Yoko Kurama

So like 2 items created every drop then? Say 1 that goes onto g.e., and the 2nd thats broken completely into shards and divided? That could work but for most of these items I don't think they want to double the number created. Well if the only thing an item drops is shards, it will cause a shortage of items in the market (most people might want to hold onto their shards), and that might keep prices up. It can't create a shortage. There will be the exact same rate of the item coming in to the game as before the only difference is some will exist as shards to begin with instead of the item, but as each shard will be valued at 1/120th of the total item value you can simply buy shards if the item itself won't buy. I don't agree that most people would want to hold on to their shards either most people doing pvm are in it for the profits from these drops, holding on to the shards isn't profitable for them. The idea of having the shards and one go to the ge is just awful it would cause deflation yes but it'd utterly crash the value of every single drop far beyond what could even be considered a fair or balanced value. It would only at most make each drop twice as common. For things like Seismic, that would be a much welcome thing that it wouldn't be negative at all. For Drygores/Nex, they're already so low that I don't imagine them crashing much more. So I doubt it would crash everything. As for whether the rate with shards as the same as now, not quite. Because an item distributed with into shards only has the same rate as now if the shards are being sold fairly often...

So like 2 items created every drop then? Say 1 that goes onto g.e., and the 2nd thats broken completely into shards and divided? That could work but for most of these items I don't think they want to double the number created. Well if the only thing an item drops is shards, it will cause a shortage of items in the market (most people might want to hold onto their shards), and that might keep prices up.

I think it might be a good idea for Jagex to make the items separate from the shards. So the team gets shards, and the item goes on GE. This would make for some KILLER deflation.

We can sell the shards? Then I retract my previous statement. I didn't catch that from the video, but if we can, then this is great. Does this also mean 100% deflation? If the object goes on GE (after players get the Shards), then whoever buys the object, their cash will entirely be taken out of the economy, right?

Statement retracted. If I can sell shards, then this is great!

Dry for 8 hours? Isn't Malevolent energy easily millions per piece? :P Well, money wise, I don't think they much care. They're some of the most loaded people in RS. ;) They are in it for the enjoyment/drops, it seems. And they seem awfully dedicated; it must be disappointing to spend all your waking hours on this and only get 2 of the Mage shields.

iTrolledU's stream has been on for 20+ hours now at barrows -- and he's obviously got one of the best teams out there (all Comp/Trimmed Comp Capes + best-in-slot gear and plenty of PvM experience), so they have a very high success rate. They have only gotten two Mage shields so far. One almost feels sorry for them; been dry for 8 hours or something. :wacko:

A lot of things have simply been pushed back to next year. So don't get your hopes up too much. World Event is the only thing that comes to mind for December 2013.

I am watching the Fumbra video, and it seems that Portents of Restoration might actually have some use.

It was killed by an elite team of people with the best stats and best-in-slot gear in the game -- and they probably went to Runefest (so they had an advantage) as well. And Mod Chris was either on their team in his alt or was at least in the FC with them. Far from a piece of cake. It's fine, I'm better than Fumbra so it can't be too hard. Yeah, that totally addresses the points I brought up, and means "it can't be too hard". You know you should really try some breathing exercises. Being mad over everything is bad for your health. Moving on, what did the shield sell for Ambler, or has that not been confirmed? I am perfectly calm and not angry. You're the one here trying to troll and trying to get a rise out of me with your flippant comments. It won't work. You're obviously upset over the last thread, still. Yoko please. Again, Ambler has the shield been sold yet? Please yourself. You're the one who came into this thread and accused me "of being mad" from the start. So take your nonsense elsewhere. I hope a Moderator can clean off the off-topic comments. This will be my last comment on your trolling.

It was killed by an elite team of people with the best stats and best-in-slot gear in the game -- and they probably went to Runefest (so they had an advantage) as well. And Mod Chris was either on their team in his alt or was at least in the FC with them. Far from a piece of cake. It's fine, I'm better than Fumbra so it can't be too hard. Yeah, that totally addresses the points I brought up, and means "it can't be too hard". You know you should really try some breathing exercises. Being mad over everything is bad for your health. Moving on, what did the shield sell for Ambler, or has that not been confirmed? I am perfectly calm and not angry. You're the one here trying to troll and trying to get a rise out of me with your flippant comments. It won't work. You're obviously upset over the last thread, still. Troll harder, please.

