brando13a

Not once did I say delete everything. the majority of the PAYING player base is between levels 30-85, or at least has a skill total indicative of someone who plays somewhat regularly. Yes there are millions of accounts between level 3-10 with under 100 total levels, but these arent the accounts that jagex caters to in new content updates. Like any business, Jagex already has a base for their product, current updates are additions to attract, and keep the LARGEST amount of people possible. so, 78,000 players vs remarkably fewer players- the 78,000 are the clear winners of who to update. the 78,000 marker, shows how many people can use the update first day, and is also an indication, that there will be LOTS more people soon to be aple to use the update, and many who will reach it eventually. Higher levels are NOT the core of runescape- they are the minority. I'll be generous and say that over 100 people have posted their distaste of this update here. the magic of numbers reveals the truth 100 < 78,000. sorry to say, but jagex wants money, and 100 happy customers here, could mean- generously- 10,000 happy customers in all runescape. this update makes closer to 68,000 happy customers (minus all the whining 90+ slayers). they want more happy customers, and more money. on a financial standpoint, you and any other member are exactly the same. in fact, the newer player seems more likely to keep playing with the attitude shown here- high level players seem so angry with updates that my instinct says they'd be more likely to quit out of dissapointment, than a lower level player would. yes, you should wait longer- the rate of inflation in equipment power and monster power is already growing far too fast. Jagex already made a mistake with releasing so many high level updates and equipment in quick succession. Guess what? you can camp there too! if you dont like competition for new items, all that tells me is you're a greedy and money hungry player who wants the new drop all to himself and the select few who would be able to corner the profit, and make a new dclaws. and again, loyalty does not equal more money, Jagex wants players to stay, but they also want- take a guess- more players. a level 90 update, affects a small amount of people. the main player base wont come close to a level 90 for a long time, and therefore dont give a rats [wagon] about a level 90 update. level 78 is much more approachable, while still maintaining a difficulty level, being about 1.5 million experience, 78 isnt an easy task. compared to 99, yes it is a smaller accomplishment, but it is in no way EASY. bring some air strikes? seriously, if you cant adapt to handle obstacles, you'll die. I understand how crowded new updates get, but guess what? not all 78000 players with 78 slayer will be online, not to mention that with all the available worlds, not all 2000 people will be there trying to take a crack at them. In reality, you wont have that much trouble getting a few kills. there are alot of people who CAN kill them, that doesnt mean that they all will, or that they'll even try, lots will, but theres still enough worlds that you'll be able to find open enough space to get your hands on the shiny new drop.

Uhmmmm, What the hell are people complaining about? 1. If you have 99 slayer, and you're so pissed off that there's nothing between 90-99- WHY the hell did you train past 90?! if you genuinely enjoyed the skill, you'd just be happy that you achieved your goal of 99, regardless of new monsters in between. 2. if you have 99 slayer, you DO have more monsters than someone of a lower level. at 99, you can fight EVERY slayer monster, as compared to 55 slayer, where you cant. so how can you possibly say you have LESS? you have less new monsters becoming available, sure, but you still have more monsters to fight that the 55 slayer dude. 3. Jagex cant cater to the few, they're a multi-million dollar corporation, they have to try to appease the masses, and they are working on higher level content, its YOUR problem if you cant accept that 78 is a high level. Just because 99 takes longer, doesnt mean 78 isnt high. Honestly, slayer is getting a new monster, and you all have the ability to slay it. stop your [bleep]ing whining already and just be happy. They arent going to stop making updates for the majority. Yes, it would be really nice to have extras in the last few levels, but the number of people in that bracket dont justify spending their time making an update specifically for those people. the player base is comprised mainly of players between levels 30- 85ish. this is where the MAJORITY of players are. there are millions of players in this game, and just because you are in the select few who has the time or determination to max out, doesnt mean you're worth more to Jagex than the 78,000 other PAYING customers with 78 slayer already. They will eventually give you all updates. have patience, and enjoy what is released, because guess what? having 99 slayer doesnt ban you from killing a level 78 slayer monster! its crazy isnt it? every update you can play, and having levels higher than the requirements doesnt prevent you from playing them! so do everyone a favor and shut up. Really, 13 pages of the supposed 'higher class' players doing nothing but [bleep] and moan that 78 slayer isnt favorable to their almighty expectations and standards, gets kinda boring, not to mention annoying, and a little sad. Act like big kids, you're getting a new toy just like everyone else.

