Veiva

I don't see why not. Again, it's really up to player skill more than equipment stats. Vorago p5 is all up to the bomb tank not being crap and mitigating as much damage as possible, everyone clearing bleeds, everyone staying away from md, everyone doing what they need to do, and the mauler mauling in time. People like to blame their inability to PvM on having little gp. If they were given max gear, they still couldn't PvM because gear != skill. And of course, better gear makes it easier but that's always going to be the case. Complaining about it does nothing. I agree wholeheartedly. Even if you don't have good gear, you can go to 'lesser' bosses. For example, I started killing Toremented Demons about a month ago with a bank worth of under 20m or so, and used a staff of light + royal crossbow. After about 10 hours, I was managing 90-100 KPH--and now, I have ascensions + virtus wand/book + bought 99 prayer (from ~96?) and 99 herb (from 96) and manage just nigh of 120 KPH. Yea, I've logged upwards of 115 hours, but that's the sad (yet necessary) bit about a MMO, especially RuneScape--the grind. Regardless, I've made upwards of 750m from one month of Tormented Demons and I started with crap gear. If I can do it, anyone can (and don't act all like 'I have a life!' because I do too!). I used to think that people who got lucky were the rich ones, not anymore. It takes dedication 99 out of 100 times.

"In-combat" notification; you can disable/enable it in combat options.

7% of the way to 200 hours... Just shy of 1600 kills. Closer to 72m or so, based on GE prices. Bad luck with the limb/claw coin flip, though :(. +1670 blues and +1000 crimsons (I didn't have inventory room haha).

The runescape client is written in C++ It's not. It uses JNI for native APIs, but it's written in Java otherwise.

New ability queuing mechanic is so dumb. It fires the ability not when you can next use an ability, but 3 ticks after you queue it! That's horrible. It means, if you don't immediately queue and ability after firing another (and by immediately I mean same tick), then you'll actually hit slower... I could be wrong, but that's how it feels. Sometimes I don't hit with Binding Shot right after Bombardment, sometimes I do, depending on how soon the abilities are queued, but when I manually do it (i.e., wait for the global cooldown and then activate the ability), I never fail to do it. edit: Even worse is I can't turn off queuing AND hit a target with an ability first shot--it has to be an autoattack. BLARGH.

Add to this it works pretty well at Tormented Demons, boosting the gp/hr by something like 500k (so 6.5m-7m gp/hr). Not bad.

I think the AI is programmed to photobomb your awesome screenies, hmm...

If you need to know still, he's been stuck in W46 Lumbridge, near the Chef, for about a week now...

200 hours of Tormented Demons. I'll burn out before it's over, no doubt... oh well. It'll be profitable, regardless.

Thanks for the info! I'll do steel titans over pack yak and will use the Taverly method. Only thing left to do some are calculations so I can see how to reach the correct charm-to-money ratio as well as how about how many more demons must die in the quest for 120 summoning... edit: For those curious, I would need to kill ~22,800 Tormented Demons over the span of about 190 hours (optimistic here), collect 91 dragon limbs (and upwards of 23,940 blue and 14,250 crimson charms). This will ensure I have enough money for the charms I have now and also cover the cost of the charms on the way. In the end I'd have made ~400m-500m gp, after summon training costs are deducted. Not so bad. Except for the 190 hours part. I've only logged 90 hours or so of TDs in my recent spree... I guess it's time to start no lifing for the first time in my RS career. Mmm. Tasty.

First, the data: 1. I have nearly 20k blue charms and 13k crimson charms, and get more every day. 2. I value my time at 6m (more realistically) or 7m (more optimistically) gp/hr. 3. I will make Geyser Titans and Pack Yaks. 4. I will be using the Enlightenment aura. Now, for the questions: 1. Which is more efficient: training by abusing Pikkupstix shop or training via Kyatt? 2. If it's the former, then it is more efficient to convert to scrolls or just sell the pouches to shop? 3. In any of these cases, what is the average charm rate, per hour? I think that's it! Thank you.

Range gear will reduce melee accuracy, so it's not a good idea to mismatch gear like that. However, right now, gloves, boots, and helmet slots don't interfere with accuracy, so you can use range gear in those slots to provide some magic defense if need be.

