Grrr - I was unfairly muted/banned!

[ianer101]

Another lack of customer service... Back in 2000, (the corp. I am still with) we got it through our Staff's thick, paranoid, heads, that mentioning other sites on their site, is something they need to GET OVER... For example... If I mention Burger King while eating at McDonalds, and McD's throws me out for this... We have horrible customer service here, don't we? If you as a business, is so paranoid that you think mentioning other sites is going to cause you to loose your customers, then it is time to look at yourself, not the mentioning of other sites. Advertising is different, but we aren't talking about that... If a corporation is secure in itself then mentioning other competition is a healthy thing, and will not bother said corporation...

These are completely different situations. I don't think Jagex minds a bit of criticism/being compared to other games, that's fine.

 

 

 

Please DO NOT use the excuse that RS Staff is protecting us from bad sites... that's a crock, and they know it... Folks need to learn to secure their computers and be safe on the net, we however, DO NOT need any site to play big brother... That is an insult and extremely bad customer service...

I'm not sure what to say... The majority of people who advertise for other websites lead you to sites that attempt to steal your password.

 

 

 

 

 

P.S. Welcome to Tip.it, but always remember that the edit button can be used if you want to say more without posting more than once in a row.

[Bobbington]

I like the way you always seem to add to your posts a line along the way of: dont try and disagree with me because I am right........ it is really not the way to conduct yourself.

 

 

 

 

 

And YES that rule is there to protect players, I know the rule and it's reasons in very high detail..... although I am doubting it is worth explaining it as you seem adimant that you will not be agreeing anything pro jagex.

 

 

 

I see it as a waste of my time to explain it for you, although if anybody eles whats to hear it they are free to ask.

[dlainedee]

You seem to belive that paying $5 per month makes you all mighty and powerfull....... frankly this is not true! Members and non member should (and are) treated the same.

 

 

 

Are you really trying to say that a member encoroging suiside should not be banned because they are paying a tiny bit of money? well what would happen if the person the insult was aimed at did actually hang them selves?

 

 

 

This game has only last count 10million players, these people are of different ages, religions, soucal backgrounds, entelagent levels. Siome people are manic depersives (a high percentage than in real life which means over 1:100) somd are mental imature..... etc etc etc......

 

 

 

 

 

You cannot just assume people will take it as a joke! People MUST think about what they say before that say it! you dont know how things are taken.... aside from that joking about suicide is never funny, and shoudl be treated seriousally.

 

 

 

I would not think a perm ban would be too far out for an offence like this.

 

 

 

First off, what you have said is absolutely uncalled for...

 

 

 

You are taking this personally, and 'allowing' yourself to be insulted, personally, when this has nothing to do with you. This is not about YOU, and this is not a reflection of the RS Staff as PEOPLE. This is a conversation about a corporation and their customer service...

 

 

 

You are however, insulting me just because you 'disagree' with me. You 'assume' that I think I am "all mighty and powerful", but nowhere in my words do I say that or even suggest that.

 

 

 

If you disagree with me, then do it in a mature fashion by telling me why you disagree and then back yourself up, without insulting me, and name-calling. Insulting and name-calling is not a way to make you look intelligent or make you look as though you might know what you are talking about. We call folks that do what you have done above to me, forum trolls. I know that is not what you intended to do or be, but it is what you did...

 

 

 

Anyway, regardless of how much I spend on a membership...You are not speaking from any corporation's point of view... Whether I spend five dollars a month, or sixty dollars a year, it makes me a *CUSTOMER*, nonetheless... ;-) I have the right to demand service, all customers do, paying or otherwise.

 

 

 

Had you had any experience in working for a corporation or even a small business, you would never have said what you said... Bottom line...

 

 

 

Your words appear to come from a child that has no experience in the working world, much less the corporate world.

 

 

 

However, I don't believe this particular customer was encouraging the mod to commit suicide. I think that is rather silly to even think it, much less ban for it. So please don't draw for straws, it is not helping your case. ;) I do think he was an idiot for saying it though, but not enough to be banned or muted.

 

 

 

10 million times $5.00 times 12 ... do the math... ;)

 

 

 

It is not the concern of a corporation what someone's personal background is. I understand taking action against racial slurs and such, but simple name-calling... like... go jump off a bridge... does NOT warrant a ban...

 

 

 

You as a mod, however, need to grow thicker skin, or maybe you should re-think being a mod. This is not an insult, but a criticism in a helpful way.

 

 

 

You're allowing yourself to be insulted, when I did not insult you or RS Staff, and never intended to insult. I am expressing my opinion from what I know, what I have seen, and what I have heard. And, my experience as a moderator and assistant, and my experience in the corporate world.

 

 

 

I can assume that people will take it as a joke, because if they have thin skin they need to get off the net. RS Staff has more important things to concern their selves with, then silly, immature, name-calling.

 

 

 

You also, cannot mistreat your customers, because you 'think' another member might really jump off the bridge.

 

 

 

You've totally changed the subject of this thread, and tried very hard to twist the meaning of my words, and then responded to the twisted meaning. That is extremely unfair, and unprofessional on your part. :(

 

 

 

Like I said, I have no ill feelings towards RS Staff, not at all. I just think, they need to rethink their security, their customer service, and the way they communicate with their paying customers.

[Crazykid1321]

On the afternoon of May 5th, 2007, It was any normal day in Rogue's Den, World 99. The conversation somehow drafted into videogame systems, movies, and then internet flash movies.

 

 

 

I then said, while still speaking of flash movies I mentioned to URL of a certain site, specifically "newgrounds.com." Then two players, one of them being a player mod shouted "reported!" At first I was confused and then thought nothing of it. I then played a few rounds of Castle Wars, I then logged off for the evening.

