Noahs Ark

[rodl]

Noah's ark? Wow this better be some cruel joke. It has never existed, wake up from your fantasy world.

[Turkish-]

Verse please.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edit: You know i'm a christian, its been declared. Once again, where is it my obligation to convince you any further than that?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Defender~

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Maybe I'm wrong. Isn't it declared to teach others of your religion? I'm almost positive. Not as much convince, but teach at least.

[Defender2516]

Noah's ark? Wow this better be some cruel joke. It has never existed, wake up from your fantasy world.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Proof that it never existed?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Defender~

[anonimu]

Are you blind or ignoring me on purpose?

 

 

 

 

*If you want to see this image, please just click the blue underlined one at the bottom or top of the section of the thread currently visible to you...*

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yes, the flood supposedly did cover the whole earth. And yes it was supernatural. But what might've actually happened is this:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not too long after humans started communicating verbally or through pictures, a big human encampment was flooded. A few humans there had boats, so they put as many domesticated animals and humans as they could on those few boats. Either the village and its surrounding area was covered by water for a few days, or one or more boats got pulled by the currents towards an ocean/sea (therefore, this might've happened in the Nile or Yangtze delta, or, if the mount Ararat is really where the ark stopped is true (which it probably isn't since it would take a whole lot of water to get the water level that high), maybe even Turkey or East Africa (the Nile would still work, but this would mean that most of the animals were eaten)). This story was then retold every generation, of course with slight exaggerations. These humans then conquered all the other groups of humans in their vicinity, and therefore the story spread. Afterwards, the story-believers traded and colonized. That's why a lot of cultures have different versions of this story.

 

 

 

I don't really think that the boat stopped at Mount Ararat. So this probably occurred in the Nile, Danube (forgot that in original post), or one of the big Chinese rivers delta. (Might also be Amazon delta but that contradicts currently approved scientific theories...)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*If you want to see this image, please just click the blue underlined one at the bottom or top of the section of the thread currently visible to you...*

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't know who you were quoting there, but it wasn't me.

 

 

 

The picture was too big to quote... I replaced it with instructions to get to it...

[rodl]

 

Noah's ark? Wow this better be some cruel joke. It has never existed, wake up from your fantasy world.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Proof that it never existed?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Defender~

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Proof it has ever existed? Actually, got any proof of any miracle happening?

 

 

 

Waiting for proof since 2007.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Defender you should believe in Santa and tooth fairy, and if you don't, proof that they never existed ?

[Defender2516]

 

 

Noah's ark? Wow this better be some cruel joke. It has never existed, wake up from your fantasy world.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Proof that it never existed?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Defender~

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Proof it has ever existed? Actually, got any proof of any miracle happening?

 

 

 

Waiting for proof since 2007.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Defender you should believe in Santa and tooth fairy, and if you don't, proof that they never existed ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Santa does exist, not the magical one you guys are refering to.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Defender~

[Flametrooper]

well, then, how can you say Santa doesn't exist, yet God does? Both have no real "evidence" - and God is harder to believe then Santa. Why do you believe in one, but not the other?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Answer This Question. Directly. Don't beat around the bush. Answer it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Then maybe people will get off your case. Just a thought.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Flametrooper~

[Defender2516]

well, then, how can you say Santa doesn't exist, yet God does? Both have no real "evidence" - and God is harder to believe then Santa. Why do you believe in one, but not the other?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Answer This Question. Directly. Don't beat around the bush. Answer it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Then maybe people will get off your case. Just a thought.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Flametrooper~

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Lets rephrase it and say that you find it harder to believe in God. I do not.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I didn't start believing in God till I was 16 personally, and no I never believed in God due to my parents, thats a generalization. The day I actually picked up the Bible and read it for myself, thats when I believed. Particular when I was reading the new testament about Jesus.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Defender~

[Flametrooper]

 

 

 

Answer This Question. Directly. Don't beat around the bush. Answer it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You still haven't.

 

 

 

(Oh and P.S. I do believe in God. I don't believe in religious dogma however. I'm more into individual spiritualism.)

[Defender2516]

 

 

 

 

Answer This Question. Directly. Don't beat around the bush. Answer it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You still haven't.