I wouldn't be surprised if it were a bug. In any case, I've done more trials with my fresh ascension crossbows and have managed to get a consistent 120 KPH--at 10 KPH improvement. I'd assume seismics would bring it up that bit more, to maybe 130 KPH. Interesting stuff. Though, even at 120 KPH, tormented demons seem to not be worth it anymore. Limbs have a hard time selling for 12m (in fact, overnight, my limbs didn't sell for that--but they sold for 11m, so oh well). 7m gp/hr for the effort it takes is not time well spent, when they were nearly 9m gp/hr with less effort before limbs crashed... edit: I'd like to note I'm a total derp. Virtus wand + book > chaotic staff. I had forgotten to set my off-hand spell and was only using the main-hand spell for damage. Much expert. So dual wield. Very book. Wow.

Sorry for the late reply! I haven't tried it, but I doubt they're too good for range/mage setups, considering they'll switch the demon's prayers to one you're using. On a similar note, I think the chaotic staff > Virtus wand + Book (though of course not seismic wand + singularity) largely because you can use Wild Magic followed by Wrack, dealing more damage than Wild Magic alone in the same amount of time. Although the demon will switch prayer if the first hit of Wild Magic is higher than 3100, it's not the norm, so more than not you'll hit with Wrack as well. Also, for trivia purposes, in the beta, Snipe & co. will knock the prayers down, leading to sub-10 kills with level 90 weapons. Fun fun fun.

What is this goal may I ask? Looks good so far. Needs more 3rd age druidic though.

Man, this trip was both awesome and annoying at the same time: Had to drop half my prayer pots in the first 15 minutes... so the trip was cut to 45 minutes, but I really don't care because much money was made.

I disagree with your ability usage for the most part. Asphyxiate can hit upwards of 5000 damage before impact. Bombardment does not take too long; it takes exactly one attack later to activate, meaning I stack it with binding shot and can deal up to 6000 or more damage (+ prior piercing shot damage that never hits more than 3100). Wild magic does not necessarily hit through prayer. Ever hit a 3100+ with the first wild magic blast? The rest will hit 0 because the demon instantly switches. If this changes in the case of a wand versus staff, then fine; but it doesn't happen with a staff. I haven't used melee [regularly], because I haven't found that it speeds up my kills. I haven't successfully been crashed yet, even though I'm on a lootshare world most of the time, so either the crashers suck I or just out DPS them. I don't disagree about magic breath, but I find it too situational (I need to be near the demon, and oftentimes [read: most kills] I kill it before it tries to melee me). Although I was incorrect about the titan, it was only because I meant melee instead of mage (as the magic attack is pretty rare); I know it uses melee. I don't disagree about the titan being useful, I personally cannot manage it because of the absurd APM it requires. I've used it before to decent success, but then I get irritated at the APM requirement. I'm just wondering how many you kill an hour with your setup? I am successfully getting 110-120 KPH without a titan, with an average of 112.