 

 

 

After a long day of school I sat down and relaxed, powered on my computer and started Mozilla Firefox. I then went to the Runescape mainsite and went to the tip.it home world, world 99. After I typed in my username and then password, I noticed that I had 2 new messages from JaGex, I first thought I was finally invited to become a player mod. (Which was believe-able, as I had no blackmarks and constantly helped newer players) But a JaGex Mod notified me via message box that the status of my account had been changed and I was permanently muted in-game and on the Runescape Official Forums for breaking game Rule 11, Advertising.

 

 

 

Opening the appeal page, I see that I have 9.0 blackmarks out of 10 (previously 0) and my flag is now red (previously green) and my current account status is "permanently muted." I thought it was a mistake, after viewing the evidence, I did not remember saying that, but slowly, I remembered the entire conversation. I then appealed my offense and categorized it as an apology, but the offense still stood. After sending many messages to JaGex about my mute, (a total of of nine in a period of one month) *even one where a JaGex mod states that he knows I'm innocent* Jagex sent me a message if I ask more about my mute (which they say the decision is FINAL), I would be punished further (e.g. permanent ban) and my messages will be blocked by JaGex.

 

 

 

What really got me angry was that JaGex continuously accused me as "being a threat to other younger players" and "Inputing a URL which is hazardous to the safety to other player's computers."

 

 

 

Thank you for taking your time to read all of this.

 

 

 

~Crazykid1321~

 

Honest Runescape Player

[dlainedee]

Another lack of customer service... Back in 2000, (the corp. I am still with) we got it through our Staff's thick, paranoid, heads, that mentioning other sites on their site, is something they need to GET OVER... For example... If I mention Burger King while eating at McDonalds, and McD's throws me out for this... We have horrible customer service here, don't we? If you as a business, is so paranoid that you think mentioning other sites is going to cause you to loose your customers, then it is time to look at yourself, not the mentioning of other sites. Advertising is different, but we aren't talking about that... If a corporation is secure in itself then mentioning other competition is a healthy thing, and will not bother said corporation...

These are completely different situations. I don't think Jagex minds a bit of criticism/being compared to other games, that's fine.

 

 

 

Please DO NOT use the excuse that RS Staff is protecting us from bad sites... that's a crock, and they know it... Folks need to learn to secure their computers and be safe on the net, we however, DO NOT need any site to play big brother... That is an insult and extremely bad customer service...

I'm not sure what to say... The majority of people who advertise for other websites lead you to sites that attempt to steal your password.

 

 

 

 

 

P.S. Welcome to Tip.it, but always remember that the edit button can be used if you want to say more without posting more than once in a row.

 

 

 

Well, I may have to disagree with that. I know for a fact that they ban for mentioning other sites, whether it is in competition with RS or not.

 

 

 

As far as sites that steal passwords, to me, RS is just playing big brother, and I don't feel that is necessary. I train my child about the net and going to sites that she doesn't know about. Downloading is out of the question, unless I check out the site first. If a child, or an adult, gets a virus, or trojan, for going to a site just because someone said to go, then they are responsible, not the corporation that it was said at.

 

 

 

I think it is great for RS to advise, and to warn, and even teach, but to ban for talking about other sites, is wrong. In my opinion, of course.

 

 

 

What if this site has nothing to do with RS, a non-competitive site that a paying member is EMPLOYED at. They are just conversing with another about their jobs -- then the ban is extremely unfair. In my opinion, and experience, it is just an excuse to stop all talk about other competitive corporations. I think RS is bigger then that, and should be a little more lenient. Many adults play, and we talk about our jobs, as well as our kids and family, and many jobs are online.

 

 

 

Everything I have posted is just my opinion, and not to be taken as written in stone. Regardless of how the Mod above twisted my meaning into something insulting against RS, is wrong, and extremely incorrect.

 

 

 

I will say this though, and I cannot and will not say who, but this person is very much in-the-know. A corporation, that is accepted by RS and is used by almost everyone for quests, information, and the like, there is only one volunteer left that plays the game (or so I have been told). The rest, including Staff have quit...due to bad customer service... :( Once this volunteer quits, unless TipIt continues to help out with quests and such, there will be no more help from that site. :( If no one plays, how can they write up quests and such...?

 

 

 

Like I said, I don't mean to sound as though I have anything against the RS Staff, because I don't. I do, however, think they need to RE-think some of their banning policies, and to err on the side of their customers, not on the side of the ban button.

 

 

 

Thank you for the welcome. :-)

 

 

 

P.S... If I add to a post, those that have already read the post, will miss what is written. Also, to add to a post, especially after it has been responded to, is what a naughty troll would do... ;-)

[dlainedee]

On the afternoon of May 5th, 2007, It was any normal day in Rogue's Den, World 99. The conversation somehow drafted into videogame systems, movies, and then internet flash movies.

 

 

 

I then said, while still speaking of flash movies I mentioned to URL of a certain site, specifically "newgrounds.com." Then two players, one of them being a player mod shouted "reported! At first I was confused and then thought nothing of it. I then played a few rounds of Castle Wars, I then logged off for the evening.

 

 

 

After a long day of school I sat down and relaxed, powered on my computer and started Mozilla Firefox. I then went to the Runescape mainsite and went to the tip.it home world, world 99. After I typed in my username and then password, I noticed that I had 2 new messages from JaGex, I first thought I was finally invited to become a player mod. (Which was believe-able, as I had no blackmarks and constantly helped newer players) But a JaGex Mod notified me via message box that the status of my account had been changed and I was permanently muted in-game and on the Runescape Official Forums for breaking game Rule 11, Advertising.

 

 

 

Opening the appeal page, I see that I have 9.0 blackmarks out of 10 (previously 0) and my flag is now red (previously green) and my current account status is "permanently muted." I thought it was a mistake, after viewing the evidence, I did not remember saying that, but slowly, I remembered the entire conversation. I then appealed my offense and categorized it as an apology, but the offense still stood. After sending many messages to JaGex about my mute, (a total of of nine in a period of one month) *even one where a JaGex mod states that he knows I'm innocent* Jagex sent me a message if I ask more about my mute (which they say the decision is FINAL), I would be punished further (e.g. permanent ban) and my messages will be blocked by JaGex.

