7/28/2009? unannounced PVP changes

[SwreeTak]

I think that Jagex have done right when they did these changes. PvP should be PvP. Myself I'm no Pker, just because of the big risks if you lose. Those who go for PvP though, I think those should risk their wealth since it is all a part of it, not just using tricks to earn money. If that's what they want to do, why don't they quit PvPing and start merchanting or skilling instead?

[Sir_Kurity]

I just don't think skillers should be penalized for teleporting.

 

 

 

Jagex is basically forcing you to skill for EP, that or waste your time.

[meili]

Can someone explain to me why we need the whole EP system anyway?

[Sir_Kurity]

I donno, so people dont rwt.

[Zepheras]

I just don't think skillers should be penalized for teleporting.

 

 

 

Jagex is basically forcing you to skill for EP, that or waste your time.

 

 

 

 

 

I guess they need to let people gain EP for killing other players then?

[muggiwhplar]

I just don't think skillers should be penalized for teleporting.

 

 

 

Jagex is basically forcing you to skill for EP, that or waste your time.

 

 

 

 

 

I guess they need to let people gain EP for killing other players then?

 

 

 

Well, that's the most logical way. What they need to do is have it so EP only goes up from getting in legit fights, killing people, and getting killed. Then, randomly, for one of your kills, you'll get a reward drop and lose some EP, instead of building it. If they randomize things it's harder to abuse.

 

 

 

They could start by hiding the EP percentage counter and stop explaining us in depth how the drop system works. As someone else said earlier, what's happening in the wilderness now is pretty much what would've happened at the barrows if Jagex had explained how the barrows drop system works. For things like this, they just need to keep the mechanics a secret or else it gets abused and we all get [bleep]ed in the [bleep].

[All_Is_Great]

I just don't think skillers should be penalized for teleporting.

 

 

 

Jagex is basically forcing you to skill for EP, that or waste your time.

 

 

 

 

 

I guess they need to let people gain EP for killing other players then?

 

 

 

Well, that's the most logical way. What they need to do is have it so EP only goes up from getting in legit fights, killing people, and getting killed. Then, randomly, for one of your kills, you'll get a reward drop and lose some EP, instead of building it. If they randomize things it's harder to abuse.

 

 

 

They could start by hiding the EP percentage counter and stop explaining us in depth how the drop system works. As someone else said earlier, what's happening in the wilderness now is pretty much what would've happened at the barrows if Jagex had explained how the barrows drop system works. For things like this, they just need to keep the mechanics a secret or else it gets abused and we all get [bleep]ed in the [bleep].

 

 

 

How would they do that without setting everyone off on how many kills it would take to get a drop? Or how much the drops are worth? Remember when the drop system was still not revealed? I think I got bones + green dhide from 10 kills in a row. That's what put me off PKing.

 

 

 

They'd be better off not trying to fix everything, they come out with one, then have to fix 10, the cycle never ends.

[muggiwhplar]

How would they do that without setting everyone off on how many kills it would take to get a drop? Or how much the drops are worth? Remember when the drop system was still not revealed? I think I got bones + green dhide from 10 kills in a row. That's what put me off PKing.

 

 

 

They'd be better off not trying to fix everything, they come out with one, then have to fix 10, the cycle never ends.

 

 

 

They could just have it so for every kill worth over 75k you get, the higher your EP gets. Though, randomly (the higher your EP, the better your chances), when you get a kill, you'll get a drop instead of an EP boost. Your drop would be determined by your current EP; the higher your EP, the better your drop. However, you'll never receive more loot than your opponent was risking. Similarly, you wouldn't get a drop from someone risking "only" 75k, even though 75k is the requirement to gain EP. Your opponent would have to be risking maybe 500k or 1M+ for you to get a chance at a drop instead of an EP boost. Also, there would be a cap on the amount of wealth you'd receive from a kill, like 10 or 50M.

 

 

 

Anyways, I'm not really trying to come up with some fool-proof system. I just wish PvP was focused on PvP, not sitting on your [wagon] for 2 hours then killing a friend for easy money.

 

 

 

Alternatively, we could remove all PvP and Bounty Hunter worlds and make duel tournaments the only risky PvP option.

 

 

 

*sigh* I wish duel tournaments never died. . . I made millions there lol

[Torlen]

I don't see why they can't switch back to old drops now.. DFS was what.. 15m while it was a drop and now its 20m? BCP, which wasn't dropped was 13m and now its 17.. them not being dropped didn't make those prices go up, inflation did. And even the legit pkers are bringing a large pile of money into the game. The chance of getting a visage from a dragon is low, the chance of getting a dfs before from a plater was also low.. the drops and their drop frequency evened themselves out. I wouldn't give props to Jagex for their PVP updates until they fix the problem that made tons of items nearly double in price.