Work in Progress This guide is very much a draft. I don't have it as nicely formatted as it should be, but I'm gonna work on that after I finish the relevant parts. Introduction In this guide, I'm not going to elaborate on the super basics. We know what Tormented Demons drop and how dangerous they are. Instead, my guide is to make it more accessible to reach high KPH without much trouble. You are expected to know the layout of the dungeon. If not, feel free to run down there and pray mage while getting a good idea of the nooks and crannies. Equipment Gear is important for any boss, but the best gear for killing Tormented Demons deviates from the standard. As for an explanation of this gear... Weapons Dual wielding is the best for one reason: stacking damage. As explained in the ability bar setup, you want to deal as much damage between switches, and two-handed weapons really don't offer the best abilities or mechanics to do so. Bolt-based range weapons are hands down the best, ensuring almost 100% accuracy when the Tormented Demon decides to be weak to range. Fire-based magic is best, similarly ensuring almost flawless accuracy when the Tormented Demon is weak to mage. Melee is horrible here. Too often you have to run in and mess up the lures around the plinth, resulting in you taking unnecessary damage. Similarly, Tormented Demons are never weak to melee weapons--even drygores aren't as accurate as you'd like most of the time, greatly reducing DPS. Therefore, never use melee. Lastly, to ensure maximum DPS and shortest kills, bring holy water. As explained in the fighting section, you should rarely use any up, and they always knock down the Tormented Demon's shield, 100% of the time. You can attack with range first, and then switch to holy water the next tick, to deal as much damage as possible from the very start, but I find it unreliable and there's a chance the range weapon misses, neutering the small advantage you have. Armour First, ([superior] elite) void armour is not the best to achieve the maximum KPH possible because of the increase in healing and prayer potions necessary for hour-long trips. Unless you do not ever get piled by multiple TDs with different combat styles (something that doesn't happen with the strategy employed), there's just not enough inventory space and thus this setup cannot be adjusted without reducing trip length by half. Therefore, the most viable armour for hour trips is Dragon rider. It greatly reduces the prayer drain, which increases the inventory space available for other stuff. In the (somewhat common) event you get piled by more than two Tormented Demons, it also provides much better armour bonuses and reduces the damage you'll take, even if only slightly. Keep in mind Tormented Demons have pretty high accuracy, so the healing reduction isn't as helpful as the prayer reduction. Necklace There's only one necklace you should be using and that's the blood fury necklace. Its siphoning effect pierces the prayers of Tormented Demons targeting you and provides necessary passive healing to survive. Ring Ring of Death is most viable here, providing generous passive healing (it has a chance of resorting 500 health whenever a Tormented Demon dies). The adrenaline reducing effect of the asylum surgeon's ring is useless 99 out of 100 times because of the particular ability rotations used. Vigour is unnecessary because there's no need to use ultimate abilities. Aura You have a couple choices. Vampyrism is hands down the best, reducing or even eliminating the need to heal. The prayer-reducing (or is it prayer-potion-increasing; to be honest I only use Vampyrism) aura is second best. Penance is useless--you shouldn't be taking that much damage that it becomes useful. Pocket IDK... I use a charming imp because I collect the charms (162 blue and 99 crimsons are gotten on average--pretty much the best charm dropper in-game, outside really boring stuff like Glacors [maybe? I don't know the Glacor KPH/charm rates]). If you want to increase DPS, use Elements/Cruelty I guess. Inventory This is my fine-tuned inventory: KEEP A SPARE SAPPHIRE LANTERN IN YOUR BANK. It will save you in the event YOU DIED. Comments, from left-to-right, top-to-bottom Excalibur greatly reduces food usage if you use it wisely.Overloads and prayer renewals, of course!I have yet to gain access to the elf city. You can save two inventory slots by doing that and using holy overloads.Since I don't have/use holy overloads, I just use super prayer potions (I know, inefficient overall). If you have holy overloads, replace these with six super restore flasks (or even six prayer potion flasks).Saradomin brews are necessary for the often-but-occasional times when more than one demon is attacking you and you don't or can't switch prayers.Weapon poison++. Does passive damage through prayer, increasing your KPH noticably.Adrenaline potion is used here and there if you happen to need it. With proper ability rotations, you should only need to take one sip at the beginning of the trip.Iron titan is the best familiar to use here, hands down. Steel Titan can and often will use range attacks, greatly damaging your KPH because 1) it will automatically switch the Tormented Demon's prayer to range and so 2) it will reduce KPH (and adrenaline gains because you'll have to rely more on mage), since you can deal more damage than it can just about everytime. Iron Titan uses melee most of the time, a style you won't be using, therefore helping out more ways I can explain, other than the useful extra DPS and forcing melee prayers.Using smoke runes saves an inventory space. They may be expensive but since you'll be using abilities, rarely will they be used up.Spring cleaner increases GP/HR by 600k. Tormented Demons drop lots of rune armour. Lots. Need I explain more?Enhanced ectoplasmator: I just use it to help track/verify my KPH (via prayer XP). Also it keeps the litter off the floor. It's really not efficient otherwise. Because wow 7k prayer xp an hour!!Home teleport tab is used to GTFO when you screw up too much or just to leave after the hour is upAbility bars You'll need two ability bars for maximum DPS: Other than the mage and range specific differences, they're identical. Prayers You should have all three prayers on your bar. I have my mage and range prayers bound to two buttons on my 'gamer mouse', which is useful enough most of the time. In the off chance I have to be within melee distance of a Tormented Demon while they are meleeing, I just click on the melee prayer in the