magzar

i think you gonna need help grammar And so do you. OT: I personally love the Achievement Diaries. I like completing the tasks, for it are things you won't do that often when you're higher level, especially the things from the Lumby Diary and the Easy/Medium tasks. Also it makes you do a lot of different things, from cutting a tree to making a fire with a familiar. I have completed all of the Diaries, except for the new Seers' one, but I've only got 4 Medium tasks left to do, so I'll have that one completed soon. That "sentence" was typed the way it was as a joke, and one you obviously didn't get. Also there are at least three grammatical errors in your post, not counting misused punctuation. OT: I think Ardougne is probably a more likely next release than the Gnome Stronghold area. To be honest, there really isn't that much to do in either of these places. So I think it will be interesting to see how they work this out. As for as arrows go, I think they may come out with a visible quiver to take that position, although how this would clash with the accumulator does pose an issue.

Guthix is awake now. no he isn't i just did wgs last night and i can assure you guthix did not wake up however i speculate in the continuance of that quest line that he will So Jagex put him back to sleep? Or what? what are you talking about? Guthix doesn't wake up in WGS

i think you gonna need help grammar

They should have been smart about it. Ie, when you complete the easy tasks you get the headband. When you complete the medium tasks you get a Medium Helmet. And when you complete the hard tasks you would get a Full Helmet. I would have preferred headband -> circlet -> coronet/crown which would have made sense considering that camelot is right there and King arthur could have been the person to give you your final reward. I think the huge amount of dissatisfaction with the fact that the headband never changes may be enough to convince Jagex to change that.

Yeh I think so, but personally, I would both buy and sell on the GE rather than junk trading, unless i absolutely have to get rid of a ton of junk. Generally when I train skills that produce a lot of junk, I do it incrementally and liquidate it through general stores as I go though. In loo of that, I find ways of training those skills that produce items I can actually sell, even if they're slower experience.

You should update this, i recently did some calculations of my own which show ranarr being more profitable that snapdragon up to a higher average than 7.5 herbs

ok well the BARE MINIMUM xp for the quest cape is 8,253,001 without factoring in hp since no quests have an hp requirement Anyone who has the quest cape can tell you, however, that with the bare minimum, you are not getting your quest cape The additional training and money required to get everything needed for these quests will easily push you above that 13m exp mark. I see the quest cape as a much greater achievement than most skill capes due to the fact that it requires you to train all your skills rather than just that one skill continuously. On top of that, the quest cape has much more challenging requirements than skill capes. Fight the barrellchest, or the giant at the top of the magical beanstalk, or any other quest bosses at minimum levels and see how long you live. Now take skillcapes Agility: run around in circles over and over and over until you get 99, time consuming and boring, but there's no challenge Attack: kill absolutely anything until you hit 99(yes you could even kill level 1 rats if you wanted to) challenge? Construction: get a truckload of money and waste it putting up a house, no challenge involved, just money Cooking: get food, click food, click fire, repeat Crafting: same concept as cooking Defence: same concept as attack Farming: get seeds, plant seeds, take a nap, pick plants, repeat Firemaking: get logs click logs click tinderbox repeat Fishing: get fishing equipment, click fishing spot, wait Fletching: get logs, get knife, click logs, click knife click product, repeat Herblore: get vials of water, get herbs, get secondary ingredients, mix them together, repeat Hunter: set trap, wait for trap to catch something, clear trap, repeat Hitpoints: see attack and defense Magic: get runes, get items, cast alchemy over and over and over, repeat Mining: get pickaxe, click rock, repeat Prayer: get bones, bury bones, repeat Ranged: get bow, get arrows, click monster, repeat Runecrafting: get runes, get talisman, run to altar, click altar, repeat Slayer: get task, kill monster, repeat (untrimmed slayer cape is one cape i really really respect and want though) Smithing: get ore, smelt into bars, get hammer, use bar with anvil, repeat Strength: see attack, defense, and HP Summoning: get pouches, get shards, get charms(this part is a [bleep] addmittedly and requires also training combat), get secondary ingredient, click obelisk, repeat Thieving: click people, repeat Woodcutting: get axe, click tree, wait none of these require any actual skill to accomplish, as they can all conceivably be done using beginner methods if someone had the desire to. Then, once you have the cape it's yours forever, you never have to touch that skill again if you don't want to. The quest cape however, requires you to use problem solving(unless you use a guide and take baby steps through every quest) and a mixture of all of these skills to achieve it, and every month you have something new you must do to keep it so you can never get lax if you want to wear your cape.