 

 

 

What really got me angry was that JaGex continuously accused me as "being a threat to other younger players" and "Inputing a URL which is hazardous to the safety to other player's computers."

 

 

 

If what you say is true, then this is a classic example of bad customer service. :-(

 

 

 

You should have (maybe) been warned, but not banned, and surely not muted.

 

 

 

As far as 'being a threat to other [younger] members', this is where playing big brother is not healthy for a website.

 

 

 

It is against the law (on the net) to have any members under the age of 13. We all know that RS is full of members under the age of 13. I understand that the children can lie about their age, and parents condone it by paying. That is all fine...

 

 

 

However, it is the responsibility of the PARENTS to stop their children from following links to sites, not RS, or any corporations.

 

 

 

They could do what we do at the site I work for... Sites that we feel, or think, are a threat, are filtered. :D The member is never banned though.

[Bobbington]

Sorry dlainedee, I think you mis interpreated my wording, I was not getting offended at all. I was mere ly pointing out the fact you seem quite reluctant to accept any right doing on Jagex part, and so I felt it was not worth putting a large amount of effort to change your mind.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You are correct, it is the pearents respoinsibilty to teach their childern web safty but lets face it........ they dont do it.

 

 

 

 

 

It is a must to protect the community the adverage age of player ont eh game is 13-17, these people are really at the very bingining of learning web safty, and are probaly not playing under supervision. I know how dangerous the internet is, and people do follow links online and go where people tell them without any knowledge of what it is. It does happen alot more than you would think.

 

 

 

 

 

We cannot know the safness of every website, and so we cannot tell is a harmless site posted ingame or on the forums is safe, and so it is important that we do not allow people to post any.

 

 

 

With the low subscription cost of the game, and the game graphics RuneScape attracts less hardcore gamers, and often younger. These people are more at risk that say players of WoW because the majority of people are less experianced.

 

 

 

I personally think I perm mute soudns a bit harsh for a first offence, however without knowing everything about the circumstances, and not knowing is jagex have a certain problem with that site I cannot say why the actions they took where taken.

[dlainedee]

Sorry dlainedee, I think you mis interpreated my wording, I was not getting offended at all. I was mere ly pointing out the fact you seem quite reluctant to accept any right doing on Jagex part, and so I felt it was not worth putting a large amount of effort to change your mind.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You are correct, it is the pearents respoinsibilty to teach their childern web safty but lets face it........ they dont do it.

 

 

 

 

 

It is a must to protect the community the adverage age of player ont eh game is 13-17, these people are really at the very bingining of learning web safty, and are probaly not playing under supervision. I know how dangerous the internet is, and people do follow links online and go where people tell them without any knowledge of what it is. It does happen alot more than you would think.

 

 

 

 

 

We cannot know the safness of every website, and so we cannot tell is a harmless site posted ingame or on the forums is safe, and so it is important that we do not allow people to post any.

 

 

 

With the low subscription cost of the game, and the game graphics RuneScape attracts less hardcore gamers, and often younger. These people are more at risk that say players of WoW because the majority of people are less experianced.

 

 

 

I personally think I perm mute soudns a bit harsh for a first offence, however without knowing everything about the circumstances, and not knowing is jagex have a certain problem with that site I cannot say why the actions they took where taken.

 

 

 

Yes, you did act as though you were insulted, by your own words, and yes you did insult me, by your words... Go back and reread if you think I am wrong...

 

 

 

I never said that RS wasn't doing anything right, *you said that* above. Please do not put words, nor meanings, into my mouth. It was you that misinterpreted what I said, then responded to that misinterpretation.

 

 

 

Btw... I don't need my mind changed... ;D I'm not against rules, regulations, or policies... It is the way they are handled that can make them bad... I find on RS a lot of good members have a lot of fear, especially high level members, because they have the most to lose. Fear should not be what good members feel...

 

 

 

Also, it doesn't matter what parents teach, or don't teach their children. It is not the responsibility of a website to force children to do what their parent refuse to do... That is the sad problem with the vast majority of kids nowadays, they are not made to take responsibility for themselves and their actions.

 

 

 

How do you see $60.00 a year as a low subscription price? Compared to many other sites, including non-game sites, $60 is either about the norm, or rather high... Most sites are around $39.99 to $49.99 a year. ;)

 

 

 

The price isn't the issue anyway... If RS thought they were charging too low of a subscription price, take my word, they would raise it. That is a no-brainer... ;)

 

 

 

Of course people click on links and go to sites that they should not, but playing big brother will not stop that from happening. Banning and muting GOOD customers because of the bad, is bad customer service.

 

 

 

I stand by what I say... When you ban, or mute a member, a CUSTOMER, then it should be done on a personal, communicative, level... NEVER should canned responses be made to appeals.

 

 

 

First offenses should be handled with a warning and nothing else... Children DO NOT read the home page, or rules, or policies. RS knows that too. So a warning should be given to all for first time offenses. Even adults deserve that courtesy.

[dlainedee]

I personally think I perm mute soudns a bit harsh for a first offence, however without knowing everything about the circumstances, and not knowing is jagex have a certain problem with that site I cannot say why the actions they took where taken.

 

 

 

You didn't answer a question that I asked, so I will ask again in case you missed it.

 

 

 

How long do the black marks stay on a customers file?

[fatpat]

My brother got a 1 day ban and a permanent mute for breaking rule 1 and 6, not so much 6 though.

 

 

 

For rule 1 he was helping his F2P friend train on guards when some other idiot walks up and begins to annoy them and "Eavesdrop" on them. My brother brought out some inside jokes and got reported for rule 1. Happened yesterday

 

 

 

For rule 6 it happened months ago. He was joking with his friend in a bank and yelled out "Buyin n00bz lv20 1 mil ea!!!! need 3!!!11!1!!".