People love assuming just because you did something you must have insider info and everything is instaeasy because you have good armor. There is no conspiratorial assumption. We know that a lot of high level people went to Runefest, that the barrows update was sneak-previewed there, and that those who went there had an advantage. Even Ambler admitted this several times (that on his/her team at least he/she did and that it provided her/him with an advantage). Where's the so-called unreasonable assumption?

It was killed by an elite team of people with the best stats and best-in-slot gear in the game -- and they probably went to Runefest (so they had an advantage) as well. And Mod Chris was either on their team in his alt or was at least in the FC with them. Far from a piece of cake. It's fine, I'm better than Fumbra so it can't be too hard. Yeah, that totally addresses the points I brought up, and means "it can't be too hard".

It was killed by an elite team of people with the best stats and best-in-slot gear in the game -- and they probably went to Runefest (so they had an advantage) as well. And Mod Chris was either on their team in his alt or was at least in the FC with them. Far from a piece of cake.

I understand that the energies won't be 7M forever, but at the moment, this makes each pet 3.5 Billion GP, and the armour about 600M. LOL.

How does your point stand when you given bonds hardly any time to settle? They were released late September. It's more than fair to say they've had some success in doing what they're supposed to already. You can refute the claims made by their success if you wish, that's your choice. In my opinion you need to give these things time over a longer period. Sorry, my staking point was not clear. Staking is supposed to be a fun activity. It gets abused so that should be looked at more closely, perhaps instead of GP they should let players compete for certain items, randomly by the game or yes, even capping it. Introducing casinos brings in a more serious element of gambling to the game that we don't need. Then we simply disagree on that point. They have been given a fair amount of time (even Jagex thinks so), and even if they haven't we can still make certain predictions on their future performance based on how they have performed so far and their design. As for the second point. That is not really accurate either. Staking isn't abused. It was always intended to allow this sort of gambling, and it has been allowed to function this way since Runescape Classic (except for the period of no Free trade). If Jagex didn't intend for gambling, don't you think they would have done something about it? They have done nothing, and hinted at nothing. They are perfectly fine with staking being used for high stakes gambling. They have been even spoken approvingly of it at times as an appropriate 'high risk, high reward' activity. They have never attempted to restrict or control it any way whatsoever, except for the removal of Free Trade (because of RWT issues, not gambling issues). It's fairly reasonable to say that they approve of it.

Nobody is disputing his intentions and his possible outcomes. To make the claim of stopping RWT before bonds have been given a chance to do that, without considering the costs involved to the game, begs the question that if someone is so sure then why are you so sure? Staking exists yes and it exists in the 'fun' sense. So does the squeal. Casinos? Whatever. <_< Bonds have been here for a quite a while. And Jagex has made EXTREMELY high and self-congratulatory claims about how they have changed this and that about the game -- many of the claims that Jagex has made are outlandish and possibly false. So challenging their claims, and evaluating the success of bonds (especially when Jagex has implied they are a success) is more than fair game at this point. So your criticism on that point simply doesn't stand. Staking does not just exist in the fun sense. People stake for millions, hundreds of millions, and billions of GP. That's not just 'fun' staking, that's on the same level as a casino, with much better odds. Surely you're aware of this?

I don't see why all the hate on TS. His so-called references to his articles are completely legitimate. Self-referencing yourself is a perfectly good thing to do, and academics and more serious forums do it all the time. It saves the time of having to rewrite the same stuff over and over again. Instead you post it once, and then you link to it when appropriate. It's not like he's just leaving links, he's discussing things as well, and putting links when appropriate. Again, I don't see why all the hate. There's a hot topic that he's written on that's been discussed heavily for the last few weeks, and so he links to himself when it comes up. Seems alright to me. He's on the main page of this site, I very much doubt he's desperate for attention. Do you have some sort of inside information that no-one else knows about or something? You're almost betting your house that you have solved all these problems in your article and that it will definately work. Suppose it does - What cost? Gambling, playing the game for real money which is defninately not what the game is about and goldfarmers turning to offering skilling on user accounts as what happened during trade restrictions. It will just swap one set of problems for another. You don't need inside information for the sorts of claims that TS is making. He's making some fairly simple and straightforward economic claims that are easily verifiable. I don't see why you think he's posturing as some sort of guy with 'insider knowledge' -- he isn't, because he doesn't need to. As for your reference to gambling. You may not have noticed, but staking already exists, and has existed for the vast majority of Runescape's existence, and it is unequivocally gambling. If we are going to have gambling (I don't think we should, but we have already decided we are going to have it), then it's much better to regulate it through official mechanisms. As for goldfarmers, they're also already here, and have always been here.