 

 

 

To sum it up: "I don't know how to make money anymore :("

[muggiwhplar]

I don't see why they can't switch back to old drops now.. DFS was what.. 15m while it was a drop and now its 20m? BCP, which wasn't dropped was 13m and now its 17.. them not being dropped didn't make those prices go up, inflation did. And even the legit pkers are bringing a large pile of money into the game. The chance of getting a visage from a dragon is low, the chance of getting a dfs before from a plater was also low.. the drops and their drop frequency evened themselves out. I wouldn't give props to Jagex for their PVP updates until they fix the problem that made tons of items nearly double in price.

 

 

 

To sum it up: "I don't know how to make money anymore :("

 

 

 

Not really... people didn't start getting rich via abusing the system till they removed the old style of PvP which he's arguing for.

[warren211]

I just don't think skillers should be penalized for teleporting.

 

 

 

Jagex is basically forcing you to skill for EP, that or waste your time.

 

 

 

I don't really get your point. From what I see, you have only a few options when skilling in pvp: Bring just the skilling gear (i.e. brawlers, hatchet, pickaxe, etc) and nothing of any value that could be lost, or bring good tanking/fighting gear to fend off pkers, or bring the gear and 75k risk and not care whether you die and lost the 75k. The first option is for low-loss skillers who just want to skill and not bother with EP, the second is for players who want ep but want to protect their money, the third is for players who want ep but don't want to or cba to risk extra on armor and supplies for self defence.

 

 

 

I don't see how a skiller in pvp is forced to get EP, he has several options of how to go about skilling depending on his risk level and budget.

[Mazhar]

I don't see why they can't switch back to old drops now.. DFS was what.. 15m while it was a drop and now its 20m? BCP, which wasn't dropped was 13m and now its 17.. them not being dropped didn't make those prices go up, inflation did. And even the legit pkers are bringing a large pile of money into the game. The chance of getting a visage from a dragon is low, the chance of getting a dfs before from a plater was also low.. the drops and their drop frequency evened themselves out. I wouldn't give props to Jagex for their PVP updates until they fix the problem that made tons of items nearly double in price.

 

 

 

To sum it up: "I don't know how to make money anymore :("

 

So.. I can't make money because they have better, more consistent drops now? K.

[NukeMarine]

The EP system makes sense in that it gives real PK'rs (those that want to kill targets) the chance to have targets (those that want to wait around with 76k gp skilling in some way).

 

 

 

The only problem have been players were not really risking 76k. They would 3 item, put on protect item, teleports away, drops item and returns, attack each other in single way with spells, hide in out of the way locations, etc.

 

 

 

Jagex fixes some of the problem by making it more difficult to get EP risk free.

 

 

 

1. Auto skull/no protect item: If you're carrying it, it's being risked on death

 

2. 10 second rule: if you're in combat, you can be safe for 10 seconds after.

 

3. Teleport: if you teleport out of combat, you wasted 20 minutes of EP time.

 

4. Dropping: you can't drop items in combat

 

 

 

**edit: Here's the suggestion I posted on the main forum**

 

 

 

1. If your character is risking 76k+ gp, your character is skulled. This helps other players tell if it's worth trying to kill you.

 

 

 

2. If your character is skulled (ie risking 76k+ gp), your dot appears yellow on the radar.

 

 

 

3. The more people on your radar, the faster your EP builds.

 

 

 

3a. EP builds fastest when at least 10 players are on your radar. It does not build if no players are on your radar.

 

 

 

3b. Each unique player on your radar can only account for 3% of your EP until your next kill. What that means if you and 10 friends all hang out in the wild protecting each other, the max you all can get upto is 30% EP.

 

 

 

4. Killing a skulled player (someone that's risking 76k gp) means you automatically get a 25k gp idol as a drop. This is in addition to normal drops you'd get with EP. You do not have to be risking anything for this drop.

 

 

 

Obviously the numbers can be shifted for balance, but it does make sense. More radar dots, more risk. Yeah, clans can exploit it, but that's a reasonable exploit.

[Sir_Kurity]

Theres nothing wrong with gaining EP in peace.

 

 

 

If jagex is FORCING us to get EP, we should be able to do it without getting attacked by some **** at the top of your level range every 2 seconds.

[Zaaps1]

Doesn't really solve anything.

 

 

 

All you gotta do is get 3 friends instead of 4. When 5 minutes is up, you just attack one of the other 2 friends and you're set.

 

 

 

And if you don't get EP for bolting, use low level bolts or something.

[NukeMarine]

Theres nothing wrong with gaining EP in peace.

 

 

 

If jagex is FORCING us to get EP, we should be able to do it without getting attacked by some **** at the top of your level range every 2 seconds.

 

 

 

So if you're getting EP in peace, how is that risking 76k gp? If getting EP means putting up with jerks attacking you every two seconds, I'd say you were risking a lot. Getting 100% EP then can mean getting pretty good drops.

 

 

 

The more risk there is in 76k'ing, then the more legitimate the EP system becomes.

 

 

 

Doesn't really solve anything.

 

 

 

All you gotta do is get 3 friends instead of 4. When 5 minutes is up, you just attack one of the other 2 friends and you're set.