 

 

 

(Oh and P.S. I do believe in God. I don't believe in religious dogma however. I'm more into individual spiritualism.)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Santa was a real person. God is a real person as well. Why do I believe God over Santa? Because I have used my Faith in circumstances without evidence of it ever happening and it does.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In the Bible it says Jesus died for our infirmities, he bore our sicknesses and diseases. The last time I was sick when I was 18 due to a stomach virus. I stood on Gods word that I will NEVER get sick again.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here I stand 4 years later without being sick since. Course, I still believe you guys wouldn't understand and say "thats just luck", yet I have used my Faith in many other areas of my life and its work just fine.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thats my "proof" that he exists, otherwise nothing would have happened and I would be having those regular colds.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Defender~

[krunkthemonk]

[

 

 

 

In the Bible it says Jesus died for our infirmities, he bore our sicknesses and diseases. The last time I was sick when I was 18 due to a stomach virus. I stood on Gods word that I will NEVER get sick again.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here I stand 4 years later without being sick since. Course, I still believe you guys wouldn't understand and say "thats just luck", yet I have used my Faith in many other areas of my life and its work just fine.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Defender~

 

 

 

I'm still amazed god chose to keep you in good health over someone who actually needs it like people in thirld world countries.

[lawrencekill]

 

[

 

 

 

In the Bible it says Jesus died for our infirmities, he bore our sicknesses and diseases. The last time I was sick when I was 18 due to a stomach virus. I stood on Gods word that I will NEVER get sick again.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here I stand 4 years later without being sick since. Course, I still believe you guys wouldn't understand and say "thats just luck", yet I have used my Faith in many other areas of my life and its work just fine.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Defender~

 

 

 

I'm still amazed god chose to keep you in good health over someone who actually needs it like people in thirld world countries.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

God needs someone who can spread the info? It's better to help someone with a higher chance to change the future(although god can see in the future...)? I dunno take your pick.

[Ambassadar]

Defender... I am a Christian and what you said about you will never get sick again sounds quite odd. I have never heard anything like that in the Bible. Why do you believe this? I don't think Jesus or anyone making a claim that Christians wouldn't get sick. Just wanted to give you a chance to explain your point because it struck me as rather an odd thing to say.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On to the Noah's Ark discussion.

 

 

 

Theory: So all the Earth was covered in water in the flood... Where is the water now? How could the Earth have been covered?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

A couple of possibilities(just tossing some stuff out there)...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It is underground. Recently a huge volume of water was found under Eastern China. I think they said it might have the volume of the arctic ocean or something. It has been a few days since I read the article so my memory is a little fuzzy but the quantity of water was massive. We have no clue how much more water may deep in the crust of the Earth.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Another possibility could be geologists are correct about pangea. Maybe Pangea is the Earth as Noah knew it. That would explain how he collected all the animals. The water from Noah's flood could still be in existence today in the form of existing oceans. "But that's not enough water to cover everything!" Correct. But what if God ripped pangea apart and in the process lowered the level of all the land at the same time as raining water down from the heavens? If he lowered the elevation of the land the seas could burst up from below and flood the land with existing water amounts on Earth. It says in the Bible that not only did it rain but the waters burst forth from the deep which sounds kinda like the land tumbling into the seas and Earth's plates ripping apart. Towards the end of the flood which the shift in the plates could have been completed and the pressure of the plates colliding could have driven the land back up again while at the same time water drained into the Earth's crust to lower ocean levels at the same time.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The only other two options I can think of would be that a lot of the water was lost into space through the ages or God just created it from scratch and made it disappear. I personally don't think it was these latter two. I'm not saying any of this is scientific proof. It is just a few ideas I am tossing out there to mull over.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

One other cool thing is the dimensions listed in the Bible of Noah's Ark are pretty darn close to the dimensions of a battleship. It's pretty darn cool if you study the engineering behind those dimensions because with advanced engineering it was determined that was one of the best and most stable ratios of dimensions a ship could be made in and they were determined thousands of years ago in the Bible.

[warri0r45]

 

In some cases, unfortunately.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Unfortunately? I don't really understand how that's unfortunate. Why would you want to argue with someone who believes in a Faith or a Religion, does it bother you?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It bothers me that some religous folk flat out deny science, evidence and logic. Even worse is if they try and prove thier supernatural mythical stories using science.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And ambassadar, although I realise you aren't pushing your points as an absolute proof or denial of modern mainstream scientific theories, here's a few things to ponder (this is going on the assumption whcih people make that the bible is the literal word of god. People who believe this usually [or have to] agree with the accound of Noah word for word).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1- The demensions of the ark (120m long, 20 wide or so? Can't remember) are such that twice every animal on the planet couldn't fit on it. Common sense. That's if you take the bible as literal fact, of course.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2- Freshwater lakes. :uhh: Why are there such things? Or did god take all of the salt out? :uhh:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