This is something I think is going to be a major issue in the future. With finite level limits, and the fact that jagex originally released equipment on the scale of an upgrade every 10 levels, they limited their ability to have continually increasing upgrades. I personally would like to see socketing come into runescape, or levelable weapons. Personally, if a dragon long leveled up and changed graphics as you used it more. I would go and whip out my D long and start using it. Having a weapon like one in the bonus campaigns for Neverwinter nights would be awesome in my opinion. I forget what it's called, but it's a sword with the soul of a mage trapped inside it, you can talk to it for some hilarity, and as you level in the game it gives you the option to add different enchantments, say ice or fire damage, or a vampiric effect(like guthans), or draining certain stats in order to increase damage, but you can only choose a certain number of enchantments, and once you've chosen you can't change them. This could even be done with the training sword, you get it as a noob, and it levels up with you, and you can only have one per player, if you somehow lose it, it returns to lumbridge or something and you can go and retrieve it. Many games have things similar to this, and i think it would be a fun addition to the game, weighing the benefits of 1-10 lightning damage on hit which will momentarily stun your opponent if they're wearing metal armor, versus 50% of damage done being put back to your health, versus draining your health(or accuracy) to add to the power of your blows.

personally i would just stand outside the entrance and use the firepit as a safespot does it count as an obstacle as far as the accumulator is concerned?

Lulz, Warrior you're a narb I'm reading your ancestral bones guide I'll help out by posting any odd areas i see even though i'm still not personally that interested in how the dungeon plane is laid out. I guess i can understand why some people would be.

Forsakenmage Riods2525(for penguins) or mine(when my friend sarah is on)

Moocky for once I agree with you. This guy has posted 5 threads, none of which have any real discussion value, and they're all pretty much complaining or whining. I move to ban him from creating threads. Do I hear a second?

I think people are forgetting the benefit of the Fremmy boots when it comes to MTK if you do MTK then the boots are totally FTW i just wish they didn't kinda make it look like you're wearing sandals and have wicked bad frostbite

look, i am not like you people. i look at your sigs and you are all like cb +120 with like 100m cash.i am 91 cb and net of 10m. think about that. lulz you picked the wrong person to say that to I'm level 106, with about 4m right now i still blow my nose on 12k

i agree with this solution wholeheartedly. This is actually basically what I was originally trying to suggest before the thread became a massive debate over whether junk trading makes profit or not.

I tried to stupify it down to your level, but it looks like I'll have to go even lower. Attempt number two... You have a rare gem and a thousand clothes pins, the real life GE values the gem at $100,000 and the clothes pins at $1,000 each. You have 1 of two options.... 1) You sell the gem on the real life GE for $105,000 and are left with $105,000 cash and 1,000 clothes pins - with that $105,000 you purchase a very nice car. Total value in the end - $1,105,000. 2) You trade the gem alongside the clothes pins to someone for $1,100,000 cash. Then using that cash, you are able to purchase a very nice car, a house, a boat, and all the food you want. Total value in the end - $1,100,000. Now to repeat myself, you are arguing that option 1 is better since you are left with $5,000 more in the end according to the GE prices....which is (another repeat coming up) RIDICULOUS. Scenario 1 is selling a divine sigil in the ge, scenario 2 is junk trading the divine sigil...you are telling us that scenario 1 is the better choice so we are telling you that you're argument is very, very dumb. hey genius i've already said multiple times, if you have the junk, it's better to initiate a junk trade to rid yourself of it, and then start using the G.E. If I had a gem, and 1000 clothes pins, and could sell them together for 1,100,000 i would. However, if I only had the gem, I would see it by itself rather than trying to find 1000 clothes pins. I don't get what you haven't gotten about that, because I've repeated it multiple times.

Of course you are better off selling your partyhats in the GE. They are OVERpriced. Nobody is willing to buy them for full cash, let alone a partyhat + junk for full cash. I was thinking we were finally getting somewhere, but this statement made me doubt it. i don't know what items are junked and which aren't i was just saying party hats are pretty much stagnant