[hohto]

For rule 1 he was helping his F2P friend train on guards when some other idiot walks up and begins to annoy them and "Eavesdrop" on them. My brother brought out some inside jokes and got reported for rule 1. Happened yesterday

 

 

 

There are rules about offensive language and the line must be drawn somewhere. I've personally seen so offensive jokes that they aren't even funny anymore. I personally think that if you gotta start verbally smashing someone and he replies, both deserve punishment.

 

 

 

For rule 6 it happened months ago. He was joking with his friend in a bank and yelled out "Buyin n00bz lv20 1 mil ea!!!! need 3!!!11!1!!".

 

 

 

He was lucky not to get permanently banned: if Jagex tolerated even that kind of jokes, we couldn't soon tell what's a joke and what not. Joke with me like that and I'll definately report.

[Bobbington]

I personally think I perm mute soudns a bit harsh for a first offence, however without knowing everything about the circumstances, and not knowing is jagex have a certain problem with that site I cannot say why the actions they took where taken.

 

 

 

You didn't answer a question that I asked, so I will ask again in case you missed it.

 

 

 

How long do the black marks stay on a customers file?

 

 

 

Oh sorry, they stay on account forever (expect in some exceptions - but I dont know the details of that so cant elaborate)

 

 

 

Remember though it's not a case of "your account is 10% banned"...... it's more of we have warned you about this, it acts as evidance. I personally think if people have broken enough rules to collect 10 black marks they are really not good for the games community...... its not hard to follow a set of simple rules, I know people who where perm banned for repeatidly using offencive language....... they where simplay not willing to change there ways!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

fatpat, I understand when things are jokes, but it's always to think about how what you say could be interprated by otheres around you, and how evidance would look to Jagex. I will always try to include the fact that I am joking, or do things like that through privatce messages when I know the recipient will understand the joke.....

 

 

 

Although I would always go with "phr33 st00f pl0x" or somthing that is annoying and noobish but not against the rules.

 

 

 

I'ts a shame and should be learned from.

[dlainedee]

I personally think I perm mute soudns a bit harsh for a first offence, however without knowing everything about the circumstances, and not knowing is jagex have a certain problem with that site I cannot say why the actions they took where taken.

 

 

 

You didn't answer a question that I asked, so I will ask again in case you missed it.

 

 

 

How long do the black marks stay on a customers file?

 

 

 

Oh sorry, they stay on account forever (expect in some exceptions - but I dont know the details of that so cant elaborate)

 

 

 

Remember though it's not a case of "your account is 10% banned"...... it's more of we have warned you about this, it acts as evidance. I personally think if people have broken enough rules to collect 10 black marks they are really not good for the games community...... its not hard to follow a set of simple rules, I know people who where perm banned for repeatidly using offencive language....... they where simplay not willing to change there ways!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

fatpat, I understand when things are jokes, but it's always to think about how what you say could be interprated by otheres around you, and how evidance would look to Jagex. I will always try to include the fact that I am joking, or do things like that through privatce messages when I know the recipient will understand the joke.....

 

 

 

Although I would always go with "phr33 st00f pl0x" or somthing that is annoying and noobish but not against the rules.

 

 

 

I'ts a shame and should be learned from.

 

 

 

No, I have to disagree with that. If a member doesn't do anything wrong for say...1 year, 5 years, 10 years (to the extreme), the black marks remain? That is extremely unfair and unprofessional, and it wouldn't matter if it is a game, or whatever place that has memberships.

 

 

 

My friend got banned for 3 days because he said his place of employment. It isn't a bad place, and he wasn't inviting anyone to go and join up, just mentioned it. His place of employment is an online corporation. He now has 7.5 black marks, this was over a year ago. He has had no other infractions... RS is WRONG for this.

 

 

 

He is an adult, he was having a conversation, all he did was mention his employment.

 

 

 

Let me explain one small reason why I believe they are wrong in the way they handle this, and that is because they tell the member (paying), that is banned, to *start* a new member name... If this member is so bad that RS deems a ban as the measure of punishment, why invite them back??

 

 

 

When a member is banned from my corporation's site, they are not invited to join up with another MEMBER NAME, and if they are found out joining with another name, they are instantly banned again.

 

 

 

Once you ban someone, regardless of their name-change, they should stay banned for life. The name changed, not the person. So, if you are giving them another chance, then why not just give them back their original member name?

 

 

 

So back to my question... If a member obeys all the rules, and of course, never again repeats the offense that he was temporarily banned for, they do not remove the black marks as time goes by...?

 

 

 

If you can't see the injustice in this, then there really is no use in us going round and round anymore. :-)

[Crazykid1321]

 

Let me explain one small reason why I believe they are wrong in the way they handle this, and that is because they tell the member (paying), that is banned, to *start* a new member name... If this member is so bad that RS deems a ban as the measure of punishment, why invite them back??

 

 

 

When a member is banned from my corporation's site, they are not invited to join up with another MEMBER NAME, and if they are found out joining with another name, they are instantly banned again.

 

 

 

Once you ban someone, regardless of their name-change, they should stay banned for life. The name changed, not the person. So, if you are giving them another chance, then why not just give them back their original member name?

 

 

 

So back to my question... If a member obeys all the rules, and of course, never again repeats the offense that he was temporarily banned for, they do not remove the black marks as time goes by...?

 

 

 

If you can't see the injustice in this, then there really is no use in us going round and round anymore. :-)

 

 

 

Almost exactly what they told me to "start another account." There is only one reason for this kind of injustice, JaGex is no longer what it used to be, it is now a large company who has no other intentions than to increase profits. They are now finding more and more ways to get people to pay more money, even resorting to Banning and Muting permanently for ridiculous reasons.