3- Not enough water on the planet. I haven't any facts here to refute your ideas of water underground, but again, this just seems like fundamentalists trying to grab onto anything they can to see thier beliefs hold water (no pun intended). Again, common sense.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't even really feel like digging up sources right now as the Ark theory holds virtually zero scientific weight and christians themselves continually assure that 'god did it' because it's just too mythical to assume otherwise.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Someone brought up a good point. Why don't people believe in santa claus? Is it because he dosen't promise an afterlife? The thing that scares me about religion is an apparant (yet no where near always true) aspect of selfishness. I believe religion x because I want to live forever in heavan. I think if you are a Christian and this is your motivation (I'm not suggesting this is the motivation for any christians here) then you have totally missed the point of Jesus' teachings and selfless nature.

[warri0r45]

 

Noah's ark? Wow this better be some cruel joke. It has never existed, wake up from your fantasy world.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Proof that it never existed?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Defender~

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Proof that I'm not god? Proof that there isn't a purple monkey in the middle of the sun? Proof that Santa isn't real? Proof that Cobain, Lennon, Dimebag, Hendrix and Hicks aren't still alive, living in my basement?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Chop chop defender, I want evidence that my beliefs aren't false.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You have failed miserably to see that the point of science is not to prove people's beliefs wrong or right. Evidence may suggest something, but true science isn't based on vested interests. The onus is on you, as your beliefs go against what the overwhelming majority of scientists know about the phisical nature of this planet and the impossibilities of the account of Noah. Think about this for a second. Just put your brain back in and think. If I say that there is a purple monkey at the middle of the sun and write a comprehensive literary religous article on it, do you think that gives me the right to just say to scientists 'prove it's not there.' NO.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Anyone remember my topic, the challenge? If you think that the flood actually happened, give it a go. Seriously, if you want your beliefs to have any academic weight, try it. There's a link near my sig.

[blue107]

Dude, why are people always worried about what I'M going to say? Just shut up and read. Who cares?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also, people who DON'T go "off on tangents" aren't very creative thinkers and are extremely boring people. Deal with it or just don't read it, but please, stop crying about it. It's annoying.

Because you think that if you believe something then that is fact. You never accept that you are wrong and never will

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Pretty much everyone knows this which is why people avoid talking to you, because they know that arguing with you is pointless

[Satenza]

Noahs Ark

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Against science, against rationality, against logic against everything we have to test whether something is true or not.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

For fairytales, for ignorance, for intolerance, for immoral acts that harm others(Genocide).

[Biabf]

I don't really see how it would be possible to cover the entire earth in water.

 

 

 

Correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't need enough water to fill 4,514,080,560 kmÃÆââ¬Å¡Ãâó (highest point x surface area) which is roughly 4,514,080,560,000,000,000,000 litres minimum, good luck explaining where than water came from.

 

 

 

NB: I know this figure could be very wrong dude to raises and dips in the earth's surface, just a guess?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't believe there is a Ark, even if there was. How would you go about proving it is THE Ark? You can't really do anything except carbon date it which wouldn't hate because around that time there were a lot of boats never mind the fact that wood normally decomposes way before 2000 years of being cut.

 

 

 

Please correct anything I got wrong.

[Death_By_Pod]

 

Noah's ark? Wow this better be some cruel joke. It has never existed, wake up from your fantasy world.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Proof that it never existed?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Defender~

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Bill: "I think that some people have psychic powers."

 

 

 

Jill: "What is your proof?"

 

 

 

Bill: "No one has been able to prove that people do not have psychic powers."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't think you get this 'burden of proof' concept.

[Tigra00]

 

Dude, why are people always worried about what I'M going to say? Just shut up and read. Who cares?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also, people who DON'T go "off on tangents" aren't very creative thinkers and are extremely boring people. Deal with it or just don't read it, but please, stop crying about it. It's annoying.

Because you think that if you believe something then that is fact. You never accept that you are wrong and never will

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Pretty much everyone knows this which is why people avoid talking to you, because they know that arguing with you is pointless

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Duh. Because I'm right. Why argue with someone when they're right? I've been wrong here before and I've admitted it and said "Whoops, my bad." It's no big deal.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What I AM NOT wrong about, however, is topics like this.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