bar. Of course, for action bar keyboard gurus, this probably doesn't matter. Notice I have Torment on the mage bar and Anguish on the range bar. Using these curses is a massive help, and will increase you DPS (well, of course). When I switch bars, I also switch prayers. This ensures I deal the most damage possible. Healing I have saradomin brews on the bar so I can chug on one between attacks, if necessary. I have a button on my mouse that is bound to that slot, which makes it much easier. Also, excalibur is a simple double-tap to heal, which is better than equipping it from the inventory, then switching to gear, then right click -> activate. But that's pretty standard in PvM... I think. Surge Sometimes the demons feel like being spread out. I have them target me then surge towards the middle plinth. It helps... once in a while. Killing a Tormented Demon, a Step-by-Step Mini-Guide Equip holy water.Queue piercing shot and then attack the Tormented Demon.Switch main-hand weapon to match off-hand. From here, use ability rotations to kill demon, switching weapons and ability bars as necessary.So what are the ability rotations, you may be wondering? Depending on which abilities are on cool down, these are the best rotation, in order: Range ability rotations Always start with needle strike. If you deal over 3100 damage, switch to mage (this happens, but not as often as you'd think). On the other hand, if you deal under 3100 damage (which will be the case most of the time), do the following: If you have health to spare: launch bombardment and then immediately queue shadow tendrils. This can result in over 12000 damage, though it will usually do much less.If you don't have health to spare: launch bombardment and then immediately queue piercing short.Launch snapshot. Both hits will land.Launch snipe. Generally, you only do this if all the abilities are on cooldown.Mage ability rotations This one is a bit simpler, but also less versatile: Launch concentrated blast and then immediately queue wild magic. Regardless of the damage dealt by concentrated blast, wild magic will hit twice. This means you can deal over 9000 damage, literally, before switching weapons, though most of the time it will be less. If you use a staff, wild magic will not hit the second splash if more than 3100 magic damage was dealt, hence why I cannot stress enough to use dual wielding.Launch asphyxiate and then after the first damage splat appears, queue wrack. Generally, you'll deal two splats of damage from asphyxiate unless the first hits over 3100 plus wrack damage. No other ability should be used over wrack, because they are delayed and thus if the Tormented Demon switches prayers, the attack will be useless.Lauch concentrated blast and then immediately queue dragon's breath. Sometimes you will need to follow up with wrack if this doesn't deal enough damage, however unlikely it may be.Switching gear You switch weapons after each rotation, outlined prior, unless the rotation did not do enough damage (suprisingly, this does happen sometimes). Follow up with basics. If your Iron Titan is always attacking, as it should be, this will generally never be a problem. How to switch gear efficiently Have the mage and range ability bars bound to a key (I have them bound to 'A' and 'S'). Also have the prayer slot bound to a key (I use 'X'). When you switch bars, immediately press X. At the same time, you should also have equipped the next weapons. Generally, you'll need to click on the first weapon, and when it is switched out of your inventory, equip the next. This seems to eliminate 'dead clicks'. Therefore, don't spam click to equip the next set of weapons, otherwise you'll find you often don't equip one or both of them. Locations Stone of Jas plinth (middle, minimal luring, advanced difficulty [insert video here] The hands-down best location is the plinth where the Stone of Jas resided. Explaining how to lure them here is kind of difficult--actually, it's very difficult. You'll have to learn from experience. This location is best on worlds of 200 to 400 population (less is worse, more is difficult), otherwise the demons spawn way too quickly and will proceed to make you their indentured servant or just not spawn fast enough, making you wait around. Try and only have Tormented Demon attacking you. Sometimes you'll have to lure nearby ones around the plinth while killing one. Try and stay away from the plinth so you attract other Tormented Demons. Running around is not efficient and will greatly impact your KPH. Also you may be attacked by more than one demon. If the demons are using the same style, great! Kill your target ASAP and move on to the next. If they are using different styles, then switch prayers between their attacks. This is not always possible (the attacks may land at the same time), in which case try and move around the plinth until only one demon is attacking you. If that's not possible without attracting more, just heal as necessary and pile through your target. Try and never have more than two demons attacking you. When they switch styles, it oftentimes means they will massacre you. I get over 150 KPH on average with Ascension crossbows and Virtus wand + book using this location. Southern rocks (no luring, medium difficulty) [insert video here] The next best location is the southern spot (I recommend this location for advanced-beginners [haha]). Try not to lure them if you can help it, since it'll prepare you for the plinth. I kill the western, then the middle, then the eastern one, and surge back to the western one. At peak efficiency, you're looking at 125 KPH at tier 80 and above. Better weapons are neglible since you are bound by spawn time more than kill time. Never use the northern spot. It sucks. Statistics For those interested, I have logged over 22,000 kills with varying methods and rates. On average and at peak efficiency, I kill about 150 Tormented Demons an hour, using Ascension crossbows and Virtus wand + book, using the plinth spot. Limb drop rate is approximately 1:250 (claws are also 1:250). Armour drops are rarer, but are generally worth more than claws. You can expect 162 blue and 99 crimsons at 150 KPH (36% of dropping 3 blue charms, 22% of dropping 3 crimson charms). Since prices are so variable, there's no idea of GP/HR rates. At the moment (2015/01/21), I make shy of 10m GP/HR. Factoring in expenses, it's close to or more than 9m GP/HR. As of writing, I've recorded, in my latest log starting in July 2014: 92 limb drops, 86 claw drops, and 57 armour shards.

