Zepheras

First off, you're not supposed to be 'putting in effort' for scrolls. It's all meant to be random. If you're choosing to go against the idea of getting the scrolls randomly over a long period of time, and instead force yourself to kill tons of the same monster for the scrolls, I don't think you deserve a reward despite your 'determination', 'hard work', 'sweat and tears' whatsoever. The banner holder imp has already filled the slot of what you're asking for. So yes, Jagex has already rewarded you. It's SOMETHING. I completed the hobgoblin, and probably another challenge that I forgot. The former was while getting killcounts for Bandos. It didn't come across to me as hard work, I just got lucky, and it was a pleasant surprise.

Well, those who've been saying that the old graphics are better should be happy now. :rolleyes:

Build a bigger dungeon./ That's viable as a solution for the space constraint, but what about the choice of 'race'? What constitutes a race in RuneScape? Add every breed into the list of champions?

I wonder how Jagex decides which race gets to have a champion. There isn't one for ice warriors, other variety of ogres at least. And if EVERY single race gets a champion challenge of their own, I don't think the basement can actually fit all the banners.

I do too. I just spent 52m for 80-90 prayer, and any new prayer better be usable in PvP, or I will be mad. I mean, not only do people with high prayer spend tens or hundreds of millions, but prayer is already added onto our combat level. The herblore update was BS. Really, it is fairly useless in comparison to what it was useful for before the removal of its uses in PvP. Sure, it will slightly speed up slayer xp, but not much, unless you pot everytime it drops down to 118. Sure it helps in FFA, until you realize that most corpie teams who FFA won't let you join if you have a high herb level. Sure agility armor is nice, until you realize that below 0 KG, negative weight doesn't help run energy deplete slower. Really, when are you running long distances with a full invy of heavy items where you also don't need armor outside of agility armor? Now, if you could combine these with bandos or barrows, it would be very useful for places like duo SGWD and getting to DKS, but outside of those, it really has very few uses. It also isn't really worth the time spent getting, unless you want agility xp. The time spent getting the armor could very easily be recouped by resting and raising energy. Now, the rock cavern is the really only useful update, and the introduction of how that area was found stank. No real explanation, they just threw it out there with some half-assed little story about the dwarfs blah blah blah. The slayer update was decent, but a slap in the face for all the slayers who have waited YEARS for a new, high level slayer monster. (No, 78 isn't high.) Or at least another use for slayer points, or SOMETHING. Also, you should have AT LEAST be able to automatically KO gargs if you had hammer in invy. This is only slightly less work, very slightly less. And the number left in task saves all of what, 2 seconds a time? Geez Jagex. So no. Jagex has fixed a good number of problems, but they have also effed up too much of their new content for this year to have been even halfway great update wise. Supposedly, within a few weeks on RuneTek5, the game was supposed to be running smoother. I still have trouble getting things out of the bank if I click too fast, even if they are right in a row. Weapons are harder to switch, as is armor, which is a real problem at places like DKS or TDS. If those updates are as useless as you say, does that mean that Jagex shouldn't have implemented them at all? If everyone agrees that hgih level potions are useless without PVP, the level 78 slayer beast is one of the lousiest ever, the agility clothing have no use at all, the quests are crappy, should the game now REMOVE these updates from the game? Useless update should have no impact whatsoever if they disappear overnight right? Since no one would notice them. But no, they may be useless to you, but useful to other players. Agility robes definitely have some use for me, either as a skilling outfit for Pyramid Plunder, or farm rounds. What's the point of a new high level slayer beast, if Jagex is currently holding back from releasing any high level equipment, while trying to balance out magic and defence? Even if there's one, the probability of high level equipment is nearly zero. What do you mean about poorly introduced areas? GWD came out overnight with no proper introduction at all. Pretty much every area in the game just get added to the game "like that". And I'm against auto smashing gargoyles anyway. I like the idea of special techniques to kill slayer beasts, instead of considering the extra click as 'something I CBA to do because I just want to grind my slayer up".

