is pretty much impossible.

 

 

 

I believe that there is a calculated chance of finding an item.

 

 

 

Lets say 1/1000 Drag Chain, 24/1000 Drag Legs, 100/1000 Rune Baxe, 875/1000 GP.

 

 

 

So there is Always a chance of finding a Drag Chain, but a greater chance of finding Drag Legs. The Drag Legs will therefore be 24x more common a drop than the Chain. Although more likely to be found more often, there is still a chance that you'll find 10 chains to every 1 legs you loot, even if it is highly unlikely...

 

 

 

theres nowhere other than wiz tower with only one lesser, so u obviously got from a different lesser demon.

 

 

 

read the argument before questioning what someone else has already answered

[zerger0]

Why is it even when Jagex, the MAKERS of the game confirm a theory, people argue against it? This theory is wrong, its a good idea, and i can see how you thought of it. But still, just becuase a few of you believe it doesnt make it any more true...