I've got a third age robe top and a third age amulet. I've bought the robe top when it was 22M and the amulet when it was 20M. If I would sell them now on the GE for max, i'd make around 45M. If I did what you said and sold them on the GE when I got them I would have made 3M. How can you possible say selling is your best option for making profit? You are also saying that by keeping the item you will only contribute to the stagnation of the price. While this is true, who in their right mind sacrificies 42M to "help the community" by letting those undervalued items go up quicker. Who? I certainly don't. On the other hand, I do agree it's very silly of people to spend hours upon hours collecting junk. That's a small minority though. Most people with a lot of junk have either accumulated it over time, or have gotten it by buyng some underpriced item. In those cases, you're best off selling your rare with that junk, and this way, liquidate those frozen assets. But I think you already said that too. I was just pointing out that there's few people who actively seek for junk. Those oportunities are long gone. Ok Bedman, I agree holding your third age was smart, but obviously the prices weren't stagnant before because they're easily triple the price they were back then, to which i'd say well done holding. Actually, I just looked at the G.E. for third age, and all three sets have shown more than a 15% increase in the past 30 days. So I guess third age isn't stagnant. Quite the dilemma, but it's promising because it shows some people are using the G.E. to trade it. So I guess 3rd age is a bad example. A better one is party hats, those are totally stagnant, or declining. They would be an ideal rare to trade on the G.E. The Dfh may be another good example, due to the fact that other than a small rise in the past week it has crashed horribly, that's one rare I would have gotten rid of before it hit bottom. The dragonfire shield is another. I don't know if people junk these or not, but they're good examples of rares that would be a good choice to sell if you're merching them. Madmanpur3 i think pretty much everyone agrees that you don't know what you're talking about, especially since you in essence just asked me if i'd rather have a rare and a ton of junk, or a group of rares. That analogy doesn't even come close to making sense in this argument. My argument is that it's better not to have junk at all and to sell your rares for profit. There is certainly no value in boosting your bank value with junk, and I have already said the best course of action would be to liquidate it. I have also said that, as is, the only way to liquidate your junk for full value is by junk trading. I understand its value for that purpose and don't dispute that. What I'm disputing is people who think adding junk to a trade makes the rare cost more. It doesn't. We have all agreed to that. You seem to be the only one left on the wrong page. It also doesn't matter if you care how much the game sets prices at, you still have to use those prices because programming prevents you from doing otherwise. GF. :thumbsup: Actually, I'm pretty sure we all agree YOU have no idea what you're talking about. What thread are you reading? [/hide] The thread where someone's trying to convince everyone that it's better to not have any junk and just sell your items? Everyone agrees it's better to not have junk... but why should you sell your items if you can't get the proper price for it? You continue to ignore this fact with every post. NO ONE wants to take a 400M loss because of Jagex's stupidity. NO ONE. Also, on the note of junk... you don't just get junk for no reason. You get junk because you were training a skill, or you got it from a drop, or you needed to rent some more powerful weapons and armor. Gaining junk or not isn't your choice. And it's MUCH better to accumulate junk and get the full price for your items than be ripped off, or have to hold onto an item you'd rather sell, but can't for the proper price. soma it's only a loss if you payed that much for it then sold it for much less The price you get is for the junk not for the rare.....

I've got a third age robe top and a third age amulet. I've bought the robe top when it was 22M and the amulet when it was 20M. If I would sell them now on the GE for max, i'd make around 45M. If I did what you said and sold them on the GE when I got them I would have made 3M. How can you possible say selling is your best option for making profit? You are also saying that by keeping the item you will only contribute to the stagnation of the price. While this is true, who in their right mind sacrificies 42M to "help the community" by letting those undervalued items go up quicker. Who? I certainly don't. On the other hand, I do agree it's very silly of people to spend hours upon hours collecting junk. That's a small minority though. Most people with a lot of junk have either accumulated it over time, or have gotten it by buyng some underpriced item. In those cases, you're best off selling your rare with that junk, and this way, liquidate those frozen assets. But I think you already said that too. I was just pointing out that there's few people who actively seek for junk. Those oportunities are long gone. Ok Bedman, I agree holding your third age was smart, but obviously the prices weren't stagnant before because they're easily triple the price they were back then, to which i'd say well done holding. Actually, I just looked at the G.E. for third age, and all three sets have shown more than a 15% increase in the past 30 days. So I guess third age isn't stagnant. Quite the dilemma, but it's promising because it shows some people are using the G.E. to trade it. So I guess 3rd age is a bad example. A better one is party hats, those are totally stagnant, or declining. They would be an ideal rare to trade on the G.E. The Dfh may be another good example, due to the fact that other than a small rise in the past week it has crashed horribly, that's one rare I would have gotten rid of before it hit bottom. The dragonfire shield is another. I don't know if people junk these or not, but they're good examples of rares that would be a good choice to sell if you're merching them. Madmanpur3 i think pretty much everyone agrees that you don't know what you're talking about, especially since you in essence just asked me if i'd rather have a rare and a ton of junk, or a group of rares. That analogy doesn't even come close to making sense in this argument. My argument is that it's better not to have junk at all and to sell your rares for profit. There is certainly no value in boosting your bank value with junk, and I have already said the best course of action would be to liquidate it. I have also said that, as is, the only way to liquidate your junk for full value is by junk trading. I understand its value for that purpose and don't dispute that. What I'm disputing is people who think adding junk to a trade makes the rare cost more. It doesn't. We have all agreed to that. You seem to be the only one left on the wrong page. It also doesn't matter if you care how much the game sets prices at, you still have to use those prices because programming prevents you from doing otherwise. GF. :thumbsup: Actually, I'm pretty sure we all agree YOU have no idea what you're talking about. What thread are you reading?