Because things that got added were lame, not the excisting content. The core of the game stayed the same while most updates were dull, uncreative and useless. The upgrades are nice, but the added content will be forgotten after a week. And your definition of the 'core' of the game is?

The length of the recent quests were everything but long. WGS (although one of a kind) took me hours and hours to complete with a guide. Most of the quest that were released this year could be completed in 30-60 minutes without a guide. This ofcourse based on my own experiences. They also lacked bosses, which is a good way to end a quest. Also something that bugs me is that the official difficulty is based on the requirements (Within the Light was a Master quest) rather than the actual difficulty of the quest itself. This had nothing to do with this topic though. :P I'm still waiting for that one huge update that will hopefully make complainers like me shut up. C'mon JaGeX, don't you guys have something up your sleeve? 30-60 minutes of talking to NPCs, completing small tasks, reading the background storyline is decent for me. You can't expect a boss in the quest when it's not part of the story, nor can you ask for a longer questing time if there isn't a giant puzzle to solve. Almost every quest we have can be completed within an hour, just that I spend time reading every single dialogue, clicking on all the possible dialogue options and generally enjoy a part of a long story that has yet to be. Quests like sheep herder, Mourning Ends II, Underground Pass are your long quests, but they aren't that long in terms of storyline, instead you spend more or less 80% of the questing time doing a repetitive task. If players insist long quests all the time, we can always dump all the quest NPCs and items in the middle of Meiyerditch or an obscure room in the Temple of Light, but that defeats the purpose of the quests we had in RuneScape, which have storylines as the base for development.

...which had to be put in thanks to their asinine personal shops and the G.E.'s tight controls. ...which replaced the infinite shop stock. ...which replaced the limited shop stock prior to the removal of unbalanced trade, but bought up mostly by shop bots. All in all, still great. :smile:

Okay, first off, what exactly is "upgrayedd" supposed to mean? Besides being completely unpronouncable, it makes absolutely no sense. Upgrayedd = Upgrade :P Yes, we know. But we're still trying to figure out what it means. I've read through entire updates threads wondering if I was the only one scratching my head. :| And this. Oh, I can explain it. Upgrayedd is the name of a character from Idiocracy. Basically it's a movie about what would happen if everyone in the world devolved into morons over the next 500 years. And he spells it with two D's for the double dose of his pimp hand. :razz: Anyway, I started calling Upgrades, Upgrayedds because I found the whole idea of substituting large content for the upgrades rather stupid. I understand that upgrades are necessary to the game, but I think there have been too many in lieu of bigger updates, more in depth additions, etc. I also think that the new content has suffered in terms of length and playability because of the upgrades, can anyone say 2009 the year of the 20 minutes quests as well? Basically though after I post this I'll be ridiculed for my opinion because everyone here likes to mark out for the upgrades and put them over like they're the best things ever, when in many cases they're just fixes to problems created by Jagex in the first place, case in point, the 38 thousand PVP updates we've had this year this year. I don't rip on the other news stuff because that's what it is, other news. Small fixes. Those are usually fine, as are the patch notes. But when this kind of crap is pawned off on me as an update for the week, I get irritated. Also, I think that the upgrades should be made, but content shouldn't have suffered which I think it has. So when I see an upgrade that is crap, like this Champion's challenge and the Leprachaun champion, which doesn't even give you the music which is also dumb, so that the whole thing is completely idiotic I'll call it an Upgrayedd, because I think it's a stupid upgrade. News Flash: MHL likes to whine about updates, but we still love her. I only ever really complain about updates. You'll rarely hear me whine about anything else because I think the game itself is still very good. Also, I don't PVP so you never hear me say anything about that except for the constant attention they show for it instead of doing something useful, like giving depth to their updates. And I've complained this year because the updates sucked this year. Upgrades were fine, updates sucked. Even the Holiday events seemed phoned in this year. I mean give a replica item from an earlier holiday event i.e. rubber chicken and the carrot, and go back to the Reaper's house again, I mean why waste existing code when you can save time *and* give an unoriginal event? :lol: Yeah, other than that, I'm cool with Jagex, though I appreciate if they hit the tanning booth before they do their next video. Their paleness hurts my eyes. :x The deaths house was completely reworked, it's very different from 2 years ago and the spider realm was awesome, i still think you complain a whole too much tbh <_< Eureka, I get it! Ever since the days where BTS still existed, players complain on every single update, no less. But ironically, the game itself is still good! Therefore, More lackluster updates = More complaints = A better game! \:D/ \:D/ \:D/ \:D/ \:D/ Seriously, how can a game be still good if every update this year, as what you think, sucked, when I see no difference between them and those from the beginning of RuneScape 2 and BTS? :blink:

We got more bank space? :P I think its been a great year, but nothing has been able to top While Guthix Sleeps from last year in my opinion. That quest together with HD made last year one of the ones ive liked the most. Are you telling me that Runetek5 that let's me click on a vial in one tab and withdraws a death rune from something 3 tabs over, or simply doesn't withdraw it at all, isn't great? :shock: I love doing that. Nothing like having an outfit lined up nicely in one tab and clicking each item in order, only to have 3 runes, some random quest items and 2 of the items you actually wanted. Theres been some fixes which really have helps and others which are nice to have. However the bugs and issues RT5 created as well as more pressing older bugs still exist. 9/10 for improvements 4/10 for content 10/10 for changing there mind on an update every other day Its a good year just the focus seems to be anywhere and everywhere. I get that weird bank withdrawal thingy too, until I realised that it's better to click on the same spot at the first item you need, with the number of clicks based on how many items you're taking out. For those without placeholders anyway. \:D/ It's going to take some time before something can take over WGS + HD, at least I haven't seen any update this year. It's comparable to the changeover from RS Classic to RS 2, so I don't really compare this year's update to those and then conclude than 2009 is a bad year. I guess updates just come and go, there isn't exactly a very exciting update in RuneScape, since they trickle into the game in small packages and at pretty regular intervals. Lots of goals for me when I go back to member; high level herblore, agility, mining, the new ardougne diary all the way to elite, get myself a D pick, ten ravens, hopefully hunt my own amulet of ranging... The quests this years are definitely better than quite a lot in the past though, both in terms of graphics, storyline and length. The only long quests I had in the past were those that makes you travel here and there to obscure locations, talk to obscure NPC for a part of an item, or puzzles with high failure rates. I spent more time travelling around than reading storylines.

So, what was the last decent quest you saw? Which of the old updates were considered big for you?

You'll be surprised then, that some of the minor updates will affect your gameplay whether you like it or not, such as the removal of the follower restriction on travelling, so you won't be just 'using' a single update. The patch notes way outshine the main update this time, and I feel that the Champions' Challenge can do more than just a few additions to the champion list. In terms of difficulty the higher levels one don't seem to fit the title of 'champion'....even some of the bosses you find in quests takes a little more challenge, like food or prayer potions. Although the not-so-little fixes here and there definitely made by day, and improved the gameplay on the whole. I don't know if it's just me, but a few Tip.Iters seem to take pride in putting down updates, siding with the negative arguments during any debate in the General Chat, way too often for me not to recognise their signature and avatars. Are you trying to clock some forum post count or something? What are you talking about? Where did I say I hated all the other updates? Its was my opinion on which updates i found useful, as this after all is a discussion topic. Sure i will come across the others at some point but that's the same for every update. Ah apologies, the last part was meant to be a sidenote, which in particular, is not related to you. I just find it funny that you said you'll be using 'one' update when there's at least a bunch in the patch notes that you'll inevitably be enjoying.

You'll be surprised then, that some of the minor updates will affect your gameplay whether you like it or not, such as the removal of the follower restriction on travelling, so you won't be just 'using' a single update. The patch notes way outshine the main update this time, and I feel that the Champions' Challenge can do more than just a few additions to the champion list. In terms of difficulty the higher levels one don't seem to fit the title of 'champion'....even some of the bosses you find in quests takes a little more challenge, like food or prayer potions. Although the not-so-little fixes here and there definitely made my day, and improved the gameplay on the whole. I don't know if it's just me, but a few Tip.Iters seem to take pride in putting down updates, siding with the negative arguments during any debate in the General Chat, way too often for me not to recognise their signature and avatars. Are you trying to clock some forum post count or something?