Just ignore the last few pages of posts then. No they don't. Corp is weak to spears and always has been...?? Nex does not need spirit shields. You can do it in T70 comfortably. The only people using shields at Nex should be the tanks, for which Chaotics are a far better (and attainable) option. They don't anymore, that's true. However when Nex was released and pre-EoC, spirit shields (Ely and Divine certainly) were elite, very useful, and very expensive hard-to-get items that all the elite teams demanded you have. They remained unobtainable and inacessible to the majority of the target demographic for years and really only crashed because of EoC.

If people actually bothered to read all of my points instead of seeing one and then focusing it, you would see that I have said the problem is with teams and LS/CS. We have not only read your post, but also acknowledged it, and replied to that particular point. Perhaps you are the one that hasn't read everything. Particular Sly's post (as well as mine) where we discuss that point. LS/CS IS a problem. It is however not the only problem. It's hard enough getting a decent, dedicated and competent team, but that fact that kills take so darn long, that you can't rejoin the kill upon death, that normal drops are far worse than Nex and you need a lot more people and the potluck version of the drop means that you could spend days or weeks there without much luck. A lot of people just don't have that kind of time for one activity in RS. Even when or if CS gets fixed, there will still be a lot of people who won't bother with it for those reasons, and the price will likely still be quite high. Even when CS gets fixed, it's quite clear that the effort needed to obtain Seismic Wands/Orbs is disproportionately higher than the effort needed to obtain Drygores or Ascensions. That's something you haven't been quite able to acknowledge, and it's definitely related to the dis-balance of T90 gear prices/accessibility. I never said it was uber hard. I have done several Vorago kills in teams myself. I am simply saying the level of difficulty is incongruent with the drop rate and THAT is what results in such a high price tag.

You're not gonna want to hear this but reading this paragraph actually made me appreciate the community a bit more. I like the way you put it and I think it belongs that way for the overall good of the game. Keep in mind that it's impossible to completely (or near-completely) eliminate tragedies such as this; especially without also near-completely eliminating the players' freedoms. I disagree. There are dozens of ways or dealing with these problems without getting rid of Free Trade, or getting rid of 'freedoms'. It's just that historically Jagex has been very careless with this. We don't need to accept the careless disregard of the libertarian mindset. It's not an either or situation. We can have a game where people are safe, and it's fun, and we aren't all callous Darwinists.