 

 

 

I believe that this is morally wrong in at almost every standpoint. (excluding JaGex's of course)

[Bobbington]

 

Let me explain one small reason why I believe they are wrong in the way they handle this, and that is because they tell the member (paying), that is banned, to *start* a new member name... If this member is so bad that RS deems a ban as the measure of punishment, why invite them back??

 

 

 

When a member is banned from my corporation's site, they are not invited to join up with another MEMBER NAME, and if they are found out joining with another name, they are instantly banned again.

 

 

 

Once you ban someone, regardless of their name-change, they should stay banned for life. The name changed, not the person. So, if you are giving them another chance, then why not just give them back their original member name?

 

 

 

So back to my question... If a member obeys all the rules, and of course, never again repeats the offense that he was temporarily banned for, they do not remove the black marks as time goes by...?

 

 

 

If you can't see the injustice in this, then there really is no use in us going round and round anymore. :-)

 

 

 

Almost exactly what they told me to "start another account." There is only one reason for this kind of injustice, JaGex is no longer what it used to be, it is now a large company who has no other intentions than to increase profits. They are now finding more and more ways to get people to pay more money, even resorting to Banning and Muting permanently for ridiculous reasons.

 

 

 

I believe that this is morally wrong in at almost every standpoint. (excluding JaGex's of course)

 

 

 

To be honest with you that is a bit unfair, yes profit is important to them, as it is with any company..... however you must remember that andrew, paul (and I think) Constant Tedder (big boss man) all care alot about the gam, it's workers and it's future.

 

 

 

Andrew and paul are evn on the rich list! they have ÃÆââ¬Å¡Ãâã108,000,000! so at the end of the day although it's nice more money is probaly not the main thing thats driving them.

 

 

 

Infact Jagex has made another list! it's in the top 100 companies to work for in Britan for the excelnt way they treat their staff. this is not just in pay (the pay is about adverage) but interms of treatment, environment and events they hold. They seem to have huge parties for random occasions. Andrew and paul really do care.

 

 

 

I personally agge with dlainedee that baned players should not be able to make new accounts but the way the game is set up it is hard to prevent without a full admital of the event. I am pretty sure though the ICU team will be watching them more carfully than other accounts.

[Crazykid1321]

 

 

 

To be honest with you that is a bit unfair, yes profit is important to them, as it is with any company..... however you must remember that andrew, paul (and I think) Constant Tedder (big boss man) all care alot about the gam, it's workers and it's future.

 

 

 

Andrew and paul are evn on the rich list! they have ÃÆââ¬Å¡Ãâã108,000,000! so at the end of the day although it's nice more money is probaly not the main thing thats driving them.

 

 

 

Infact Jagex has made another list! it's in the top 100 companies to work for in Britan for the excelnt way they treat their staff. this is not just in pay (the pay is about adverage) but interms of treatment, environment and events they hold. They seem to have huge parties for random occasions. Andrew and paul really do care.

 

 

 

It is not really the Gower brothers or Constant Tedder, but it is the people who they employ, I'm sure Andrew and Paul, being the creators of the game really care about it and its players, but most of the time, it is not they who reply to Customer Support messages or make decisions on to ban or mute a person or not. It is Moderators who use computers to reply for them and even make banning decisions. Even if it is personal, it seems that these Staff members don't really care about the game or its customers.

[dlainedee]

To be honest with you that is a bit unfair, yes profit is important to them, as it is with any company..... however you must remember that andrew, paul (and I think) Constant Tedder (big boss man) all care alot about the gam, it's workers and it's future.

 

 

 

Andrew and paul are evn on the rich list! they have ÃÆââ¬Å¡Ãâã108,000,000! so at the end of the day although it's nice more money is probaly not the main thing thats driving them.

 

 

 

Infact Jagex has made another list! it's in the top 100 companies to work for in Britan for the excelnt way they treat their staff. this is not just in pay (the pay is about adverage) but interms of treatment, environment and events they hold. They seem to have huge parties for random occasions. Andrew and paul really do care.

 

 

 

I personally agge with dlainedee that baned players should not be able to make new accounts but the way the game is set up it is hard to prevent without a full admital of the event. I am pretty sure though the ICU team will be watching them more carfully than other accounts.

 

 

 

I don't mean to offend you, that is not my intention, but you must be a child, or at least a young teen. You don't yet understand the corporate world (of course, I don't think any of us do - fully :D).

 

 

 

Anyhoo... ;D OF COURSE THE MONEY IS EVERYTHING! :D It's nice to love your job, no doubt, but, if there is no income - coming in, no profit to be made, then there is no job. ;D

 

 

 

Well...as far as the way they treat their own staff, that has absolutely nothing to do with the way they treat their customers. Almost apples/oranges... ;) Think about this...if someone is working for you, and everyone including yourself, can't stand nor tolerate this person, you would fire or lay them off... ;D That's a no-brainer, so - Apples and oranges... :)

 

 

 

I think, these people went from young computer geniuses, messing around with gaming in their garages...to multi-millionaires (after the smoke cleared from the 'dot com bust'). That is a good thing (not the bust)...but, the things that I know, see and experienced, makes them appear as though they don't understand the 'customers/clients' department of a corporation and how very important that department is. Maybe that isn't their fault, or at least not at first.

 

 

 

When a corp grows financially, and their business deals with memberships, then it is the time to consider having a customer service department that does nothing but customer service. You have to, at some point, put your puter folks back in front of the codes (only) and away from the paying customers. ;) Most computer geniuses are not people/persons, not on a large scale anyway.

 

 

 

I really don't agree with SS4Alex that the only reason is more money/profit. For any corporation, money/profit is a given, so I don't think that has anything to do with the lack of good customer service.

 

 

 

I think the reason may be that they get overwhelmed and they just don't want to deal with all the problems that comes with having customers (people). It can be, and is overwhelming and I know this for a fact. I think, they feel let's just ban or mute the supposed problem, allowing the person to sign up again, because it is easier... This is not good.