When you say 'many', you're actually talking about rares, and a few items that are in the midst of being massively merchanted or dumped. That accounts for less than 1% of all the items being traded in the GE everyday. Perhaps you place importance on these few highly priced items, but I'm looking at the efficiency of the GE as a whole in getting me most of the commodities I need or to sell my unwanted items regardless of quantity. When you talk about the flaw of GE to update prices fast enough, that isn't just a flaw in GE, but players and the items themselves. By normal supply and demand standard, I don't think any items can rise by 100-200% overnight, except game updates that will clearly increase the demand of a training commodity (High level prayer, for example). However when it comes to rares and merchanted items, players either want to sell for SO MUCH higher, or dump at SO MUCH lower, such that either extremities doesn't fit into the price range on GE. Artificial supply and demand by hoarding and dumping, will always be an issue. However, GE prevents massive jumps in pricing to a certain extent, and players bypass it using junk trade. I don't need to be a PKer to be aware of the impact that PKing in its current state has. In fact, some PKers don't know how the drop system has affected the economy. I won't talk about whether the new PVP system is better or worse than the old wilderness system though, since it's not relevant to the topics of this thread. Then this makes the point of the thread relevant isn't it? Majority of the players do not make use of all of Jagex's implementations to have fun, and as such your opinion of whether one update was good or bad is biased. I see the implementation of GE, removal of extreme potions from PVP, and the changes to 76k as good updates. You may disagree. But at the end of the day Jagex implements updates based on a variety of factors, for which you should try to understand before judging if it's a good or bad update based on your own preference. 1. I don't see how designating a trade location is a 'restriction'. I do see wasting time spamming in Falador as a 'restriction' to my gameplay hours, though. 2. Unfortunate, it is.

I don't see how having those 5 characteristics put you in a better position to judge updates. Myself going from pre-RWT fix to post-RWT fix feel that the Grand Exchange ended the days where I have to waste 30 minutes to an hour spamming in Varrock W2 just to sell some herbs and runes. Granted it's not perfect, but neither was the old market system. Merchants manipulate the prices as well, while certain items weren't able to circulate in the market fully because it's too difficult to sell items in small quantities. When do you need to junk trade? If you're merchanting. I don't participate in that. The last one is ironic. It seems that you're the one who doesn't rely on all of Jagex's implementation to have fun, instead going sour over how they removed PK (the new system gives better drop, actually) and free trade, remove PK and free trade, remove PK and free trade, remove PK and free trade, then conclude that Jagex is a money grubber.

So...how many times have you failed?

They probably have similar feelings towards your opinion. You should never equate your own opinion as special or valuable. Probability states that it is unlikely that it is. This is a general comment. It can be applied to everybody. You must realize that there must be many people around who get tired of people who keep stating the opinion that the system is flawed You are your friends didn't encounter an unfair way or a flaw. The system is the same for everybody and is therefore per definition not unfair. The system is also designed as it is, so that eliminates the existence of some flaw. The whole game is like this really. Did you ever get a dragon shield half drop? I didn't. Highly unfair wouldn't you say? A visage drop? I haven't had one with 99 slayer. Also unfair? No, not really. The drops are based on a system that is the same for everybody. It is just that the outcome is semi-random. It is designed like that. It is also not a flaw. The whole of runescape is made in the way you find unfair. The real problem here is that I think you confuse your opinion with fact. The system isn't flawed and it isn't unfair. The system feels flawed to you. It feels unfair to you. But both statements aren't the same. And your opinion falls in the category of 'feeling' and not 'being' unfair. The system is flawed in the sense that it keeps item based on high-alchemy wealth, which is not a true representation of how valuable the items are to the player. A system that applies to everyone will be fair, but that doesn't mean that it's not flawed. Does the Defence stats apply similarly to all players? Yes. Does that mean that the Defence system isn't flawed? No, otherwise how did players take advantage of it and create unbalanced pure characters? The fact that the same barrow item piece gets removed from the game every time you die means that out of the four pieces, there's always a specific one that has a lesser quantity to circulate in the market. Look at sets with good effects like guthan and verac. Guthans warpsears and veracs helms are always lost during death, keeping the price of these item high up. Had the system base it on your choice of items, or GE price, the price of the 4 items would have been more even, meaning that you don't have 'lousy' barrows trips when you keep getting the other 3 items that are always low in price. Of course, the upside to this is that those same old items are always high in demand, making boss trips and slayer more profitable. This is the only reason for the system to exist, since Jagex has the intention of making sure you lose certain slayer/boss item when you die. They assigned low alchemy price to items that has to be kept in demand to prevent boss hunting and slayer monsters from becoming obsolete, rather than those risk VS reward argument, which doesn't even apply to metals from bronze to dragon equipment.

