Do you believe in God?

[forsaken]

What im about to say might come out a bit incoherent, but i'll give a try anyway. Most of what im going to say is going to be groundwork in a manner of speaking, and it may seem a bit random, but you'll see where im going (or not going) - feel free to point out anything that i say that may be wrong.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm not so much providing the basis of why there is a god, or why there isn't - just whats been flying through my mind as i read these topics.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

We all know that in history, what the historian writes down becomes the truth, but he has his prejudiced view of what happened and so writes his own version which is slightly twisted, and therefore the truth is twisted (providing he is the only one who is allowed to write about it at the time).

 

 

 

But everybody who reads it say 1000 years later, take it for the truth, and it becomes the truth, it doesn't matter what really happened, because when the large majority of the population believe that that was how it happened, it is the truth.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Where am i going with this? I'm not exactly sure.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Muslim and Christianity, two different types of religions, two different gods, both believe that their god is the one god. How does that work? With the point of some supernatural or divine if you will force creating the universe, and both religions believing that that driving force was their own god, and both are equally .. how do i say this, 'totally believe it'. It's hard to say but.. both believe they are completely right, and so in a way, both are right. From the third person's perspective. Yet that can't be right, can it? Unless both gods are just one - which brings up many interesting points such as, why doesn't 'god' just make it 1 religion? :P

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh btw, im an atheist i guess.

[HugATree]

 

 

 

 

Matter is just another form of energy. Energy is never created or destroyed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So how does it renew itself?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The energy? it doesn't. If you mean the matter then it renews itself from other energy sources.

[bmagic]

i guess i do a little...

 

 

 

if that helps at all

[Meesy]

 

 

 

Your bizaree reasons are nothing more than an attempt to justify the impossible.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Please, refute my actual reasons, where are my objections to matter being eternal wrong?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The things of this earth can break down and renew because they are given energy from different places (ie the sun).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In the beginning, how can this matter get energy enough to reproduce? And how does a non-living thing reproduce?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Matter is just another form of energy. Energy is never created or destroyed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yup, E = MC^2 (Energy = Mass * Square of the Speed of Light).

 

 

 

That formula just proves that as soon as you go with the speed of light, your mass will increase so you will go slower. Has very little to do with od or the first life on earth.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And btw, scientist still have *no* idea how the first life form (bactery) came on earth, they suspect that because of high presure on a certain (unknown and no longer excisting) protein there suddenly was a bactery *POOF*!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Don't you believe them? Me either.

[chambochae]

 

 

 

 

Your bizaree reasons are nothing more than an attempt to justify the impossible.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Please, refute my actual reasons, where are my objections to matter being eternal wrong?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The things of this earth can break down and renew because they are given energy from different places (ie the sun).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In the beginning, how can this matter get energy enough to reproduce? And how does a non-living thing reproduce?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Matter is just another form of energy. Energy is never created or destroyed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yup, E = MC^2 (Energy = Mass * Square of the Speed of Light).

 

 

 

That formula just proves that as soon as you go with the speed of light, your mass will increase so you will go slower. Has very little to do with od or the first life on earth.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And btw, scientist still have *no* idea how the first life form (bactery) came on earth, they suspect that because of high presure on a certain (unknown and no longer excisting) protein there suddenly was a bactery *POOF*!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Don't you believe them? Me either.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What you mean is that you have no idea how life started. I really suggest you read this page on the origins of life. It's very detailed. Also the NASA website has lots of info on how life may have started, including experiments to show it could happen.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I wouldn't call that having *no* idea of how life started.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

so... tempted... to use... rolly eyes... must resist!

[Meesy]

What you mean is that you have no idea how life started. I really suggest you read this page on the origins of life. It's very detailed. Also the NASA website has lots of info on how life may have started, including experiments to show it could happen.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I wouldn't call that having *no* idea of how life started.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

so... tempted... to use... rolly eyes... must resist!

 

 

 

Lol, when I press the link about how close scientists are to discovering how live started, I get a "page not found".

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Coincidence?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Btw, roll your eyes at me, I couldn't care less.

[HugATree]

(edit: nvm)

[chambochae]

 

What you mean is that you have no idea how life started. I really suggest you read this page on the origins of life. It's very detailed. Also the NASA website has lots of info on how life may have started, including experiments to show it could happen.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I wouldn't call that having *no* idea of how life started.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

so... tempted... to use... rolly eyes... must resist!

 

 

 

Lol, when I press the link about how close scientists are to discovering how live started, I get a "page not found".