Except that Vorago takes 4x as long to kill as Nex does. Thus, drops may as well be 4x rarer. Yet there can be multiple fights of vorago on 1 world. But are there usually that many per world? I admit I don't really know but if few are going to vorago then it doesn't really matter how many can. And the reason why people aren't going to vorago is the LS/CS system. If/when this gets sorted, a lot more people will go to vorago. This is only partly true. There are plenty of people already at Vorago. Not as many as there could be, but plenty still. The ones that are there do LS+S or FFA+S or just LS or FFA. LS and FFA have always had players who would use them. If the CS/LS system was fixed, I am sure more players would go there, but that isn't to say that the place is entirely deserted at the moment. Furthermore, the ONLY problem is NOT the LS/CS system as far as the price of the wands/orbs go. A lot of it does have to do with the effort involved, the difficulty of the fight, and the mechanics. Those directly influence the supply of the items, and their price as well. Particularly in today's experience-crazy culture (where, as opposed to the past where high level players were balanced players who tried everything, they are mostly skillers), a lot of high level players won't bother going because of the effort involved, and would much rather chase 200M's. The Vorago mechanics are rather annoying -- it has extremely high KO ability an yet if you die you can't rejoin the fight... You overstate the problematic nature of the LS/CS system with regards to pricing. YES, it is a problem, but it isn't the only problem. Jagex has always had a fetish with luckscape and grinding and all with regards to bosses where you sometimes get ridiculous situations where you kill a boss hundreds of times and still don't get a good drop. Now that they are actually designing more and more complex, elite, top-level, and difficult bosses, their fetish with the drop mechanism is meshing with the difficulty of the bosses and making truly expensive gear. In the past, items were usually only super expensive for the first few days (for example, the first Drygore weapon sold for max cash instantly), but they would crash very soon as supply increased even a little bit because the bosses were reasonably designed. Now that bosses actually are super difficult, and we still have the ridiculous luckscape drop mechanisms the prices aren't budging as much. It's a combination of these two things that's a problem. It could easily be resolved by increasing the drop-rates, or a new drop-rate mechanism that isn't solely based on chance, or even distributing the avenues of high level gear (through methods such as skilling), all of those would keep prices very reasonable. In the past, bosses were relatively easy. So it made sense to give them drops through a luckscape mechanism. Because people could easily camp them for ages. I remember going through hundreds of kill that were dry at God Wars. Since the bosses weren't that hard, any competent teams could be there forever -- the mechanic of purely luck-based drops made sense (though it wasn't my preference). Now that bosses are genuinely difficult, can't be camped the same way as they could be in the past where with one inventory of food/supplies you could camp for hours or days -- it makes no sense to still have purely luck-based drops. In other words, do one or the other. Make luckbased drops with weak/manageable bosses, or make hard bosses and give them MUCH more generous drop rates. Combining the two just doesn't work. It messes prices, discourages people and has a lot of other nasty side effects.

Ask him if he can miss 1b so I can get this title =C I asked, he said earn it. Become a gambler like me and/or be ridiculously lucky. Fixed. So having money now means you are a gambler or lucky, so I couldn't have earned the vast majority of my wealth by other methods? Kiln was easy money, no luck just skill. Nex we had lower than average drop rate slightly but we just kept at it, so slightly unlucky with that. Flipping items, knowledge on which items were good to flip at the time, no luck or gambling. Frost dragons, of course, need to be extremely lucky to get those frost dragon bones! Selling floors in DG, required huge luck to be able to do 15-20 min floors regularly, everyone knows it. So can you actually point out, from those methods that I used to gain money, where I gambled and/or got extremely lucky? On topic: Won't be a good first few tries at Barrows, I imagine a video or two will be up quite fast showing the different attacks so it shouldn't be too hard from then to have a good chance at it. Only problem I see is the team, having the people on and available to do it. It was a remark made in jest (as yours was), but if you do want to take it seriously, then sure, we can do that too. The answer to your question is an unequivocal yes. I didn't say that obtaining money can only be done through chance or knowledge-less activities. No. But to get a LOT of money in RS, that's generally how it's done. Having money doesn't mean you got it all from luck or staking, but having 10 BILLION (that's how much the person who we are discussing has) does mean that you got a significant portion of it from gambling (staking/flower game/dicing), or being lucky (sniping a boss drop). If you have several stacks of max cash, there is a very high probability that you got it from the methods I described. That's the only way to make that sort of cash on RS. That statement isn't unreasonable, it's quite fair.

I agree completely, but making them with the same resource as the armor is a bit of an odd choice, to say the least. I think the reason is fairly obvious. They weren't content with the the degrade-to-dust melee armour probably being a few hundred mil; so they went out of their to decrease the supply of the resources that make the armour (malovent energy) so that the armour could be several hundred million for as long as possible. All the super-wealthy people will go out of their way to gather this new status symbol (the pets, that's what they are -- they're not just as a nice 'fun and cool' thing, they're a status symbol), and probably get their hands on all the energies they need for this. It's not a real update unless everything costs hundreds of millions of GP or billions. I guess they can rest assured that all the things from this update, the shields, the pets, and the armour will probably hit that mark. Mission accomplished, for Jagex. Ask him if he can miss 1b so I can get this title =C I asked, he said earn it. Become a gambler like me and/or be ridiculously lucky. Fixed.

I understand that you have clarified that the lure isn't important itself, but I and others would appreciate it if you could post the video or give details. Not because we want to lure people ourselves, but rather so that we can avoid it. You seem like a veteran player, and if it got you, I'd assume it's pretty sophisticated and dangerous. It would be a good public service announcement. As for the article, I am sorry to hear what has happened to you, and I am largely sympathetic to your post.