OP before you post a thread worrying about 12k, take a look at price trends, there hasn't been a significant rise or fall in SS's in the past month and honestly are you really that worried about it? Should I assume you're Jewish? (sorry to any jewish people i couldn't resist, i know it's stereotypical and untrue)

Anyway I guess we're pretty much on the same page now that we: A) need a newer, more effective way to liquidate our junk B) need to have a few tweaks made to the G.E. to make it more worthwhile to players to use the G.E. to trade their rares C) should not let 13 year olds run the Runescape economy D) would be better off without junk trading if these changes were implemented Are we in agreement?

I've got a third age robe top and a third age amulet. I've bought the robe top when it was 22M and the amulet when it was 20M. If I would sell them now on the GE for max, i'd make around 45M. If I did what you said and sold them on the GE when I got them I would have made 3M. How can you possible say selling is your best option for making profit? You are also saying that by keeping the item you will only contribute to the stagnation of the price. While this is true, who in their right mind sacrificies 42M to "help the community" by letting those undervalued items go up quicker. Who? I certainly don't. On the other hand, I do agree it's very silly of people to spend hours upon hours collecting junk. That's a small minority though. Most people with a lot of junk have either accumulated it over time, or have gotten it by buyng some underpriced item. In those cases, you're best off selling your rare with that junk, and this way, liquidate those frozen assets. But I think you already said that too. I was just pointing out that there's few people who actively seek for junk. Those oportunities are long gone. Ok Bedman, I agree holding your third age was smart, but obviously the prices weren't stagnant before because they're easily triple the price they were back then, to which i'd say well done holding. Actually, I just looked at the G.E. for third age, and all three sets have shown more than a 15% increase in the past 30 days. So I guess third age isn't stagnant. Quite the dilemma, but it's promising because it shows some people are using the G.E. to trade it. So I guess 3rd age is a bad example. A better one is party hats, those are totally stagnant, or declining. They would be an ideal rare to trade on the G.E. The Dfh may be another good example, due to the fact that other than a small rise in the past week it has crashed horribly, that's one rare I would have gotten rid of before it hit bottom. The dragonfire shield is another. I don't know if people junk these or not, but they're good examples of rares that would be a good choice to sell if you're merching them. Madmanpur3 i think pretty much everyone agrees that you don't know what you're talking about, especially since you in essence just asked me if i'd rather have a rare and a ton of junk, or a group of rares. That analogy doesn't even come close to making sense in this argument. My argument is that it's better not to have junk at all and to sell your rares for profit. There is certainly no value in boosting your bank value with junk, and I have already said the best course of action would be to liquidate it. I have also said that, as is, the only way to liquidate your junk for full value is by junk trading. I understand its value for that purpose and don't dispute that. What I'm disputing is people who think adding junk to a trade makes the rare cost more. It doesn't. We have all agreed to that. You seem to be the only one left on the wrong page. It also doesn't matter if you care how much the game sets prices at, you still have to use those prices because programming prevents you from doing otherwise. GF. :thumbsup:

Bedman, the fact that people do keep these items is the problem. When people have no junk to liquidate they see selling their rares as a loss. It is not, however, a loss at all. This is due to the fact that the g.e. prices are set and even junk trading does not actually change the value of the item itself. Through either the g.e. or junk trading, that item's value is a constant. Therefore selling for max on the G.E. will always produce a gain. Even for horribly under-priced items, because there is no way to "truly" get around their market price, selling them on the G.E. still makes a profit. Beginning to move away from junk trading and into trading rares on the G.E. would stimulate its ability to adapt to supply and demand, slowly but steadily bringing up prices closer to "street value." Holding your items hoping that the prices will change has no benefit, and if you have no junk to get rid of then there is no reason you shouldn't put your rares on the G.E. As far as stable rares, I was referring more to stagnant rares such as third age. Due to the fact that very few people buy or sell these on the grand exchange, you can discern, with fair certainty, that the prices are going to remain steady therefore all you're doing by holding the item is contributing to the stagnation of prices. Like I have said before, If you have no junk that you need to get rid of, and a stagnant rare your best option is to put it on the G.E. regardless of how under-priced it is, because this is the only way to make a true profit. I do agree that if you have junk that you need to get rid of it's a good idea to use a junk trade to get rid of it, if you don't mind the loss in profit cause by not being able to get that 5% increase. My problem is that people have the wrong idea about how junk trading works and therefore don't use the G.E. because they think they're taking a loss by doing so, even if they don't have any junk they need to get rid of. Some players will even actively seek out junk to be able to make a trade which promotes to the clogging of the economy with it, and further proliferating the problems with the G.E. You should NEVER, UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES, seek out junk if you want to make a profit. That people actually do that astounds me. So, to summarize, if you have junk you need to get rid of, junk trade it away because that's the only way to get rid of it for full value.(If you ask me the best thing to do with this is to try to funnel all the junk we can into price manipulators bank accounts) Once you're rid of it however, for the love of all that is holy, don't go try to get more, just do what I intend to do and sell on the G.E. If enough people follow this advice, then the G.E. will rise to its potential, and the rare market prices will reach their "street values," though it may take some time. Use price trends. Buy and sell smart. Do it on the G.E., and make a profit and help fix the system so that everyone can be satisfied.

Yeh, but did you do it while sleeping through 90% of your classes from 6th-11th grades? Anyway, You can apply real world economics(that means the math of economics, not to say that the systems are the same) due to the fact that the basic mathematical laws of economics do apply. Though the system is not precisely the same, all the same formulas still apply. These are unchangeable regardless of circumstance. I completely agree with you that currently the only way to liquidate junk for its full value is through junk trading. My point throughout this that I have been trying to make, is that although replacing your junk with its equivalent value in coins allows you to have more available liquid assets, it does not allow for a positive gain. Selling on the G.E. however, does. For instance, if you had already recently sold a rare, relieving yourself entirely of your junk, and then you had the great fortune to acquire another rare, perhaps of greater value even that was remaining at a steady price, would you take the time to gather all the needed junk again or would you sell it on the G.E. and make a profit. For players with no junk to liquidate, the best option will always be the G.E. due to its potential for profit. You take absolutely no loss from selling an item on the g.e. regardless of its price, unless you sell it below median prices. The only thing to be gained through junk trading is the exchange of frozen assets for liquid assets. This pretty much sums up my entire argument and I think you have to agree that this is true.

bedman go to school and talk to thee economics teacher, ask them to explain the difference between liquidation and profit to you Why dont you: a) Go to school (in general). B) Develop a brain. c) Learn to use punctuations. d) Learn not to use enter on every sentence. You've been proven wrong so many times. Everyone has tried explaining it to you. I'm not even bothering anymore to explain again what Soma and others have done much better than me. I'm only going to ask you to read it again. And again. And again. Till you finally understand it. I graduated an honor student actually. I am perfectly capable of using both proper sentence structure, and punctuation. I often choose not to on forums for the sake of saving time. I'm sorry if this presents itself as a problem to you, however I really can't be bothered to care. I was in advanced classes throughout my education, and passed economics with a 97. I actually scored a 99 on the final exam. A difference of opinion does not prove me wrong, and I advise you to do thorough research into the subject of economics. If you honestly do not understand the difference between liquidation of frozen assets and profit, then you have no place in this discussion. I have repeatedly backed up my argument with facts, statistics, and numerous examples. People for junk trading have openly admitted that the extra value in the trades is due to liquidating assets, and not an actual profit. They have also admitted that when junk trading, you are still selling items for their G.E. values. Even after this you still continue to assault my ability to perform simple math by asserting that an item's value is determined by a player set "street value." While I agree that this is the item's value to players, and the the G.E. does not accurately represent the items practical value, this is not the value used when determining profit, prices or anything else based in economics. Due to the fact that economics is a form of mathematics, one must always use the items established market price in calculating such things. While in practical value coins are much more useful than junk, the practice of junk trading is used to liquidate frozen assets and not, under any circumstances, to make monetary profit. This monetary profit is defined by an overall increase in net worth. This net worth includes the market value of any junk you may possess. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Profit I recommend you use that and read about both economic and accounting profits. I realize that there are some terms in there that will sound like greek to many high school aged players, but the information therein backs up my argument. @Dharokslayer: The extra 400m is the liquidation of junk. That money is used to buy your junk, and not to be factored in to the price of your rare. In the real world this practice is known as "bundling." In the end your bank value is still 500m, as opposed to the possible 505m possible if you had sold your item on the G.E.