I agree and like that. But really unless we always click "Items kept on death" everytime we pick up a drop then we will have unfair times where we loose items we weren't supposed to loose. Seriously i am all for losing items on death but it's really unfair that even when my friend planned his equipment he lost his Armadyl chest (When planned he would keep it) because of a Rune platebody which he and i did not know would protect over Armadyl. Bad thing is...it was his second time losing Armadyl items at Bandos. But last time has nothing to do with this topic, just saying. EDIT: Just imagine this situation You plan your equipment after 10 minutes, and your satisfied. You have used cheap items so that you get to use Armadyl plate because it is good to use for ranging and you will keep it with the equipment you have fixed. Then you go to Bandos. You realize that dieing can happen as it's your first time to solo. So you go knowing you can die, but what you know is you will keep your Armadyl plate so your releived. Even though you will loose over 600K+ if you die it's okey if you keep your valued items. So you kill boss, and you are caught off guard when he respawns again. You think "Darn i died" when you get hit 54, but you also accept it. But then your surprised and shocked, Rune platebody (50K) is kept over Armadyl plate (20M). That's exactly what happened to my friend and it's really unfair. Unfair Maybe. I dont mean to flame or rant, but it is his fault for not doing the research on the value of his Armadyl Plate beforehand. There are many websites, ie. Tipit, that show you the alch value price of the item. You can even offer the price in a general store to see the low alch price (wildy gen store for high alch price). When he picked up the rune platebody he should have known that the value of the rune plate was more to begin with. Him not knowing that is a fault of him not doing his research. Sorry but its just that simple. Thats HIS fault for assuming just because something is valuable to players that its valuable to the game. He could of had many other options to not lose the Arma. Imp Boxes, High alching the plate, putting the plate in a famliar. All of these options would have saved his Armadyl. But he didnt think, he just assumed someone else was right and went with it, and thats his fault. He learned his lesson and so did you. The system is not flawed at all, its just your lack of desire to understand and research the system before you take part in it. Dont just say this protects over this. You need to KNOW what the alch values are for items. Not necessarly down to the GP, but a general idea of what is more valauble to the game. If you get an item you know is high in alch value, you need to understand what your risking to the game has changed. I know the arma plate alchs for around 30k. If I get a drop that I know is around that price, Im either going to bank it somehow, or alch it. Look at boss tables before hand. See what items you KNOW are more alch value that the items are risking. This is so you know what to pick up and what not to. Its not hard, it takes 5 minutes to do. You didn't do that and you payed the price for it. Definitely flawed. You are getting penalised the moment you keep the reward of killing a boss in your possession. I know a rune platebody protects over a bunch of things, so I should never pick one up, because I'm taking a risk for keeping my reward? Can someone explain what is the point of the "items on death system"? You have no say in what to keep. The system keep based on nothing close to how valuable they are in the market. You slam your head against the keyboard when you see 3 rune platebody instead of your armadyl set. Like I've mentioned just now, it's just to rub salt in your wounds after you died, even worst than losing everything on death. In fact, it's better to just lose everything on death, instead of having a dilemma over what to bring, what to pick up, when to pick up.