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Coincidence?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Btw, roll your eyes at me, I couldn't care less.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Well they are there. I just tested them. In two browsers, and refreshed. I got that page via google, it probably has a cache of it... here.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And it's not a link about how scientists are close to finding how life started, it's a page about the ways in which life could actually start.

[Meesy]

Works for me.

 

 

 

Does this or this work for you?

[Duke_Freedom]

 

 

Matter is just another form of energy. Energy is never created or destroyed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yup, E = MC^2 (Energy = Mass * Square of the Speed of Light).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That formula just proves that as soon as you go with the speed of light, your mass will increase so you will go slower. Has very little to do with od or the first life on earth.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I was just showing matter is another form of energy, and the fact that energy doesn't "disappear"...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh well I guess I'll also post my (philosophical) thoughts about 'the beginning' then.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

My idea is that one of the following conditions has to be true:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1) 'Nothing' doesn't exist.. In other words: Everywhere in the Universe there is 'something'. This leads to the fact that there was no beginning as there always existed 'something'.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2) 'Something' can be made from 'nothing'. If there was 'nothing' at some point and there is 'something' now, then I can only conclude that 'something' can be made from 'nothing', and the point at which this happened can be called 'the beginning'. People could call this that 'super-natural thing' or 'god', but I refrain from that as I only believe in logics and science, so I expect that there is a logical reasoning why 'something' could be made from 'nothing'.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~ Duke Freedom

[Meesy]

'Something' can be made from 'nothing'. If there was 'nothing' at some point and there is 'something' now, then I can only conclude that 'something' can be made from 'nothing', and the point at which this happened can be called 'the beginning'. People could call this that 'super-natural thing' or 'god', but I refrain from that as I only believe in logics and science, so I expect that there is a logical reasoning why 'something' could be made from 'nothing'.

 

 

 

But if there, in all those years, no logical explonation has been found... What makes you think that there will be found one soon?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Besides, as I posted on Scape, the bible is REALLY trustworth book, can't be bothered to explain why because I have to study. :P

 

 

 

But as soon as we get the database back, I'll show you why. ;)

 

 

 

It took me a day to write it and look that up :\

[HugATree]

 

 

 

1) 'Nothing' doesn't exist.. In other words: Everywhere in the Universe there is 'something'. This leads to the fact that there was no beginning as there always existed 'something'.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You mean like Vacuum energy or zero-point energy?

[Duke_Freedom]

 

'Something' can be made from 'nothing'. If there was 'nothing' at some point and there is 'something' now, then I can only conclude that 'something' can be made from 'nothing', and the point at which this happened can be called 'the beginning'. People could call this that 'super-natural thing' or 'god', but I refrain from that as I only believe in logics and science, so I expect that there is a logical reasoning why 'something' could be made from 'nothing'.

 

 

 

But if there, in all those years, no logical explonation has been found... What makes you think that there will be found one soon?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Why should we know the biggest mystery of 'the beginning' already? We still know little about a lot of things.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

People have lived on Earth for a long time too, yet they didn't know the world was round for a long time either...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1) 'Nothing' doesn't exist.. In other words: Everywhere in the Universe there is 'something'. This leads to the fact that there was no beginning as there always existed 'something'.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You mean like Vacuum energy or zero-point energy?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yeah like that.

[HugATree]

 

'Something' can be made from 'nothing'. If there was 'nothing' at some point and there is 'something' now, then I can only conclude that 'something' can be made from 'nothing', and the point at which this happened can be called 'the beginning'. People could call this that 'super-natural thing' or 'god', but I refrain from that as I only believe in logics and science, so I expect that there is a logical reasoning why 'something' could be made from 'nothing'.

 

 

 

But if there, in all those years, no logical explonation has been found... What makes you think that there will be found one soon?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So you suggest people give up finding the answers? Yea sure, we've got a good gap filler called "God".

 

 

 

Too bad we didn't do it sooner, the ill and mentally disabled would still be getting "cured" via prayers and exocisims.

[chambochae]

 

'Something' can be made from 'nothing'. If there was 'nothing' at some point and there is 'something' now, then I can only conclude that 'something' can be made from 'nothing', and the point at which this happened can be called 'the beginning'. People could call this that 'super-natural thing' or 'god', but I refrain from that as I only believe in logics and science, so I expect that there is a logical reasoning why 'something' could be made from 'nothing'.