First of all, Ye Holy Religious people who say I can't use science to disprove the Bible...Why can't I? You seem to LOVE to try to prove it with science. "Oh, there is evidence of a great flood on X part of land..." or "Oh, they recently found a large quantity of water under China..." So, you can use this to PROVE the Bible, but we can't use even MORE facts to disprove it? Whatever. Hypocrites.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here are some facts:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1) It would take over 4 or 5 times the amount of water in the oceans the flood the entire world above the highest mountain. This water IS NOT in the Earth. How do I know that? Because it just isn't possible. The Earth doesn't have enough volume to hold it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2) It is said in the Bible that the water was salty. It is also said that Noah didn't have to gather any fish, bugs, or birds, because they could swim/not drown/fly, repsectively. First off...All freshwater fishes/creatures would be dead today, but they're not. Most species of bugs CAN'T survive in water. Go ahead, drop a fly in some water once. It'll drown. Not good enough since he can fly? Okay, drop a beetle in. He'll drown too. And the birds could fly, so they didn't have to be aboard the boat either, aye? How about this - Birds can't fly for 40 days and 40 nights, and DEFINATELY not in a world-wide torrential down-pour. They have to land SOME TIME and they still have to eat. Obviously, the people who wrote the Bible were NOT scientists and were not aware of these facts.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

3) The atmosphere would crush your lungs and you'd drown in water vapor if the world was covered in water. I honestly don't think even god could stop that one...I mean, you're breathing in freakin' water vapor and there are tons of pressure in your lungs. God's a little busy, like...Making it rain and breaking the laws of physics to make matter (water) appear from thin-air.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But of course, you'll just say God made all of this possible. God created all the water, and then took it away, and he made all these creatures stay alive through his power. Whatever. How about this - None of it happened. Ever. Why is that that when science isn't on your side, it can't be used, but when it IS on your side, you hump it almost as much as the Bible? And take that lightly, because science is rarely on your side. Rarely as in, like...Never.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And defender, I don't hate religious people, I dislike religion and hate stupid people. Just because I told the truth and said Jesus is a rip-off of the Hindu religion (accepted as possibley the oldest religion EVER) and that Muhammed is a rip-off of Jesus, that means I hate religious people? Ooookay. It's the truth, dude. Noah's Ark is a rip-off of the Epic of Gilgamesh and the other stories like it, too. It's all just a bunch of recycled crap and you're all worshipping the same camp-fire stories with different ideals, thus hating eachother. You all claim to be the happiest people on Earth, too, which I find hilarious.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm probably much happier than you. I'm not worried about God being angry with me. If God existed and was angry with me, I'd give him the finger and tell him to send me off the Hell, then.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

...By the way, Hell is also a made-up concept. Doesn't exist.

[rodl]

Defender, your points are worthless. You are saying a single boat would hold 2 pairs of every creature on the planet earth? How strong should the boat be to withstand that amount of weight and how big is it supposed to be? Also about you never getting sick, I never get sick either, may be once in my childhood, yet I don't even believe in god you fool. You are saying things that are against logic, science and evidence. Oh wait, even common sense isn't on your side anymore.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Following your logic defender, I reckon I can teleport in space.

[Not]

This water IS NOT in the Earth. How do I know that? Because it just isn't possible. The Earth doesn't have enough volume to hold it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Well I'm convinced :uhh:

[assassin_696]

Defender, you poor deluded fool.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

To take a different view, even if the Noah's ark story was true (it isn't), the story is fundamentally about your God practicing ethnic cleansing. Discuss.

[warri0r45]

Defender, you poor deluded fool.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

To take a different view, even if the Noah's ark story was true (it isn't), the story is fundamentally about your God practicing ethnic cleansing. Discuss.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

God made a mistake. So he fixed it. Everyone was slaughtered because of the way they were made. Here's an interesting question, did the people who died in the flood (i.e. humanity) end up in hell? I sure hope not, because they died by gods hands and didn't have a chance to repent. If we truly have free will, I'd bet at least a few would have and thus were wrongly accused to eternity imprisonment when they should be free.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

#-o

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And I'm still waiting for proof that there isn't a purple monkey in the middle of the sun, defender.

[Abyssalwhip]

 

Defender, you poor deluded fool.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

To take a different view, even if the Noah's ark story was true (it isn't), the story is fundamentally about your God practicing ethnic cleansing. Discuss.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

God made a mistake. So he fixed it. Everyone was slaughtered because of the way they were made. Here's an interesting question, did the people who died in the flood (i.e. humanity) end up in hell? I sure hope not, because they died by gods hands and didn't have a chance to repent. If we truly have free will, I'd bet at least a few would have and thus were wrongly accused to eternity imprisonment when they should be free.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

#-o

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And I'm still waiting for proof that there isn't a purple monkey in the middle of the sun, defender.

God's biggest mistake... making humans.