 

 

 

They use the 'excuse' (which is an extremely poor excuse and should never be told to your clients even if true), that they are under staffed and don't have the time for us. There is no reason, whatsoever, why a multi-million dollar corporation such as RS is understaffed and doesn't have the time to deal with customers on a personal level, when they are in the customer business.

 

 

 

~~~

 

 

 

Even if they didn't want to use the conventional ways of seeing when a member signs up with a new member name, because they feel it is time consuming, they can use our means of payment. I may have more then one credit card, bank account, or phone number, but it is highly unlikely that I would sign up for such accounts using a fake name and address. They have names for people that do this, and a room at the local hilton... ;)

 

 

 

The way I understand it, and it is over my head, dial-up users' IP addresses comes in blocks, so a little more time consuming, but not impossible. High speed users, they know who logs into their site. And even with dial-up, they can see every member name you make, even if you close the account down. ;)

 

 

 

The bottom line here is, they really need to rethink their permanent ban and mute. They need to be slow to take drastic action against their members, especially their paying members. However, how they treat their paying members affects whether or not their FTP members become paying members. Word of mouth = Free to pay, should be the bottom line for any corporation.

 

 

 

Sady, but had I known about their customer service policies before I decided to become a member and spend any real time, I may not have become one. Word of mouth can make or break a corporation...especially when dealing with the adult customer/client aspect of a corporation...

 

 

 

I stay because I do like the game, and because $60 a year is nothing to me, a drop in the bucket. But, it is still unfair to me, and all their clients, that we must be in fear of every tiny thing we do and say, unable to relax and fully enjoy the game.

 

 

 

Many of their policies can be very confusing anyway, which of course, makes it unfair to the members. The sad part of this is, they permanently ban members over policies, without at least one warning (and without adding bad marks).

 

 

 

Do they have some policies that are confusing which makes them unfair? Yes, I think so...

 

 

 

For one example, I may tell a member while playing RS to go to runehq .com, but not yada .com. I 'think' (unsure though) that I may be allowed to tell a member to use TipIt .com, but if I say yada1 .com I'm banned. Is RuneVillage .com ok, but yada2 .com is not? See where I'm going?

 

 

 

They state that saying (typing) other websites on their game is punished by permanent ban or mute, then why allow these? What about McDonalds, Barns & Noble, Walmart, Winn-Dixie, on and on. These are also websites now. Why are we not banned from saying those?

 

 

 

Of course, it is obvious that Hq is accepted by RS as a website that we are allowed to say, because of Copyright laws. No where on the RS site does it state that we are allowed to say Hq, and most children wouldn't understand copyright laws anyway, or recognize it, same for many adults. So in all reality we are all violating the rule by saying 'go read at runehq .com' ...

 

 

 

How can RS justify saying - some sites are allowed, but not others, and worse, banning good members when there is no list of accepted sites for us to use, to go by? We cannot read their minds, we cannot know what is allowed and not allowed, if they pick and choose sites on a whim.

 

 

 

They really aren't banning you, they are just making you start all over again... extremely unfair and more so, unprofessional. They are banking on the idea that they will not loose the money, because you will sign up again. Thus, they are taking the easy way out, at the customers expense.

 

 

 

My wish for a wish list would be, budget in a customer service department, and allow it to revamp their policies. And, stop playing big brother. There is a lot of adults playing now, and we continue to grow. We also have the money, which they want. ;D Playing big brother to adults, when RS has a filter in place, is un-becoming of any corporation. :-)

[Crazykid1321]

 

I really don't agree with SS4Alex that the only reason is more money/profit. For any corporation, money/profit is a given, so I don't think that has anything to do with the lack of good customer service.

 

 

 

I think the reason may be that they get overwhelmed and they just don't want to deal with all the problems that comes with having customers (people). It can be, and is overwhelming and I know this for a fact. I think, they feel let's just ban or mute the supposed problem, allowing the person to sign up again, because it is easier... This is not good.

 

 

 

They use the 'excuse' (which is an extremely poor excuse and should never be told to your clients even if true), that they are under staffed and don't have the time for us. There is no reason, whatsoever, why a multi-million dollar corporation such as RS is understaffed and doesn't have the time to deal with customers on a personal level, when they are in the customer business.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~~~

 

 

 

Even if they didn't want to use the conventional ways of seeing when a member signs up with a new member name, because they feel it is time consuming, they can use our means of payment. I may have more then one credit card, bank account, or phone number, but it is highly unlikely that I would sign up for such accounts using a fake name and address. They have names for people that do this, and a room at the local hilton... ;)

 

 

 

The way I understand it, and it is over my head, dial-up users' IP addresses comes in blocks, so a little more time consuming, but not impossible. High speed users, they know who logs into their site. And even with dial-up, they can see every member name you make, even if you close the account down. ;)

 

 

 

The bottom line here is, they really need to rethink their permanent ban and mute. They need to be slow to take drastic action against their members, especially their paying members. However, how they treat their paying members affects whether or not their FTP members become paying members. Word of mouth = Free to pay, should be the bottom line for any corporation.

 

 

 

Sady, but had I known about their customer service policies before I decided to become a member and spend any real time, I may not have become one. Word of mouth can make or break a corporation...especially when dealing with the adult customer/client aspect of a corporation...

 

 

 

I stay because I do like the game, and because $60 a year is nothing to me, a drop in the bucket. But, it is still unfair to me, and all their clients, that we must be in fear of every tiny thing we do and say, unable to relax and fully enjoy the game.

 

 

 

Many of their policies can be very confusing anyway, which of course, makes it unfair to the members. The sad part of this is, they permanently ban members over policies, without at least one warning (and without adding bad marks).

 

 

 

Do they have some policies that are confusing which makes them unfair? Yes, I think so...

 

 

 