I'm gonna throw something out there for everyone: Runescape has a total of 0 buyable skills. In fact, the closest thing we have to buyable, is actually free. There is NO way of directly paying gold, for experience. However we can stand around and do nothing, and get random events and exp lamps. exp lamps are the closest thing we have to buyable skills. Unless there's a magic place where you can take your gold stack and literally pay straight gold for exp points in any given skill, there are no buyable skills. The cases we have, such as cooking, are merely cost effective, or highly efficient (exp/hour wise, not exp/gold), but none are literally buyable.

yes, I did already say that protect prayers make the fight longer when both people use it. speaking from experience of different level ranges however, my level 26 pure has no problem with other people using protect prayers, at all. my level 89 maxed melee pure on the other hand is a different story, as it too can use protect prayers. I'm not saying that prayer should be used all the time, but if i have 80 str attack and defence, and a pure of the same level attacks me with 99 attack and strength, I sure as heck am going to want to use prayer to wear down his hits!. It's absurd to allow yourself to take a disadvantage like that, because its been very handily proven that pures can hold their own vs defence, otherwise people wouldnt make pures at all. as for wasting resources- thats really a personal choice, if the pure attacks the "mid level skiller" no doubt in hopes of an extremely easy kill, they should be aware that the skiller wont just bend over and take it. pvp as a whole, is far too indulged in imaginary pride and honor. play as dirty as you want, whatever it takes to WIN. having a pure is one step to winning in certain fights, but whining about other players tactics doesnt help YOU win. if people dont like how you pk, they should adapt and one up you- dscim special anyone?

@ above- The reason for that is: hypocrits! They whine and complain when you do it, and the call you a noob after they do it. this right here is the prime example, really it cant be said much better! Being a pure gives you the advantage in that you have the power of a very high level, at a very low level. when someone of the same level (who lacks that extra power) uses the alternative skills they've trained to match the power of pures, they are insulted and flamed. Pking is not JUST FOR PURES, it is for ANYONE who feels like killing players! using prayer is taboo, because it takes away from the massive offensive advantage of pures, and because it absolutely drags out the fight between two well rounded players. defence is frowned upon for about the same reason. all in all, since the birth of pures, any defensive strategy has been labelled as nooby- why? because it takes away from the advantage they have. personally i have both a pure and a few well rounded accounts (one of which may be back with the ban appeal update! \ ) and my lower levelled pure has a cake walk because the armor available and defensive skills cant come close to hurting my offensive advantage. alternatively, my highest level all around character HAS to use defensive strategies just to survive, let alone win. thats my two cents, pures arent the worst thing in the world, but many pkers have the mentallity that anything defence is noob, therefore they flame when other people do it, and when they're on the rope, they generally do it themselves. these are the players who havnt been around too long, and dont understand WHY they dont like these things, they're just sheep following older players mentallities.

I believe the quest "a tail of two cats" has a lengthy cutscene of robert the strong (bob the cat) fighting and defeating a dragonkin, both of whom are accurately portrayed in that display. as for the origin of dragon items, we know they are/were smithed on freneskrae(sp?) by the war loving race who resides there. *necrosyrtes, kudos xsxqpowerx! I'd assume that the dragon items are made BY the necrosyrtes (most likely dragonkin), their source of dragon metal is unknown.

correct, all dragon pieces dropped by tormented demons match the dragon pieces that are on the demon itself. No the dragon items are not from the demons, to the best of my knowledge they are from Feneskrae(sp?) and used by a race called the necrosomething. cant be more specific sorry, but the impling who takes you to the imp catcher minigame talks about the dragon items and their origin, and it isnt demons.

Until Jegex gives us a 10 seconds grace between KILLS (actual kills, not just fights) shut up about fricking pjing! deal with it, people arent going to stop until they're forced to so [cabbage] or get of the pot! yes its 'unfair' and yes it really sucks when you get a good kill and then bam, they drop you out of nowhere and you loose your loot and your items (potentially). but theres nothing you can do about and whining wont help unless your whining at Jagex, so go spam RSOF about making a change.

I fail to see why exactly bunny ears/scythe are being mentioned, those are fine rares/discontinued items. they arent in question. Party hats, halloween masks, easter eggs, pumpkins etc, give no indication of account age. I was around for the drop, but currently dont own a party hat (because i choose not to, the rare market isnt stable enough for me to invest in considering how little I play) If people are so against removing those rares and remaking them as items like every other holiday item, then why not make a shop that has unlimited numbers of the rare items, for the current market value? (as in it keeps current with the market value) and as for showing age- I quite like the year capes idea! however- Jagex doesnt like to give out the age of accounts, I've personally sent a query to find out the exact age of my account ( I started within the first few months of runescapes release) and I was replied with a message which warned me that many people ask, and they use this information in account selling. Old accounts are like fine wine, age is better- so while I like the idea, I strongly doubt it would be implemented based solely on that reason.

Again, you try to constru runescape as real life, it isnt. There is no reason, NONE for there to be broken/unfair/anything wrong in a FANTASY WORLD. Why people fight this so strongly is beyond me, just because of this thread I now plan purchase a few party hats and alc them just because it would help remove some of them, but wont because it would only make the price higher. Jagex is the creator, in a game-life comparison, Jagex is GOD not the government. They've taken actions against rares, they know they made a mistake, hence why they havnt released any more rares. the problem now is, they have a giant sore on the face of their game, and they need to find a way to take it away without causing damage. the problem with that is that they cant, no matter what they do, people get pissed, so eventually they'll cut their losses and just eliminate rares in one way or another, its nescessary, as there is no PURPOSE for rares, they are useless trinkets, with no value other than : Oh look, that guy has some pixels on his head....yay? they were never meant to be monstrously expensive items that have stagnated above the market, they were a fun holiday release. those who say that things become what they werent meant to be- so what? sometimes its a good thing, sometimes its a bad thing- PoH's were never meant to allow you kill people anywhere, but they did allow it, so why did jagex change that? Because it wasnt right, it wasnt the intent of PoH's, Partyhats appear to be a harder thing to convey as broken. If they were meant to be ultra valuable items, they'd have alch values that are ultra high. and @ShadowFazPZ- no one here is whining that its too hard to obtain these items. its not about availability, its not about status, its about the party hat being a broken item- a 30gp item is worth a hundred million gold, they just arent what they're supposed to be, they've evolved past 'fun' items, to items that have no purpose other than moving money. and yes, the definition of rare is well known, however these are holiday items, not 'rares' Elysian(sp) shield is a rare item, party hats and masks and eggs and pumpkins etc are DISCONTINUED, rare implies there is still a SOURCE, in that, no matter how many of the item is taken out of the game, there is still the possibity for more to enter through some means. if everyone dropped their 'rares', they'd disappear and there would be no more rares. however if everyone dropped all the hammers in runescape, they could still get more. hopefully you understand the point!

@ above So life isnt fair? why should runescape follow en suite? that makes no sense and is flawed logic to which i pity severely. just because something is wrong in a completely unrelated place, doesnt mean it has to be the same here! life doesnt equal runescape, nor should it, runescape is a place to escape life, that's the very essence of leisure activities, to escape the frivolous and tedium of life, to replace it with something you enjoy- and trying to make runescape like life: unfair, does not make it enjoyable in my eyes. this is a game, and so should remain as a game, not made into life, where things really arent fair and such things as this are unchangeable. this is a GAME with a broken piece, fix the broken piece and the game gets better than it currently is. I for one dont plan to stand in the way and fight POSITIVE change.

I'm pretty sure its cheating because the rules say that buying things ingame through out of game sources is... well.... cheating? it actually states that as a rule, so yeah, it is cheating, just because you dont view it as bad, doesnt mean it isnt against the rules. I dont think speeding is bad when i drive, but its still agains the law... :shame: :^o

@ above I did actually miss the point about new slayers having an advantage, so my bad there, no excuse but my own ignorance. as for saying that rares will eventually reach 0, this is a fact. they are currently a limited resource, with no way or replenishing their quantity, but MANY ways to take them out of the game (alching, dropping, dieing etc) so my statement is true, because ANY player, regardless of how they view the item, COULD lose it, and therefore it will eventually reach 0 through mistakes, or players who actively choose to eliminate them. I've personally done this, and alched at least 10 partyhats, when they were around the value of 10k each street value. so, the logical statement that limited resources will eventually run out, is true. Gas is an example of this, people see the value in it, but it WILL run out.

But Slayer's not a discontinued skill that you can no longer gain experience in no matter what you do, so that is irrelevant. I wasn't talking about Slayer as a skill; I'm talking about the prices of whips. Just because someone who starts now can no longer sell a whip for 10M doesn't mean Jagex should change the prices because they missed out on that opportunity. People who missed out on rares don't need the system changed. I honestly LOVE when people dig themselves into holes for me to just throw the dirt on and seal their argument away for good. by your logic, exactly how you're thinking it, you have 2 BIG holes. 1: you assume that there are no more whips coming into the economy, whips dont equal party hats, because whips have an 'unlimited' source. there is a set amount of party hats, which will never increase, and will eventually reach 0. so no, jagex shouldnt touch whip prices because thats a stupid example in the context of this discussion. 2: if you want things set to their original price for the sake of balance, as you suggest with whips (which were closer to 30 mil as an average the first day they were out, some went for much more, but i remember buying mine for 36m the first week people started to get them) then party hats should be set to 100 gp, because thats what i payed for mine back at the drop! so not only do you have a completely nonsense comparison (whips are unlimited, party hats ARE NOT, they have a limited source) but your example of price is even wrong, because the original price of party hats was NOTHING, they were FREE! literally free, there were no requirements level wise to obtain a party hat. so good fight sir, but rethink your argument, because you are wrong.

That's a very ignorant view. the rare market is a good portion of the high end market, considering there isnt a rare worth less that what? 10 mil? you cant say that this only affects 'jealous people' it affects the whole friggin market, and through that every single player. Sorry to say, but you are just plain wrong with assuming this thread is about jealousy. I personally have owned party hats at many points in my rs career, they meant nothing but money to me, and maybe that makes me weird considering i was at the actual drop :? but I dont care, I'm not stuck up enough to deny the problem at hand. There is a problem here, people just arent willing to accept it, because.... I honestly dont know, theres no reason not to agree with this, its about removing a broken portion of the game. I feel sorry for you Jard, this is a good idea, but with anything in RS, player opinion isnt respected too much, maybe when Jagex says this is a problem they'll admit you were right!

People also WANT flareswords, and lightsabers, and guns, and MSB to have the 50% spec bar, and the old wildy. point is, its not about want, because people's wants are what kill the game in the end. Everyone wanted the wildy, but so did RWTers, that one was an obvious for the greater good move. This one isnt as clear, mostly because its not jagex telling you that its not right. If I was the one who started posting that the wilderness was broken and leading to RWTing, people probably would've laughed and said thats too bad, but the wildy is such a big part of the game, they'll never remove it. Party hats arent right, so that means they ARE wrong, and something needs to be done. thats my view. not neccesarily this, but something close.

true, however from a business standpoint it would be a bad move. It would be like selling a ferrari to a 16 year old who just got their drivers license, and then saying you cant have the keys until you've driven 5 other cars for 2 years a piece to get the required experience to use the ferrari. it would just piss people off, they're paying for content, and they get mad when the content is "locked" to them. yes is just whiny kids, but those whiny kids give a good chunk of money to Jagex, and they dont want to piss all over their customers.

I dont mean to be another downer, however theres a fairly sizeable hole in any attempt to figure out this perplexing item's true value. While Jagex has stated the roulette metaphor for the function of the ring, and the drop system of monsters in general- We dont know what is on either wheel. Without that little piece of knowledge its impossible to say exactly how much the ring affects, as we dont even know what it affects in the first place. We could make educated guesses on a monster which has fairly 'rare' drops, but a very small drop table, and then mathmatically determine which drops are found on the second wheel by the amount they are found, seeing as the drops of the 'second wheel' will be multiplicatively rarer* so its nearly impossible to determine. figure out the second wheel for a monster, and then you can calculate the chance of landing on the rare item slot of the first wheel, and then you can determine how RoW effects drops. there are already extensive drop percentage charts, all you have to do is break that up into first/second wheel, and it should be fairly easy after that to start an experiment. using every and any monster WONT work. *(simple probability states the probability of any item on the second wheel is multiplied by the probability of landing on the "rare" slot of the first wheel. a simple example, completely fabricated, would be that there is a 1/10 chance of getting the rare slot on the first wheel. and then each item on the second wheel has an equal chance of dropping, suppose 5 items exist on this wheel, meaning that each drop has a 1/50 probability of being dropped, while the items of the first wheel each have a 10% chance of being dropped. this example however is incredibly basic, as most drops almost assuredly have variable drop rates- so given 10 slots on the first wheel, 5 on the second, we would more likely see ranges of drops on the first wheel, as well as the second. meaning that every drop has a different chance of dropping, ie- Kalphite queen, has dragon chains, and d2h, lava battlestaffs, all of these are definitely on the rare wheel, but the rates are 33% each, they are something like 1/250, 99/250, 3/5.)

I've played RS since about a month after its release, watching its development has been interesting. Similarly, I've played AQ since around the time it was released, and eventually payed the low, one time payment to have full access to the lunchbox game. A few key notes I've noticed between the two: They ARENT COMPARABLE BECAUSE THEY'RE FUNDAMENTALLY DIFFERENT GAMES! Aside from both containing 'rpg' in their main descriptor, they have almost nothing in common, one is an mmo, the other is a 2D, lunchbreak game and is advertised as such. AQ completely trumps RS when it comes to the Staff actually taking involved interest in the customer, the forum community and support is amazing, where you can actually talk to the creator of the game REGULARLY, and you actually have a good say in what happens with content, aswell as many people winning staff thrown competitons, and getting suggestions put in game (with actual recognition!) AQ may not be the leading game, but its a time killer, "fun" isnt the key word, but its enjoyable, and you dont have to be totally transfixed on it all the time, you can do literally anything and play that game at the same time with no problem, it fills empty space for people with ADD : That's not to say RS is lacking in any way, its a bigger, dare i say better game, but I enjoy AQ for the very personal feel the online community gives, as you can activily cooperate with the people who make the game and help them with making the game! RS is a more corporate feeling game, where you dont have as much sway in anything aside from blind polls. Both are good, but they are so vastly different you cant compare the actual games, because obviously RS is better, 3D vs 2D, more in depth bla bla bla. as for AQ ripping off people- no not really, they make lots and lots of puns (most are pretty terrible) but they dont actively rip off things from other games, they make well known references, but i've yet to see them steal straight ideas from any one game.

I guess the argument boils down to how proud people are. Elitists are always going to remain as they are, and theres really nothing you can do about it, because they're better than you. and that is literally the argument against elitism, you cant fight it because the opponent is invincible, and unchanging, not in actuality, but in the constructs of their own mind. I've personally owned party hats, mind you long before they reached their current value, but appreciative value holds true. I cashed out when reds hit 30 mill, which for some reason rings a bell with around the time barrows became somewhat affordable to the average scaper. Having said that, I wouldnt feel at all betrayed that my little trinket was made available to everyone. I'd be a little muffed about the ordeal if it was done exactly as you say, with no requirements or work needed to obtain these status wielding items. I like your idea, as i've said before, but the problem isnt what's right, and all the people dragging real world analogies into this are just using unfair examples, because this is A GAME. Really, if those items were made into milestone markers, they'd still be appreciated as a whole, they'd hold status, and people would still strive for them. the only difference is that it would remove a largely broken part of the market place. Scythes and bunny ears are a different story, I suppose. I've always longed for a scythe, and I dread the fact that we'll probably never see scythes released as actual weaponry (which would be badass), but people who got these, were the lucky few who were there. I have to agree that these should remain rare, as with every holiday comes a new release and new treats for everyone to enjoy, and if you werent there, too bad, you can get next years. this isnt as wrong as you may think, its not elitist, or prejudice, or ... age-ist? its a simple matter that theres something new every year, and Jagex "fudged up" a couple of years and it really made an ugly mark on the game - the rare market. summary- remove tradeable rares, replace them as milestone markers/ earnable rewards to keep their status. dont worry about the money, it needs to be removed from the game anyway, and the people who have the items can more than likely afford the loss of money, if they have the hats they pretty obviously werent using the money for anything productive. all items that are already untradeable, keep as is, this is already fine, people will continue to get rewards, and seeing as none of the items have an actual use, no one misses out! ....but seriously, I hope they release scythes as weaponry, I might actually un-retire if they do!

nochalo. I like your idea, but dont agree entirely. There are a few flaws that would be detrimental from an economic standpoint, as have already been pointed out, mass inflation would occur and blah blah blah the world ends I suppose. a problem that is easily fixed- rather than give gold for the item, give an "upgraded" version to holders of the original item. (dont announce this would happen before hand though) this little "upgrade" could be something like a sparkle, a little stripe or whatever the heck you wanna throw on the item. This wouldnt make people happy seeing as they just lost a boatload of money, but hey, they still have their special little hat that makes them better than everyone else. the next point I dislike is the fact that people are granted instant access. This shouldnt be. I agree that everyone should have access, just not so easily attainable. put level requirements, make the hats and costume pieces rewards and bonuses for getting certain levels, much like a skillcape, but much more generalized in how you get them. anything from completing a certain amount of achievement diaries, to having a certain total level could unlock partyhats, santa hats etc, this would still make them available, and still make them a symbol of prowess and status. I've been around since the original drop of christmas crackers, i remember buying and selling them for hundreds, to low thousands of gold a piece. I missed out on the bunny ears, and the halloween scythe, I wish I'd checked in to get them, but the fact that I may have been playing long enough to get them doesnt mean i have the right to have it. not easily at least. I thoroughly enjoy your idea and really do hope it comes to fruition, but I also hope that the people who have the items arent rewarded in the slightest for having them, apart from perhaps a little pat on the back animation given to their version of said item. removal of rares- Yes. reimbursment- No. availability- level/achievement based. (yellow party hat (unt) available at 1500 total etc.) those are my only suggestions for you. konets

If Jagex ever does release sailing, I highly doubt they'd be able to muster enough content to make it a skill. It's so obscure, and finite, that it just doesnt make sense to have as a skill. My personal opinion would be that sailing would be a minigame/unlockable feature, which would be unlocked through a quest, and would rely on pre-existing skills to allow you to travel to different places, or to heighten your success rate of travel. As a whole the skill would sound pretty boring, and kinda forced and strained for content. We have construction- build a boat, heck we can make canoes with WC. Sailing just makes so little sense... blah, I cant even convey my contempt and distaste for the very idea of a sailing 'skill'. a minigame would be nice though! seems perfect for a do-able minigame- we could have so that we have to maintain the ship, while someone navigates, and we could do things like, repair the sails, and bail water... I feel like I've heard of this before... :wall:

For the option, the more that's in a game the better usually. With rare exception people appreciate variety, Doesnt matter if a dragon short sword is the be-all end-all of weaponry, but it may do something useful for someone. Dragon dagger is pretty much moot except for the special, and the ability to poison. dragon spear? who uses that? very few practical uses, and most of those are pretty obscure. the fact is, even though they arent omni-useful, they serve their own purpose in different situations, and the more situations we have to deal with, the nicer it is to have a wider variety of tools.

I feel so old when people say things like that. That picture reminds me of very recent times, dragon axes are out, skill capes for that matter. It all feels new to me still, but then again, I guess I've been around since about 3 months after RS started.. GAHHHH NOSTALGIA ATTACK! :ohnoes:

To everyone bashing about punctuation and how hard it is to read: Boo-friggin-hoo, get the hell over it! if you dont want to read it, DONT, if it makes you mad that he types like that, then go away and leave him in peace if you dont have anything constructive to post. All you're doing is criticizing with nothing towards intelligent discussion, so really you're worse than him, except you get to wear your proud little grammar badge... On topic: It would be nicer if we could stack them, but obviously jagex is more into the idea of not having things unbalanced. Not saying it wouldnt be unbalanced, but obviously they view it as a balance issue, or it may be an oversight, either way, there probably wont be a change unless you start some riots on the RSOF.