 

 

 

But if there, in all those years, no logical explonation has been found... What makes you think that there will be found one soon?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Besides, as I posted on Scape, the bible is REALLY trustworth book, can't be bothered to explain why because I have to study. :P

 

 

 

But as soon as we get the database back, I'll show you why. ;)

 

 

 

It took me a day to write it and look that up :\

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And yet, ultimately, it was written by humans claiming to have a voice in their head. Therefore, in order to call the bible trustworthy, you first need to prove God exists. Then you need to prove he's not a liar. Then you need to prove that God instructed humans to write all of the bible.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm talking mainly about genesis here.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

For example, it is entirely possible that God does exist and he did instruct humans to write the bible, then one of those humans thought "hmm, this needs some kind of introduction" and proceeded to write genesis without divine instruction, making it up as he went along. Entirely possible.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Meesy, in my opinion, we will never find a logical explanation as to what caused the big bang. This is because we are a part of this universe, we are inside it, we cannot see out (even if "seeing" has any meaning at all outside), we cannot go outside to have a look (a heck of a long way to travel, even if "going" has any meaning outside, and even if going outside were possible).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But science is a continuous process. We are continually learning more, it doesn't all happen in a day. So who knows, maybe we will know someday.

[Astralinre]

 

 

'Something' can be made from 'nothing'. If there was 'nothing' at some point and there is 'something' now, then I can only conclude that 'something' can be made from 'nothing', and the point at which this happened can be called 'the beginning'. People could call this that 'super-natural thing' or 'god', but I refrain from that as I only believe in logics and science, so I expect that there is a logical reasoning why 'something' could be made from 'nothing'.

 

 

 

But if there, in all those years, no logical explonation has been found... What makes you think that there will be found one soon?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Besides, as I posted on Scape, the bible is REALLY trustworth book, can't be bothered to explain why because I have to study. :P

 

 

 

But as soon as we get the database back, I'll show you why. ;)

 

 

 

It took me a day to write it and look that up :\

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And yet, ultimately, it was written by humans claiming to have a voice in their head. Therefore, in order to call the bible trustworthy, you first need to prove God exists. Then you need to prove he's not a liar. Then you need to prove that God instructed humans to write all of the bible.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm talking mainly about genesis here.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1: For example, it is entirely possible that God does exist and he did instruct humans to write the bible, then one of those humans thought "hmm, this needs some kind of introduction" and proceeded to write genesis without divine instruction, making it up as he went along. Entirely possible.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2: Meesy, in my opinion, we will never find a logical explanation as to what caused the big bang. This is because we are a part of this universe, we are inside it, we cannot see out (even if "seeing" has any meaning at all outside), we cannot go outside to have a look (a heck of a long way to travel, even if "going" has any meaning outside, and even if going outside were possible).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But science is a continuous process. We are continually learning more, it doesn't all happen in a day. So who knows, maybe we will know someday.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1: If the Christian God did exist, and He did inspire the Bible, I do not believe he would let a book of lies be incorporated into it. There are plenty of other books that were written, such as the Gnostic Gospels, which were not included in the Bible because they were just made up by humans. (They also disagreed with the rest of the Bible and were historically inacurate)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2: Since we cannot observe or prove how the universe was created, that leaves open the possibility of God, among other things.

[mad4u689]

 

 

 

 

2: Meesy, in my opinion, we will never find a logical explanation as to what caused the big bang. This is because we are a part of this universe, we are inside it, we cannot see out (even if "seeing" has any meaning at all outside), we cannot go outside to have a look (a heck of a long way to travel, even if "going" has any meaning outside, and even if going outside were possible).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But science is a continuous process. We are continually learning more, it doesn't all happen in a day. So who knows, maybe we will know someday.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2: Since we cannot observe or prove how the universe was created, that leaves open the possibility of God, among other things.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I agree with this, and I don't even consider myself agnostic. There are so many possibilities, an infinity of possibilities, for how the universe was created, then. (Unless you believe, as I do, in the infinity of the beginning of time... but that's a different argument.) It leaves open the possibility of God, but its place as 1/infinity hardly warrants special consideration, and even if it did, if God is outside of the universe and thus beyond our comprehension, isn't there something utterly futile about speculating Him?