But unlike those 555,679 people, I'd eventually be able to afford the red partyhat for its full price (16% of the way there) :P. To be honest (and not joking), I have it in there to remind myself of my ultimate RS goal.

I have an offer in the GE for a red partyhat @ 1 gp just for this reason. On another note, 17 limb drops. I made a fancy Excel spreadsheet to log kills etc and this is my average: The armour pieces are wrong because I screwed up somewhere along the way (initially everything was in Notepad). Have to go do another 50 hours worth of TDs to get a more reliable picture of my new strategy that nets ~110 KPH.

As it stands, offensive familiars are hardly worth it. The increased APM to successfully manage an Iron/Steel Titan at Tormented Demons outweighs the benefits, for example, and this is why I use a Bunyip there (rarely ever does the damage I take necessitate me needing to eat, and if that happens, I use sacrifice at the end of a kill)... The only worthwhile familiars are the moment are beasts of burden and the bunyip, in my opinion. Even the unicorn isn't worth it, because its low heal decreases your adrenaline.

Tormented demons: 1900 killed in 23 trips (about 20 hours; some trips were cut short). I think this loot page speaks for itself: I sold armour pieces (6 slices, 2 lumps, 1 shard) and 3 claws for a total of 26.7m to help a friend get back into NoobScape, so they aren't in the screeny.

Since everyone else is posting loots :(... About 10 hours of Tormented Demons. 777 kills as well, if I counted correctly. Not selling until they add a special to the dragon crossbow (so probably never).

So I was killing Tormented Demons and thought to myself "I'm tired of waiting for them to spawn!" so I stopped luring and instead rambo'd them for a delicious 60 minutes... and only improved my KPH by 30%. If I killed 100 an hour normally that'd be awesome...! But I only manage 70-75 per hour, so this improvement means my KPH is just 90. I've heard of some of the awesome Tormented Demon slayers getting upwards of 120. My gear is void, styles are magic (Chaotic staff) and range (Royal crossbow). I use holy water to knock down their shields, then immediately use my abilities strategically: I first use Wild Magic, immediately queue Wrack, so I hit 3 times (except when Wild Magic first hits over 3100; that's annoying, to say the least). Then I use Piercing Shot, queue Bombardment, then queue Binding Shot. Then I use asphyxiate and immediately queue Wrack. Then I switch back to range and use Piercing Shot followed by Snapshot. I then queue demon death animation. Depending on other factors, this could be slower, but regardless, I don't take more than 30 seconds to kill a demon, hence I'd think 100-110 KPH would be obtainable this way. Would level 90 gear make all that much of a difference? If not, does anyone have a recording of the way in which they lure or otherwise slay Tormented Demons efficiently? I use the southern spot, if that helps any (the best one featured in the Tip.it guide, I think).

Hey, did anyone get an Enlightenment aura in their bank with today's update? It says 100% boost to XP and recharges in 5 days...