Slayer Sucks

[compfreak847]

 

This has just about hit pointless. Your rates are never mentioned in this thread. You refuse to post them here to show us what your rates are, and as such the only possible conclusion is that you do not have them. Don't come up with some bs excuse about not "spoon-feeding" the other people (or whatever it was you said). I have been with this thread the entire time, the least you could do is to post them now (or repost if you are correct, but I doubt).

 

 

 

Also, do not make up things (again) about what I did or did not say. The results you posted from Qeltar's database were his results alone. I found that in the thread and saw the picture of the table again as well as my response. If you did the same you would realise I never agreed with the numbers, but I did agree the calculations themselves were correct. Now what does that mean? It means that the calculation was correct (such as 100*X=100X), but the numbers were not (meaning the number represented by X is incorrect).

 

 

My rates WERE posted. As mentioned, most of them matched up with Qeltars; the ones that did not, I re tested until the correct numbers were established.

 

 

 

 

I had answere all the questions you asked. You keep mentioning that I hadn't seperated the drops. I have proved that for Abyssal Demons and Spiritual Mages that there would be no change if I did. None of the other tasks have rare drops with that large of a significance. Still the point is, that only applies to profit. You cannot deny that the experience rates are correct. They incontravertibly prove that you get more combat experience (and overall) when compared to Armoured Zombies. Therefore Slayer does not 'suck'. This means if your point all along was for the reverse argument, then that condition has been met and the thread was actually finished about 2 months ago.

 

 

 

See above, already proven it is not needed to seperate. Either you are an idiot or blind. I have mentioned banking times many times. I have said over and over that I have not timed it (zomg!!!! that's mentioning it!!!!!!!.... :roll: had to add that). How can I add something which I do not have.... oooh ooh I know, I know, i'll make it up like you so often do.

 

 

I proved that it would have drastic effects on spirit mages, and rare drops for all monsters constituted more then your profit. Many questions on experience rates remain unanswered such as banking times, summons used, tasks cannoned, and specific outfits\prayers\pots used - and that's not even getting started on charm rates.

 

 

 

 

And yet, I proved I could get a kill rate of 300 earlier in the thread. The drop rate is between 1/100 and 1/150, I used the median of 1/125. So yes that was all correct.

 

No, you certainly didn't. Drop rates of 140 were used (later adjusted downards to please you), with kill rates of 240 per hour.

 

 

 

 

yet we have never heard anyone with maxed melee stats also get this rate. Explain to me what you could possible do in your "laid-back" state that drops the Slayer experience per hour from 30.8k to 11.25k. That is a 63% drop.

 

Never seen 30.8k per hour, the most I've ever seen obtained is just over 19k. A drop of 8k XP is typical for paying less attention via posting on forums, IMing, and chatting with friends via CC and PM while tending to various RL tasks.

 

 

 

 

Again, I have shown it is not needed in this case. Seriously now, are you that stupid. I am pretty sure I even explained when I first posted it that I only gave the total profit.

 

Then give the rest so we can get on with the debate. Petty arguing over whether or not details should be released gets you nowhere.

 

 

 

 

See how I said "believed" and how I brought up the 65k? It infers that there was now testing. See how that works?

 

Assuming you meant now, and that would indeed be an interesting quote - except that it was certainly not the end of our debate, and my numbers WERE based on testing. I'm not even going to get into the issue of you completely making up rates for the first few months of arguing, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you are now telling the truth (as I honestly thought for the first 40 pages).

 

 

 

Two maxed players, slaying quickly and efficiently, are going to obtain very similar rates. If they don't, one or the other of them is doing something wrong. So here's my game plan for the next few months: If our methods and task details are examined closely, we can note the discrepancy in your and my results, then test with a standardized invo and outfit to compare results and eliminate as many possible discrepancies as we can. Once that's worked out, we can meet in game or use another method to slay side by side and see what's causing the discrepancy. We should then be able to hammer out the details of what we both agree slayer's rates are for once and for all; after that, it's a simple task to run the calculations to compare them to Armored Zombies 103k & 190k profit + 6.8k Summoning XP. We can both re test zombies as well to ensure that data is as accurate as possible and there's no room for argument in any of the rates).

 

 

 

If you have any comments or concerns with that, please let me know now and I'll change it, I'm sure we'll soon get bogged down in the tiny details, but it's nice to have a plan to keep things moving (I usually do for debates, but I'm taking some advice and publicizing it to help keep debates flowing smoothly).

[ydrasil]

My rates WERE posted. As mentioned, most of them matched up with Qeltars; the ones that did not, I re tested until the correct numbers were established.

 

Then do me coutesy of reposting them, as I just mentioned. That is at least the 5th time I have asked you to repost them and you have yet to do so. It is not that difficult a request is it?

 

 

 

I proved that it would have drastic effects on spirit mages, and rare drops for all monsters constituted more then your profit. Many questions on experience rates remain unanswered such as banking times, summons used, tasks cannoned, and specific outfits\prayers\pots used - and that's not even getting started on charm rates.

 

Where did you prove it would have a drastic effect? I showed via drop rate of boots and kill rate that at the time of posting, it was the same result as I had. There was maybe a 10-20k increase over what was claculated, anything but significant. Oh please, everyone who has read the read (most notably should be you) that all of those questions have been answered (my banking times are not given and I have already stipulated that I do not have them, that is an answer). In my post where I introduced the tested results I explained these things, not to mention throughout the entire thread that I have always had the same answers to those questions. But just for sake so you can't make up a bs excuse again, here they are (Why I should even bother I don't know, if anything I should tell you I have posted them [which I have] and tell you to look for them just as you continue to do so. Your memory is either that terrible [in which case your certainty that you have posted your rates isn't a certainty] or you a purposely being an... well I let you think of some words that fit here.):

 

Summons used - In multicombat zones I always use a Geyser Titan. In non multicombat zones I use a Unicorn. The one exception is Scabarites which is multi where I had utilised a Unicorn, I have since switched to the Geyser.

 

 

 

Tasks Cannoned - Aberrant Spectres, Bloodvelds, Dagannoths, Fire Giants, Scabarites and Suqahs. I have not yet deceided whether or not to swap to using a Geyser Titan in the Chaos Tunnels for Fire Giants (slower, unsure by how much but has more profit, but not many cannonballs are really used anyway).

 

 

 

Specific Outfits - Slayer Helm, Fire Cape, Amulet of Fury, Berserker Ring, "Barrows" Gloves, Dragon Boots are the constants that do not change. For my standard outfit I use Bandos Chestplate and Tassets, with a Abyssal Whip and Rune Defender. If I have Skeletal Wyverns or Mithril Dragons the Defender changes to a Dragonfire Shield, also for Miths I switch to a Leaf-Bladed Sword (better than Whip for this task). If I have Gargoyles, I use a Saradomin Sword, same as with Waterfiends but I use Karils for them. I use Proselyte on tasks where I am using constant protect prayers (except Wyverns and Miths). On Spiritual Mages I use Zamorak Robe Legs instead of Proselyte. Finally I always use a Saradomin Godsword for specials, except on Miths where I use a DDS.

 

 

 

Prayers - Superhuman is used as a minimum on every task except for three. On those three I use piety, those tasks are Waterfiends, Mithril Dragons and Skeletal Wyverns. Protect from Magic is used on Spiritual Mages, Suqahs and Mithril Dragons. Protect from Melee is used on Black Demons, Bloodvelds and Skeletal Wyverns. Protect from Range is used on Scabarites.

 

 

 

Potions - No matter what I use, I re-pot every 10 minutes. Super Sets are used always. If I am not taking damage due to a protection prayer, I do not use Super Defence. If that is the case, I also use Zamorak Brews. Prayer Potions are used to restore prayer and very rarely I might have 1 Super Restore with me (to restore prayer in place of 1 Prayer Potion, but to also restore Summoning so if my familiar runs out I can summon another).

 

 

 

I should not have to answer these questions again.

 

 

 

No, you certainly didn't. Drop rates of 140 were used (later adjusted downards to please you), with kill rates of 240 per hour.

 

Oh please give it up, it wasn't adjusted downwards to please me. The kill rate that I get is around 300 per hour, just because you seem unable to get this, does not mean other cannot. I ahve always said the drop rate is about 1/125, it is clsoe to that in Zarfot's guide I believe.

 

 

 

Never seen 30.8k per hour, the most I've ever seen obtained is just over 19k. A drop of 8k XP is typical for paying less attention via posting on forums, IMing, and chatting with friends via CC and PM while tending to various RL tasks.

 

Only goes to show you must have 'accidentally' (by that I mean purposely) missed my table I posted. Not to mention Zarfot also gains over 30k per hour. Please explain how a drop of 8k is typical? Typical of who? Chatting results in no time lost. I ahve always talked to my friends whilsts slaying and it has never caused a drop of 1k, let alone 8k. What would you be in away from the computer in the first place?

 

 

 

Then give the rest so we can get on with the debate. Petty arguing over whether or not details should be released gets you nowhere.

 

Yet I have stated over and over (which you cannot seem to comprehend), that I did not log the amount of every single type of drop I received. I logged the profit of each trip. This argument on your side is petty. It is essentially "Did you log every drop received?" I answer "No" You respond by saying "Did you log every drop received?". Do you see the problem?

 

 

 

Assuming you meant now, and that would indeed be an interesting quote - except that it was certainly not the end of our debate, and my numbers WERE based on testing. I'm not even going to get into the issue of you completely making up rates for the first few months of arguing, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you are now telling the truth (as I honestly thought for the first 40 pages).