For one example, I may tell a member while playing RS to go to runehq .com, but not yada .com. I 'think' (unsure though) that I may be allowed to tell a member to use TipIt .com, but if I say yada1 .com I'm banned. Is RuneVillage .com ok, but yada2 .com is not? See where I'm going?

 

 

 

They state that saying (typing) other websites on their game is punished by permanent ban or mute, then why allow these? What about McDonalds, Barns & Noble, Walmart, Winn-Dixie, on and on. These are also websites now. Why are we not banned from saying those?

 

 

 

Of course, it is obvious that Hq is accepted by RS as a website that we are allowed to say, because of Copyright laws. No where on the RS site does it state that we are allowed to say Hq, and most children wouldn't understand copyright laws anyway, or recognize it, same for many adults. So in all reality we are all violating the rule by saying 'go read at runehq .com' ...

 

 

 

How can RS justify saying - some sites are allowed, but not others, and worse, banning good members when there is no list of accepted sites for us to use, to go by? We cannot read their minds, we cannot know what is allowed and not allowed, if they pick and choose sites on a whim.

 

 

 

They really aren't banning you, they are just making you start all over again... extremely unfair and more so, unprofessional. They are banking on the idea that they will not loose the money, because you will sign up again. Thus, they are taking the easy way out, at the customers expense.

 

 

 

My wish for a wish list would be, budget in a customer service department, and allow it to revamp their policies. And, stop playing big brother. There is a lot of adults playing now, and we continue to grow. We also have the money, which they want. ;D Playing big brother to adults, when RS has a filter in place, is un-becoming of any corporation. :-)

 

 

 

I believe that JaGex staff should take a break from making in-game updates and focus more on improving their Customer Support, because it is one of the, if not the worst part of their "service." They (JaGex Staff) should focus on the customer's needs first before their own frustration's.

 

 

 

I am an extremely dissatisfied customer because Jagex has neglected my needs by not looking at my appeal most closely, I mean for God's sake, the appeal responses are also automatic. Also I mean that JaGex's need for more profit and cash has been placed first than to great customer service. JaGex expects to take my money after their own laziness.

 

 

 

P.S. I'd rather be called Carzykid1321 rather than SS4Alex, thank you. :D

[Bobbington]

I don't mean to offend you, that is not my intention, but you must be a child, or at least a young teen. You don't yet understand the corporate world (of course, I don't think any of us do - fully Very Happy).

 

 

 

19 years old, have had seveal part time jobs working in a store with over 200 employees, I was the first person in a 10 year gap to get a letter to my manager about how good my customer service was (turns out now she keeps coming back and we hate her :P but that is besides the point)

 

 

 

I am also now a univsesity student, doing graphic design and with that I am self employed as a designer, I go into companies and help them improve their image, and their marketing...... all in all I am alot better in this than most people.

 

 

 

Aside from that I also have fairly respectible qualifications in business studies, and human psychology studiying each for every years.

 

 

 

When a corp grows financially, and their business deals with memberships, then it is the time to consider having a customer service department that does nothing but customer service. You have to, at some point, put your puter folks back in front of the codes (only) and away from the paying customers. Wink Most computer geniuses are not people/persons, not on a large scale anyway.

 

 

 

They do, the customer service section of the staff is huge, this covers the snap shot review team, the ICU team, the OST team the forum support team, the Player moderator support team...... etc etc....... it is a huge department.

 

 

 

Each team is headed up by managers and each group of teams have a middle manager, the teams interact with specialists mixing so it is spread over to get a good coverage.

 

 

 

Also they do alot of polociy changes things are constantly beeing tweaked, altered softend, hardend, or removed. There are changes every day, all aimed at improving the levels of service offered.

 

 

 

The staff are regually trained to ensure consistancy, and even the volentary groups (mod) are trained for this.

 

 

 

They use the 'excuse' (which is an extremely poor excuse and should never be told to your clients even if true), that they are under staffed and don't have the time for us. There is no reason, whatsoever, why a multi-million dollar corporation such as RS is understaffed and doesn't have the time to deal with customers on a personal level, when they are in the customer business.

 

 

 

Who said they are understaffed? there are some rare occassions where coverage is not perfect but this is the same with any company..... sundays and bank holidays are always going to be undrstaffed, this is England!

 

 

 

They use as you put it "canned responces" to provide a better service, speeding up their productivity, whilst not subtracting from the quality. Using them actually means they can maintain a level of standared.

 

 

 

However, how they treat their paying members affects whether or not their FTP members become paying members. Word of mouth = Free to pay, should be the bottom line for any corporation.

 

Whilst members are prioritiesd over free players in customer support, it is very admarable that they treat each group the same! I would think it would detract fromt eh image of the company if they only looked after those who paid. I have a lot of respect for how jagex treat their players.

 

 

 

Remember this game started as a F2P game, members is only somthing that developed at a later date. Originally all the funding came from adverts, this was enough to fund the game although they introduced members so they can more than fund it but make it great.

 

 

 

Free players are just important as members!

 

 

 

For one example, I may tell a member while playing RS to go to runehq .com, but not yada .com. I 'think' (unsure though) that I may be allowed to tell a member to use TipIt .com, but if I say yada1 .com I'm banned. Is RuneVillage .com ok, but yada2 .com is not? See where I'm going?

 

 

 

For a while fan sites where no longer punished as they where in use far too often, although it was still very much against the rules reported players would get off with a warning. However NOW you may not name fan sites either, I will not go into the reasons for this for confidentialty reasons, but the reason is valid...... thou shalt not name any site even a fan site.

 

 

 

They state that saying (typing) other websites on their game is punished by permanent ban or mute, then why allow these? What about McDonalds, Barns & Noble, Walmart, Winn-Dixie, on and on. These are also websites now. Why are we not banned from saying those?

 

 

 

If them mentioned these companies interms of online enterties it would nto be allowed, and too right..... however these are not web based companies, they just happen to have a web eliment like 80% of other businesses......

 

 

 