[JohnnySmum]

 

 

 

 

 

2: Meesy, in my opinion, we will never find a logical explanation as to what caused the big bang. This is because we are a part of this universe, we are inside it, we cannot see out (even if "seeing" has any meaning at all outside), we cannot go outside to have a look (a heck of a long way to travel, even if "going" has any meaning outside, and even if going outside were possible).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But science is a continuous process. We are continually learning more, it doesn't all happen in a day. So who knows, maybe we will know someday.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2: Since we cannot observe or prove how the universe was created, that leaves open the possibility of God, among other things.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I agree with this, and I don't even consider myself agnostic. There are so many possibilities, an infinity of possibilities, for how the universe was created, then. (Unless you believe, as I do, in the infinity of the beginning of time... but that's a different argument.) It leaves open the possibility of God, but its place as 1/infinity hardly warrants special consideration, and even if it did, if God is outside of the universe and thus beyond our comprehension, isn't there something utterly futile about speculating Him?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I find it fascinating that people are more interested by where they came from than where they're going. By any view, it's far more profitable to consider what lays ahead than what's already happened. Whether you believe God or the Big Bang created everything, it's important to realise where you're going.

[chambochae]

 

 

 

'Something' can be made from 'nothing'. If there was 'nothing' at some point and there is 'something' now, then I can only conclude that 'something' can be made from 'nothing', and the point at which this happened can be called 'the beginning'. People could call this that 'super-natural thing' or 'god', but I refrain from that as I only believe in logics and science, so I expect that there is a logical reasoning why 'something' could be made from 'nothing'.

 

 

 

But if there, in all those years, no logical explonation has been found... What makes you think that there will be found one soon?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Besides, as I posted on Scape, the bible is REALLY trustworth book, can't be bothered to explain why because I have to study. :P

 

 

 

But as soon as we get the database back, I'll show you why. ;)

 

 

 

It took me a day to write it and look that up :\

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And yet, ultimately, it was written by humans claiming to have a voice in their head. Therefore, in order to call the bible trustworthy, you first need to prove God exists. Then you need to prove he's not a liar. Then you need to prove that God instructed humans to write all of the bible.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm talking mainly about genesis here.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1: For example, it is entirely possible that God does exist and he did instruct humans to write the bible, then one of those humans thought "hmm, this needs some kind of introduction" and proceeded to write genesis without divine instruction, making it up as he went along. Entirely possible.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2: Meesy, in my opinion, we will never find a logical explanation as to what caused the big bang. This is because we are a part of this universe, we are inside it, we cannot see out (even if "seeing" has any meaning at all outside), we cannot go outside to have a look (a heck of a long way to travel, even if "going" has any meaning outside, and even if going outside were possible).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But science is a continuous process. We are continually learning more, it doesn't all happen in a day. So who knows, maybe we will know someday.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1: If the Christian God did exist, and He did inspire the Bible, I do not believe he would let a book of lies be incorporated into it. There are plenty of other books that were written, such as the Gnostic Gospels, which were not included in the Bible because they were just made up by humans. (They also disagreed with the rest of the Bible and were historically inacurate)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2: Since we cannot observe or prove how the universe was created, that leaves open the possibility of God, among other things.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1: Whether a god exists or not is one matter, but whether the christian god exists is another entirely. It is true that the christian god probably wouldn't let someone add a book of lies to the bible (although I've been told he never interferes), but the fact is we have absolutely no evidence to suggest that the christian idea of god does exist. For all we know the god that told humans to write the bible could have been having a laugh. It's every bit as likely as the christain god existing. Oh, the gullability of the human species...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2: Of course, that's what I've been saying. Personally I'm not interested in placing a bet where the odds of winning are 1 in infinity.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

JohnnySmum... this is a topic about religion, that's why we're talking about it...

[Usara]

Learn the mistakes of the past, and dont make them in the future.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So, with the hundred of religions in the world, you still consider it 'safe' to believe in God? And what if another religion turns out to be true? Boy would your face be red :P .

[Guest Coke]

of course i belieave in god wtf is your problem?

[HugATree]

 

 

 

I find it fascinating that people are more interested by where they came from than where they're going. By any view, it's far more profitable to consider what lays ahead than what's already happened. Whether you believe God or the Big Bang created everything, it's important to realise where you're going.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You die thats what happens. Everyone has or will do it, but to follow a religion or belief just because it comforts your mind seems to be a somewhat weak belief. In any case what happens when you die is as much speculation as what created everything.

[VipLink]

well i dont really believe in god but why do u care? ^^

[insane]

Let's not bring Christianity or the bible into this... it has little to do with the existence of God; you also cannot prove anything with it, as it would be considered circular reasoning.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edit: Welcome back Sonsie! :o

[J4K3]

No, I do not.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

To believe in God is nothing short of gullible.

 

 

 

Agreed totally ;)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

ps. i hated my re teacher