 

It was a typo, it was meant to be "no" not "now". Again I ask "What numbers?" The number were based on those two intial assumptions which are inferred in that post if you understand it.

 

 

 

Two maxed players, slaying quickly and efficiently, are going to obtain very similar rates. If they don't, one or the other of them is doing something wrong. So here's my game plan for the next few months: If our methods and task details are examined closely, we can note the discrepancy in your and my results, then test with a standardized invo and outfit to compare results and eliminate as many possible discrepancies as we can. Once that's worked out, we can meet in game or use another method to slay side by side and see what's causing the discrepancy. We should then be able to hammer out the details of what we both agree slayer's rates are for once and for all; after that, it's a simple task to run the calculations to compare them to Armored Zombies 103k & 190k profit + 6.8k Summoning XP. We can both re test zombies as well to ensure that data is as accurate as possible and there's no room for argument in any of the rates).

 

Your replies thus far indicate you aren't as efficient as you would have everyone believe. In this post you mention you have never heard of anyone getting over 19k Slayer experience per hour, that is pretty much proof to this fact. I have shown my rates already. I am not able to do this as you would suggest. Uni restarts for me next Monday, and that continues on for the next 7 weeks to when I then have a 4 week break between sessions. While I can be on during those times, I would prefer to complete and revise my Uni work as it is more important to me at the moment. I could do it within the next few days possibly however.

[compfreak847]

 

Then do me coutesy of reposting them, as I just mentioned. That is at least the 5th time I have asked you to repost them and you have yet to do so. It is not that difficult a request is it?

 

It is, as the numbers have background ties to verify each method, and the second one is pulled out of context you'll start screaming about how it doesn't have cannon or piety or any of the other half dozen methods disproved in the early pages.

 

 

 

 

Where did you prove it would have a drastic effect? I showed via drop rate of boots and kill rate that at the time of posting, it was the same result as I had. There was maybe a 10-20k increase over what was claculated, anything but significant. Oh please, everyone who has read the read (most notably should be you) that all of those questions have been answered (my banking times are not given and I have already stipulated that I do not have them, that is an answer). In my post where I introduced the tested results I explained these things, not to mention throughout the entire thread that I have always had the same answers to those questions. But just for sake so you can't make up a bs excuse again, here they are (Why I should even bother I don't know, if anything I should tell you I have posted them [which I have] and tell you to look for them just as you continue to do so. Your memory is either that terrible [in which case your certainty that you have posted your rates isn't a certainty] or you a purposely being an... well I let you think of some words that fit here.):

 

Let's see, you gave the profit as 685k per hour. At 1/130 kills (previously agreed upon rate) per boot, and 240 kills per hour (81.6k XP\h, slightly high for a low HP\mid defence, spread out monster, but I think it's a reasonable assumption if one pays very close attention) not including your banking times, which you still haven't given me, I'm coming up with 240/130=1.85 boots per hour X 237k per = 438k per hour. Now, it's very difficult to pick up the lesser 1-2k drops without losing a whip hit, but I'm sure you throw that in, so I'll add the approx. 30k from that onto your rate. Nature runes and pure essense give enough back to cover prayer pots for protection and +10% strength as well as super sets, with approx. 20k left over. This gives us a grand total of, assuming ALL drops are picked up, 488k per hour. A far cry from your 685k per hour, a full 200k\h difference - and that's not inclduing banking\task time, which will add another few minutes to each task and drop the ates by 5-7%.

 

 

 

 

Tasks Cannoned - Aberrant Spectres, Bloodvelds, Dagannoths, Fire Giants, Scabarites and Suqahs. I have not yet deceided whether or not to swap to using a Geyser Titan in the Chaos Tunnels for Fire Giants (slower, unsure by how much but has more profit, but not many cannonballs are really used anyway).

 

The majority of those tasks were proven to be inefficient to cannon - see earlier in this thread.

 

 

 

 

Specific Outfits - Slayer Helm, Fire Cape, Amulet of Fury, Berserker Ring, "Barrows" Gloves, Dragon Boots are the constants that do not change. For my standard outfit I use Bandos Chestplate and Tassets, with a Abyssal Whip and Rune Defender. If I have Skeletal Wyverns or Mithril Dragons the Defender changes to a Dragonfire Shield, also for Miths I switch to a Leaf-Bladed Sword (better than Whip for this task). If I have Gargoyles, I use a Saradomin Sword, same as with Waterfiends but I use Karils for them. I use Proselyte on tasks where I am using constant protect prayers (except Wyverns and Miths). On Spiritual Mages I use Zamorak Robe Legs instead of Proselyte. Finally I always use a Saradomin Godsword for specials, except on Miths where I use a DDS.

 

 

 

Prayers - Superhuman is used as a minimum on every task except for three. On those three I use piety, those tasks are Waterfiends, Mithril Dragons and Skeletal Wyverns. Protect from Magic is used on Spiritual Mages, Suqahs and Mithril Dragons. Protect from Melee is used on Black Demons, Bloodvelds and Skeletal Wyverns. Protect from Range is used on Scabarites.

 

So you use +10% & piety with bandos? Interesting, I always used proslyte top\veracs skirt for that, but I do have bandos so I'm willing to go with it. A discrepancy, though.

 

 

 

 

Potions - No matter what I use, I re-pot every 10 minutes. Super Sets are used always. If I am not taking damage due to a protection prayer, I do not use Super Defence. If that is the case, I also use Zamorak Brews. Prayer Potions are used to restore prayer and very rarely I might have 1 Super Restore with me (to restore prayer in place of 1 Prayer Potion, but to also restore Summoning so if my familiar runs out I can summon another).

 

I use super sets, and repot every 5 or 8 minutes, but I'll try the 10 minutes. Not a big fan of brews, but it shouldn't change results.

 

 

 

 

Oh please give it up, it wasn't adjusted downwards to please me. The kill rate that I get is around 300 per hour, just because you seem unable to get this, does not mean other cannot. I ahve always said the drop rate is about 1/125, it is clsoe to that in Zarfot's guide I believe.

 

Then again, you said you made up your rates from earlier, so don't try to refrence them. The boot rate has always been 1/140.

 

 

 

 

Yet I have stated over and over (which you cannot seem to comprehend), that I did not log the amount of every single type of drop I received. I logged the profit of each trip. This argument on your side is petty. It is essentially "Did you log every drop received?" I answer "No" You respond by saying "Did you log every drop received?". Do you see the problem?

 

I'm talking about rare drops. A simple yes or no suffices, but a "no" makes it that much harder to compare rates.

 

 

 

 

It was a typo, it was meant to be "no" not "now". Again I ask "What numbers?" The number were based on those two intial assumptions which are inferred in that post if you understand it.

 

I knew it was a typo, and I responded to it as such. The numbers were based off my results, not yours, as duly noted above.

 

 

 

 

Your replies thus far indicate you aren't as efficient as you would have everyone believe. In this post you mention you have never heard of anyone getting over 19k Slayer experience per hour, that is pretty much proof to this fact. I have shown my rates already. I am not able to do this as you would suggest. Uni restarts for me next Monday, and that continues on for the next 7 weeks to when I then have a 4 week break between sessions. While I can be on during those times, I would prefer to complete and revise my Uni work as it is more important to me at the moment. I could do it within the next few days possibly however.

 

I never said I hadn't heard of someone, I said I hadn't seen real proof of it being regularly obtained using the methods proven most efficient in this thread. If your leaving, we need to establish which numbers are different for each of us, as we'll never have time to test every task. I'd suggest we end the previous argument\flame war above for the sake of brevity; if you agree, I'll simply stop responding to the top so we can more easily debate the numbers themselves. I'm somewhat busy over the weekend, but I should have time for posting and some testing. We need to work fast today and friday, though, to have rates established and tested before you leave.

[ydrasil]

It is, as the numbers have background ties to verify each method, and the second one is pulled out of context you'll start screaming about how it doesn't have cannon or piety or any of the other half dozen methods disproved in the early pages.

 

I asked you before to stop making up excuses. You quite simply refuse to post it, and the reason now is because i'll complain? Do you understand how little sense that makes? So because I am asking for it, i'll complain when I finally have it. The only thing I am complaining about is you making up excuses to get out of posting it.

 

 

 

Let's see, you gave the profit as 685k per hour. At 1/130 kills (previously agreed upon rate) per boot, and 240 kills per hour (81.6k XP\h, slightly high for a low HP\mid defence, spread out monster, but I think it's a reasonable assumption if one pays very close attention) not including your banking times, which you still haven't given me, I'm coming up with 240/130=1.85 boots per hour X 237k per = 438k per hour. Now, it's very difficult to pick up the lesser 1-2k drops without losing a whip hit, but I'm sure you throw that in, so I'll add the approx. 30k from that onto your rate. Nature runes and pure essense give enough back to cover prayer pots for protection and +10% strength as well as super sets, with approx. 20k left over. This gives us a grand total of, assuming ALL drops are picked up, 488k per hour. A far cry from your 685k per hour, a full 200k\h difference - and that's not inclduing banking\task time, which will add another few minutes to each task and drop the ates by 5-7%.

 

Those calculations are correct, but your numbers themselves are wrong. 1/125 comapred to 1/120 is such a small difference that I don't see why you bother complaining about it and need to make up reasons (such as it was agreed upon) just so that you can use it. 240 is quite simply terrible. I could get approximately 250 kills per hour without Slayer. 300 Kills per hour is my rate that I get, it is also the rate that Zarfot gets as shown in his guide. Just because you seem unable to get it, does not make it so for everyone else. I use the 3 spawns outside the Zamorak General chamber. You also ignore the fact that at the time of posting the boots were a different price. When I posted it with the boots at 278k, the average rate I was getting was only about 10-20k higher than if the drop profit was calculated. You can also stop complaining about me not giving banking times as I do not have them. This comes to mind:

 

 

 

Nemo dat quod non habet.

 

 

 

The majority of those tasks were proven to be inefficient to cannon - see earlier in this thread.

 

Think what you will. I know what I have posted in this thread and I did show it was efficient for a cannon if you could only make 400k per hour. Considering my profit per hour is much higher it is even more efficient. So there is no excuse for not using it. Also, those calculations themselves were correct but as you would know if you looked back, I never fully agreed with the numbers. I test I did myself proved as much. I did a test comparing Bloodvelds with and without a cannon. The results showed 3 things:

 

 

 

1. Qeltar (who according to you supposedly has a great testing methodology) was so far off the mark with what can be achieved. I got a pretty significant increase in kills per hour (just under 200 kills per hour).

 

 

 

2. It also showed (this was before the release of Armoured Zombies) that Zombie Monkies were inferior to Bloodvelds in every way. As I was getting 95.7k melee experience per hour only using superhuman strength compared to piety (the Monkies were only 100k).

 

 

 

3. It showed that it was more efficient to use a cannon with a profit rate of only 400k.

 

 

 

So you use +10% & piety with bandos? Interesting, I always used proslyte top\veracs skirt for that, but I do have bandos so I'm willing to go with it. A discrepancy, though.

 

Yes I do.

 

 

 

I use super sets, and repot every 5 or 8 minutes, but I'll try the 10 minutes. Not a big fan of brews, but it shouldn't change results.

 

Zamorak Brews are the better than Super Attack if you are not taking damage in those cases. You get an additional 2 Attack levels and it also restores a small amount of prayer.

 

 

 

Then again, you said you made up your rates from earlier, so don't try to refrence them. The boot rate has always been 1/140.

 

Oh please. I had never said or inferred that the rate I gave on page 8 was my actual rate. You are suggesting I am not allowed to reference something that is true but you are allowed to reference things that are not even there? That's absurd. The rates I gave regarding the Spiritual Mages is my rate (not just mine either, check Zarfot's guide again). In my experience (and according to Zarfot, who gained his rate over 13.8m Slayer experience), it appears closer to 1/125. The main problem however is you are unwilling to accept that you can't seem able to get 300 kills per hour, but that others can.

 

 

 

I'm talking about rare drops. A simple yes or no suffices, but a "no" makes it that much harder to compare rates.

 

When did I ever give another answer that wasn't saying I did not have them seperated? Geez.

 

 

 

I knew it was a typo, and I responded to it as such. The numbers were based off my results, not yours, as duly noted above.

 

Oh right I understand. You knew it was a typo, but you based your response as if it wasn't. It is all so clear to me now.

 

 

 

I never said I hadn't heard of someone, I said I hadn't seen real proof of it being regularly obtained using the methods proven most efficient in this thread. If your leaving, we need to establish which numbers are different for each of us, as we'll never have time to test every task. I'd suggest we end the previous argument\flame war above for the sake of brevity; if you agree, I'll simply stop responding to the top so we can more easily debate the numbers themselves. I'm somewhat busy over the weekend, but I should have time for posting and some testing. We need to work fast today and friday, though, to have rates established and tested before you leave.

 

That is because the methods in this thread aren't efficient (well technically they are, the reason I say they aren't is because you are under the belief that your conclusion towards the cannon and such are correct.... when they aren't). A cannon is efficient, moreso for higher profit making. Considering you have mentioned that high levels should not have a problem making money (you have said this numerous times in other threads). The point is every method I use for training Slayer ingame is among the most efficient ways. I'm not going to not use a cannon because you are under the delusion that it isn't worth using at 400k. Especically considering it is worth it and I make well over 400k an hour. I'll be on Runescape today so if you add me then I have no objections to testing.

[sadukar123]

Compfreak is jealous of my Slayer. XD

[compfreak847]

 

I asked you before to stop making up excuses. You quite simply refuse to post it, and the reason now is because i'll complain? Do you understand how little sense that makes? So because I am asking for it, i'll complain when I finally have it. The only thing I am complaining about is you making up excuses to get out of posting it.

 

No, the reason is because the numbers are useless without the background built up in the earlier posts. It's the same reason your rates aren't helpful at the moment; simply giving a number with no information on how it was obtained prevents comparison.

 

 

 

 

Those calculations are correct, but your numbers themselves are wrong. 1/125 comapred to 1/120 is such a small difference that I don't see why you bother complaining about it and need to make up reasons (such as it was agreed upon) just so that you can use it. 240 is quite simply terrible. I could get approximately 250 kills per hour without Slayer. 300 Kills per hour is my rate that I get, it is also the rate that Zarfot gets as shown in his guide. Just because you seem unable to get it, does not make it so for everyone else. I use the 3 spawns outside the Zamorak General chamber. You also ignore the fact that at the time of posting the boots were a different price. When I posted it with the boots at 278k, the average rate I was getting was only about 10-20k higher than if the drop profit was calculated. You can also stop complaining about me not giving banking times as I do not have them. This comes to mind:

 

1/120 vs. 1/130 isn't a huge difference, but it's the number we agreed upon earlier, and closer to what I believe is the real number (1/140). Switching to zammy mages indeed boosts KC by a small amount, but reduces XP from the lower HP; just because you CLAIM you can get 90k XP\h on a very low HP spread-out monster doesn't make it so. Add it to the list of things we compare.

 

 

 

Oh, and as for prices, back when this thread was posted they were worth far more then that, and back when slayer came out whips were several dozen million. You can't say "my numbers are correct because they used to be".

 

 

 

 

1. Qeltar (who according to you supposedly has a great testing methodology) was so far off the mark with what can be achieved. I got a pretty significant increase in kills per hour (just under 200 kills per hour).

 

 

 

2. It also showed (this was before the release of Armoured Zombies) that Zombie Monkies were inferior to Bloodvelds in every way. As I was getting 95.7k melee experience per hour only using superhuman strength compared to piety (the Monkies were only 100k).

 

 

And what makes your rates more reliable then queltars and mine? What proof do you have YOUR not skewing your results for the sake of argument?

 

 

 

3. It showed that it was more efficient to use a cannon with a profit rate of only 400k.

 

 

it most certainly didn't. Go back and read the posts, I CONCLUSIVELY proved it shortly before you left.

 

 

 

 

Zamorak Brews are the better than Super Attack if you are not taking damage in those cases. You get an additional 2 Attack levels and it also restores a small amount of prayer.

 

You get 1 extra atack level in exchange for a big defence, HP, and strength cut; delay to where your strength level drops below the amount subtracted, and you'll end up far overbalancing the bonus with a strength drop - and it's only able to be used on a few very low level monsters where strength matters much, much more then attack boosts.

 

 

 

 

Oh please. I had never said or inferred that the rate I gave on page 8 was my actual rate. You are suggesting I am not allowed to reference something that is true but you are allowed to reference things that are not even there? That's absurd. The rates I gave regarding the Spiritual Mages is my rate (not just mine either, check Zarfot's guide again). In my experience (and according to Zarfot, who gained his rate over 13.8m Slayer experience), it appears closer to 1/125. The main problem however is you are unwilling to accept that you can't seem able to get 300 kills per hour, but that others can.

 

Excuse me? You specifically stated you completely made up your numbers for the first 40 pages. So no, you aren't allowed to reference them. See above replies for your 300 rate.

 

 

 

 

Oh right I understand. You knew it was a typo, but you based your response as if it wasn't. It is all so clear to me now.

 

I based my response off of knowing it was, and it was quite obvious. Stop avoiding the issue and respond to the post :roll:

 

 

 

 

That is because the methods in this thread aren't efficient (well technically they are, the reason I say they aren't is because you are under the belief that your conclusion towards the cannon and such are correct.... when they aren't). A cannon is efficient, moreso for higher profit making. [Especically considering it is worth it and I make well over 400k an hour.]

 

They were proven correct by me before, go back and refresh your memory.

 

 

 

I'll be on Runescape today so if you add me then I have no objections to testing.

 

Don't bother, you've still refused to release many essential details. It's utterly impossible for us to test the rates for every single slayer task in depth slaying side by side in the next 3 days, especially considering I'll be gone most of the weekend.

 

 

 

Compfreak is jealous of my Slayer. XD

 

Nah, I hate dark beasts. And I got twice as many whips as you (and 3 heads) before I even hit 85, which I leveled using a couple of my WGS lamps \

[Dire_Wolf]

After i trained with slayer i realized that Slayer does not suck, but it's not the greatest skill either. So at beginning of this thread i would agree, but not now.

[compfreak847]

After i trained with slayer i realized that Slayer does not suck, but it's not the greatest skill either. So at beginning of this thread i would agree, but not now.

 

I agree with you that the skill certainly doesn't suck, but I'm not sure if your saying my rates are correct or not. If you think they're correct, then I agree with every word of your post; if you don't, then jump in the debate with me and ydraisle :P

[Dire_Wolf]

After i trained with slayer i realized that Slayer does not suck, but it's not the greatest skill either. So at beginning of this thread i would agree, but not now.

 

I agree with you that the skill certainly doesn't suck, but I'm not sure if your saying my rates are correct or not. If you think they're correct, then I agree with every word of your post; if you don't, then jump in the debate with me and ydraisle :P

 

I just think the title is not right. Should be change to "Slayer is not so good". Also did you create this before or after Slayer update?

[ydrasil]

No, the reason is because the numbers are useless without the background built up in the earlier posts. It's the same reason your rates aren't helpful at the moment; simply giving a number with no information on how it was obtained prevents comparison.

 

Didn't I just ask you to stop making excuses? If they are really there, tell me exactly where to find it, I will then re-read the background parts to relate. There is no valid excuse you can give as to why not. You really need to stop saying I provided no information with my rates. I gave a plethora of information, most of which you didn't even read (as was evidenced earlier where I showed you hadn't read it). The only information that you accused me over and over of not giving was banking times, which I didn't have. So yes they are helpful, but you continue to make up excuses and act as if mine are invalid (when we all know they are not).

 

 

 

1/120 vs. 1/130 isn't a huge difference, but it's the number we agreed upon earlier, and closer to what I believe is the real number (1/140). Switching to zammy mages indeed boosts KC by a small amount, but reduces XP from the lower HP; just because you CLAIM you can get 90k XP\h on a very low HP spread-out monster doesn't make it so. Add it to the list of things we compare.

 

If I ever agreed upon it was only due to you being too stubborn to change it. Zammy Mages are better than Saradomin Mages as they are closer together (and boosts KC by 60 apparently). It does not reduce the experience per hour however. Killing 240 Sara Mages is the equivalent of 272 Zamorak Mages, and yet since I get 300 it shows that Zamorak Mages are much more efficient. "Claim" is the wrong word. That word infers that I have no proof or evidence, and yet I do. I have posted it many times throughout the thread, how about you look for it and you will see I am correct. The ones near Kril are the closest spawns I know of. There are 3 spawns all within I think about 6 steps of each other (as in the furthest 2 are that many spaces apart with one inbetween them). They have very low Defence which only adds to the killing speed. Why don't you actually test it yourself instead of making 'claims' that mine are wrong.

 

 

 

Oh, and as for prices, back when this thread was posted they were worth far more then that, and back when slayer came out whips were several dozen million. You can't say "my numbers are correct because they used to be".

 

The point I am showing is that there was absolutely nothing wrong with the results with them when I posted them. That means at that point in time, Slayer was shown to be incontravertibly (one would think as there was nothing wrong) more efficient than Armoured Zombies. Using current prices means it is 578.56k profit per hour. There is also the reverse for other tasks. Over the course of the 3 tasks of Nechryaels I have done, my Rune Boot drop is currently 1/242.5 (as I had only received 2). I think we can all agree that the drop rate of these boots is closer to 1/125 which means the profit rate in the table is lower than expected. Lower by approximately 40k. I had purposely lowered my Black Dragon rate also. That profit rate is based on once my inven fills up I no longer pick up the Green Dragonhide/Bones (I kill it inbetweent he spawns of the Baby Blacks, my Geyser also does a good job on them). If I were to bank I would lose a fraction of the experience rates, but the profit rate would jump enormously. Either way, the higher profit on the Mages essentially compensates for these things (undercompensates really as the rate would increase by well over 100k).

 

 

 

And what makes your rates more reliable then queltars and mine? What proof do you have YOUR not skewing your results for the sake of argument?

 

Qeltars have been shown over and over to be much lower than what is easily possible to attain. For example his rate for Bloodvelds of 107 per hour compared to me getting 199 (the 199 wasn't on Slayer either). His rate for Saradomin Mages is only 169, when even you say you get 240 (his were off Slayer, but that is a huge difference). For Zamorak Mages he gets only 190, a Slayer Helm will not cause a 110 drop. Skeletal Wyverns he only gets 41, I get just over double that. Abyssal Demons (on Slayer) he gets 112, I get 143. Black Demons he gets 98 (off Slayer), I get 147 (on Slayer). Are you noticing a pattern here? Shall I continue? I remember someone saying this in the thread, it was along the lines of "Qeltars rates go over a mile but are only an inch deep". So while he may have tested alot of different NPCs, the amount of testing on each is too small.

 

 

 

As for yours, I do not know what is wrong with them as I have yet to see yours. I also do not skew my results to prove my point, I am perfectly capable of doing so without skewing them (as evidenced by my current Slayer rates).

 

 

 

it most certainly didn't. Go back and read the posts, I CONCLUSIVELY proved it shortly before you left.

 

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

I went back and read my test, just goes to show you didn't or have "accidentally" forgotten it. You never conclusively proved that a cannon was inefficient. The test showed that I got 199 kills per hour without a cannon and 395 with. Almost doubling the speed. The cannonballs used was 2,238. With a cannon to get 99 kills only takes just under 30 minutes and uses 1,127 cannonballs in that time. They currently being worth 188 means for a cannon to be efficient requires you make over 427k. However that is not all. Because with a cannon the task does not last an hour you save money on supplies. Back when I posted this it was worth approximately 42k saved bringing it down to 385k being required.

 

 

 

There is also the fact that you would get the exact same amount of drops, but half the time frame, thereby doubling the money gained from drops on an hourly basis. It was about 50k I posted, and we are now down to 335k. Finally you complete the task quicker, and hence more money is gained due to faster accumulation of Slayer points. While I am not sure if I agree with how I did it back then, it will still reduce the profit rate being required by even more. So yes, a cannon is more efficient than no cannon on Bloodvelds as long as you make over 335k per hour. you never actually disproved this. You complained that I apparently forgot that I would get less experience, which I than proceeded to prove overall on an hourly basis you get more experience per hour. That was the only NPC I actually tested myself, and to be honet, none of Qeltars rates can really be utilised for comparison as we know his rates are so far off.

 

 

 

You get 1 extra atack level in exchange for a big defence, HP, and strength cut; delay to where your strength level drops below the amount subtracted, and you'll end up far overbalancing the bonus with a strength drop - and it's only able to be used on a few very low level monsters where strength matters much, much more then attack boosts.

 

Someone can't read... I use Zamorak Brews and Super Strengths. So the Strength boost remains the same and you get 2 extra Attack Levels. As I also explained, the Defence drop and Hitpoints damage is irrelevant. An example is Aberrant Spectres. With protect from Magic on, you take no damage. Hence damage and defence from the brew is irrelevant (you heal naturally). There is also the small prayer restoration. So you just proved how much you don't pay attention.

 

 

 

Excuse me? You specifically stated you completely made up your numbers for the first 40 pages. So no, you aren't allowed to reference them. See above replies for your 300 rate.

 

Again you show how little you pay attention. Did I say I made up every rate? No I did not. I stated and I have never said differently that the rate for Slayer I gave earlier in the thread was based on this two intial assumtpions. So either pay attention and stop making up bs to try and prove your point. It is also more evidence that you need to make up things in order to prove a point.

 

 

 

I based my response off of knowing it was, and it was quite obvious. Stop avoiding the issue and respond to the post :roll:

 

Assuming you meant now, and that would indeed be an interesting quote - except that it was certainly not the end of our debate, and my numbers WERE based on testing. I'm not even going to get into the issue of you completely making up rates for the first few months of arguing, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you are now telling the truth (as I honestly thought for the first 40 pages).

 

That is definately an odd way to show you weren't assuming "now" isn't it? Also, to what are you referring to when you say I should respond to that post. I did respond to it.

 

 

 

They were proven correct by me before, go back and refresh your memory.

 

I know what is in the thread, I know you didn't prove them inefficient. If you really did, how about you direct me to where your proof can be found? I am not looking for something that isn't there.

 

 

 

Don't bother, you've still refused to release many essential details. It's utterly impossible for us to test the rates for every single slayer task in depth slaying side by side in the next 3 days, especially considering I'll be gone most of the weekend.

 

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

It was your idea. I agree to go with your idea and all of sudden nope, not going to happen? I have released everything I have. Nemo Dat Quod Non Habet - One cannot give what one does not have. So since that is the case, how is it a refusal? This is just another lousy excuse. All that is needed for the test is we go to a NPC where there is more than enough spawns to support 2 people with no slowing in the rate and start. The test doesn't have to go for that only, approximately 10 minutes would suffice (a test of that size is not going to be out my much).

 

 

 

As it happens, I was on Runescape just now and I tested the Banking times, and I will supply them to you. However, I will not supply them until your first either post your rates or direct me to where they can be found exactly (do not say earlier in thread as that does not count).

 

 

 

P.S The title has always been wrong in my opinion.

[compfreak847]

 

Didn't I just ask you to stop making excuses? If they are really there, tell me exactly where to find it, I will then re-read the background parts to relate. There is no valid excuse you can give as to why not. You really need to stop saying I provided no information with my rates. I gave a plethora of information, most of which you didn't even read (as was evidenced earlier where I showed you hadn't read it). The only information that you accused me over and over of not giving was banking times, which I didn't have. So yes they are helpful, but you continue to make up excuses and act as if mine are invalid (when we all know they are not).

 

I already told you where they are. They are detailed from page 15 through to the link I gave where you agreed with them.

 

 

 

 

Qeltars have been shown over and over to be much lower than what is easily possible to attain. For example his rate for Bloodvelds of 107 per hour compared to me getting 199 (the 199 wasn't on Slayer either). His rate for Saradomin Mages is only 169, when even you say you get 240 (his were off Slayer, but that is a huge difference). For Zamorak Mages he gets only 190, a Slayer Helm will not cause a 110 drop. Skeletal Wyverns he only gets 41, I get just over double that. Abyssal Demons (on Slayer) he gets 112, I get 143. Black Demons he gets 98 (off Slayer), I get 147 (on Slayer). Are you noticing a pattern here? Shall I continue? I remember someone saying this in the thread, it was along the lines of "Qeltars rates go over a mile but are only an inch deep". So while he may have tested alot of different NPCs, the amount of testing on each is too small.

 

All tasks where Qeltar's rates and mine differed substantially were re-tested to obtain accurate rates.

 

 

 

 

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

I went back and read my test, just goes to show you didn't or have "accidentally" forgotten it. You never conclusively proved that a cannon was inefficient. The test showed that I got 199 kills per hour without a cannon and 395 with. Almost doubling the speed. The cannonballs used was 2,238. With a cannon to get 99 kills only takes just under 30 minutes and uses 1,127 cannonballs in that time. They currently being worth 188 means for a cannon to be efficient requires you make over 427k. However that is not all. Because with a cannon the task does not last an hour you save money on supplies. Back when I posted this it was worth approximately 42k saved bringing it down to 385k being required.

 

Supplies were shown to be much less then you thought with a SGS, almost eliminating the prayer potion cost and bringing to total to slightly over 400k - and 400k being the division mark, anything within 50k of 400k indicates a statistically insignificant difference in speeds.

 

 

 

 

Someone can't read... I use Zamorak Brews and Super Strengths. So the Strength boost remains the same and you get 2 extra Attack Levels. As I also explained, the Defence drop and Hitpoints damage is irrelevant. An example is Aberrant Spectres. With protect from Magic on, you take no damage. Hence damage and defence from the brew is irrelevant (you heal naturally). There is also the small prayer restoration. So you just proved how much you don't pay attention.

 

 

And agian, someone failed to understand my post. If you don't get what I'm saying, don't bother flaming, just tell me and I"ll try to reword it so you get it. Since Zammy brews reduce hitpoints and defence, they can only be used tasks with very low offense when relying soly on a SGS for healing - nearly half of your healing power will be stolen by the brews, and your defence reduced, meaning that most tasks which hit a significant amount will not be a viable option.

 

 

 

 

Again you show how little you pay attention. Did I say I made up every rate? No I did not. I stated and I have never said differently that the rate for Slayer I gave earlier in the thread was based on this two intial assumtpions. So either pay attention and stop making up bs to try and prove your point. It is also more evidence that you need to make up things in order to prove a point.

 

And stop trying to restate what you already said in a different manner to try and worm out of what's either (I'm assuming) a mistake or an outright lie. So did you or didn't you make up your experience numbers?

 

 

 

 

That is definately an odd way to show you weren't assuming "now" isn't it? Also, to what are you referring to when you say I should respond to that post. I did respond to it.

 

No, you simply responded by saying that I pretended it wasn't a typo, and never gave a response to my statement that they were my rates, not yours, and they were NOT made up.

 

 

 

 

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

It was your idea. I agree to go with your idea and all of sudden nope, not going to happen? I have released everything I have. Nemo Dat Quod Non Habet - One cannot give what one does not have. So since that is the case, how is it a refusal? This is just another lousy excuse. All that is needed for the test is we go to a NPC where there is more than enough spawns to support 2 people with no slowing in the rate and start. The test doesn't have to go for that only, approximately 10 minutes would suffice (a test of that size is not going to be out my much).

 

A 10 minute test is significantly worse then useless, and most tasks cannot be finished in 10 minutes. Hopefully one round with all the slayer monsters will be enough, but it may require several. I am, however, gone for a significant portion of the weekend (Going to see an old friend's sons graduation party, going to church events most of Sunday), so I don't think I'll have the 30 or 40 hours necessary to run through each task. Perhaps you could sacrifice some uni time so it doesn't have to wait until the next time you take a break :P

 

 

 

 

As it happens, I was on Runescape just now and I tested the Banking times, and I will supply them to you. However, I will not supply them until your first either post your rates or direct me to where they can be found exactly (do not say earlier in thread as that does not count).

 

See above, I see no reason why rates posted earlier shouldn't count.

 

 

 

 

P.S The title has always been wrong in my opinion.

 

It's an attention grabber, and it lets me see if people bothered to read the post based on their response.

[ydrasil]

I already told you where they are. They are detailed from page 15 through to the link I gave where you agreed with them.

 

That is the first time you have given a page number, and you claim it stretches from there till 40 something. The only rate you gave for Slayer on this page was 14.9k which is your rate. That was your attempt at calculating it from Qeltars numbers. Here is the original link to the picture of the table used:

 

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/5144/graphqe2.jpg

 

I found a fair few errors with it and you admit you skewed the results lower. After a couple changes you got it to being 59.6k after being "adjusted" for Slayer, which I never agreed with. You cannot fully adjust those results as we never knew the extent of which the superhuman strength and Slayer helm increases the experience. Either way, all of those numbers were from Qeltars database and were not your own. Even still, you purposely took the rates from the lower end when 2 were given and took the rate for without a cannon with a rate for a cannon was provided. All of which is entirely irrelevant considering how bad his rates are in the first place.

 

 

 

There was nothing else on that page mentioning a rate for Slayer. So if it didn't start on page 15, where is it? So i'll ask again, where can your rates be found? Not from Qeltar's database, where are yours? This time I want post numbers of your posts that actually include your rates. Post number is easily found by counting down to what post on that page, and adding it to the last number in the address bar.

 

 

 

All tasks where Qeltar's rates and mine differed substantially were re-tested to obtain accurate rates.

 

Then direct me to the post numbers where you show yours rates with detail.

 

 

 

Supplies were shown to be much less then you thought with a SGS, almost eliminating the prayer potion cost and bringing to total to slightly over 400k - and 400k being the division mark, anything within 50k of 400k indicates a statistically insignificant difference in speeds.

 

Umm what? That test was conducted with a SGS. Don't come up with bs that it would elimate the cost of prayer, it doesn't. If it is within 50k less than 400k is it still more efficient, and is not statistically insignificant. That is just another excuse you are using to try and prove your point.

 

 

 

And agian, someone failed to understand my post. If you don't get what I'm saying, don't bother flaming, just tell me and I"ll try to reword it so you get it. Since Zammy brews reduce hitpoints and defence, they can only be used tasks with very low offense when relying soly on a SGS for healing - nearly half of your healing power will be stolen by the brews, and your defence reduced, meaning that most tasks which hit a significant amount will not be a viable option.

 

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

Thank you for proving my point! I understood what you were saying, you clearly did not understand what I was saying in both of my posts. You have just said here that Brews reduce Hitpoints and Defence as if that is a problem. That they can only be used on tasks that have low offense. Do you see the problem yet? Your an idiot if you still don't. You say I don;t understand, yet you have conclusively proven yet again that you do not. Shall I quote my post and prove it? Here it is:

 

An example is Aberrant Spectres. With protect from Magic on, you take no damage. Hence damage and defence from the brew is irrelevant (you heal naturally). There is also the small prayer restoration. So you just proved how much you don't pay attention.

 

Zamorak Brews are the better than Super Attack if you are not taking damage in those cases. You get an additional 2 Attack levels and it also restores a small amount of prayer.

 

If I am not taking damage due to a protection prayer, I do not use Super Defence. If that is the case, I also use Zamorak Brews.

 

All of these prove my point. I am not taking damage from the NPC so therefore the damage received from the Zamorak Brew is irrelevant. I am not taking damage from the NPC so therefore the Defence reduction received from the Zamorak Brew is irrelevant. Do you understand now? So please stop accusing me of misunderstanding when I haven't and you have over and over.

 

 

 

And stop trying to restate what you already said in a different manner to try and worm out of what's either (I'm assuming) a mistake or an outright lie. So did you or didn't you make up your experience numbers?

 

I have to restate it in a different manner as you seem unable to comprehend it in the previous manners used. The fact that you asked this question proves once again how little you pay attention. As I have said over and over, the only thing that was made up was the Slayer rate which at the time I had believed is easily possible. At the time I had also stated that I believed higher was possible (and indeed it as as evidenced over and over). I never said any other rate was made up, the reason why is because none of the other rates were made up? Do you understand now?

 

 

 

No, you simply responded by saying that I pretended it wasn't a typo, and never gave a response to my statement that they were my rates, not yours, and they were NOT made up.

 

Yet I have never seen your rates, and you just showed how contradictory you are:

 

Stop avoiding the issue and respond to the post

 

No, you simply responded by

 

Does that not mean you knew I responded all along? And that you made up the fact that I did not?

 

 

 

A 10 minute test is significantly worse then useless, and most tasks cannot be finished in 10 minutes. Hopefully one round with all the slayer monsters will be enough, but it may require several. I am, however, gone for a significant portion of the weekend (Going to see an old friend's sons graduation party, going to church events most of Sunday), so I don't think I'll have the 30 or 40 hours necessary to run through each task. Perhaps you could sacrifice some uni time so it doesn't have to wait until the next time you take a break :P

 

Test is better than no test is it not, therefore a test is not worse than useless. 10 minutes allows for a reasonably accurate rate that can extrapolated to an hour. It would not be out by more than 5% either way. I also never suggested that all tasks could be completed in 10 minutes (although Scabarites can depending on task number). In either case, 10 minutes was only an example.

 

 

 

See above, I see no reason why rates posted earlier shouldn't count.

 

 

Still have no idea where your rates are exactly so I won't add my banking times yet.

[zalitz_miner]

How is a 10 minute test useless? It most certainly is good enough for an extrapolated experience per hour number. The time to get there would be in the 10 minute test and if you wanted you could even tack that number onto the test for banking at end of task. Banked/set up and got there in 3 minutes. Tested for 10 minutes and got 10k melee xp. So 10,000*60/13 = ~46,154 xp per hour. This sort of test may not be useful for profits but it's certainly not useless. By the way it's just an odd coincidence that the hypothetical number came out to be near your rate.

 

 

 

EDIT: Noticed ydrasil posted this already, had this typed up and started playing a hockey game with my brother and never got to submitting it. His post wasn't there when I typed my post up.

[Sir_Kurity]

Generally, bigger sample size = better and more accurate results.

[zalitz_miner]

It is silly to claim that you need to kill some huge number of monsters to get a good average. A video of killing 18 dust devils should indeed be quite close to the average rate. Six minute tests of many skills are rarely off by 10, let alone 5 or less, percent.

 

 

 

Large amounts of testing is only needed when getting accurate drop rates as you would need to get all of the drops including rare drops a few times to be satisfactory in the level of accuracy.

[nicrune007]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thats some pathetic slow xp lol.

 

Besides, you don't get each task 1/23 of the time.

 

Some task are more common so you have to take account to that.

[compfreak847]

 

 

 

Thats some pathetic slow xp lol.

 

Besides, you don't get each task 1/23 of the time.

 

Some task are more common so you have to take account to that.

 

Agreed, some of those tasks are off. That was before the rates were fixed for the low tasks, several monsters like Dust Devils, Dagganothhs, and Fire Giants (generally the top XP earners) were found to be considerably more, and the final rate of 75k was worked out. Also, the rates shown in the upper table are not yet adjusted for slayer mask + prayer, so they are off by 15%.

 

 

 

That being said, some tasks being more common was an interesting idea that I had thought about but never really posted on. Does anyone have some data on the frequency of each task? I must confess that I have nothing on it, so a few others in agreement is good enough proof for me. Hard data please, not "well I think blah blah blah tasks seem more common".

 

 

 

Large amounts of testing is only needed when getting accurate drop rates as you would need to get all of the drops including rare drops a few times to be satisfactory in the level of accuracy.

 

Disagree strongly. I've seen a 10% difference in rates from 60 minute tests at Armored Zombies, where are generally fairly standard for rates. And for the purposes we need, it has to be within 2-3% at the very most.

 

 

 

 

That is the first time you have given a page number, and you claim it stretches from there till 40 something. The only rate you gave for Slayer on this page was 14.9k which is your rate. That was your attempt at calculating it from Qeltars numbers. Here is the original link to the picture of the table used:

 

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/5144/graphqe2.jpg

 

I found a fair few errors with it and you admit you skewed the results lower. After a couple changes you got it to being 59.6k after being "adjusted" for Slayer, which I never agreed with. You cannot fully adjust those results as we never knew the extent of which the superhuman strength and Slayer helm increases the experience. Either way, all of those numbers were from Qeltars database and were not your own. Even still, you purposely took the rates from the lower end when 2 were given and took the rate for without a cannon with a rate for a cannon was provided. All of which is entirely irrelevant considering how bad his rates are in the first place.

 

 

 

There was nothing else on that page mentioning a rate for Slayer. So if it didn't start on page 15, where is it? So i'll ask again, where can your rates be found? Not from Qeltar's database, where are yours? This time I want post numbers of your posts that actually include your rates. Post number is easily found by counting down to what post on that page, and adding it to the last number in the address bar.

 

Note that I said it started on page 15. The rates are finalized around pages 36, at which point you left the thread after agreeing with them.

 

 

 

 

Then direct me to the post numbers where you show yours rates with detail.

 

See above.

 

 

 

 

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

Thank you for proving my point! I understood what you were saying, you clearly did not understand what I was saying in both of my posts. You have just said here that Brews reduce Hitpoints and Defence as if that is a problem. That they can only be used on tasks that have low offense. Do you see the problem yet? Your an idiot if you still don't. You say I don;t understand, yet you have conclusively proven yet again that you do not. Shall I quote my post and prove it? Here it is:

 

 

 

All of these prove my point. I am not taking damage from the NPC so therefore the damage received from the Zamorak Brew is irrelevant. I am not taking damage from the NPC so therefore the Defence reduction received from the Zamorak Brew is irrelevant. Do you understand now? So please stop accusing me of misunderstanding when I haven't and you have over and over.

 

And my point was that very few tasks have low enough offense to utilize them, and brought up the point that attack bonus matters much less at those tasks, making them essentially irrelevant in testing. Glad you finally understood what I was trying to say.

 

 

 

 

I have to restate it in a different manner as you seem unable to comprehend it in the previous manners used. The fact that you asked this question proves once again how little you pay attention. As I have said over and over, the only thing that was made up was the Slayer rate which at the time I had believed is easily possible. At the time I had also stated that I believed higher was possible (and indeed it as as evidenced over and over). I never said any other rate was made up, the reason why is because none of the other rates were made up? Do you understand now?

 

See above. Just as it's my fault if you don't understand my posts, it's yours if I can't understand your posts. Neither of us are mentally [developmentally delayed]ed, as far as I can tell, so any lack of clarity in explanations is the fault of the poster, not the reader. I'm slightly curious as to how you manage to add up your (supposedly not made up) rates and get a rate that IS made up.

 

 

 

 

Yet I have never seen your rates, and you just showed how contradictory you are:

 

See above.

 

 

 

 

Does that not mean you knew I responded all along? And that you made up the fact that I did not?

 

 

No, it means you completely plucked one quote out of context to avoid my point that yes, you did physically respond to the post, but you responded only by accusing me of not understanding and failed to clarify your post or respond to my points.

 

 

 

Yes

 

No

 

See how contradictory you are? Out of context quotes are worse then useless -.-

 

 

 

 

Test is better than no test is it not, therefore a test is not worse than useless. 10 minutes allows for a reasonably accurate rate that can extrapolated to an hour. It would not be out by more than 5% either way. I also never suggested that all tasks could be completed in 10 minutes (although Scabarites can depending on task number). In either case, 10 minutes was only an example

 

Tests are worse then useless if they give incorrect results that skew the poster into thinking. 10 minutes will result in large variances; I've gotten 10% variance on a 1 hour rate, and 10% for these rates would be far too much.

 

 

 

 

Still have no idea where your rates are exactly so I won't add my banking times yet.

 

See above.

[ydrasil]

Agreed, some of those tasks are off. That was before the rates were fixed for the low tasks, several monsters like Dust Devils, Dagganothhs, and Fire Giants (generally the top XP earners) were found to be considerably more, and the final rate of 75k was worked out. Also, the rates shown in the upper table are not yet adjusted for slayer mask + prayer, so they are off by 15%.

 

"Some" are off? They are all way below what is possible. Not one of them is even close to a proper average rate. If you actually looked at your table there is a specific portion there that says "+15% for Prayer\Mask" - "1.15". To which you then multiplied the previous number buy. So you had already attempted to adjust for for those bonuses (incorrectly in my opinion as the exact amount of effect they have is undetermined).

 

 

 

That being said, some tasks being more common was an interesting idea that I had thought about but never really posted on. Does anyone have some data on the frequency of each task? I must confess that I have nothing on it, so a few others in agreement is good enough proof for me. Hard data please, not "well I think blah blah blah tasks seem more common".

 

I mentioned this ages ago when I posted my results that the rate at which you get each task is unknown. I also said that because it is unknown I based my averages upon equal opportunity. I believe it to be dependant on Slayer and Combat level. When Zarfot went got an additonal 13.8m Slayer experience after 99, his most common task was Dark Beasts. He received them I think 33 times compared to the next lowest being in the low 20s I think. This makes sense as he already had 99 Slayer and 126 combat (which went up to 138 throughout this), so it is understandable the "hardest" assignment he would be given most often. Or something to that effect.

 

 

 

Disagree strongly. I've seen a 10% difference in rates from 60 minute tests at Armored Zombies, where are generally fairly standard for rates. And for the purposes we need, it has to be within 2-3% at the very most.

 

10% is a huge difference that can't be pinned that to length of the test, especially when you see 10% off for a 60 minute test. If you are getting 10% less experience at say Armoured Zombies, I can tell you that won't be due to it being a 60 minute test, but the mistakes you will have made during the test. A shorter test will not be 100% accurate, but it allows for the amount of mistakes to be severely lessened as you do not have to concentrate for as long.

 

 

 

Note that I said it started on page 15. The rates are finalized around pages 36, at which point you left the thread after agreeing with them.

 

My point was if it started on page 15, how come there was no rates given on page 15? I know for a fact you have never posted a table of similiar purpose to what I have, that details experience rates and profit rates for every task.

 

 

 

I also went back to page 36 hit "ctrl+f" and typed in your name. If they were apparently finalized, it would be in one of your posts correct? Anyway, on page 36 you only made one post that had 2 lines of text in it, so not page 36. I checked page 37, in your first post you say you get a little over 20k slayer xp per hour, but the rest of the post indicates that this posts tone was sarcastic. Next post was essentially only one line of text, nope not on page 37. Let's try 38. First post of yours on this page has no rates in it. Ahh here we are, your next post has a rate in it. However you post "~50k?" for profit so it is unlikely you are actually sure about this rate. The rest of the posts were just on herbs runs and such. Back to page 34, then checking 35 and that will sum up for being about 36 wouldn't you think? First post says you say it is about 65k with constant attention. I think it is fair to say that in this post I am responding to (on page 69) that you have indicated that it shown to be 75k. So therefore this can't be it either. Nothing else on this page, one more to go. Finally we have another rate! "65k melee\80k profit vs. 103k melee\190k profit?" Well it isn't 75k either, so that can't be it. Next post was a response to Waterfiends, saying it maxes at 60k with piety. Nothing else about a rate here. So if it apparently got finalized around page 36 to be 75k? why is it not within those 5 pages I checked?

 

 

 

Now I will ask again (7th time?). Where are your rates located (you know, for every task, like all the detail you expect everyone else to have)? I want a Post Number not a random page number and saying it is about there.

 

 

 

And my point was that very few tasks have low enough offense to utilize them, and brought up the point that attack bonus matters much less at those tasks, making them essentially irrelevant in testing. Glad you finally understood what I was trying to say.

 

Wait so let me get this straight. I incontravertibly proved that I understood your posts and that you clearly had no clue about what I had posted, and in doing so I have only just finalyl understood you? Seriously what the hell. Your response hear again indicates you did not understand my response (don't come up with some bs that I can't underrstand yours - if there is any reason why I can't understand it would be me wondering how you can be this stupid, not the post itself).

 

 

 

So according to you, for Zamorak Brews to work, the NPC has to have a low offense? Please explain to me how that is relevant when they cannot, i'll repeat cannot deal damage to you? At Aberrant Spectres by using Protect from Magic prayer, you cannot be hit by them. So why would they need to have a low offense? Zamorak Brews provide an additional 2 Attack Levels throughout the entire task (provided you pot at the same time as you would with a super attack, which I do). It also restores some prayer at the same time so yes, using a Zamorak Brew and a Super Strength is better than a Super Attack and Super Strength on these types of tasks.

 

 

 

See above. Just as it's my fault if you don't understand my posts, it's yours if I can't understand your posts. Neither of us are mentally [developmentally delayed], as far as I can tell, so any lack of clarity in explanations is the fault of the poster, not the reader. I'm slightly curious as to how you manage to add up your (supposedly not made up) rates and get a rate that IS made up.

 

Oh please, you are going to try and put the blame on me? The lack of understanding is purely on your behalf. I have no idea how you could not understand what I was explaining. The example I posted should have cleared any possibility for a misunderstanding, but somehow you managed to miss the point entirely. That was 4 times in a row I have said that you are not taking damage, so therefore the Hitpoints loss and Defence reduction from the Brew is irrelevant. This makes for the 5th explantion, all of which have no room for misunderstanding.

 

 

 

Feel free to also show me where I have not understood your posts here? I have understood everyone of them, but your point is invalid as I have shown 5 times now. Any lack of clarity in this case is directly your fault, as the posts were full of clarity. Don't believe me? Go quote every single one of my 4 (now 5) explanations to someone and tell them it is to explain why a Zamorak Brew should be used in place of a Super Attack. Then come back and tell us if they understood it.

 

 

 

No, it means you completely plucked one quote out of context to avoid my point that yes, you did physically respond to the post, but you responded only by accusing me of not understanding and failed to clarify your post or respond to my points.

 

Your post was based on a misunderstanding, as it was "no" not "now". Your post was based on it being "now" and hence it was not worth responding the rest of it. The quote was not plucked out of context, I believe the meaning of it was quite clear that you went under the assumption that it was "now".

 

 

 

Tests are worse then useless if they give incorrect results that skew the poster into thinking. 10 minutes will result in large variances; I've gotten 10% variance on a 1 hour rate, and 10% for these rates would be far too much.

 

That may be the case, but a 10 minute test is not going to give incorrect results now is it? Not to mention there is no 100% correct answer. It is an approximation of the average rate, and this is what the test would provide. I am not denying longer tests are more accurate, I am just disagreeing with your reasoning behind 10 minutes being worthless when it most certainly isn't. A 10% variance in a 1 hour test is due to the tester. You obviously had to of made some significant errors to lose out on approximately 10k experience (assuming you are referring to Armoured Zombies). If in a 10 minute test you kill 40 of a certain NPC, it stands to reason that in 60 minutes you will kill approximately 6x that amount at 240. If instead the rate for another 1 hour test was 250 kills per hour, than a 10 kill difference is a pretty small difference (4%).

[compfreak847]

 

"Some" are off? They are all way below what is possible. Not one of them is even close to a proper average rate. If you actually looked at your table there is a specific portion there that says "+15% for Prayer\Mask" - "1.15". To which you then multiplied the previous number buy. So you had already attempted to adjust for for those bonuses (incorrectly in my opinion as the exact amount of effect they have is undetermined).

 

Strongly disagree. Your looking at those rates prior to slayer mask\prayer, using proven methods for adjusting, and I find info on tasks like suqahs and iron dragons to be very similar to my rates.

 

 

 

 

I mentioned this ages ago when I posted my results that the rate at which you get each task is unknown. I also said that because it is unknown I based my averages upon equal opportunity. I believe it to be dependant on Slayer and Combat level. When Zarfot went got an additonal 13.8m Slayer experience after 99, his most common task was Dark Beasts. He received them I think 33 times compared to the next lowest being in the low 20s I think. This makes sense as he already had 99 Slayer and 126 combat (which went up to 138 throughout this), so it is understandable the "hardest" assignment he would be given most often. Or something to that effect.

 

Exactly, but I haven't seen any hard data on how frequent each tasks are - and it's very hard to collect in a short timeframe; even leveling to 99, your only going to get a few dozen of each tasks (like Zarfot).

 

 

 

 

10% is a huge difference that can't be pinned that to length of the test, especially when you see 10% off for a 60 minute test. If you are getting 10% less experience at say Armoured Zombies, I can tell you that won't be due to it being a 60 minute test, but the mistakes you will have made during the test. A shorter test will not be 100% accurate, but it allows for the amount of mistakes to be severely lessened as you do not have to concentrate for as long.

 

I'm telling you it's not that; all equipment and inventories remain the same, and with auto-reteliate the main factor (speed of attacking) is completely removed. If anything, a regular task should yield considerably more variance as it incorporates human error.

 

 

 

 

My point was if it started on page 15, how come there was no rates given on page 15? I know for a fact you have never posted a table of similiar purpose to what I have, that details experience rates and profit rates for every task.

 

 

 

I also went back to page 36 hit "ctrl+f" and typed in your name. If they were apparently finalized, it would be in one of your posts correct? Anyway, on page 36 you only made one post that had 2 lines of text in it, so not page 36. I checked page 37, in your first post you say you get a little over 20k slayer xp per hour, but the rest of the post indicates that this posts tone was sarcastic. Next post was essentially only one line of text, nope not on page 37. Let's try 38. First post of yours on this page has no rates in it. Ahh here we are, your next post has a rate in it. However you post "~50k?" for profit so it is unlikely you are actually sure about this rate. The rest of the posts were just on herbs runs and such. Back to page 34, then checking 35 and that will sum up for being about 36 wouldn't you think? First post says you say it is about 65k with constant attention. I think it is fair to say that in this post I am responding to (on page 69) that you have indicated that it shown to be 75k. So therefore this can't be it either. Nothing else on this page, one more to go. Finally we have another rate! "65k melee\80k profit vs. 103k melee\190k profit?" Well it isn't 75k either, so that can't be it. Next post was a response to Waterfiends, saying it maxes at 60k with piety. Nothing else about a rate here. So if it apparently got finalized around page 36 to be 75k? why is it not within those 5 pages I checked?

 

 

 

Now I will ask again (7th time?). Where are your rates located (you know, for every task, like all the detail you expect everyone else to have)? I want a Post Number not a random page number and saying it is about there.

 

Notice the key word in "about". My rates are are not giving in a specific post, as the arguments about them spread over many pages. You should know, it was you who I was arguing with.

 

 

 

 

Wait so let me get this straight. I incontravertibly proved that I understood your posts and that you clearly had no clue about what I had posted, and in doing so I have only just finalyl understood you? Seriously what the hell. Your response hear again indicates you did not understand my response (don't come up with some bs that I can't underrstand yours - if there is any reason why I can't understand it would be me wondering how you can be this stupid, not the post itself).

 

You can drop the stuipd argument. I've proven that I'm not an idiot, and using that as a cover up isn't an effective argument, or even an argument at all. I can sit here and post "your an idiot because you misread my post" all day long, and follow up any misunderstandings of mine with "your an idiot because you posted wrong", but the reverse argument can be used in either. Pick one and stick with it, either it's the posters or the readers fault. Don't try and say it's "always" my fault irregardless of if its my post or my interpretation.

 

 

 

So according to you, for Zamorak Brews to work, the NPC has to have a low offense? Please explain to me how that is relevant when they cannot, i'll repeat cannot deal damage to you? At Aberrant Spectres by using Protect from Magic prayer, you cannot be hit by them. So why would they need to have a low offense? Zamorak Brews provide an additional 2 Attack Levels throughout the entire task (provided you pot at the same time as you would with a super attack, which I do). It also restores some prayer at the same time so yes, using a Zamorak Brew and a Super Strength is better than a Super Attack and Super Strength on these types of tasks.

 

I certainly wasn't aware you used protect from magic at specters; I find karils to be enough magic defence that a unicorn keeps me healed, and the savings in prayer potions makes up for the very minor boost a summon can provide.

 

 

 

 

Your post was based on a misunderstanding, as it was "no" not "now". Your post was based on it being "now" and hence it was not worth responding the rest of it. The quote was not plucked out of context, I believe the meaning of it was quite clear that you went under the assumption that it was "now".

 

It certainly wasn't. I read "no", and I thought about responding simply by asking if it was a typo, but it was quite obvious that it no, as now wasn't even grammatically correct - the whole sentance didn't make sense if it was now instead of no. I was trying to avoid being nitpicky, but I might as well post if it you insist upon harping on it.

 

 

 

 

That may be the case, but a 10 minute test is not going to give incorrect results now is it? Not to mention there is no 100% correct answer. It is an approximation of the average rate, and this is what the test would provide. I am not denying longer tests are more accurate, I am just disagreeing with your reasoning behind 10 minutes being worthless when it most certainly isn't. A 10% variance in a 1 hour test is due to the tester. You obviously had to of made some significant errors to lose out on approximately 10k experience (assuming you are referring to Armoured Zombies). If in a 10 minute test you kill 40 of a certain NPC, it stands to reason that in 60 minutes you will kill approximately 6x that amount at 240. If instead the rate for another 1 hour test was 250 kills per hour, than a 10 kill difference is a pretty small difference (4%).

 

It most certainly is. If I'm differing 10% in a test where I don't even do anything besides climb up and down a ladder every 3 minutes, it's quite obvious that combat results are skewed due to the randomness of the hit calculation system.

[ydrasil]

Strongly disagree. Your looking at those rates prior to slayer mask\prayer, using proven methods for adjusting, and I find info on tasks like suqahs and iron dragons to be very similar to my rates.

 

If you are being sincere when you strongly disagree... then the only reason Slayer mighr be bad is because you are bad at doing Slayer (with respect to experience rates). There was never a "proven" method of adjusting his rates for Slayer. There was you saying that are correct, but there was evidence to back up that claim. The only way to see if the adjustment is correct is for Qeltar himself to use the exact same method and equipment (only difference would it would be on Slayer using a Slayer Helm and using +10% strength prayer). That is the only real way to do it because everyone has different reaction times and attention spans. Also my current personal rate for Suqahs is 44.2k to Slayer (although up to around 50k is possible). Not only that, but I have gone that bad in any task even if you multiply his numbers by 1.15.

 

 

 

Exactly, but I haven't seen any hard data on how frequent each tasks are - and it's very hard to collect in a short timeframe; even leveling to 99, your only going to get a few dozen of each tasks (like Zarfot).

 

I know that, I only said that it was my belief that combat level and Slayer level affects the frequency of tasks.

 

 

 

I'm telling you it's not that; all equipment and inventories remain the same, and with auto-reteliate the main factor (speed of attacking) is completely removed. If anything, a regular task should yield considerably more variance as it incorporates human error.

 

I don't think I've ever hard a large difference in testing but I can't be 100% sure. The point is, a 10% drop at Armoured Zombies is huge, something must have changed.

 

 

 

Notice the key word in "about". My rates are are not giving in a specific post, as the arguments about them spread over many pages. You should know, it was you who I was arguing with.

 

No, of course I completely missed the word about. That is clearly why I looked a couple pages before and after, you know, because I didn't know it was "about" page 36. I know for a fact that you have never given your rates for each task (experience and profit rates for each). Here's the kicker. You say I have "never" given detail with my results and that you have. The only thing I am apparently missing was the banking times. If that is the case, it can be deduced that you have those rates yourself. So what are banking times then?

 

 

 

You can drop the stuipd argument. I've proven that I'm not an idiot, and using that as a cover up isn't an effective argument, or even an argument at all. I can sit here and post "your an idiot because you misread my post" all day long, and follow up any misunderstandings of mine with "your an idiot because you posted wrong", but the reverse argument can be used in either. Pick one and stick with it, either it's the posters or the readers fault. Don't try and say it's "always" my fault irregardless of if its my post or my interpretation.

 

 

*Laughs at the irony in the first sentence* (Yes I know it is a typo)

 

Your responses to every single part on the section of Zamorak Brews does nothing but indicate you have misunderstood over and over. Then you tried to blame me for that. It was not a cover up, just calling it as I see it, your responses to that section was nothing short of idiotic. You can sit there and post ""your an idiot because you misread my post"" all day long if you want, the difference is you would be lieing.

 

*Laughs at the irony with the last 2 sentences*

 

The last 2 sentences indicated that you once again misunderstood my post. I posted this "Any lack of clarity in this case is directly your fault, as the posts were full of clarity." It clearly says "in this case". Now please explain to me how this means it is always your fault? I have never said it is either always the composers fault or the responders fault. I was pointing out in this case it was the responders fault because there wasn't exactly much room for misinterpretation.

 

 

 

I certainly wasn't aware you used protect from magic at specters; I find karils to be enough magic defence that a unicorn keeps me healed, and the savings in prayer potions makes up for the very minor boost a summon can provide.

 

This is also where you effectively admit you misunderstood. Hell it isn't really a misunderstanding really, as there is no way it can be taken any other way. I'll quote exactly what I said:

 

An example is Aberrant Spectres. With protect from Magic on, you take no damage.

 

And now you are going to say you had no idea I used Protect from Magic? Lets also look at a couple of my earlier posts:

 

Zamorak Brews are the better than Super Attack if you are not taking damage in those cases.

 

If I am not taking damage due to a protection prayer

 

Every single time it was indicated there was no damage being taken. 2/3 directly say I am using it, and the 3rd infers it. Also, feel free to explain how a Unicorn will provide ample healing when I am being attacked by up to around 7 Aberrant Spectres at any one point in time. In case you do not understand why, I use a cannon in the Pollnivneach (think I spelt wrong) well. Also, just out of curiosity, how many healing aura scrolls would you go through per task on average?

 

 

 

It certainly wasn't. I read "no", and I thought about responding simply by asking if it was a typo, but it was quite obvious that it no, as now wasn't even grammatically correct - the whole sentance didn't make sense if it was now instead of no. I was trying to avoid being nitpicky, but I might as well post if it you insist upon harping on it.

 

So by not being nitpicky your response started with "Assuming you meant now, and that would indeed be an interesting quote". The rest of the post did not indicate that it based on "no". The very next part of the quote is "- except that it was certainly not the end of our debate, and my numbers WERE based on testing" You went straight from assuming it is "now" to saying it was not the end of the debate. That is referring to when that number was brought up earlier in the thread.

 

 

 

It most certainly is. If I'm differing 10% in a test where I don't even do anything besides climb up and down a ladder every 3 minutes, it's quite obvious that combat results are skewed due to the randomness of the hit calculation system.

 

I have been recording some vid's of different tests ranging from about 7 minutes to 11 or so. every single one has been reasonably close to my hourly rate. So far I have done it for Waterfiends, Bloodvelds, Gargoyles, Skeletal Wyverns and Fire Giants. I performed 2 tests for both Gargoyles and Fire Giants to try different methods.

[Obtaurian]

 

I certainly wasn't aware you used protect from magic at specters; I find karils to be enough magic defence that a unicorn keeps me healed, and the savings in prayer potions makes up for the very minor boost a summon can provide.

 

 

 

 

I was extremely interested in this whole discussion until I read this. You seriously slay spectres with Karil's and a unicorn? Seriously? There is a very good reason why you are not getting very good Slayer rates, and this quote sums it up nicely.

 

 

 

. . . REALLY? Karil's?! UNICORN?! No cannon, I presume? It takes me 20 minutes to do a spectres task. How long does it take you, an hour? Two? Read Zarfot's guide. I think you'd really benefit.

 

 

 

I'm afraid that on the subject of Slayer, I just can't take you seriously anymore. I'm baffled. Shocked. You're supposed to be the efficiency man, the naysayer of Slayer, the 10 billion hours of PvP combat, the fight pits master! How in the world did this happen, Comp? 69 pages of arguing back and forth, and this could have been solved had you just admitted to being a horribly inefficient Slayer on the first sentence of the first post.

 

 

 

Now I'm extremely curious. I want to know your blocked task list and your methods for slaying every single slayer monster that isn't on that block list. I don't need inventories, I just need protect pray/no protect pray, whip/ss, etc. Basic stuff.

 

 

 

I refuse to believe that a man who revels in debate is so clueless of as to what he's debating.

[pureprayer]

How about someone just does 20 hours of slaying and don't count per task just count to see how much per hour you get with banking and getting resources from the ge, and changing equipment.

 

 

 

Might be fair but we would need more then 20 hours.

[Zaaps1]

On the topic of frequency you must also remember that not only are some tasks more common than others, but some groups of tasks are very often looped. There's no real way to determine frequency since there's no way you can ensure you do not have a certain task looped, regardless of if it's a major loop or minor loop.

[nicrune007]

 

I certainly wasn't aware you used protect from magic at specters; I find karils to be enough magic defence that a unicorn keeps me healed, and the savings in prayer potions makes up for the very minor boost a summon can provide.

 

 

 

 

I was extremely interested in this whole discussion until I read this. You seriously slay spectres with Karil's and a unicorn? Seriously? There is a very good reason why you are not getting very good Slayer rates, and this quote sums it up nicely.

 

 

 

. . . REALLY? Karil's?! UNICORN?! No cannon, I presume? It takes me 20 minutes to do a spectres task. How long does it take you, an hour? Two? Read Zarfot's guide. I think you'd really benefit.

 

 

 

 

The slayer rates are for melee xp, even if he used a cannon it will stay the same.

[Zaaps1]

 

I certainly wasn't aware you used protect from magic at specters; I find karils to be enough magic defence that a unicorn keeps me healed, and the savings in prayer potions makes up for the very minor boost a summon can provide.

 

 

 

 

I was extremely interested in this whole discussion until I read this. You seriously slay spectres with Karil's and a unicorn? Seriously? There is a very good reason why you are not getting very good Slayer rates, and this quote sums it up nicely.

 

 

 

. . . REALLY? Karil's?! UNICORN?! No cannon, I presume? It takes me 20 minutes to do a spectres task. How long does it take you, an hour? Two? Read Zarfot's guide. I think you'd really benefit.

 

 

 

 

The slayer rates are for melee xp, even if he used a cannon it will stay the same.

 

 

 

Well the thing is that some tasks are really a no-brainer to cannon. I cannon almost all of my tasks. So then it isn't just melee xp that is being compared but ranged as well.