 

 

 

And if you don't get EP for bolting, use low level bolts or something.

 

 

 

By your counter-example, assuming better drops are at the 100% EP level, they're losing out by keeping it low. In addition, each player is losing 76k ever 5 minutes which is bound to add up. Yeah, 10 guys can sort of take advantage of it, but what's wrong with that? It's better 10 guys cooperating than one guy AFK'ing is some second story house or an out of the way tree.

[muggiwhplar]

I wish they'd just make it a bannable offense lol, or kick you out of a PvP world if you go x minutes without legit combat

[Zaaps1]

 

 

 

Doesn't really solve anything.

 

 

 

All you gotta do is get 3 friends instead of 4. When 5 minutes is up, you just attack one of the other 2 friends and you're set.

 

 

 

And if you don't get EP for bolting, use low level bolts or something.

 

 

 

By your counter-example, assuming better drops are at the 100% EP level, they're losing out by keeping it low. In addition, each player is losing 76k ever 5 minutes which is bound to add up. Yeah, 10 guys can sort of take advantage of it, but what's wrong with that? It's better 10 guys cooperating than one guy AFK'ing is some second story house or an out of the way tree.

 

 

 

What are you talking about? That makes no sense, you aren't trying to kill the guy...

[NukeMarine]

 

 

 

By your counter-example, assuming better drops are at the 100% EP level, they're losing out by keeping it low. In addition, each player is losing 76k ever 5 minutes which is bound to add up. Yeah, 10 guys can sort of take advantage of it, but what's wrong with that? It's better 10 guys cooperating than one guy AFK'ing is some second story house or an out of the way tree.

 

 

 

What are you talking about? That makes no sense, you aren't trying to kill the guy...

 

 

 

So what did you mean by attack one of the three friends with you every 5 minutes? In my suggestion, you have to kill a player (in a way that'll reduce your EP which I should have added) in order to clear out the system tracking how much EP you've gotten per player on your radar. Just attacking another won't do it, as you point out above.

 

 

 

Now, can the system track how long you've been around other players? I think so. It doesn't have to track everyone, just those is less crowded areas.

 

 

 

The point being, if the only way you can earn EP is around other people that know that if they kill you they get 25k gp, well, surviving long enough to get EP means you EARNED your EARNING POTENTIAL. If you try to game the system with clan mates, it'll take at least 30 players standing around for 2 hours fending off others in addition to whatever they bide their time with to really be effective. If you got that strong of a clan, more power to you.

[Dragonlordjl]

They should make it where you can only kill any specific player once per 15 minutes and still receive loot. That is, you have to kill different people to still receive loot. It wouldn't stop 76king, but it'd make it difficult enough that many people wouldn't bother.

[siim]

They should make it where you can only kill any specific player once per 15 minutes and still receive loot. That is, you have to kill different people to still receive loot. It wouldn't stop 76king, but it'd make it difficult enough that many people wouldn't bother.

 

I know a few clans that are specialized to 76k tricks. So it still would not be hard to abuse.

[sa121]

They should make it where you can only kill any specific player once per 15 minutes and still receive loot. That is, you have to kill different people to still receive loot. It wouldn't stop 76king, but it'd make it difficult enough that many people wouldn't bother.

 

I know a few clans that are specialized to 76k tricks. So it still would not be hard to abuse.

 

Plus that'd make DMing pretty annoying if you do best 2/3, 4/5, etc. It'd take 1 hour 15 minutes total if you were doing the latter.

[brunokiller]

Or instead of stopping them from fighting, give them less or equal loot as the dieing player carries( to stop killing the same player over and over again with 75k).

[Zaaps1]

 

 

 

By your counter-example, assuming better drops are at the 100% EP level, they're losing out by keeping it low. In addition, each player is losing 76k ever 5 minutes which is bound to add up. Yeah, 10 guys can sort of take advantage of it, but what's wrong with that? It's better 10 guys cooperating than one guy AFK'ing is some second story house or an out of the way tree.

 

 

 

What are you talking about? That makes no sense, you aren't trying to kill the guy...

 

 

 

So what did you mean by attack one of the three friends with you every 5 minutes? In my suggestion, you have to kill a player (in a way that'll reduce your EP which I should have added) in order to clear out the system tracking how much EP you've gotten per player on your radar. Just attacking another won't do it, as you point out above.

 

 

 

Now, can the system track how long you've been around other players? I think so. It doesn't have to track everyone, just those is less crowded areas.

 

 

 

The point being, if the only way you can earn EP is around other people that know that if they kill you they get 25k gp, well, surviving long enough to get EP means you EARNED your EARNING POTENTIAL. If you try to game the system with clan mates, it'll take at least 30 players standing around for 2 hours fending off others in addition to whatever they bide their time with to really be effective. If you got that strong of a clan, more power to you.

 

 

 

Ah. My fault. I was responding to Jagex's update, not your suggestion.