It is fine to talk about the program I-tunes, howver it is clear that you must not discuss the itunes download site.

 

 

 

So in all reality we are all violating the rule by saying 'go read at runehq .com' ...

 

I would recomed you re reading the rules...... yes you are violating the rules, it must NOT be mentioned.

 

 

 

How can RS justify saying - some sites are allowed, but not others, and worse, banning good members when there is no list of accepted sites for us to use, to go by? We cannot read their minds, we cannot know what is allowed and not allowed, if they pick and choose sites on a whim.

 

 

 

They dont, you must not mention any site...... simple as! there are differnt punishments depending on the site, for example saying "google" would only reaistically be punnished by a warning, alhough advertigsing a hack site, or telling people how to get to a site via google would be punished harder. It is done via risk assesment..... would you prefer it if eveything was punished by a perm ban for consistancy? or let eveybody mention any site for consitancy?

 

 

 

They really aren't banning you, they are just making you start all over again... extremely unfair and more so, unprofessional. They are banking on the idea that they will not loose the money, because you will sign up again. Thus, they are taking the easy way out, at the customers expense.

 

that not fair they ban for a reason, they often hope a player would not create a new account, there will be some technical or legal reason to stop this though..... I dont know what.

 

 

 

My wish for a wish list would be, budget in a customer service department, and allow it to revamp their policies.

 

Wish granted! several years ago....

[Bobbington]

I believe that JaGex staff should take a break from making in-game updates and focus more on improving their Customer Support, because it is one of the, if not the worst part of their "service." They (JaGex Staff) should focus on the customer's needs first before their own frustration's.

 

 

 

I am an extremely dissatisfied customer because Jagex has neglected my needs by not looking at my appeal most closely, I mean for God's sake, the appeal responses are also automatic. Also I mean that JaGex's need for more profit and cash has been placed first than to great customer service. JaGex expects to take my money after their own laziness.

 

 

 

P.S. I'd rather be called Carzykid1321 rather than SS4Alex, thank you. :D

 

 

 

If you understood the set up of the company you would realise that would be a waste of time.

 

 

 

http://www.jagex.com/corporate/index.ws

 

 

 

Take a look at the staff list, it will show you how they are set up. The cotent team are entirly seperate than the customer support one. If you stop conetnt to focus on customer support you woudl just have a load of content designers sitting around doing nothing :P

 

 

 

I admit that like any company it does have it's weak spots, but I find it encredibly rare that people know what that are talking about....... Jagex does not have bad custoemr sercie in the granc sceam of things.... if you want to see bad customer service try getting a replacement part for a HP computer..... out of all the peopel I know non of them have been happy.

[dlainedee]

19 years old, have had seveal part time jobs working in a store with over 200 employees ...

 

 

 

:) It's ok, you misunderstood all that I said, but, it takes time and experience. You have plenty of time to get that experience. :-)

[Dragonlordjl]

Customer Service is, in itself, an oxymoron. I cannot recall ANY instance where there was CS that was pleasing. Most companies hire foreign CS reps with a limited knowledge of English (and also a heavy accent), as they are cheaper. See, what bothers me MOST about Jagex's CS is that it's largely automated. And the automation software they use is not very good. I believe it runs off of keywords:

 

 

 

I sent them a message concerning the large number of accounts with over 20m fishing experience, irrational names, and no other ranked skills. I included a list of those names. They sent me back something explaining black marks and how to appeal a ban.

 

 

 

If Jagex had horrible CS, but it was actually handled entirely by HUMAN BEINGS, I would not care. However, when I know that the majority of my messages will not ever be read by human eyes, it's very disheartening.

 

 

 

The fact that Jagex issues permanent mutes/bans for saying things such as RuneHQ or Tipit further reinforces their obvious reliance on automated CS. I guarantee that any bozo who is somewhat experienced with RS knows what RHQ and TIPIT are. I also guarantee that the workers at Jagex are aware of those fansites. Therefore, the only logical explanation for a permanent ban for saying those sites is that it was processed by a computer. Oh, and it is also blatantly obvious that their CS is HORRIBLE when a friend of mine sends a message filled with explicit swearing as a ban appeal and gets it accepted.

[Bobbington]

The fact that Jagex issues permanent mutes/bans for saying things such as RuneHQ or Tipit

just to set you straight there, they would not give that punishment for that offence unless it is clear that you are refusing to listen to warnings against it at which stage I am sure you would agree the punnshment fits the crime.

 

 

 

Even if you disagree with a rule you should still try and follow it, I have no respect for people who refuse to listen to a warning it reflects badly on them, no matter what the rule was that was broken.

 

 

 

I do sadly hear alot of the responces beeing totaly wrong, although like any business you are more likely to hear of mistakes than good doings..... I think Jagex may appreciate more reponce about mistakes via the "comment on our service" link of the runescape home page.

 

 

 

I have been told in private that unless you get the "sorry we could not read your message" reply, a human has looked at it.... sadly again like in any business some employees are more dedicated in others.

 

 

 

If you have a probelm I would recomend not deleating your inbox messages (as Jagex can look at what you have easily) and them use the complain subcatogory and try to include the Jmods name.

 

 

 

I belive although they do have several 100 premade messages there is no auto reply thing for queries. And abues reports are always reviewed by humans.

[allan1114]

Hehe I wanted to make a skiller account and i create the name and pass. I completely forget about it and a week later i remember it and log it in. It says my account has been locked. I go to the message box and it says there were 3 reports at me for offensive language and i am permanetly banned. I make 2 appeals and they say they are positive and they have substantial evidence that I commited these offenses. I went to the little evidence tab and it says there is no evidence. The funny part is that my account it still in the first room in tutorial island and its never been logged in. The only reason i made an appeal is because i like the name: "I trim iron"

[Bobbington]

Dont know what went on there, probaly a mistake at their end with the message they sent.... however your account would ben banned for the name, names are banned when they are offencive, use double+ spaces (new accounts, encorage rulebreaking, pretend to be Jagex, or somthing like yours which they would assosiate with rule breaking.