That's not true at all. Like said a few posts up, The reason some armor items are so expensive is because things protect over them. Barrows helms are so expensive because you lose them. Making it so you keep the helm instead of other peices only means the helm would fall price, and the peice lost would rise. Lets say the Helm fell in price, and the Legs rose. The legs would then keep over the helm, so helms would go up and keep over the legs ect. ect. It would be a never ending cycle. In the long run it wouldn't make things cheaper, it would just make them all equally expensive. As for the cost system, in all honesty is a simple Risk vs Reward system. If you want better preformance you might be having to risk some items in order to get that preformance. Theres plenty of alternate options for equipment without large sacrafice in stats. Example: Rune Gloves vs Barrows Gloves. Whats worth more to you, -3 in stats, or -15m in items? I think you need to re-read my sentence. EDIT: Nevermind, somehow I don't see the link between your post and mine. What's with the never-ending cycle of price change? What's with the risk VS reward? :shock: :shock: You're saying that you prefer to always lose the same item out of the 4 barrows item in each set, so that the other 3 are kept low in price, while one item is forever kept high just because the death system removes this specific item every single time? I'm referring to sets that has useful set effect such that you always want to wear the whole thing. Next, you're saying that the better the item (hence the higher the price), the more you should lose it when you die, because you chose to use it? So, what was the point of keeping the 3 'most valuable' items when you die, to mock yourself on how you lost a armadyl plate instead of a rune plate that you picked up as a drop? My original post was about keeping items based on GE price, so that less people loses their claws and whips, demands drop, and price falls a little.

I would prefer more game content. Never used the customer support (if any), ever.

So, aside from having a decent gravestone, "a friend" is the new must to survive death? Anyway, this topic isn't even about how you can prevent item loss from death, but rather the selection of three items you keep, should you for some reason cannot get to your grave in time. So it's like, if you get your fury back in time, great. If not, why should you lose your fury instead of your barrows when it's clearly not the 'most valuable' by player standard?

Exactly. As I said before, whether a game is good or not, it is all subjective. Gosh, I wish these kind of flame wars stop coming up in these topics... And since all the candidates of this competition knows that quantity counts for a win, a few MMORPGs including RuneScape are in the best position to win. Considering this, if RuneScape or any other MMORPG didn't win, then they must suck really, REALY BAD to lose to those console games right? We can then start a discussion on whether it's still worth the time and money to play this game that you've already spent a good few months, or even years on. There must be some redeeming factors of RuneScape that encourages players to even bother clicking the mouse to vote once or many many times.

Perhaps RuneScape isn't better than those games on Xbox and PS3, though I'm wondering why Blizzard didn't win the award, since both are on comparable terms. Having Jagex win the award gives me the satisfaction that I'm paying less for a better game. :thumbsup: You're paying less for a game that got more votes. It's not a better game in the slightest, WoW > Runescape. However, WoW requires so much time, makes you log on at certain times to raid, makes you concentrate the entire time you're playing. Runescape is chilled, afkable, satisfying and lets you play in your own time for however long you like. For this fact I'd give em a vote for creating an awesome game, and can understand why they got the votes. Then perhaps WOW isn't that great of a game then? Everyone's definition of good and bad games differs from each other. To me, the "chilled, afkable, satisfying and lets you play in your own time for however long you like" deserves a win more than a game that can seriously hinder my personal life.

Not really, events such as connection loss and momentary lag are not part of the in-game lessons that you can learn about. What do you propose, get a better connection before you start playing? Forever go on boss trips in welfare gear? The idea of keeping items on death gives the impression of protecting three most valuable item, yet it is decided by the game, which is like an oxymoron. I may want to protect some low value item for sentimental sake, or actual high end items to minimise my wealth, but in either case I can't. In fact, they're better off making you lose all your items, instead of this contradicting system.

Perhaps RuneScape isn't better than those games on Xbox and PS3, though I'm wondering why Blizzard didn't win the award, since both are on comparable terms. Having Jagex win the award gives me the satisfaction that I'm paying less for a better game. :thumbsup: